Old Foam Cavity Wall Insulation?

johneym

Hello Folks,

Moved into a 2nd hand 30 year old bungalow recently an had a guy out to have a look at putting in cavity wall insulation. But its already insulated!!
You would never think it from inside the house as its not a particularly warm house. Its yellow foam stuff an he says it dates back at least 10 years and must have been among the first houses to get insulated.
Also he says its not half as good as what they are putting in the cavity now and as its foam there is a danger of it actually holding or transmitting moisture from outer to inner leaf. Apart from that over time it sags so doesnt work really well anyway.This defeats the whole purpose of insulation doesnt it?
Anyway Im not really sure what to do yet or how to proceed. I just thought I would bash it around here an see what people think.

Thanks a lot,

John

Quiksilver

Hi Johneym, You say it's yellow foam stuff? Did you see the insulation? It may be pumped fibreglass or wool. If so it could be removed. if it's foam then their mightn’t be a whole lot you can do. The problem I’ve seen with foam in houses is that it can disintegrate over time leaving gaps in the insulation. The only solution may be internal drylining with an insulated slab or the exterior insulation.

johneym

Oh Quicksilver,

thank you so much for the reply.I was afraid my gigantic problem would be simply swept under the carpet!!
I have been investigating. Its mineral wool fibre and very water absorbant. And yes I have tested it. On UK sites I have been reading about the numerous problems the houses have with this. It transmits the damp and causes mould. These people usually get the company who put in in to take it out again as it was never suitable. Its the cheapest form of insulation and the UK government offered it free to many people say 10- 15 yrs ago. Now the problems are to be seen. There are for this reason many companies who specilize in removing it.Usually the contractor who blew it in must be responsible for removing it. If not, the government green plan pays. Here in Ireland I have not found anyone who removes this insulation and have no idea of the cost. I also do not know who pumped it in my house. It was there long before I bought it. I want the bead insulation. We are sure this has sagged big time as there are freezing cold spots and not so freezing spots all over the outer walls.

What can I do? Please tell me more about the removal process? Have you seen this? Is it expensive?

Johney

Quiksilver

Hi johneym, seems like you've all your research done, not much more I can tell you. I work with an insulation company(Not trying to turn this post into an advertisement, just want to give some helpful advice), I've seen quite a few house here in Limerick that have wool pumped into the cavity. It's not a good insulation method at all. We're five years in the business an have done two extractions. It's not an easy process, it involves a lot of holes, more so than pumping the insulation and requires a few larger 6" holes to be cored. Not many companies do it as the process varies from house to house. The process also won't remove 100% of the wool and could take up to 3-5 day to do.

johneym

thanks Quick,
Very informative post.

its a 150 meter square bungalow. Simple rectangle shape. Any idea of the approx cost of such a venture?
Also do you know if any grants are available to clear up such a mess?

Appreciate your comments,

John

brendankelly

I have been preaching about this for years. In the 80s people were advised to pump their cavities and now they are paying for that mistake. I have very little education but even I knew where putting rockwoll in a cavity would end up. The cavity was the best idea to stop cold bridging and I believe they should always be left alone.

You need to get as much of the rockwool as you can out because it is causing a cold bridge. I would advise against filling your cavity with anything because you cannot check to make sure it is done properly. If you do decide to fill it make sure the company that does it are reputable.

Hightorque

Could you pump a polyurethane foam in there by pressure?

slimjimmc

You should look into external insulation too. It's very expensive but if your walls are prone to rain penetration it's a good solution.
It also provides excellent thermal insulation and qualifies for the SEI grant.
http://www.sei.ie/uploadedfiles/InfoCentre/Insulatingyourhome.pdf
http://www.sei.ie/Grants/Home_Energy_Saving_Scheme/homeowner/About_the_Measures/Wall_Insulation.pdf

Quiksilver

hi johneym, you could be look at in or around €2000-€3000 euros just for the removal. Companies that do the foam insulation, pump the foam into walls that have the wool/fiberglass insulation with the idea that the foam will expand and squash the fiberglass and fill any gaps in the insulation. I could see this causing more of a problem as you will be left with a large compressed mass of fiberglass that would act more so like a sponge.
There're no grants available of the removal process.
As long as the fiberglass isn't water damaged it you could get the external insulation which has a grant of €4000. The €3000 you would pay for the removal could go towards that. It is a good job but is very expensive.

brendankelly

Quick silver is 100% accurate. Even if expanding foam compressed the wool/fibreglass this will cause a cold bridge. and over time the Wool/fibreglass will shrink again causing problems.

People should beware of the 09 VW gangs that would sell sand to an Arab. They will turn up and convince people that Kingspan, a gang of Polish and a bucket of expanding foam will cure every thing. The gang of Polish will then appear that cannot speak enough English to explain what they are trying to do. And next the 09 VW appears looking for money and he will tell you to leave your windows open.

amyg1982

@johneym

Did you ever get this sorted. I am experiencing this with my house now??

Would love to hear any advice

NickSantigo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/107843117#Comment_107843117

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2056154372/old-foam-cavity-wall-insulation

Sorry to bring up an old post but did either you or the OP ever solve this problem? I have the exact same size bungalow as the OP with the exact same issue.

Thanks