Time to take to the streets??

cdsb46

After all this Bulls***t with Fianna Fail not being able to push Cowen out the door, is it now time that we the people take to the streets and push him out, i'm sure by looking at the polls, the majority of the people want the government gone!!!.
The Green Party promised us a vote by the end of January, yet they have failed to do so and are now saying they will wait for the most important piece of legislation in the history of this state to be rectified, yet this legislation still hasn't being even published nearly 5 weeks since the budget. This is a joke we cannot trust them to do anything with the finances of the state, if they cannot publish this important legislation quickly.
It's time we take our democratic right and responsibility to take to the streets and force this government out!!!!
POWER TO THE PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PenelopeT

It's a bit of a joke really. 90% of the country are totally fed up wit him and his party and yet refuses to leave office. The only reason he wants to stay, I can gather, is because he knows his party will be defeated badly at the next election and is clinging onto power while he can. This isn't very democratic of him. The people want him gone. They want an election. They want to reaffirm their faith in politics; but FF have done so much wrong now that noone is willing to put their trust in them. As for the Greens.. don't get me started. Action is required NOW.

PenelopeT

Just a thought.. maybe he won't resign because he knows what the craic is with the dole...?;)

cdsb46

Cowen has said that he wants to this democratically, yet he wasn't elected to the party leader, he was chosen by bertie and not once was he elected by the people to lead the country, ever since he became taoiseach he has tried his best in informing us the citizen's of this state, the IMF secret deal should have being the final straw (how can we trust any of them, when they came out in the public domain and told us there was not going to be an IMF loan) the government is shrouded in secrecy, how can we trust them to put this country right, when they are the party that put us in this mess,by turning a blind eye to help their cronies get as much money out of us as they can!!!!!
Why aren't we on the streets forcing them out!?!?!
It's our democratic responsibility to have our voices heard and to make sure that what we want needs to acted upon!!!!!

sligopark

cdsb46 wrote: »

POWER TO THE PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

far too much fluoride in the water for the Irish to get themselves bithered with protesting over anything really

Ken.

the people of tunisia were able to force their leader out for the love of god and that was practically a dictatorship.

sligopark

lucyfur09 wrote: »

the people of tunisia were able to force their leader out for the love of god and that was practically a dictatorship.

no fluoride there and probably with the covert assistance of the US...

unfortunately they have no interest in a bog pig from offaly.

cdsb46

sligopark wrote: »

far too much fluoride in the water for the Irish to get themselves bithered with protesting over anything really

Well jesus how much sh** is it going to take for this country to stand up for itself and force them out!!!, it's getting ridiculous, the FF party are taking us for fools allowing their leader lie to us in the Dail, be drunk ( hungover) on national radio, be very cosy with the two men that have caused most of damage ( Seanie and Drumm) he was finance minister when all this was happening right under his nose and the taoiseach, he talks about how the party has moved away from brown envelopes, only cos there isn't a big enough brown envelope for 34billion€, he's just as corrupt as Bertie and Haughey, Cowen just did it in bigger numbers!!!!:mad:

sligopark

cdsb46 wrote: »

Well jesus how much sh** is it going to take for this country to stand up for itself and force them out!!!

many of us have asked ourselves just the very same question

cdsb46

sligopark wrote: »

many of us have asked ourselves just the very same question

Lets march so!!!

ilovesleep

cdsb46 wrote: »

Lets march so!!!

I would love to

cdsb46

ilovesleep wrote: »

I would love to

Then when don't you!! why don't we, the FF party is taking us for a ride!!!! not to mention those F**king greens!!!:mad:

pigeonbutler

cdsb46 wrote: »

Lets march so!!!

First of all, you're over-reacting. This government is simply tying up loose ends such as passing the Finance Bill and related legislation before going to an election it is likely to be heavily defeated in.

Also, maybe you don't watch the news very often and therefore haven't realised that a march in itself will get 30 seconds media coverage and be roundly ignored, regardless of how many people show up. That is of course unless it turns violent, in which case there'll be endless media coverage. So really, you're suggesting a violent overthrow of the government?

Which would need to be very violent given that the Gardaí and military are at the disposal of the government to maintain order. If that's what you're suggesting you should say so. The admins might not be keen to help you out by allowing it be promoted on boards though seeing as it would make them partially complicit in something between sedition and treason.

joey54

Are SF not organising a march?

michael999999

The bloody state publically funded broadcaster couldnt be arsed to televise the press conference tonight! There almost as bad as the gangsters in the dail!

cdsb46

pigeonbutler wrote: »

First of all, you're over-reacting. This government is simply tying up loose ends such as passing the Finance Bill and related legislation before going to an election it is likely to be heavily defeated in.

They are taking there time tying up loose ends as i mentioned already it has already taken them 5 weeks to publish the bill and still no sign of it! they are taking us for a ride by prolonging there ultimate death of both government parties, you say that any protest only get about 30 seconds of media coverage, i disagree i seem to remember the imf protest which was covered by all the big media outlets not just in the state but right across the globe for well over 30 seconds, so maybe you should look at the news more!

cdsb46

pigeonbutler wrote: »

Also, maybe you don't watch the news very often and therefore haven't realised that a march in itself will get 30 seconds media coverage and be roundly ignored, regardless of how many people show up. That is of course unless it turns violent, in which case there'll be endless media coverage. So really, you're suggesting a violent overthrow of the government?

Which would need to be very violent given that the Gardaí and military are at the disposal of the government to maintain order. If that's what you're suggesting you should say so. The admins might not be keen to help you out by allowing it be promoted on boards though seeing as it would make them partially complicit in something between sedition and treason.

Also i think you should maybe learn to read more carefully, i never once mentioned violence being used, a government can be forced out by a large rally by the citizens of the state, also many non-violent methods can be used to force the government out, a general strike would be a good option!!

PenelopeT

Excuse me but I don't think cdsb46 is encouraging anything wrong here. Brian Cowen has refused to listen to the frustration of the people and continues to hold his office. I wouldnt be surprised if people DID take tot he streets! He is making a laugh of the political system! How does he expect to retain our respect and patience with this carry on? And clearly we're not the only ones who think it if Michael Martin, who he described as his excellent friend, is intending to vote against him. Embarrassing.

Wolfe Tone

Personally I think we should take to the streets.

Thats all I will say in light of the politics forum charter.

pigeonbutler

cdsb46 wrote: »

They are taking there time tying up loose ends as i mentioned already it has already taken them 5 weeks to publish the bill and still no sign of it! they are taking us for a ride by prolonging there ultimate death of both government parties, you say that any protest only get about 30 seconds of media coverage, i disagree i seem to remember the imf protest which was covered by all the big media outlets not just in the state but right across the globe for well over 30 seconds, so maybe you should look at the news more!

If you look at back at other years you'll find that the Finance Bill is generally published around 31 Jan/1 February. Dept of Finance and AG's office staff have been very tied up with Banking legislation of late also so expecting earlier than usual publication in those circumstances is hardly reasonable.

Most of the people of the country realise that. Of course an opinion poll that asks "Should there be an election now?" will get a majority Yes but that's because it doesn't set the context and scene for people. Off you go and organise a march and we'll see how many join you.

I'd begin to worry more about our democracy when an outspoke group taking to the streets can bring down a government, particularly in the pointless circumstances that the government has agreed its own imminent sell-by date.

ilovesleep

Agree with cdsb46

As angry as i am as to whats happening, i really think violence would no nothing but throw a bad light on ireland. There really isnt any need. A large rally would be great. It would be therapeutic as well. Ireland doesnt have much longer to do this because theres no point protesting when a new government is in power. A lot of people needs to release tension and theres better way than a rally against FF.

Wolfe Tone

To be honest a march will just be ignored.

Im not advocating violence, but a march wont do sh!t.

ilovesleep

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

To be honest a march will just be ignored.

Im not advocating violence, but a march wont do sh!t.

It will show Brian Cowen and FF that they are not wanted.

Wolfe Tone

ilovesleep wrote: »

It will show Brian Cowen and FF that they are not wanted.

Like they dont know that?

sligopark

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Im not advocating violence, but a march wont do sh!t.

Have to agree - how could it be made forceful but non violent and still legal?

• Public urination on the street?
• Discharge of slurry?
• Poorly parked vehicles with anti ff slogans?
• Power washing slogans onto the paths outside the Dail?
• Buckets of earth dropped off outside Leinster House? Buckets of blood?

Rabble Rabble

A note on how Ireland's democracy works.

We elect representatives.
They meet in the Dail.
They elect a government to govern. We dont therefore get to pick the Taoiseach. You may be confusing us with a presidential system. The Taoiseach is elected by the Dail, not the people.

That government lasts a defined limit or until the Dail passes a motion of no confidence in it, or the Government choses itself to go to the People. If it passes the confidence motion it survives, if not it is constitutionally bound to 1) resign, or 2) ( more likely) dissolve the parliament and go to the people. If it is a) the President will ask the Dail to pick another government, without a majority an election must be held.

The swings of public opinion dont matter until this happens. If it were the case the UK coalition would stop ruling right now, it now polls less than labour.

You marching has no effect on this. Nor should it. You could probably get 50,000 people to march against this government, and you could get 50,000 anarchists, at a stretch, to march in favour of anarchism. Or 50,000 Marxists to demand Marxism. You can see why we dont have "street" politics. Governments would change to the system the last biggest march wanted. Dictatorships and the French, have street politics.

So march all you want - it will have no effect until the sane constitutional dissolving of the Dail comes into effect, and a motion of no confidence has already been tabled.

Wolfe Tone

I'm a fan of the aul sit down protests, sit ins, that type of thing.

ilovesleep

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Like they dont know that?

Brian Cowen seems to believe differently.

Rabble Rabble

sit ins are good, not going to change the government though.

cdsb46

pigeonbutler wrote: »

If you look at back at other years you'll find that the Finance Bill is generally published around 31 Jan/1 February. Dept of Finance and AG's office staff have been very tied up with Banking legislation of late also so expecting earlier than usual publication in those circumstances is hardly reasonable.

Most of the people of the country realise that. Of course an opinion poll that asks "Should there be an election now?" will get a majority Yes but that's because it doesn't set the context and scene for people. Off you go and organise a march and we'll see how many join you.

I'd begin to worry more about our democracy when an outspoke group taking to the streets can bring down a government, particularly in the pointless circumstances that the government has agreed its own imminent sell-by date.

Yes but this is as said by both Brian Cowen and John Gormley that this is a very urgent piece of legislation, this is no ordinary Finance Bill, so we therefore can't compare it with previous Finance bill's, if this bill was as important as they all say it would take priority over any other piece of legislation. I feel as do many others the finance bill is a cover so as brian can keep power for little more longer!!!:mad:

MrPirate

I do recall a recent sit-in protest resulting in the Guards beating a number of the protesters who were on the ground doing nothing wrong...

Wolfe Tone

Rabble Rabble wrote: »

sit ins are good, not going to change the government though.

Depends how widespread they are, and where they occur.

cdsb46

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Depends how widespread they are, and where they occur.

Every fianna Fail constituency office would be a nice start, then department offices, maybe look at the smaller departmental offices, it would still have the same reactions

ArtSmart

dunno. looks like rain tomorrow.

the_syco

I wonder how many people will vote them in again? I'm thinking enough.

I know who I won't be voting for: anyone who organised a strike that endangers my job, or a protest which prevented me from going to my job.

phantom_lord

sligopark wrote: »

far too much fluoride in the water for the Irish to get themselves bithered with protesting over anything really

lolers. stick to the conspiracy forum plz.

Wolfe Tone

cdsb46 wrote: »

Every fianna Fail constituency office would be a nice start, then department offices, maybe look at the smaller departmental offices, it would still have the same reactions

Wouldn't bother with constituency offices tbh.

pajor

MrPirate wrote: »

I do recall a recent sit-in protest resulting in the Guards beating a number of the protesters who were on the ground doing nothing wrong...

Yeah, the student protest against the fees. Thats why im thinkin all this 'lets take to the streets' stuff won't work. Due to the constitution saying the guards must be apolitical, they will simply come and bate people and i have very supple skin... :pac:

P. Breathnach

lucyfur09 wrote: »

the people of tunisia were able to force their leader out for the love of god and that was practically a dictatorship.

We'll have our chance in a few weeks' time. That's the advantage of having a functioning democracy rather than a dictatorship.

I don't relate to the impatience so many people are manifesting here.

Further, I am a bit worried that there will be huge shock and disappointment when it dawns on people that the electoral humiliation of FF and the GP won't make things noticeably better: give it six months or so, and people will be bitching about the failures of the (probable) FG/Lab coalition.

ilovesleep

Id love to do something dramatic like a sit in but as rabble rabble has said it would not make a blind bit of difference.
I want to rally around leinster house and show my displeasure and scream, shout and cry and stick my fingers up at FF.

ilovesleep

P. Breathnach wrote: »

We'll have our chance in a few weeks' time. That's the advantage of having a functioning democracy rather than a dictatorship.

I don't relate to the impatience so many people are manifesting here.

Further, I am a bit worried that there will be huge shock and disappointment when it dawns on people that the electoral humiliation of FF and the GP won't make things noticeably better: give it six months or so, and people will be bitching about the failures of the (probable) FG/Lab coalition.

You are right. The damage is done and the new government will be cleaning the mess that FF has created. Hopefully people will have the sense to see that FF got us here.

ArtSmart

P. Breathnach wrote: »

We'll have our chance in a few weeks' time. That's the advantage of having a functioning democracy rather than a dictatorship.

I don't relate to the impatience so many people are manifesting here.

Further, I am a bit worried that there will be huge shock and disappointment when it dawns on people that the electoral humiliation of FF and the GP won't make things noticeably better: give it six months or so, and people will be bitching about the failures of the (probable) FG/Lab coalition.

good point. the Obama syndrome

reckon it'll take a while myself.

but at least the hunger for change, not matter how changeable (he he) is there.

bildo

A lot of apathy, negativity and laziness in this thread.

Who ever says that protesting cannot achieve political change has clearly never been near a history book.
YOU are the people of this country and you are the only ones with power.

If you allow your representatives to behave in this way then they will.
The people of Ireland need to unite and say NO to corruption, NO to secrecy within government and demand the dissolution of the Dail.

It is possible, it happened in Tunisia only last weekend and has happened many times throughout history.

You are your own worst enemies when you maintain these apathetic defeatist attitudes.

Brian Cowan is just a man, you are a nation.

ilovesleep

bildo wrote: »

A lot of apathy, negativity and laziness in this thread.

Who ever says that protesting cannot achieve political change has clearly never been near a history book.
YOU are the people of this country and you are the only ones with power.

If you allow your representatives to behave in this way then they will.
The people of Ireland need to unite and say NO to corruption, NO to secrecy within government and demand the dissolution of the Dail.

It is possible, it happened in Tunisia only last weekend and has happened many times throughout history.

You are your own worst enemies when you maintain these apathetic defeatist attitudes.

Brian Cowan is just a man, you are a nation.

Ok I'll help

cdsb46

Finally someone that has faith in how a true democratic society works, people who say that there is no point in protesting, obviously would just prefer to lie down and allow themselves to be walked all over!!!.... is this what our hero's fought for, for us to just sit back and let this current government walk all over us, why have in recent times irish people felt it right to just sit back when its obvious that the government are and have being lying to us!!!!:mad:

phantom_lord

bildo wrote: »

A lot of apathy, negativity and laziness in this thread.

Who ever says that protesting cannot achieve political change has clearly never been near a history book.
YOU are the people of this country and you are the only ones with power.

If you allow your representatives to behave in this way then they will.
The people of Ireland need to unite and say NO to corruption, NO to secrecy within government and demand the dissolution of the Dail.

It is possible, it happened in Tunisia only last weekend and has happened many times throughout history.

You are your own worst enemies when you maintain these apathetic defeatist attitudes.

Brian Cowan is just a man, you are a nation.

What are you advocating exactly?

cdsb46

phantom_lord wrote: »

What are you advocating exactly?

He's advocating that we should march for dissolution of the dail and are for us the people of ireland to have our say on Fianna Fail and its secrecy and lies, we should have had the right to decide on this IMF deal and how we should get ourselves out of this mess, this will not happen when the people who caused this mess are still hanging for dear life!!!

sligopark

phantom_lord wrote: »

lolers. stick to the conspiracy forum plz.

come on phantom conspiracy forum is for unproven stuff - fluoriding the population ala stalin and the german round up of jews is historical fact - but hey nice one - if I wasn't as informed I would have backed off here - if not a ploy perhaps you should investigate further

sligopark

bildo wrote: »

Brian Cowan is just a man, you are a nation.

meaning?

phantom_lord

sligopark wrote: »

come on phantom conspiracy forum is for unproven stuff

It's for discussion of crazy stuff by gullible people who have spent too much time looking at silly youtube videos.

if I wasn't as informed I would have backed off here

I think you meant misinformed, else you wouldn't be mentioning Hitler and Stalin in the same breath as the fluoridation of Irish water.

if not a ploy perhaps you should investigate further

I've already heard the nonsense spouted about it already tyvm.

sligopark

phantom fluoridation of population is common practice prior to infliction,

and common knowledge


for other theories in regard to conspiracy ala Brian Cowen is a lizard etc I do invite you to the Conspiracy theory forum ...

For fluoridation of populations they will most probably refer you back here