Car tax

superfish

seriously where is our car tax going the state of the roads in the west of Ireland is a complete joke I cant count the number of potholes ive gone through the past couple of month. its ok in the daytime because you can nearly always dodge them but you can forget night time driving. also our cars must be road worthy for uncarworthy roads. as soon as you have no tax or nct they come down on you like a ton of bricks its a shame they are not so fast when it comes to spending on our roads. what are other peoples thoughts on this

mikom

Some government apologist will be along shortly to try and tell you it's motor tax not road tax.
Hold tight.

corktina

Its the bad weather caused the pot holes and due to the recession theres no extra money to fix them quickly.
What would you rather do, pay extra tax to fill them up straight away or drive cautiously for a bit whilst they get around to catching up the back log?

superfish

corktina wrote: »

Its the bad weather caused the pot holes and due to the recession theres no extra money to fix them quickly.
What would you rather do, pay extra tax to fill them up straight away or drive cautiously for a bit whilst they get around to catching up the back log?

id prefer not to have my alloys smashed to bits in the process. why do so many people find the need to defend our government when you are clearly being ripped off. oh I dont mind paying 600 quid a year in car tax and i dont mind payin 1.42 for petrol and I dont mind smashing my car to bits because the government told me we are in recession

corktina

whose defending the govt? simply the roads are in a bit of a mess due to nones fault but Gods and it will take a while to fix them unless we are Ok to pay more tax to pay for them to be fixed quicker (assuming the NRA CCs have the resources to do more work)

superfish

corktina wrote: »

whose defending the govt? simply the roads are in a bit of a mess due to nones fault but Gods and it will take a while to fix them unless we are Ok to pay more tax to pay for them to be fixed quicker (assuming the NRA CCs have the resources to do more work)

so your telling me the damage to the road through tuam was caused by bad weather or that it was caused by the council digging it up countless times to lay pipes, an doing a ****e job of filling it back in. its been that way for years, i could point out a fair few roads around ireland west that are completly neglected and has nothing to do with the bad weather from what you say we might as well give up paying tax because they are not going to bother fixing the roads and we should just blindly accept this

MarkoC

corktina wrote: »

whose defending the govt? simply the roads are in a bit of a mess due to nones fault but Gods and it will take a while to fix them unless we are Ok to pay more tax to pay for them to be fixed quicker (assuming the NRA CCs have the resources to do more work)

And its THE gods fault we pay high taxes for the road maintenance ? Or the god should fix the roads ?
Only god knows why the transport minister gets 250K a year + other benefits when UK Prime Minister gets around 214K
Nearly all the roads are perfect over there. Was driving in UK in sept 2009 on the country roads and they all were in better condition than Cork - Rosslaire N25 MAIN ROAD here ...

What the local idiots did here in Cork ?
Digged up nearly half of the Cork - Middleton road and then found out that due to cold weather the tarmac wont stick to the ground and now people suffering on a moon road now

Also ive seen them fixing 1 nus stop in Cork 3 rimes in 1 month (6 men brigade arrived in the morning, where was job only for 2 men and for couple hours) They spent there all day reading papers, visiting bookies and i dunno what else ... Was looking at them and thought, where the hell i pay my road tax ....

Guy:Incognito

mikom wrote: »

Some government apologist will be along shortly to try and tell you it's motor tax not road tax.
Hold tight.

Whats that got to do with being a government appologist? If they called it Road tax and claimed it went to a fund for road upkeep then there might be a cause to moan, but they clearly call it motor tax and no where do they state it's for the roads. The councils are the ones to moan at about the state of your local roads.

Making silly statements like yours designed to somehow stop people with different opinions from yourself commenting having their say isnot going to work btw.Being worng is being wrong , regardless of who calls you on it or if no one does.

superfish wrote: »

s or that it was caused by the council digging it up countless times to lay pipes, an doing a ****e job of filling it back in.

I thought we were blaming the government?

CarMuppet

I spent euro720 on suspension components for two of my cars in 2010. All costs have been refunded by the county council.

It's a pain the a$$ but at least I've gotten the cash back. It can take up to 4 months for their insurance company to pay out. After spending over euro1800 on road tax in 2010 so I don't feel guilty for claiming. It took a fair but of persuading and phone calls to get the cash back.

As said above the attempt to work on the n25 road in Cork is an other example of a pathetically run public sector department with absolutely no accountability nor planning being demonstrated. Well done lads in the CCC; you've done us proud again.

Max Power1

mikom wrote: »

Some government apologist will be along shortly to try and tell you it's motor tax not road tax.
Hold tight.

Im not a government apologist.

Its called motor tax.

If you are also paying road tax then you are making a voluntary donation. There is no such thing as road tax.


:rolleyes:

billyboy01

All the damage being done to peoples cars due to potholes, is actually good, as it generates new car sales, creates work for mechanics and best of all it brings in revenue for the Government with VAT, VRT and Income tax from the workers in the Garages!

This is an example of Paddy Logic!:)

Ah right Ted!

superfish

Max Power1 wrote: »

Im not a government apologist.

Its called motor tax.

If you are also paying road tax then you are making a voluntary donation. There is no such thing as road tax.


:rolleyes:

ok could you please explain what im paying tax on my car for when I already paid a huge chunk of tax on it when i first bought it ? also if thats the case who pays for the roads were they free ? please elaborate

slimjimmc

superfish wrote: »

ok could you please explain what im paying tax on my car for when I already paid a huge chunk of tax on it when i first bought it ? also if thats the case who pays for the roads were they free ? please elaborate

The VRT is a tax charged on registering the car.
VAT is a tax charged on the purchase of the car, also paid on parts & services.
Motor tax is a tax for being permitted to use the car in a public place.
Road tax is a tax ring-fenced for the maintenance of roads.

We don't do the latter here. The money for road maintenance comes from general exchequer which is made up from all taxes including VAT, VRT, Motor Tax, income tax, commercial tax, etc, and which is also the same pot which funds schools, hospitals, and roads. No specific tax is ring-fenced for roads in Ireland.

The VAT you paid on your internet connection and computer could equally be going towards roads as much as your motor tax (or not as the case may be).

billyboy01

slimjimmc wrote: »

The VRT is a tax charged on registering the car.
VAT is a tax charged on the purchase of the car, also paid on parts & services.
Motor tax is a tax for being permitted to use the car in a public place.
Road tax is a tax ring-fenced for the maintenance of roads.

We don't do the latter here. The money for road maintenance comes from general exchequer which is made up from all taxes including VAT, VRT, Motor Tax, income tax, commercial tax, etc, and which is also the same pot which funds schools, hospitals, and roads. No specific tax is ring-fenced for roads in Ireland.

What about Tolls, and soon to be Tolled roads ie the M50 and N roads!

JP Liz V1

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/motor_tax_and_insurance/motor_tax_rates.html

It is a legal requirement in Ireland to have motor tax if you want to drive your vehicle in a public place. Motor tax is a charge imposed by the Government on some motor vehicles. The revenue from this tax is used to maintain and upgrade the road network in Ireland. Motor tax is collected by your local authority on behalf of the Government.
The amount of motor tax you pay for a vehicle registered before July 2008 is proportionate to the size of your vehicle's engine - in other words, the more powerful your vehicle, the higher the cost of your motor tax. For new cars registered since 1 July 2008, motor tax charges are determined on the basis of seven CO2 emission bands with lower emissions resulting in lower charges.
New cars registered between 1 January 2008 and 30 June 2008 had their motor tax charged on the basis of engine size initially. If it was beneficial for those cars to switch to the CO2 based motor tax system, this happened on the first renewal of motor tax after 1 July 2008. The CO2 based system does not apply to second-hand imports that were registered abroad prior to 2008.
Not only are you obliged by law to pay motor tax to drive your vehicle, you are also required to display evidence that you have paid (i.e., a current tax disc) on the windscreen of your vehicle. Failure to display a current tax disc on your vehicle is considered a motoring offence and will result in a €60 on-the-spot fine issued by a traffic warden or a Garda.

Some bloody potholes you could swim in them

superfish

slimjimmc wrote: »

The VRT is a tax charged on registering the car.
VAT is a tax charged on the purchase of the car, also paid on parts & services.
Motor tax is a tax for being permitted to use the car in a public place.
Road tax is a tax ring-fenced for the maintenance of roads.

We don't do the latter here. The money for road maintenance comes from general exchequer which is made up from all taxes including VAT, VRT, Motor Tax, income tax, commercial tax, etc, and which is also the same pot which funds schools, hospitals, and roads. No specific tax is ring-fenced for roads in Ireland.

thank you. so basically it is us the public that pay for road maintainance. so who cares what form of tax we call it car tax road tax. the point is we are paying for it and nothing is being done. also thankyou for explaining this I was not aware we paid so much tax on just cars whats next

billyboy01

If the car gets taxed anymore and fuel rises, I will be off the road and hence wont be working. Living off the State!

BrianD

It comes from Government funding.

Problem with this country is that it has an extensive road network - most of local roads. Unfortunately, bad planning has meant that we have all these folks living in one off housing on local roads that expect a pristine road surface to their houses.

A bold solution might be to adopt what happens in Australia and New Zealand. Make these bohereens unsealed roads that receive no more maintenance then sending a grader down them once a year. By unsealed I mean, just a stone base that will support vehicular traffic at slow speeds. Think of it, almost 80,000 kms of road could be removed from needing regular maintinance saving us a fortune. This saving could then be applied to M, N and R routes and into public transport.

slimjimmc

billyboy01 wrote: »

What about Tolls, and soon to be Tolled roads ie the M50 and N roads!

Tolls are charge for use of a specific section of road they are not a tax in themselves, in fact tolls have VAT added in the charge. You can legally avoid a toll by avoiding the tolled section, it's much more difficult to drive and avoid a tax.

corktina

bottom line: we have no money...if you want to pay more (or manage without a few hospitals or schools), then you can have better roads

CarMuppet

corktina wrote: »

bottom line: we have no money...if you want to pay more (or manage without a few hospitals or schools), then you can have better roads

Or.... Force the public sector to take on the private sector efficiencies, working hours, work ethics and payscale. As a taxpayer in this little country I demand value for my money!

mikom

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Whats that got to do with being a government appologist? If they called it Road tax and claimed it went to a fund for road upkeep then there might be a cause to moan, but they clearly call it motor tax and no where do they state it's for the roads. The councils are the ones to moan at about the state of your local roads.
Making silly statements like yours designed to somehow stop people with different opinions from yourself commenting having their say isnot going to work btw.Being worng is being wrong , regardless of who calls you on it or if no one does.

Calm down dear.

Guy:Incognito

mikom wrote: »

Calm down dear.

In two well thought out and presented posts you have shown everyone the error of their ways, havnt you?

mikom

Not saying anyone is right or worng.
It's not a matter of right or worng....... just opinions.

Guy:Incognito

mikom wrote: »

Not saying anyone is right or worng.
It's not a matter of right or worng....... just opinions.

It's not as it happens. It's called motor tax and it goes to general council coffers, not some sort of road fund. Thats a fact, not an opinion.

superfish

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

It's not as it happens. It's called motor tax and it goes to general council coffers, not some sort of road fund. Thats a fact, not an opinion.

no matter what you say or how you say it we are still paying for it

Guy:Incognito

superfish wrote: »

no matter what you say or how you say it we are still paying for it

who said we werent

We all pay various taxes etc that fund the country, including the roads. Motor tax forms part of that, but doesnt directly fund roads.motor tax also pays for everythign else councils spend money on.

superfish

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

who said we werent

We all pay various taxes etc that fund the country, including the roads. Motor tax forms part of that, but doesnt directly fund roads.motor tax also pays for everythign else councils spend money on.

the point of the post is that we are paying for a service that is just not being provided. why stick up for the government or council do you enjoy throwing your money away ?

mikom

Ok, you're right, I'm worng.

I'll let your buddies in Renault in on this info......

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handling, the Grand Mégane has a perfectly balanced
chassis and precise steering. Discover the new EDC
(Effi cient-Dual Clutch) automatic gearbox that offers top
level performance with comfort and driving pleasure and
comes with very low consumption and emission level.
Together with a range of high-performance economical
and ecological diesel engines (all available dCi engines
with Band A, lowest road tax : 104€ per year), the Grand
Mégane is proof that driving an estate car can be a
real pleasure.

http://www.renault.ie/media/e-brochures/att00221187/D-Grand-Megane.pdf

Guy:Incognito

superfish wrote: »

the point of the post is that we are paying for a service that is just not being provided. why stick up for the government or council do you enjoy throwing your money away ?

and the relevance of the 2nd post on the thread to that? The fact is we dont pay for road maintenance through some sort of mythical Road tax. Some peopel dont seem to get that fact and constantly come on here bemoaning the fact they pay their motor/road/car etc tax and the roads are ****e in their area. One has little to do with the other.

If you have issues why not take it up with your local councillors or turn up at the next council meeting. Go beyond your computer screen. Or for the chronically lazy, email them.

mikom wrote: »

Ok, you're right, I'm worng.

I'll let your buddies in Renault in on this info......



http://www.renault.ie/media/e-brochures/att00221187/D-Grand-Megane.pdf

Motor distributers (I've heard 2 or 3 others refer to it in their ads too, Kia being one) pandering to the ignorant, or being ignorant themselves. is irrelevant.

superfish

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

and the relevance of the 2nd post on the thread to that? The fact is we dont pay for road maintenance through some sort of mythical Road tax. Some peopel dont seem to get that fact and constantly come on here bemoaning the fact they pay their motor/road/car etc tax and the roads are ****e in their area. One has little to do with the other.




Motor distributers (I've heard 2 or 3 others refer to it in their ads too, Kia being one) pandering to the ignorant, or being ignorant themselves. is irrelevant.

I did not post the second post. if you look through the thread its apparent we do pay for it and if not how do you suppose the roads were built in the first place they did not just appear i think the tax payer may have had something to do with it, as does the tax payer have everything to do with their upkeep. now your stating the car manufacturers are wrong and your right

Guy:Incognito

superfish wrote: »

now your stating the car manufacturers are wrong and your right

Yes thats exactly what I'm saying.

https://www.motortax.ie/OMT/welcome.do;jsessionid=0aa0114830d72c292949609041ad9e358e06df1d86f8.e38PaNaSbhuOay0MahaMe0

Can you find any refernce to a road tax there or anywhere it says motortax goes directly to road funding?

superfish wrote: »

I did not post the second post. if you look through the thread its apparent we do pay for it and if not how do you suppose the roads were built in the first place they did not just appear i think the tax payer may have had something to do with it, as does the tax payer have everything to do with their upkeep.

I never said you were the poster of the 2nd post. I was makign the point that thats what I was replying to.

Yes , roads are taxpayer funded, but not from motortax, at least not anymore than any other tax. All taxes collected go in to a big pot. From that the country is funded. No one tax is ringfenced for roads.

It's really not very difficult stuff and being ignorant of the facts doesnt make you right.

superfish

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Yes thats exactly what I'm saying.

prove it then in the meantime you may want to have a read of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignorance

Guy:Incognito

superfish wrote: »

prove it then in the meantime you may want to have a read of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignorance

Ah the type of post that facepalms were made for. If you take a look back at the post you just quoted you'll find a link to motortax.ie, where all your questions will be answered.

Many people, including a lot that should know better, refer to things like "fast lanes" on our motorways. Are they right too just because they say it?

-Chris-

superfish wrote: »

the point of the post is that we are paying for a service that is just not being provided. why stick up for the government or council do you enjoy throwing your money away ?

The fundamental problem with your argument imho is that the Gov't need to take in a certain amount of revenue in order to run the country, and the council are tasked with fixing the roads.
If nobody pays Motor Tax, then the Gov't will have to raise revenue elsewhere, by increasing a different tax. If they don't plug the revenue gap they'll have to cut expenditure, but not specifically anything to do with cars/roads.
Whether the council fix your roads is based on their efficiency and priorities, and nothing to do with whether you pay your Motor Tax or how the Gov't is doing at balancing their books.

If you want your road fixed, lobby your Council or whoever to get it done. Refusing to pay one specific tax, out of a multitude of taxes you're subject to, will make damn all difference as to whether they fix the road or not.

Absurdum

http://www.vrt.ie/roadtax.php

http://www.whatcar.ie/roadtaxcalculator.php

http://www.motorcheck.ie/faq/does-it-have-valid-road-tax

http://story.irishsun.com/index.php/ct/9/cid/15665b944045da4a/id/42052946/

general public in colloquialism shocker!

Guy:Incognito

Absurdum wrote: »

http://www.vrt.ie/roadtax.php

http://www.whatcar.ie/roadtaxcalculator.php

http://www.motorcheck.ie/faq/does-it-have-valid-road-tax

http://story.irishsun.com/index.php/ct/9/cid/15665b944045da4a/id/42052946/

general public in colloquialism shocker!

Again, the press being ignorant is no defence. All it leads to is ill informed rants.

Bar the first one, cos i dotn know who runs it, the others are offshoots of UK businesses afaik. The UK does have somethign called Road tax. Thats people being lazy.

-Chris-

AFAIK, in the UK it's Road Fund License

Guy:Incognito

-Chris- wrote: »

AFAIK, in the UK it's Road Fund License

Was it not changed to or from car/road tax at one stage recently enough though?
I will hold my hands up here to having little interest in what the UK called their system of tax as I'm not involved in paying it :-)

Absurdum

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Again, the press being ignorant is no defence. All it leads to is ill informed rants.

Bar the first one, cos i dotn know who runs it, the others are offshoots of UK businesses afaik. The UK does have somethign called Road tax. Thats people being lazy.

really, who cares, we all know what people are referring to :rolleyes:

Guy:Incognito

Absurdum wrote: »

really, who cares, we all know what people are referring to :rolleyes:

The people starting threads about how the roads are crap even though they pay their "road tax" seem to care. If they informed themselves about what its called and where it goes they could use all that energy they waste whipping themsleves in to a tissy actually talkign to peopel who matter/ care or can do something about the roads.

Having ill informed rants on here is not going to fix **** all.

If I start calling income tax hospital tax can I start demanding whatever amounts of income tax are collected in the country be used soley for hospitals?

-Chris-

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Was it not changed to or from car/road tax at one stage recently enough though?
I will hold my hands up here to having little interest in what the UK called their system of tax as I'm not involved in paying it :-)

Me neither, it's just something I picked up (that may have become out of date in the meantime ).

Absurdum wrote: »

really, who cares, we all know what people are referring to

But that's the point - it's not ringfenced for roads, it's disingenuous to call it Road Tax and refusing to pay Road Tax (or paying more of it) won't directly influence the state of our roads!!

Absurdum

I don't think that calling it "road tax" implies that it is therefore exclusively to be used to pay for roads, rather that it is a tax for the privilege of using the roads

Guy:Incognito

Absurdum wrote: »

I don't think that calling it "road tax" implies that it is therefore exclusively to be used to pay for roads, rather that it is a tax for the privilege of using the roads

But its neither, nor is it claimed to be. Which is the point.

superfish

feck this im not gunna hang round here anymore im getting myself a shovel and some gravel and im gunna fill every pot hole in ireland they dont call me superfish for nothing ya know. now who wants to help ????.....

Guy:Incognito

superfish wrote: »

now who wants to help ????.....

You should ask the council, they might help.......

Did you find all that info to prove me wrong and the car manufacturers right btw? I assume not seeign as it hasnt been mentioned again.

superfish

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

You should ask the council, they might help.......

and they might not too they would just slow me down anyway with all that shovel leaning

-Chris-

Absurdum wrote: »

I don't think that calling it "road tax" implies that it is therefore exclusively to be used to pay for roads, rather that it is a tax for the privilege of using the roads

But I thought that was the entire point of the thread:

superfish wrote: »

seriously where is our car tax going the state of the roads in the west of Ireland is a complete joke...

CiniO

superfish wrote: »

seriously where is our car tax going the state of the roads in the west of Ireland is a complete joke I cant count the number of potholes ive gone through the past couple of month. its ok in the daytime because you can nearly always dodge them but you can forget night time driving. also our cars must be road worthy for uncarworthy roads. as soon as you have no tax or nct they come down on you like a ton of bricks its a shame they are not so fast when it comes to spending on our roads. what are other peoples thoughts on this

My thoughts on this are, that Irish roads are not ready for winter conditions.
Usually there was no real winter in Ireland, so the roads were grand. When some frosts came in, many roads just didn't manage to survive.
You can say it's the government's fault, but how could they know there will be such a severe winters in Ireland. (this applies to all similar topics like burst water pipes, slippery roads with not enough gritting, etc... Reason is only one - no one really expected such a weather, when they were building these roads, pipes, etc).
I'm sure there isn't enough people, money, and equipment to fix all the roads in one moment.

Comparing with other countries. F.E. Germany. Roads are great, but they were designed to survive severe frosts, as these are usual in Germany. At least tax payers know where their money went.
Other example - Poland. Roads are crap like in Ireland. Even everyone knows there are severe winters in Poland, roads are just not ready for it, and after every winter plenty of potholes appear. But how can they build good roads, if there isn't any money? There is no motor tax in Poland, so at least tax payers can't complain that their money is wasted.

Builderfromhell

On a serious note, the roads will continue to deteriorate owing to damage caused by severe weather. The Local Authorities are broke and if they have any money it will be spent on flood prevention and repairing more damage.

The immediate solution is to drive a vehicle with strong suspension. A 4 x4 perhaps.

superfish

some good and informative points being made so basically the problem is just going to get worse. we had a bad winter last year and this year so do you think they will prepare for it next year ? they cant keep using the excuse that it was unexpected. looks to me as if its time to jump ship (not just because of the roads ) but where is a good country to go to ?