Irish Times Poll Results - December '10

Sully

Irish Times poll results out..

FF 17 -7, FG 30 +6, Lab 25 -8, SF 15 +7, GP 2 n/c, Ind 11 +2.

This is a follow on from the last Irish Times poll in June which saw Labour at 32%, a new found fame for them which is slowly dwindling away it would seem. FG are stable, but SFs rise is being confirmed. Labour supporters moving to SF in election shocker? Cant see SF getting enough candidates tbh, nevermind votes! Fianna Fails downturn still on track, thank god.

Summary? No party running away with it just yet, but FG steading up. Can they peak or is this their peak? Can Labour regain some ground? Just a poll mind, but it gives a rough indication.

Labour/SF/Ind if it turned out to be true? Labour wont deny it, but would Sinn Fein really go into government with Labour?!

No info on personal ratings.

Sully

Got the leaders results..

Taoiseach Brian Cowen is down 5% to 14%, Fine Gael's Enda Kenny is down 2% to 23% and Labour's Eamon Gilmore is down 5% to 44%.

The Greens' John Gormley is down 5% to 13% and Sinn Féin's Gerry Adams falls 1% to 28%.

Sulmac

For the four largest parties, those are quite large swings, though I guess it has been three months since the last one from them. Have they adopted a new polling methodology? These results are quite consistent with the poll in The Irish Sun/RedC a few weeks ago.

Great result for Sinn Féin, good for Fine Gael, worrying for Labour and another disaster for Fianna Fáil (although higher than the 13% recorded in The Irish Sun/RedC poll). Greens still have their core vote, it seems.

Another result of tonight's poll: 8% (-5) satisfied and 90% dissatisfied with the government's performance.

OhNoYouDidn't

As with all polls, it has to be taken with a pinch of salt.

But who in the name of Jaysis are the 8% satisfied with the government?

14% are happy with Cowan and 8% the government?

irishh_bob

Sully wrote: »

Irish Times poll results out..

FF 17 -7, FG 30 +6, Lab 25 -8, SF 15 +7, GP 2 n/c, Ind 11 +2.

This is a follow on from the last Irish Times poll in June which saw Labour at 32%, a new found fame for them which is slowly dwindling away it would seem. FG are stable, but SFs rise is being confirmed. Labour supporters moving to SF in election shocker? Cant see SF getting enough candidates tbh, nevermind votes! Fianna Fails downturn still on track, thank god.

Summary? No party running away with it just yet, but FG steading up. Can they peak or is this their peak? Can Labour regain some ground? Just a poll mind, but it gives a rough indication.

Labour/SF/Ind if it turned out to be true? Labour wont deny it, but would Sinn Fein really go into government with Labour?!

No info on personal ratings.

looks like both sinn fein and fine gael have made good moves

sinn fein moving gerry down south has energised the party and electorate + pearse doherty has hit the ground running since his election

as for fine gael , they,ve been keeping enda hid in the closet this past few weeks while ( the more authoritive ) michael noonan has moved to the fore and produced stellar performances in the dail and in the media

Chucky the tree

Enda Kenny is really holding back FG.

irishh_bob

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Enda Kenny is really holding back FG.

with a decent leader , fine gael would be on 45 % , labour have more than doubled thier vote since 2007 , fine gael have added a mere half dozen points and sometimes less

Sully

For a man holding back the party, there doing very well in polls.. Record levels. Many folk voted FG in the locals and european elections, under Kenny, so I think most of the crap on leaders (all bar FF) is down to media.

FG have done consistently well with him being in media and out of media. So I discount that. On the flip side, Noonan was despised by the media also during his time.

So, in my view, the media don't portray it as it is here. Very influencial.

Look at SF.. Media giving them no time, yet they hammered everyone in Donegal and have reached new heights in polls.

Bizzare.

PeterIanStaker

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

As with all polls, it has to be taken with a pinch of salt.

But who in the name of Jaysis are the 8% satisfied with the government?

14% are happy with Cowan and 8% the government?

I reckon that support for FF is in around the 25% mark just people won't admit it. Sad I know.

mike65

FF 17 -7, FG 30 +6,

Lab 25 -8, SF 15 +7

Looks like leftish vote is leaking towards SF.

90% dissatisfied with government.

Oasis_Dublin

These polls are a waste of time. People say they will vote Fine Gael or Sinn Féin but we all know these mindless drones will vote FF, uimhir a haon. Irish people get the government which they deserve.

Mr.Micro

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

These polls are a waste of time. People say they will vote Fine Gael or Sinn Féin but we all know these mindless drones will vote FF, uimhir a haon. Irish people get the government which they deserve.

I agree these are the people who think the Celtic Tiger is going to come back if they vote FF.

Amhran Nua

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

These polls are a waste of time. People say they will vote Fine Gael or Sinn Féin but we all know these mindless drones will vote FF, uimhir a haon. Irish people get the government which they deserve.

The polls are a waste of time, because people vote for TDs, not for parties. Whoever has filled in the most potholes that will get the most seats. Has Labour even bothered to come out with any policies yet?

Oasis_Dublin

I'm not sure how much of it is party allegiance and how much of it is based purely on the candidate. There are definitely some people who will not vote for certain candidates because of the party they are aligned to however.

Mr.Micro

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I'm not sure how much of it is party allegiance and how much of it is based purely on the candidate. There are definitely some people who will not vote for certain candidates because of the party they are aligned to however.

Just yesterday I overheard a conversation where a person was saying to another FF have been in power forever and the country needs a change. The reply of the other person was " I could not bring myself to vote for FG.....and incredulity in his voice asking the other "could you"? So its party not policies.....sheep.

NewHillel

Sully wrote: »

For a man holding back the party, there doing very well in polls.. Record levels. Many folk voted FG in the locals and european elections, under Kenny, so I think most of the crap on leaders (all bar FF) is down to media.

FG have done consistently well with him being in media and out of media. So I discount that. On the flip side, Noonan was despised by the media also during his time.

So, in my view, the media don't portray it as it is here. Very influencial.

I don't agree, IMO FG would be doing much better under Richard Bruton. Enda just hasn't got the charisma to get the public behind him. I don't think its a coincidence that the rating goes up when Enda keeps a low profile. (M Noonan is excellent at the moment, though. I'm looking forward to him being a government minister, again.)

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

These polls are a waste of time. People say they will vote Fine Gael or Sinn Féin but we all know these mindless drones will vote FF, uimhir a haon. Irish people get the government which they deserve.

Mindless drones, sheep, what next?
The reality is straightforward - Cognitive Dissonance. People have invested so much time and energy supporting FF that they can't allow themselves believe that they have been duped. Its easy to recognize CD in others, not so easy to recognize, or deal with, in ourselves. So, not drones, not Sheep, just human like us all.

Oasis_Dublin

Bah. It's a secret ballot!

North_West_Art

Sully wrote: »

Look at SF.. Media giving them no time, yet they hammered everyone in Donegal and have reached new heights in polls.

Bizzare.

because the media are funded by the government, and will do their utmost to put negative spin on SF, if even mention them at all, particularly after the by-election result in DSW where they ran away with the vote.. all down to Pearse Doherty, who forced the by-election, then hammered the opposition. They gained the young vote, because most young people are online every day, a lot of support gained through social networking sites.
Ireland's electorate is young. State run media (rte) is watched by the older generations.. most young people have turned away from this

Amhran Nua

Amhran Nua wrote: »

The polls are a waste of time, because people vote for TDs, not for parties. Whoever has filled in the most potholes that will get the most seats. Has Labour even bothered to come out with any policies yet?

I'm kind of surprised about how lazy you can be. I hope this is the last time labours policies get pointed out to you.

http://www.labour.ie/policy/

North_West_Art

North_West_Art wrote: »

because the media are funded by the government, and will do their utmost to put negative spin on SF, if even mention them at all, particularly after the by-election result in DSW where they ran away with the vote.. all down to Pearse Doherty, who forced the by-election, then hammered the opposition. They gained the young vote, because most young people are online every day, a lot of support gained through social networking sites.
Ireland's electorate is young. State run media (rte) is watched by the older generations.. most young people have turned away from this

Unfortunately most young people have turned away from the polls as well though

Fo Real

No major surprises there for me tbh. Fine Gael have some very impressive representives, in particular James Reilly, Leo Varadkar and Michael Noonan. Anytime they are on a political panel on a TV/radio talkshow, they wipe the floor with the other speakers. Always informed and articulate. I know who'll I'll be voting for in the upcoming election.

The drop in support for Labour can probably be attributed to the revelations of Gilmore's "colourful" past coming to the fore and becoming more widely known. And by colourful, I mean a very strong red. The man was associated with the Sinn Féin Workers Party and supported communist governments across the globe including North Korea. He also opposed the Solidarity movement that strove to bring democracy to Poland.

Sinn Féin's rise in support probably comes from the hicks that previoulsy supported FF. From one Republican party to another. SF have (alledgedly) left the gun behind so people don't feel shame voting for them now and their younger candidates have no conection to the party's past terrorist activites.

Just my 2 cents on the poll.

hotmail.com

My analysis:

FF - This poll confirms that FF's vote is firmly below 20%, a psychological level that may influence Cowen's continued leadership of the party over the coming weeks. If this poll figure is reflected in the election, FF will struggle to get 35 seats, a complete disaster for the party.

FG - Despite a rise of 6 points, 30% is still a poor result for FG given that FF's vote has competely collapsed. Essentially FG is only up by 3 points on the 2007 election on the basis of this poll. The prospect of existing FG TDs losing seats in tight areas is actually a possibility with 30%.

Lab - This poll reflects the fragility of the Labour vote. They are a semi protest party and it seems that many of the protest voters have moved to SF.

Greens - They are within the margin of error, enough said.

SF - Their vote is fragile like Lab, if they keep protesting they will do well and could pick up to 10 seats next time round. SF is popular in areas where for whatever reason, many of the electrot don't traditionally vote. They are also transfer unfriendly and the presence of Gerry Adams will only perpetuate that unfriendliness in my view.

Ind - The next Dail will have a lot of independents (and I include Joe Higgins, Richard Boyd Barret and Claire Daly in that lump).

Sully

NewHillel wrote: »

I don't agree, IMO FG would be doing much better under Richard Bruton. Enda just hasn't got the charisma to get the public behind him. I don't think its a coincidence that the rating goes up when Enda keeps a low profile. (M Noonan is excellent at the moment, though. I'm looking forward to him being a government minister, again.)

Christ almighty on a stick - no chance. Fine Gael is much more then one man. Put someone else instead of Enda, and people will moan. Bruton doesn't have leadership qualities - people just like him because he knows his finances. Noonan comes on the scene, and people think he should be the future leader. FGs ratings have been high regardless of Kenny being in public or not. Do you think if he goes quiet people say "Enda who? I'm voting FG, no idea what your on about - Kenny? Leader? Who?"

North_West_Art wrote: »

They gained the young vote, because most young people are online every day, a lot of support gained through social networking sites.

If anything, its Fine Gael that attracts the youth vote - YFG is the largest youth political wing. SFs youth presence is effectively non-existent. Its the larger parties using social networking sites, most young people don't give a toss about SF.

It was also a heavy YFG presence in Donegal throughout.

Unless, you have some stats on the bye-election vote indicating youth voting?

Oasis_Dublin

Is YFG really the largest of the ogras?

NewHillel

Sully wrote: »

Noonan comes on the scene, and people think he should be the future leader.

He had his chance and was deemed wanting. IMO FG should have stuck with him, far better than Enda.

Sully wrote: »

If anything, its Fine Gael that attracts the youth vote - YFG is the largest youth political wing. SFs youth presence is effectively non-existent. Its the larger parties using social networking sites, most young people don't give a toss about SF.

Any evidence for that? IMO YFG is not a patch on YFF - YFF get them young, in their mid-teens and groom them for servitude. By all accounts it works - lots of FF Groupies still out there on College Campuses. (I'd love to be proved wrong on this, BTW.)

P.S. I haven't seen any supposed deities on a stick, but it'll take some Deity to save us all now. (We're doomed I tell you, ah doomed. :eek:)

steelcityblues

Fo Real wrote: »

No major surprises there for me tbh. Fine Gael have some very impressive representives, in particular James Reilly, Leo Varadkar and Michael Noonan. Anytime they are on a political panel on a TV/radio talkshow, they wipe the floor with the other speakers. Always informed and articulate. I know who'll I'll be voting for in the upcoming election.

The drop in support for Labour can probably be attributed to the revelations of Gilmore's "colourful" past coming to the fore and becoming more widely known. And by colourful, I mean a very strong red. The man was associated with the Sinn Féin Workers Party and supported communist governments across the globe including North Korea. He also opposed the Solidarity movement that strove to bring democracy to Poland.

Sinn Féin's rise in support probably comes from the hicks that previoulsy supported FF. From one Republican party to another. SF have (alledgedly) left the gun behind so people don't feel shame voting for them now and their younger candidates have no conection to the party's past terrorist activites.

Just my 2 cents on the poll.

Or maybe just a lot of people who respect the fact that their current TDs actually know the meaning of the word republicanism - which we've seen by their non complaince to the EU masters, measures to properly punish the rogue bankers/developers, and by pushing for by-elections to be actually held.

Also, it won't be just former FFers, but many who would have been kind to Labour in the past, but are now copping on that Gilmore really stands for nothing, who will seriously consider SF now. They are the real losers of recent polls, and the stingy comments from Labour people to SF people on several forums shows they are in a crisis now.

As long as the days of FF being a major party are actually over, then I think you and I can at least agree that is progress.

Amhran Nua

Papa Smut wrote: »

I'm kind of surprised about how lazy you can be. I hope this is the last time labours policies get pointed out to you.

http://www.labour.ie/policy/

Great, did they put them out last week? Good to see they have finally come out with some sort of policies rather than just relying on Gilmore. Well, good in that at least we know what labour means to do:

• €500m toward a jobs fund - thats not going to turn much around
• A three year wage freeze - stagflation here we come
• Remove minimum wage reduction - good, but how does that work with a wage freeze
• Professional fees reform - the IMF beat you to it lads
• Upward only rent reviews - banned in February
• Establishing a national bank with the pension fund - already gutted to bail out the banks (ironic!)
• Citizens bonds - already done, national solidarity bond
• Exports to developing countries, STI - the middle class in developing countries is below a minimum wage earner here in terms of spending power, if SFI can suck up billions without producing a marketable product why are they talking about protecting our IP

...and on and on and on, you give up after a while. I couldn't find any reference to cuts except €4.5 billion, is that the extent of it? Tax rises:

• Increase carbon tax to €25 per tonne (net of fuel poverty measures) 130
• Reduce Pension Reliefs 400
• Third rate of tax at 48% 255
• Investment Property Relief 150
• Property schemes 360
• Minor Reliefs 219
• Progressive Structure for Capital Gains Tax 130
• New rate structure and thresholds for CAT 110
• 5% increase in rate of DIRT to 30% 125
• Reduction in personal credit by €250 335
• Increase tax on seconds homes from 200 to 500 94
• Excise package and anti-smuggling initiative 180
• Tax Exiles 100
• Abolish airport travel tax -110

Total Tax Measures 2478

Lovely, so more than half what they want to cut in tax increases. Not that it will make any difference, they could have released policies indicating they wanted to focus primarily on Ireland's cabbage industry and they would still get the votes based on the number of potholes filled.

Lazy indeed.

Sully

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

Is YFG really the largest of the ogras?

NewHillel wrote: »

Any evidence for that? IMO YFG is not a patch on YFF - YFF get them young, in their mid-teens and groom them for servitude. By all accounts it works - lots of FF Groupies still out there on College Campuses. (I'd love to be proved wrong on this, BTW.)

Ah no, I think I read that part wrong on double checking - its one of the largest, but Ogra FF is the largest according to Wikipedia. Whether that changed in recent years - I have no idea, because speaking from various colleges societies its mostly FG youth groups with a base or large membership exceeding Fianna Fail in recent times.

I assume membership figures cant be proved either way, so Ogra Greens could be kicking everyones ass?!

Fo Real

steelcityblues wrote: »

Or maybe just a lot of people who respect the fact that their current TDs actually know the meaning of the word republicanism - which we've seen by their non complaince to the EU masters, measures to properly punish the rogue bankers/developers, and by pushing for by-elections to be actually held.

I'll agree that Sinn Féin putting forward a team of young, fresh candidates is a smart move. They first tasted success using this tactic with Mary Lou McDonald and haven't looked back since. They need to sever all ties with their terrorist past (that includes getting rid of Gerry as party leader) and then they may become tolerable as a mainstream party by people such as myself, even if I don't agree with their extremist euro-sceptic views.

Also, it won't be just former FFers, but many who would have been kind to Labour in the past, but are now copping on that Gilmore really stands for nothing, who will seriously consider SF now. They are the real losers of recent polls, and the stingy comments from Labour people to SF people on several forums shows they are in a crisis now.

I disagree that Gilmore stands for nothing. He is a closet Communist and would get moist at the thought of Castro paying a state visit to the Soviet Republic of Ireland. I suggest you do some research on his past views on the USSR and other Communist states.

I agree that there is a lot of voters swinging between Labour and SF. This makes sense as they are both Lefty parties and a government composed of the two is a real possibility after the next general election. Although personally I'd see it as a nightmare scenario where trade unions carry their members onto the gravy train while the rest of us are left with this massive national debt burden.

As long as the days of FF being a major party are actually over, then I think you and I can at least agree that is progress.

True. But I think FF will return witin the next decade. There will always be people who can be bought by a gombeen.

thebman

Fo Real wrote: »

True. But I think FF will return witin the next decade. There will always be people who can be bought by a gombeen.

This is exactly why political system reform should be the top of everyone who cares about our countries agenda.

Anything else is selling republic down the train to try to your local potholes filled/planning permission and is essentially corruption in my book as it means you are selling out to your local interest at the expense of the entire nation.

Sir Oxman

Talking to a friend of mine today about who he and his wife will vote for in the GE and it was FG.
Both had never gave them a vote before, would have been Labour nationally and SF locally in the past.
This is an unemployed man and wife on reduced hours with 3 kids barely holding heads above water.
The Labour and SF stuff hasn't done it for them - they know they'll be taking more cuts but feel FG are the best bet to get a review of the bailout and apply some kind of stimulus to the economy.

I've no gripe with Kenny but FG should really be a good bit higher than all polls suggest - at least a steady mid 30s maybe higher.
I think it's down to him being leader (for some reason)

meglome

gambiaman wrote: »

I've no gripe with Kenny but FG should really be a good bit higher than all polls suggest - at least a steady mid 30s maybe higher.
I think it's down to him being leader (for some reason)

Kenny isn't a bad guy but the public just don't like him. You look at Tony Blair and Gordon Brown in the UK. For all the things Blair did wrong the public generally liked him but Labour were hammered in the last election with Brown in charge. It'll be a real shame if FG don't get rid of Kenny as leader, not because he's a bad leader but because they'll lose votes. It's very likely Labour will get into government with FG but I'd like Labour to have as little say as possible given their policies.

ednwireland

anyone think joan is a liability for labour (i do)
i would vote fg but the new candidtate they are putting up in donegal sw, has some serious past and cant give him a vote.

thebman

She is a liability for Labour as she won't talk policy and prefers to just constantly attack when on TV shows.

Makes her seem like she doesn't know her own parties policies or at least doesn't want the public to know what their policies are.

femur61

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Enda Kenny is really holding back FG.

I have emailed Enda, and lots of the front bench saying the same thing. Maybe if more people did it but it appears everybody says it they/he would listen. SF in power scares me but if FG won't listen to the public on their choice of leader would we be ignored on other issues.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Wonder if it looked like FG were to do badly would Leo Varadkar be fast tracked in as leader.

Bruton's pissed on his chips and is probably seen as a traitor to the non-dublin support base now.

thebman

Amhran Nua wrote: »

Total Tax Measures 2478

Lovely, so more than half what they want to cut in tax increases. Not that it will make any difference, they could have released policies indicating they wanted to focus primarily on Ireland's cabbage industry and they would still get the votes based on the number of potholes filled.

Lazy indeed.

Exactly the problem with Labour, if you increase taxes, you harm the economy.

You should cut more than you tax in order to do minimal harm to the economy as any harm to the economy means more taxes/cuts in future.

North_West_Art

Papa Smut wrote: »

Unfortunately most young people have turned away from the polls as well though

yes, most young people tend to ignore the polls, I wonder what is the ratio of young to old that participate in the polls? (ps. I cant find my original post and dont remember deleting it... it has mysteriously vanished!?)

caseyann

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

As with all polls, it has to be taken with a pinch of salt.

But who in the name of Jaysis are the 8% satisfied with the government?

14% are happy with Cowan and 8% the government?

I would say thats their family members voting for them

Sully

Good old Dempsey had a few words to say about this today..

Reacting to the poll, Mr Dempsey said Fianna Fáil will have a very difficult election but they will put their plan to the people and others will do the same.
He said the party's showing was disappointing, but not unexpected after what they have gone through in the last three or four weeks with the EU-IMF bailout and the Budget.
Commenting on the Opposition parties' results, Mr Dempsey said the results show the Labour Party is beginning to be 'found out' now it has to put forward policies.
He added that Fine Gael's strategy of keeping leader Enda Kenny off the airwaves seems to be working well.

Ever notice that the FF line is always about their hardship is being caused by the tough choices recently made? Still in denial. And couldn't knock FG, just Kenny? Maybe he hasn't noticed that his own party leader has insulted the nation more times and failed to lead, never mind being in the gutter with his personal ratings.

North_West_Art

Sully wrote: »

If anything, its Fine Gael that attracts the youth vote - YFG is the largest youth political wing. SFs youth presence is effectively non-existent. Its the larger parties using social networking sites, most young people don't give a toss about SF.

"according to the Sunday Independent/IMS poll, a staggering 18 per cent of 18- to 24-year-olds would vote for Sinn Fein"

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/editorial/fatal-attraction-18-per-cent-of-young-bloods-would-vote-sf-486420.html

Not saying this is good or bad, I spotted it in the Indo, thats all

Sully

North_West_Art wrote: »

"according to the Sunday Independent/IMS poll, a staggering 18 per cent of 18- to 24-year-olds would vote for Sinn Fein"

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/editorial/fatal-attraction-18-per-cent-of-young-bloods-would-vote-sf-486420.html

Not saying this is good or bad, I spotted it in the Indo, thats all

Thanks for that link, thats the type of research I like to here.

Though, Donegal is different so I would have doubts that large amounts of youth voted. Plus it was on a day of college - but according to that, its the youth in employment.

Fantastic info though, thanks!

EDIT: Just spotted the date. With so many liking SF, their vote count was fairly low in the last election. Very interesting and id love to see that poll done again.

Wolfe Tone

North_West_Art wrote: »

"according to the Sunday Independent/IMS poll, a staggering 18 per cent of 18- to 24-year-olds would vote for Sinn Fein"

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/editorial/fatal-attraction-18-per-cent-of-young-bloods-would-vote-sf-486420.html

Not saying this is good or bad, I spotted it in the Indo, thats all

I know loads of young people who are planning to vote SF, people who I never thought would.

Flex

Very thankful to see Labour have declined. People may becoming more aware of their policies (nearly 60% of deficit correction to come via tax increases, great idea...). I think as time goes on, Labours support will drop as many people saying they will vote Labour are former Fianna Fail voters who will vote Fine Gael but refuse to publically admit it. Labour should be ashamed of themselves, surely they realise how much their policies would hinder an economy and makes things worse, yet they still put them out, preying on the ignorant and dim witted.

Strongly hope that Fine Gael can form a majority government after the election. Was emailing my local TD and was told they are planning to run enough candidates to win an overall majority. Im sure Enda Kenny is holding them back, but I hope that when it comes to casting their vote, people keep things in perspective.

irishh_bob

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

I reckon that support for FF is in around the 25% mark just people won't admit it. Sad I know.

you could be right , i reckon they will still get over 35 seats

thier are a few demographics who are still loyal to them in large numbers

pensioners = no cuts whatsoever since the start of the rescession and a 150% increase in payments since 1997

farmers = farmers only ever vote for one of two parties ( monaghan farmers excluded ) and farming is going very well at the moment

public sector workers = regardless of recent cuts , they are still very well paid and those ps workers who are on in years know FF have always looked after the unions and public sector worker

thier is also still a large number of voters ( especially in rural ireland ) who vote along family lines

Oasis_Dublin

I know one rather famous building familiy who still plan to vote for FF, not because building is going well now or because FF have policies to stimulate it in the future but because of what FF did in the past. This is the kind of blind stupidity that is dictating (some of) the electorate.

later12

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I know one rather famous building familiy who still plan to vote for FF, not because building is going well now or because FF have policies to stimulate it in the future but because of what FF did in the past. This is the kind of blind stupidity that is dictating (some of) the electorate.

My parents have always supported FF in thanks what Charlie Haughey did for the horse industry. Before that we were, to use a depressing term, Fine Gael people as far back as the Civil war.

Progress, eh?

Now in fairness, it isn't entirely mad to vote for a party because of their previous policies. If a party has a particular affinity with building, or a track record in promoting the horse industry, or any industry for that matter, then it is not particularly crazy to at least take that into account when casting your vote.

After all, many people will never vote FF again because of (what will be) their old policies. Why not vote for them, at least partially because you like some of their old policies?

I'm not defending the people you refer to, however it is worth bearing in mind that it is at least somewhat understandable from their point of view.

Oasis_Dublin

I do accept that people are loyal to decisions which they have made in the past but surely an election is about what is set to happen over the term of the TDs stay in the Dáil.

Jayuu

I never really get this obsession with the popularity of a leader and using that as a reason to vote or not vote for a party. While a leader is the figurehead of a party, ultimately he (or she) is only one person. Ultimately whichever of the parties are in government, there is going to be an entire team of people working together. Why are people so seemingly obsessed with just one or two individuals?

As concerns the "charismatic" issue, well I'd prefer to have somebody competent as opposed to charismatic any day. I think I've had my fill of so-called charismatic leaders over the last twenty years.

hotmail.com

Oasis_Dublin wrote: »

I do accept that people are loyal to decisions which they have made in the past but surely an election is about what is set to happen over the term of the TDs stay in the Dáil.

I don't accept that.

Oasis_Dublin

hotmail.com wrote: »

I don't accept that.

So the term of the TD in the next Dáil is purely about what happened in the constituency during the previous Dáil term? Right so...