Why do I attract wierdos and/or older guys?! Please help!

LegacyUser

Hi,

I was just wondering if this happens to anyone else.. I'd also like to maybe hear from the guys as to why they think this happens!

Whenever I'm out I always seem to attract either wierdos and/or guys that are much older than me- starting from about 30 up to 40! I'm 21.

What I can't understand is why I attract their attention? Obviously I would much prefer to attract someone my own age. But instead, I get a STREAM of these types of guys coming up to me- I mean no sooner have I gotten rid of one wierdo- another one appears! It's either that- or I get a whole row of older guys staring and smiling at me!

Why??

LegacyUser

Two words (one hyphenated) : mid-life crisis. These guys would never have dared approach women when they were younger. They've now reached their thirties/forties and realise 'Hey, I can do this!', and hit on younger women. It's like a second chance to do something they were too afraid to do when they were younger.

If you're experiencing these types in pubs and clubs, stay well clear. They are just out to massage their egos.
If you meet an older guy in a nice neutral environment, it's more likely that they are sincere. Keep an open mind, you might meet someone you really like and who would treat you way better than most of the men your age.

Distorted

unregistered wrote: »

Two words (one hyphenated) : mid-life crisis. These guys would never have dared approach women when they were younger. They've now reached their thirties/forties and realise 'Hey, I can do this!', and hit on younger women. It's like a second chance to do something they were too afraid to do when they were younger.

If you're experiencing these types in pubs and clubs, stay well clear. They are just out to massage their egos.
If you meet an older guy in a nice neutral environment, it's more likely that they are sincere. Keep an open mind, you might meet someone you really like and who would treat you way better than most of the men your age.

Don't engage with them in any way. This type tends to think that if a woman accidentally looks at them, she fancies them. Don't make eye contact with them, ignore them if they speak to you, if they persist, give them a dirty look and turn away. Going out with a group of friends your own age also offers some protection - I'm not keen on greatly older men either as I find they can be manipulative. You have to wonder about some people though - yesterday I listened to a man of about 50 describe how he thought a girl of 19 was "coming onto" him when she was having an asthma attack, because of her "strange breathing sounds"!

LegacyUser

I don't make any eye contact or any attempt to entice them to come over flirting with me! They just appear one after another from no-where!
Why me moreso than my friends?

Fox McCloud

I know how you feel OP, this has ruined my night out so many times in the last few years that at one point I kinda gave up on going out in town and stuck to my local!

'unregistered' makes an interesting point about them only being out for an ego boost because generally these guys have a really weird attitude towards me and my firends, the second we say we're not interested the whole thing gets nasty. It really does drive me crazy on a night out! there is no winning in that situation, any bit of friendliness is construed as an interest, ignore them and they stick around to get a reaction, tell them your not interested and they get offended. I mean this in the nicest possible way but it is unlikey that teen/early 20s girl has any interest in a 35+ guy in a bar.

Generally happens less when out in a group rather 2 or three of us so I try go out in groups now.

Katgurl

Ugh OP I had the same problem when I was your age. I was quite weighty at the time, I always considered myself fat but looking back on my old pics I was all boobs and think I looked more womanly than my friends. I remember guys my age used flock to my skinny friends and I'd be subjected to middle aged creeps drinking me in with their eyes. It happened everywhere, staring shamelessly at my boobs whether they were on- show or not. One time I had to stop my mother going over to a guy at next table in a cafe and giving him piece of her mind.

The following year I got sick of always having to dress my curves, dropped three stone and swapped the dresses for jeans and skimpy tops. Quite unexpectedly, the middle-aged men stopped leering and the boys my own age began chatting me up.

I'm not suggesting it's anything to do with your weight (as I have no idea what you look like) I'm just giving you my experience and I think for me, it was that I had avery womanly look that appealed to these lecherous old farts.

I sympathise though because I do remember I found the attention very intimidating and unwelcome.

Emme

whyme123 wrote: »

Hi,

I was just wondering if this happens to anyone else.. I'd also like to maybe hear from the guys as to why they think this happens!

Whenever I'm out I always seem to attract either wierdos and/or guys that are much older than me- starting from about 30 up to 40! I'm 21.

What I can't understand is why I attract their attention? Obviously I would much prefer to attract someone my own age. But instead, I get a STREAM of these types of guys coming up to me- I mean no sooner have I gotten rid of one wierdo- another one appears! It's either that- or I get a whole row of older guys staring and smiling at me!

Why??

Guys of that age aren't into women their own age - I'm in my late 30s, I should know. If you look at some of the boards here you will find that guys of that age think it's perfectly normal to date somebody at least 12-15 years younger and there's more girls in their 20s into older guys than was the case when I was younger. I think that older guys take it for granted now that they can get younger women no probs, maybe you should try hanging out in places where the guys tend to be 30 and under.

R.D. aka MR.D

Katgurl wrote: »

Ugh OP I had the same problem when I was your age. I was quite weighty at the time, I always considered myself fat but looking back on my old pics I was all boobs and think I looked more womanly than my friends. I remember guys my age used flock to my skinny friends and I'd be subjected to middle aged creeps drinking me in with their eyes. It happened everywhere, staring shamelessly at my boobs whether they were on- show or not. One time I had to stop my mother going over to a guy at next table in a cafe and giving him piece of her mind.

The following year I got sick of always having to dress my curves, dropped three stone and swapped the dresses for jeans and skimpy tops. Quite unexpectedly, the middle-aged men stopped leering and the boys my own age began chatting me up.

I'm not suggesting it's anything to do with your weight (as I have no idea what you look like) I'm just giving you my experience and I think for me, it was that I had avery womanly look that appealed to these lecherous old farts.

I sympathise though because I do remember I found the attention very intimidating and unwelcome.

This is the exact same thing that happened to a friend of mine. She would attract nothing but weirdos and older men.

As soon as she lost weight she got interest from guys her age.

LegacyUser

Well, I'm not overweight- but I'm not skinny either.
I'm 5'5 and I am 10and a half stone. I would like to be 9stone.. I am trying to lose weight...

smiles302

This used to happen to me in this one pub/night club. Every single time I stepped foot in the place, 4 to 5 older men or boys my age who were just a bit creepy would not leave me alone all night!

(I'm 5'4 and just under 9 stone, so it's not definitely a weight thing)

My guess was that pub played the match earlier in the day, men start drinking...whenever matches finishes.. by the time night club opens, most of them are always drunk and there is a majority of men over women in the place.

(Not that match-watching men are creepy - just with those ratios the creeps are going to stand out more than the "normal" guys who leave you alone)

My only advice would be to go out in a group of men and women. In my experience men notice these guys quicker than we do, and they give up faster if there's other men with you.

LegacyUser

You would wonder, what is it that these guys see in us- more so than in other people?!

Girls that have responded to this post- we have already talked about weight.. but how would you/your friends &family rate you in terms of your looks?

Im just thinking it must be something to do with the way we look.. the way we act.. because thats what gets them coming over to flirt!

I suppose a younger girl is easier prey for a guy that has been going out for some time... but why some girls moreso than others? I go out with a group of girls- theres usually 3+ girls in the group of around the same age..

Its really embarresing!

I agree with another poster- it can be really annoying- you don't really want to talk to them coz your not interested and you don't want to lead them on OR they look like they could kill you and your scared.. but sometimes you feel rude then if you don't... you just can't win!

Wibbs

Emme wrote: »

Guys of that age aren't into women their own age - I'm in my late 30s, I should know.

I'd add some guys.

If you look at some of the boards here you will find that guys of that age think it's perfectly normal to date somebody at least 12-15 years younger and there's more girls in their 20s into older guys than was the case when I was younger. I think that older guys take it for granted now that they can get younger women no probs,

That part I would agree with tbh. Though like all bald men reference and compare themselves to sean connery, not all middle aged men are "silver foxes" so you get more wierdos than not from what I can see. Speaking as a 43 year old, in the last few years I've had occasion to say to guys my own age and older "eh no cop the hell on" when they've been seriously leching on 19 year olds and the like in the group. Johnny Depp they weren't either.

maybe you should try hanging out in places where the guys tend to be 30 and under.

Yea pretty much my take too. Though to be fair that's also harder than it was in the past. I recall that when I was 20 odd seeing a guy in his 40's in a nightclub was rare enough, unless he was security or owned the place. Now? It's very common, indeed you get groups of same(and women too, though less) and nary an eyebrow raised. In one way I think this is a good thing, but not when it starts getting creepy. My humble, ignore their age, just treat them like leches of any hue. Politely move away. If they push it, inform security. This may feel weird as they're "adults" kinda thing. Sod that, a creep's a creep.

Katgurl

Op, in answer to your last question, what I'm usually complimented on is being sexy / confident / feminine / seductive.

In case that makes me sound vainest woman alive I'm not I'm just saying WHEN I am complimented it's usually along those lines. I very rarely get told I'm cute or sweet.

Dunno if this is helping at all.

cafecolour

Go to a different bar/club - one with mostly folks your own age, and not where the middle aged pervs hang out.

Emme

cafecolour wrote: »

Go to a different bar/club - one with mostly folks your own age, and not where the middle aged pervs hang out.

Exactly. You don't need this kind of crap. Some:rolleyes: middle-aged guys have a seriously over-inflated sense of their own importance because in theory they have a choice of women from their own age (which they don't want) down to 16 and 17 year olds who in reality wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. Yeah, they all think they're George Clooney! Also the middle-aged men who go for younger girls are often afraid of women their own age who see through their crap straight away.

Avoid places like Cafe en Seine where you get all ages and try to go to younger, hipper places. Try to up your confidence as well. Go out in groups where there's guys your own age if possible - the older men and weirdos won't dare approach if there's a six foot something Alpha male in his 20s on the scene. Believe me, most of them are all talk and there's usually nothing behind it.

You can get some nice older guys as well but if you prefer guys your own age you shouldn't settle.

How do you dress OP? Maybe the clothes you're wearing or your demeanour attracts older men.

LegacyUser

I'm writing this as a guy in his late 30s - not a weirdo and I have given up on going to nightclubs with the intention of pulling as it's too frustrating looking at very attractive women and not being able to do anything about it (because I know I'm that bit older).

Anyway.....

You're 21 - a guy who is 30 sees you as a possibility. He may seem old to you (as when you're young, everyone over a few years older seems old) but he may have been dating 24 - 30 year olds and he doesn't know how old you are. You could look 23/24 to him. And at that age you'd probably have been working a couple of years and be dealing with guys of his age every day.

Maybe you have a certain look (or confidence about you) that older guys find becoming.

Maybe you are looking out for the next old guy or weirdo who'll come up and approach you - they see you glancing over, then they see that as an opportunity to go talk to you.

A guy coming up to say hello shouldn't ruin your night if you handle the situation confidently. Take it as a compliment, tell him you're not interested and laugh it off with him.

Are these guys only weird because they're old?

Emme

differenceofopinio wrote: »

You're 21 - a guy who is 30 sees you as a possibility. He may seem old to you (as when you're young, everyone over a few years older seems old) but he may have been dating 24 - 30 year olds and he doesn't know how old you are. You could look 23/24 to him. And at that age you'd probably have been working a couple of years and be dealing with guys of his age every day.

30 is probably ok for the OP, but AFAIK she's talking about guys up to their 40s. I would advise her to give guys up to 30 a chance and if somebody older is really nice don't rule him out either. However, she shouldn't settle, she's only 21 for goodness sake!

differenceofopinio wrote: »

Are these guys only weird because they're old?

I don't think she means that all the guys are weird, just some of them, but she wants to meet somebody her own age which isn't unreasonable. It used to be the norm to want to meet somebody around your own age, what's the big deal? Why can't older guys just suck it up and accept that this 21 year old wants to meet somebody her own age?

If the boot was on the other foot and a guy in his late 30s was being approached by woman of the same age while he wanted to meet a younger woman he'd be quick to let her know all about it!:mad:

LegacyUser

Emme wrote: »

she shouldn't settle, she's only 21 for goodness sake!

I don't think she means that all the guys are weird, just some of them, but she wants to meet somebody her own age which isn't unreasonable. It used to be the norm to want to meet somebody around your own age, what's the big deal? Why can't older guys just suck it up and accept that this 21 year old wants to meet somebody her own age?

:mad:

I don't know why some older guys can't suck it up that a 21 year old only wants to go out with someone closer to their own age.

I would have no interest going out with a 21 year old (as they're not particularly interesting).

S23

I'll have to split the difference with the pair of you Emme and differenceofopinon.

I certainly don't think it's unreasonable to want to me meet guys of her own age. It is entirely natural of course. As Emme and another couple of posters suggested maybe she should start hitting somewhere with her own age demographic. You can greatly reduce the number of older men in a place by going to the right spot. Now maybe she should be able to go anywhere she wants but if she does then getting hit on by all and sundry, unfortunately, is par for the course.

That said the OP has done nothing to define what these men are doing that qualifies as weird

Whenever I'm out I always seem to attract either wierdos and/or guys that are much older than me- starting from about 30 up to 40! I'm 21.

So it's either weirdos or men between 30-40? What is it the weirdos are doing that makes them weird? Are these 'other' weirdos closer to your age? Is it just a case of not liking them rather than them actually being specifically weird or creepy? Apart from being older what is it that the 30-40 year olds are doing that is weird?

There are a million reasons older men might approach you many of which have been explored on here. For you, OP, does them being a good few years older than you but wanting to approach you automatically make them weird?

It could be a self perpetuating thing to an extent as you may have developed a narrow view of the (pub scene) world. When you see a guy of say 34 (for example) approach is the first thing you think 'oh ffs what does this weirdo want'?
Now you don't have to entertain the notion of dating someone older (although never say never and all that) but that doesn't automatically make anyone who approaches that you don't happen to find attractive a weirdo. You can politely and confidently knock someone back. However, if you get very immature about it and get all 'ewww no go away' then that will provoke a reaction. Be firm but polite and that should work in most cases.

Of course you will run into a few creeps and weirdos but thats really just par for the course. Pubs and clubs are generally awful places for meeting people basically because there is a higher ration of people purely 'on the prowl' so if you're after anything more than a quick fumble at the end of the night then trying to find the genuinely nice ones is a needle in a haystack. Also, a hell of a lot of people like to use drinking as an excuse for behaving inappropriately (I don't agree with that but anyway) and as you know pubs and clubs are full of drunkards of varying degrees.

One final thing worth thinking about. Maybe you're extremely attractive and attract a lot of attention. It could be the case that older men have more confidence in talking to women due to more experience. Younger guys might find it harder to approach you.

As for the thing about older men being afraid to approach if there is some Alpha male around. I'd say something quite the opposite. Unless that Alpha male is in your company or obviously trying to put the moves on you it's not going to put anyone off.

And the opposite might be true. Younger lads (who don't all have to be 6ft tall, square jawed and barrell chested Alpha males to be nice people) might see a stream of 'grown ups' hitting on you and think to themselves 'jaysus she gets all this attention for the grown up men (forgive the expression) sure why would she be interested in me I'm only a young fella'.

Anyway it's all just conjecture but I hope it helps to hear some differing opinions and gives you food for thought.

Also, if you could clarify what all these older men do that is weird that might help too. I have the feeling you think that by simply approaching you they are being weird (because they are older) but I stand to be corrected

Distorted

S23 wrote: »

That said the OP has done nothing to define what these men are doing that qualifies as weird

So it's either weirdos or men between 30-40? What is it the weirdos are doing that makes them weird? Are these 'other' weirdos closer to your age? Is it just a case of not liking them rather than them actually being specifically weird or creepy? Apart from being older what is it that the 30-40 year olds are doing that is weird?

There are a million reasons older men might approach you many of which have been explored on here. For you, OP, does them being a good few years older than you but wanting to approach you automatically make them weird?

It could be a self perpetuating thing to an extent as you may have developed a narrow view of the (pub scene) world. When you see a guy of say 34 (for example) approach is the first thing you think 'oh ffs what does this weirdo want'?


Now you don't have to entertain the notion of dating someone older (although never say never and all that) but that doesn't automatically make anyone who approaches that you don't happen to find attractive a weirdo. You can politely and confidently knock someone back. However, if you get very immature about it and get all 'ewww no go away' then that will provoke a reaction. Be firm but polite and that should work in most cases.

To be fair, the OP is only 21 and simply the fact that someone of the age group she associates more with her parents is trying to hit on her might be sufficient to give her the impression it is wierd. But at 21 she might have difficulty in ennunciating her gut instinct. But if its a man in his late thirites/early forties hitting on a woman of 21, I don't really think they can be too surprised if thats the reaction of the 21 year old. Maybe at her age, she finds it difficult to be forthright enough to avoid this problem, and maybe the guys in question find it easier to "pick on" younger women and persist because they know women of nearer their own age would have told them to sling their hooks more effectively from the outset?

FWIW I find it a bit creepy too. Rather different from meeting a man of that age in a different, less pressurised setting. Quite sleazy for all ages, that scene (fine its thats your thing) but to still be hitting it in your late thirties and forties for the purpose of targetting the very young...hmmn. You have to wonder why they target someone so young and not someone their own age.

LegacyUser

Wow, where do I start..

I don't have a problem with ALL the older guys- it's just the ones whose attention is unwelcome because of their strange behaviour. I also get unwanted attention from some of the guys that are the same age as me- also because of their strange behaviour.

I enjoy talking to people. It is nice to get people coming up to you to have the chat. You go out to socialize, but at the same time I don't like leading people on. For example, I was talking to a guy that was about 10 years older than me on a night out. I enjoyed his company- he was funny, interesting and easy to talk to. But there was no spark there. When I declined his advances after a few mins he got angry with me for leading him on!

I have tried being direct with guys and saying "look, I'm sorry but I have a boyfriend" or something along those lines. To which they will only say "jeez I just wanted to talk to you". Which is understandable.
So its hard to win.
By the way, had I the choice I would go to pubs/clubs where the people there would mostly be my own age. However, I live in the country so I don't have much of a choice as to where to go.

When I say wierd- I mean guys (of any age) who in the past have groped me, stared at me from a distance, come up & stood close to me and stared some more & their eyes become glazed over and they have a funny smirk on their face, slapped my ass, taken my arm and dragged me out of the club to come home with them to "watch a DVD".. etc. Their actions make me think that those guys are looking for is a ONS. I'm just not that type of girl!
And before anyone says it, yes alcohol was a factor in these examples- but sometimes people become an enlarged form of their own self when alcohol has been consumed.

As regards to guys that are older than me- I dated a guy that was 27 and I was 20. We got on really well and had a great laugh.. but it just didn't work out. That doesn't mean to say that I won't go out with someone older than me again. Although at this moment in time, I don't know if I would go out with a guy that was over 30. I just think that they have lived there life, possibly travelled, been with a good few women, worked for a number of years. They could even have been married, divorced and have kids. I know someone my own age could be married/have kids etc but it is less likely than with a guy 10+ years older than me. They are more experienced in life and that can be good for various different things! Personally, I'm not sure that I would date a guy 10+ years older than me. I have a friend who is dating a guy that is 20 years older than her and they are very much in love and suit each other. Each to their own.

Now, back to the original topic! I don't want this turning into a "dating people of different age" debate.

S23

whyme123 wrote: »

I don't have a problem with ALL the older guys- it's just the ones whose attention is unwelcome because of their strange behaviour. I also get unwanted attention from some of the guys that are the same age as me- also because of their strange behaviour.

Sorry OP but that basically turns your post into 'sometimes I go out and guys of various ages that I don't like hit on me'. You've basically said sometimes they are the same age and sometimes they are older and some of them act a bit weird/strange. Welcome to the world of picking up/being picking up in pubs and clubs. There is absolutely nothing out of the ordinary in that.

Sorry but you're going to get guys you don't like hitting on you when you go out. Not every one will be nice and normal. Some will be creepy and rude. You'll get a mixed bag.

groped me, stared at me from a distance, come up & stood close to me and stared some more & their eyes become glazed over and they have a funny smirk on their face, slapped my ass, taken my arm and dragged me out of the club to come home with them to "watch a DVD

Barring the last one this is pretty much par for the course if you frequent places where people are out 'on the pull'.

You say you don't have a choice in where you go because you live in 'the country'. Is it a one horse town? Are there only 1 or 2 places to go? Do you know these older guys hitting on you? This would defintely change the parameters of what you said. I mean if your da's best mate/work mates are brazenly trying to get you into the sack that would definitely be weird. Do you know all these weird people hitting on you? Is it the same people over and over again. Presumably so if your choice is that limited. That would definitely be a bit weird alright.

Distorted I agree there are no shortage of creepy old bastards slobbering all over women far too young for them. What I am saying, though, is that this is just how things are. It's nothing out of the ordinary. The OP is not especially cursed. The exact same thing is an issue for a good friend of mines daughter who is about 20. You can wonder all you want why these older men don't go after women of their own age but it won't stop them hitting on people. It may not seem right but it's certainly not out of the ordinary now.

Alchol is a huge factor IMO. People really do think it's okay to act the pri*k and write it off because they had a few drinks. 'Ah it wasn't me it was the drink' is a pathetic excuse for acting like a shi*head. If you can't behave yourself when you drink then don't drink IMO.

OP bottom line is pubs and clubs are always going to be full of these people. Some older, some younger. Some nice, some creepy, some normal, some weird, some getting hammered and using it as an excuse to be a pest, some that aren't hammered and are a pest anyway. It's nothing to do with you. It's just the way things are in these places.

As for what to do. If you run into a lad who thinks a 10 minute conversation is 'leading him on' and gets annoyed about it then don't feel sorry about telling him to go take a hike.
I wouldn't be lying about having a boyfriend. You don't have to lie to tell someone you're not interested in them. It's just as easy to say you're not looking for anything romantically/sexually. If they give it the 'hey I only wanted to talk to you' then by all means tell them they can talk to you all they want.

Anyway, to finish up, don't feel especially cursed OP. You're really not. You're no different to many, many women all over the country. You will learn how to deal with these things over time. It's just part of growing up

LegacyUser

S23 wrote: »

Welcome to the world of picking up/being picking up in pubs and clubs. There is absolutely nothing out of the ordinary in that.

Sorry but you're going to get guys you don't like hitting on you when you go out. Not every one will be nice and normal. Some will be creepy and rude. You'll get a mixed bag.

I'm well aware of the above. My point is why do they target some women moreso than others. My friends comment on how much undesirable attention I get! Different groups of friends in fact. Groups of friends in Dublin and in the countryside.

Denise2007

Hi,

OP your post reminds me of a friend of mine who used to get so much hassle from older men and weirdos when we went out. It was really strange, wherever we went she would be the one that was always targeted. Some of the guys were really sleazy and always older. It got to the stage where we started to intervene !!!

She was and is a really pretty girl. I think they used to target her because she was way too polite and used to chat to them whereas we were a little bit more direct. Once she started being more direct it eased up.

I still think it's strange that men so much older approach young girls !!!

Good luck, it will get better. Just be more direct !

:-)

S23

whyme123 wrote: »

I'm well aware of the above. My point is why do they target some women moreso than others. My friends comment on how much undesirable attention I get! Different groups of friends in fact. Groups of friends in Dublin and in the countryside.

I don't think anyone here will give you a definitive answer on that.

You could be more attractive than your friends. You could look/give off an air of being approachable. Lads could see that you aren't exactly telling the other men hitting on you to fcuk off and reckon that they can be the one who cracks your defences. It could be demeanour and how you carry yourself.

I take it you don't dress particularly provactively (moreso than normal) or have an enormous chest. If you dress a certain way men might see it as bieng a bit slutty. I'm not saying I agree with it but it's true.
If you have a big chest then, as old a cliche as it is, a lot of men are fascinated with big boobs.

That's the best I have to offer you. Just try and be more assertive in telling men to take a hike. If the creepy auld lads see you putting your foot down from the get go they might be less inclined to make their lecherous moves later on.

LegacyUser

As an aside

I'm a 36 year old guy, attractive for my age, keep myself very fit and healthy etc etc

in the last year and a half I'm been single and trying to get myself back into the dating scene.

Strangely enough of the girls who have 'hit' on me (I'm way to shy to ever chat anyone up) the eldest one was 27. The average age was between 22-25, with one 20 year old! As a man in his mid thirties I don't want to date a (in my opinion) young lady, I have nothing really in common with her, music, friends, what i want to spend my time doing, these things are miles apart between me and a 22 year old.

So I ask the question what are these girls interested in me for, I think that it's a bit to do with the attitudes/way the opposite sex are acting towards each other these days

in the time I've been single I've just been struck by how agressive girls in their 30's are, they actually intimidate me, I'm not great at talking to people I've just met, I try, but if hey don't work with me and interact I lose confidence and conversation dies completely. On the othe side I find the 25 year olds just much more fun and more interested in having a chat and a flirt and just enjoying themselves more openly.

And from what I've been told by these early 20's is that they like someone older as they are more relaxed and are better company.

Sorry I'm rambling now, but basically, the younger ladies like a balanced mature fun older guy, and the older ladies (who I personally am much more interested in meeting and hoping having a relationship with), while these older ladies are just very closed and offhand.

It's very disheartening.

Fox McCloud

The difference for me anyway is not that these guys are trying to chat me up. You can spot the difference between a normal guy who might like to take you phone number or just have a nice chat. These guys will say ok have a nice night if you tell them your just out for a catch up with the girls..

Its a totally different breed of guy that actually causes me great hassle and annoyance on a night out. They tend to be visably drunk so maybe thats it.. But they're immpossible to get rid of without taking an enormous amount of you time(which one tends to paying alot for on a night out), if you dont want to br rude. Even when you are rude they stick around for a fight about it.. When 6 or 7 of these guys approach on a night out you can pretty much say my night would be ruined.

Emme

Ontheflipside wrote: »

in the time I've been single I've just been struck by how agressive girls in their 30's are, they actually intimidate me, I'm not great at talking to people I've just met, I try, but if hey don't work with me and interact I lose confidence and conversation dies completely.

How are these women aggressive? Are you mistaking caution for aggression? A lot of women in their 30s are very cautious of guys because guys their age and up are more likely to be married.

Ontheflipside wrote: »

On the othe side I find the 25 year olds just much more fun and more interested in having a chat and a flirt and just enjoying themselves more openly.

25 year olds probably haven't been messed around as much by guys and they're less likely to be as guarded as the women in their 30s.

Corkblowin

whyme123 wrote: »

I'm well aware of the above. My point is why do they target some women moreso than others. My friends comment on how much undesirable attention I get! Different groups of friends in fact. Groups of friends in Dublin and in the countryside.

I do feel for you, but just have to echo what many of the other posters have said, you get creeps and weirdos in any age group. As for why they approach you, I'm guessing that its because you are pleasant and polite (as well as good-looking) and so do not wish to come across as rude. It would be a shame if you felt you had to change your personality because of it - there are enough A**holes in the world (male and female) who are obnoxious to people just for saying hello.

On the general issue of age, I'm 38 and separated. I went out with a girl of 26 for about a year, and also dated a woman of 42 for a few months. Its not about age but the person. I wouldn't particularly look for a woman in her 20's, but at the same time wouldn't rule one out just because of her age. I enjoy chatting to new people I meet, be they 21 or 61, and wouldn't assume that just because you didn't tell me to f-off then 'I'm in'! That shows that they may be older, but still immature.

I suppose what I'm saying is to take everyone as you find them, regardless of age (do you actually ask these guys their ages btw), and if you get a guy like the one who thought you were leading him on just because you were friendly, dismiss him as the one with the problem, not you.

Good luck!

curlzy

Hey OP,

First of all, if a guy approaches and you want none of it, a simple "**** off" works a treat:D, if they think you're a bitch who gives a ****e??? Secondly don't go analysing yourself and thinking you need to lose weight, it could be that you're a super hot chicky and guys your age are intimidated and the older guys are deluded/cocky enough to think they have a chance. Either way stop feeling bad about what men think of you. Watch "ways of seeing" part 2 by John Berger, you can download from from Youtube, it's really facinating, it's about the way women have been indoctrinated into constantly watching themselves to make sure they're attractive to men. John Berger's well respected, I learned about him in college and it's not about militant feminism or man hating, it's very informative. Have to say it's very liberating to really understand it and then learn how to not give a f*ck.

Bottle_of_Smoke

There's probably something about you specifically drawing them in.

This could even be physical, like soft facial features. I know a girl who is half asian and she gets similar guys appraching a lot.

Perhaps you look like a nice/non-threatening girl who is easy to talk to, warm/friendly smile/mannerisms. The last thing these guys would do is try it on with someone who's gonna blank them.

Wompa1

If you aren't happy with it then maybe approach guys you do fancy rather than waiting for them to come to you

alexa5x5

I know where you’re coming from OP. From my teens up till now (mid-20's) I seemed to act like a magnet for every weirdo/creep out there. In the beginning I used to chat to anyone who came up to me, but like you said when I said I wasn’t interested anything other than a chat they became aggressive. Unfortunately, there seems to be an attitude out there that if your on a night out and your dressed up your far game for every man out there. Despite the fact that you might just be out for a night with your friends, and dressed up because you want to look nice.

As time has gone on I’ve become very wary of talking to people on a night out because of many-many bad experiences where I felt threatened by guys that didn’t like me turning them down. I’ve actually gotten to the stage that I don’t go to night clubs; it’s just too much hassle. The only advice I can give you is to stick to your group of friends on a night out. If you feel someone looking at you, avoid any eye contact with them. If someone comes up to you that you don’t want to talk to, don’t begin a conversation with them. I find the best thing to say if I find myself in that situation is "Hello, have a good nigh" then walk off.

I know my advice seems anti-social but I’ve found being "cold" and aloof on night out is the only way to avoid un-wanted attention.

NEVER ever say "fcuk off" to a guy or anything along those lines, I’ve heard of girls being attacked physically after saying things like that to guys.

My last piece of advice is, if you feel partially pestered or intimidated by some one, speak to a bouncer and ask them to keep an eye on the guy. That worked for me once when a guy just wouldn’t take no for an answer.

Memnoch

I don't understand the age issue.

When I was twenty, I found twenty year old girls attractive. Because well, they are pretty.

Now I'm late twenties, I still find twenty year old girls attractive. Why do people expect that as men get older they should only find "people their own age," attractive. I can't imagine suddenly waking up and thinking, hey I'm 40 now, so women in their 20s are all ugly and unattractive because of some artificial social taboo.

Emme

Memnoch wrote: »

I don't understand the age issue.

When I was twenty, I found twenty year old girls attractive. Because well, they are pretty.

Now I'm late twenties, I still find twenty year old girls attractive. Why do people expect that as men get older they should only find "people their own age," attractive. I can't imagine suddenly waking up and thinking, hey I'm 40 now, so women in their 20s are all ugly and unattractive because of some artificial social taboo.

No, when you're 40 you'll still find 20 year old girls attractive. However you probably won't find 30 or 40 year old women attractive (or at least as attractive as the 20 year olds) for the VERY reason of a social taboo.

Memnoch

Now I'm confused. I find thirty year old women attractive now, I doubt that will change either.

S23

There is far too much attempting to sterotype and pigeon hole these 'older men' who approach 'younger women' on here.

As Memnoch said he won't stop finding young attractive women attractive just because he's 30 instead of 25 or 35 instead of 25 or 40 instead of 25.

To try and imply that older men (30-40 in this case)who hit on younger women don't find women of their own age (30-40) attractive is a bit ridiculous in terms of this post.

For all we know the older men who hit on the OP hit on 20 year olds, 30 year olds, 40 year olds and 50 year olds. Just because the only time the OP sees them is when they are hitting on her doesn't mean they don't ever hit on older women. There is no basis to suggest that they only go after younger women.

I'll say it again this all comes back to this being standard stuff. There's nothing particularly different about what the OP's problem is than what is faced by a large amount of women on a weekly basis when they head out.

The problem isn't age here if you read back through her posts. She gets approached by various lads of various ages who she deems to be creepy or weird. That's what she has to get to be able to deal with. If you go to nightclubs and are young and attractive you're going to get hit on a lot and a high percentage of the guys just aren't going to be for you.

As a slight aside, with regard to the age thing, I'm in the middle of the demographic we're talking about here being (just about) 30. I look at some younger looking women and find them attractive and I look at some older women and find them equally attractive. There's no harm in finding someone younger or older attractive. It's how you behave towards them that is the thing.

And, again sorry for repeating myself, people don't tend to behave too well when they are out in nightclubs looking to pick people up. And as much as you can argue that you don't have to be going to a nightclub 'on the pull' it's certainly why a hell of a lot of people go and if you are going to frequent those places you have to learn to cope with that. Whether it's right or wrong is neither here nor there. It's just the way it is

LegacyUser

Memnoch wrote: »

Why do people expect that as men get older they should only find "people their own age," attractive. I can't imagine suddenly waking up and thinking, hey I'm 40 now, so women in their 20s are all ugly and unattractive because of some artificial social taboo.

There's nothing wrong with finding younger people attractive. That's not a social taboo at all. The social taboo arises when a man in his forties won't take no for an answer from a twenty year old just because he's suddenly figured out how to talk to women and wants to make up for those wasted years.

S23

unregistered wrote: »

There's nothing wrong with finding younger people attractive. That's not a social taboo at all. The social taboo arises when a man in his forties won't take no for an answer from a twenty year old just because he's suddenly figured out how to talk to women and wants to make up for those wasted years.

Whats the differnce between a someone who is lets say 38 years old acting the pri*k and being aggressive and an asshole and not taking no for an answer

and

a 25 year old acting the pri*k and being aggressive and an asshole and not taking no for an answer?

This is a behavioural thing and not an age based thing. Someone acting inappropriately is someone acting inappropriately regardless of age. I'd suggest the problem is that the older the bloke the greater the lack of attraction. There is probably a greater 'ewww' factor with a balding lad in his late 30's acting the pri*k than some lad in good nick in his 20's acting the pri*k. It doesn't make the same behaviour any more or less acceptable though

LegacyUser

Urgh OP, I know exactly what you're talking about.
In my experience it's usually the old guys who are the most lecherous and also the ones who turn nasty when you tell them you're not interested.
I hate going out now for that very reason.
What do you do? If you are cold you're a bitch if you're friendly you're a tease.
My friend in particular gets a lot of unwanted attention from older men. It's really gross actually. She says she's not interested but because she's petite I think they feel they can keep pestering her and wear her down. Often times we have to intervene on her behalf and you would not believe the nasty insults we get!
Many of them inappropriately touch her or try to kiss her when she's just actually being polite. And they don't get the meaning of 'go away, we're on a girls night out and not wanting to be chatted up!!' Fine if you want to chat to the entire group but how rude is it to come over, single one girl out and disrupt the conversation, especially if there is one girl left sitting there on her own twiddling her thumbs. And when you draw their attention to the fact you're the worst in the world.
I find men in their 20's are much more respectable.
Also, why don't these older men go after someone their own age???? I think it's gross to have someone my dad's age trying to pull me!

Fluorescence

S23 wrote: »

There is far too much attempting to sterotype and pigeon hole these 'older men' who approach 'younger women' on here.

As Memnoch said he won't stop finding young attractive women attractive just because he's 30 instead of 25 or 35 instead of 25 or 40 instead of 25.

To try and imply that older men (30-40 in this case)who hit on younger women don't find women of their own age (30-40) attractive is a bit ridiculous in terms of this post.

For all we know the older men who hit on the OP hit on 20 year olds, 30 year olds, 40 year olds and 50 year olds. Just because the only time the OP sees them is when they are hitting on her doesn't mean they don't ever hit on older women. There is no basis to suggest that they only go after younger women.

Ah but I don't think the OP is complaining about the polite older men that she can have a chat with and if she tells them that she isn't interested romantically don't get stroppy. There's a particular breed of lecherous middle-aged->old creeps who think they're God's gift and are entitled to sleaze all over any young woman who as much as looks in their direction. I seem to attract them as well (oh, and lesbians)... I've found politely laughing off their advances and physically moving away works well enough. The trick is to find out where the line is between friendly banter and slightly flirty banter and never to cross it when approached by a drunken sleaze.

As for why some people seem to attract them more than others, I'm not sure. Best just to learn to deal with it in a way that's least annoying for you and least provocative to the other person (who, if one of the creeps might have an aggressive or hostile reaction).

Wompa1

fluorescence wrote: »

Ah but I don't think the OP is complaining about the polite older men that she can have a chat with and if she tells them that she isn't interested romantically don't get stroppy. There's a particular breed of lecherous middle-aged->old creeps who think they're God's gift and are entitled to sleaze all over any young woman who as much as looks in their direction. I seem to attract them as well (oh, and lesbians)... I've found politely laughing off their advances and physically moving away works well enough. The trick is to find out where the line is between friendly banter and slightly flirty banter and never to cross it when approached by a drunken sleaze.

As for why some people seem to attract them more than others, I'm not sure. Best just to learn to deal with it in a way that's least annoying for you and least provocative to the other person (who, if one of the creeps might have an aggressive or hostile reaction).

Laughing off someones advances is typically what Irish girls do and why they have such a reputation. If you say you're not interested you can still talk to the guy, why not? Women don't give guys much credit. I think we have just as much control over ourselves than women when it comes to sex. Women just seem to think they are above us for some reason.

Fluorescence

Wompa1 wrote: »

Laughing off someones advances is typically what Irish girls do and why they have such a reputation. If you say you're not interested you can still talk to the guy, why not? Women don't give guys much credit. I think we have just as much control over ourselves than women when it comes to sex. Women just seem to think they are above us for some reason.

You took my meaning up wrong. I said I laugh off the advances of sleazes and creeps (you know how you sometimes get that vibe that someone is creepy? I trust that. Always). If some guy seems friendly and nice, I'll have a chat with him no matter his age. If I find he's just sleazing all over people in the place or gives me that unsettling vibe I will be quite dismissive, and am well within my right to be.

I hate how a lot of people (especially on boards) are slating all irish girls as being rude bítches because it's hurtful and untrue.

Wompa1

fluorescence wrote: »

You took my meaning up wrong. I said I laugh off the advances of sleazes and creeps (you know how you sometimes get that vibe that someone is creepy? I trust that. Always). If some guy seems friendly and nice, I'll have a chat with him no matter his age. If I find he's just sleazing all over people in the place or gives me that unsettling vibe I will be quite dismissive, and am well within my right to be.

I hate how a lot of people (especially on boards) are slating all irish girls as being rude bítches because it's hurtful and untrue.

Ok, sorry I jumped the gun. In defense of people on boards we're all aware it's a generalization and there would be some girls that are different but those of us that think this is only because we've been on the receiving end. Not only that but since it's about Irish women, in my case and probably the other guys we don't get it when approaching an American girl, Polish, English etc. Just Irish.

alexa5x5

Wompa1 wrote: »

Laughing off someones advances is typically what Irish girls do and why they have such a reputation. If you say you're not interested you can still talk to the guy, why not? Women don't give guys much credit. I think we have just as much control over ourselves than women when it comes to sex. Women just seem to think they are above us for some reason.

I don’t mean to offend you but as a man you have no idea how awful it can be for a woman on a night out. I’m sure you and maybe most of your friends are well behaved, but for me, as I said in my above post, I’m completely put off going on nights out because of some men’s behaviour.

It’s become almost acceptable to grope, make disgusting comments, and pester women. And if you tell these men to leave you alone you get called a frigid bit*h.
You say Irish women have a “reputation” well maybe that’s because of the lecherous, uncivilised men out there that think it’s perfectly acceptable to treat us with such disrespect.

Yes some men can control themselves, but many cant, and unfortunately I think its getting worse. When I first started going out, when I turned a guy down there wasn’t usually a problem, gradually that turned to being accused of leading the guy on, to verbal abuse most recently. I know one friend who was shoved over buy a guy who she didn’t want to dance with. The groping thing is almost common place now, so much so that men seem almost surprised that we’re offended by it.

Like I said I’m sure you’re well behaved, but unless you’re a woman you really don’t understand.

Wompa1

alexa5x5 wrote: »

I don’t mean to offend you but as a man you have no idea how awful it can be for a woman on a night out. I’m sure you and maybe most of your friends are well behaved, but for me, as I said in my above post, I’m completely put off going on nights out because of some men’s behaviour.

It’s become almost acceptable to grope, make disgusting comments, and pester women. And if you tell these men to leave you alone you get called a frigid bit*h.
You say Irish women have a “reputation” well maybe that’s because of the lecherous, uncivilised men out there that think it’s perfectly acceptable to treat us with such disrespect.

Yes some men can control themselves, but many cant, and unfortunately I think its getting worse. When I first started going out, when I turned a guy down there wasn’t usually a problem, gradually that turned to being accused of leading the guy on, to verbal abuse most recently. I know one friend who was shoved over buy a guy who she didn’t want to dance with. The groping thing is almost common place now, so much so that men seem almost surprised that we’re offended by it.

Like I said I’m sure you’re well behaved, but unless you’re a woman you really don’t understand.

Yip, I hate night clubs. And It's lads that seem to think it's ok to grope women. I wouldn't say it's men. One of my housemates use to do it alot. But it worked an unbelievable amount of times for him. So if it's something that works for lads I'd say they won't be changing anytime soon. I've heard it's even worse in some other European countries. Also I have been groped I'd say 3 times by women and not just hand on my ass or hip...and it was unwanted...and I've been groped by 2 guys. Granted one of them was my girlfriends gay friend but again that was unwanted.

Squiggler

alexa5x5 wrote: »

It’s become almost acceptable to grope, make disgusting comments, and pester women. And if you tell these men to leave you alone you get called a frigid bit*h.
[/FONT]

This is the real problem here. In the past I have had complete strangers walk up to me, grab me by the arm and try to drag me off. In a different environment that would be viewed as attempted abduction. Groping, making lewd comments etc would all qualify as sexual harrassment.

But the assumption seems to be that this is acceptable behaviour! How? Why? Because there is drink involved? Because the assumption is that someone in a bar or nightclub WANTS this kind of 'attention'?

I don't get it. Nobody should tolerate that kind of treatment from anyone. Tell them, in no uncertain terms, that their behaviour is unacceptable. Report these people to bar staff or bar security if they persist. If we act like it is normal it will be. What are we, farm animals? Actually, scratch that, farm animals are better behaved.

And, this behaviour is not restricted to men. I have seen men victimised by groups of women (hen parties being a prime example) in the past too.

neuro-praxis

I have a lovely friend with this problem. She calls it her "dribbly oul'fella" problem.

She is a bit older than you, in her thirties, and men in their forties, fifties and sixties constantly approach her, and usually leer and/or make suggestive comments. They are usually married. Men her age never approach her. This has been a problem for her for 15 years.

There are a few reasons why in her case:

1. She is extremely friendly, very funny, outgoing and seemingly confident. She will engage and chat with literally anyone. She makes good eye contact when chatting and usually starts things off with a joke, and this friendliness gets mistaken by idiots for being "easy". In reality she is quite a reserved person, but this is not obvious.
2. She is genuinely very sexy. Without being the prettiest woman in the world, she still has huge sex appeal, no matter what she is wearing. Younger men seem to find this intimidating.
3. A third issue is that despite her apparent confidence she is very slow to react if someone makes an inappropriate comment towards her. She tends to blush and laugh it off, while deep down feeling very humiliated. This only encourages these kinds of men.

I don't know if any of this rings a bell for you or if it helps. But you are not alone!

S23

fluorescence wrote: »

Ah but I don't think the OP is complaining about the polite older men that she can have a chat with and if she tells them that she isn't interested romantically don't get stroppy.

No I realise that. Shes complaining about sleazy/creepy/weird men of all ages. This is exactly my point. You can keep looking past it and fixate on this thing about 'older men' but shes complained about men of all ages who she's not into hitting on her and as I keep saying that's just par for the course. As neuro-praxis finished the post with 'you're not alone'. That's the unfortunate point. It's a common enough thing. The OP isn't special or particularly cursed.

As for a lot of the rest that has been said I agree. The 'acceptable' level of behaviour is pretty poor these days. The disgusting overtly sexual comments and grabby nature of lads you see out now is absolutely awful. I agree with that 100%. I think it's absolutely hideous behaviour and is, quite frankly, a blight on our society.

However, this all feeds back into the 'ah sure it wasn't me it was the drink so that makes it okay' mentality there is in this country. Ah sure it's alright to act the pri*k when you're drunk because you have a nice excuse to cover yourself seems to be pretty standard thinking here. It's compounded by the fact that a lot of people are willing to accept it (maybe because they will use it at some stage?)It's a cultural thing that getting sh*tfaced is (not for everyone but in a large percentage) part of having the 'craic'. And if you can do what you want when you're sh*tfaced then this is what develops.

All of this is culutural and behavioural, though, and not really related to the OP's first post. Fixating on dribbly old men or whatever else isn't going to get anyone anywhere.

As myself and a couple of others said earlier, and neuro-praxis reiterated, women who get approached more may do so because they are a) extremely attractive b) look/give off an air of being more approachable than other women c) don't put their foot down with guys who approach them then every chancer thinks he'll give it a whirl.

I think this thread has exposed one thing. It's not really the age of any man that's the problem here. It's the type of behaviour that men of all ages have are willing to enact to try and 'pull' someone and the fact that it's now largely accepted that is the real problem.

We can complain about it here and I'm sure there are plenty of people that don't like it but if you go out to a large percentage of places tonight and all this craic is going to go on and it's not stopping anytime soon because it's becoming embedded in our culture.

LegacyUser

After reading the comments, I think the whole going out scene can be a bit of a viscious circle.
Take for example, a guy goes up to a few different girls on a night out- some may tell him to f off. He will remember the negative experiences more so than the positive ones- the 1 or 2 girls that he might have had a chat with that night.

Maybe- if a girl (like me) isn't rude to guys and chats for a bit. They think "ok, she didn't tell me to f off so, I'm in." When the girl gives him an excuse- he gets narked, because hes disappointed. The drink kicks in and he thinks "ya, I'm pissed off and I'm going to tell you about it!." So the girl is going to think some guys are assholes.

It is a hypothetical situation that happens so many times. It's evident in your posts, but not every encounter ends up like this thankfully!

I think manners is a thing of the past. I would regard myself as a polite person. However, I have met so many people that have been rude and horrible to me. I sometimes think, why should I bother being nice!


As regards to the following comment...

neuro-praxis wrote: »

There are a few reasons why in her case:

1. She is extremely friendly, very funny, outgoing and seemingly confident. She will engage and chat with literally anyone. She makes good eye contact when chatting and usually starts things off with a joke, and this friendliness gets mistaken by idiots for being "easy". In reality she is quite a reserved person, but this is not obvious.
2. She is genuinely very sexy. Without being the prettiest woman in the world, she still has huge sex appeal, no matter what she is wearing. Younger men seem to find this intimidating.
3. A third issue is that despite her apparent confidence she is very slow to react if someone makes an inappropriate comment towards her. She tends to blush and laugh it off, while deep down feeling very humiliated. This only encourages these kinds of men.

QUOTE]




1. Yes, I am very friendly. I have a good sense of humour. I know this because I can keep a conversation going, get people laughing, people smile when the speak to me.
2. I'm not so sure of. How do you know your sexy/gorgeus? You can't measure it against something standard. The only "evidence" I may have is that friends, family and guys on nights out- tell me I'm gorgeus, hot, sexy, pretty, etc.. but I just think that friends and family are going to say this to me because they love me.. (I hope) no-one would tell a friend or a family member that they were ugly! I think guys say this to me because they just wanna get laid- regardless of being ugly/pretty.