ESB employees get free Electricity WTF?

bonzos

I just read the article in todays indo where ESB employees get up to €480 worth of free electricity every year,this perk is enjoyed by over 99%of employees including the top executives who earn up to €700k per year PA!!!This is the same semi state that charges customers who are having difficulties in paying their bill a €100 "consultation fee" before the cut off their power....is it any wonder this country f**ked.

Tefral

They would have got it in a payrise anyway so it makes no difference..
EDIT: Also what fees the ESb charges its customers is set in stone by the Energy Regulator. They are not allowed to alter this.

Count Dooku

cronin_j wrote: »

They would have got it in a payrise anyway so it makes no difference..
EDIT: Also what fees the ESb charges its customers is set in stone by the Energy Regulator.

I presume that main purpose of Energy Regulator is to keep living standards of ESB staff :rolleyes:

bamboozle

so that's over 3 million a year wasted on this perk, so many state bodies have pointless expenses that need to be eradicated...will it ever happen? i doubt it.

sunday times did an interivew with the head guy in the company which owns Airtricity. they want to buy ESB and Bord Gais, in the interview this guy was saying the average salary in ESB was over 70k, whereas the average salary in Airtricity was under 35k.

flip side being Eamonn Ryan was saying this morning that we shouldnt sell either Bord Gais or ESB as they both invest about 2 billion annually into the rish economy and if they went private this may stop.

baldbear

ESB staff get 55% off a certain amount of units each month. Don't alot of companies offer discounts to their staff, so i don't see a problem.

But its a disgrace that Pauric McManus salary is so big. Bloody 700k is a scandal. Also, all ESB staff get about 6k a year in special deals done by the unions. PACT agreements, profit sharing etc.

MidlandsM

I started a thread about this story yesterday in After Hours and most of the posters to my thread thought it was OK and and perk of their jobs!

What a shower of clueless fools they are.......no wonder this countrys gone down the tubes.

Tefral

Count Dooku wrote: »

I presume that main purpose of Energy Regulator is to keep living standards of ESB staff :rolleyes:

Just so we're clear i dont work for the ESB personally but my father does. This arrangement has been with the ESB since they first started the 400kv line back in the 80's. Instead of payrises, some staff opted to get the amount deducted from their ESB bills.

I think just because its a Semi-state body people are in uproar over it.. But no-one was giving out in the private sector when they had similar perks. I know until recently my job in the Private Sector had some good perks.

trad

I get a 15% discount of all my puchases form my employer and the discount amounts to much more than the ESB gives it's employees. Whats the problem? It's less than a tenner per week.


Guinness used to give their employees free stout (probably still do), it's called being a good employer.

RichardAnd

Just before the the bonfires and torches are lit and the parties sent out to hunt for state employees, let me just throw in a few coins.I have family working for Irish Rail. They get a reduction on train ticket prices.One of my uncles used to work for Caburys, he got free chocolate on a regulaur basis (which was nice when I was a kid ).I myself work for a software company and we get social events paid for by our employer.Conclusion: Many jobs have perks and these are not limited to the PS or semi-state.

Ardennes1944

cronin_j wrote: »

They would have got it in a payrise anyway so it makes no difference..
EDIT: Also what fees the ESb charges its customers is set in stone by the Energy Regulator. They are not allowed to alter this.

THANK YOU! most people think its the ESB's wish to charge higher prices, but being semi state they have to charge what the regulator tells them too! they also give in and around 200mill to the government every year in profits.

keithclancy

bonzos wrote: »

I just read the article in todays indo where ESB employees get up to €480 worth of free electricity every year,this perk is enjoyed by over 99%of employees including the top executives who earn up to €700k per year PA!!!This is the same semi state that charges customers who are having difficulties in paying their bill a €100 "consultation fee" before the cut off their power....is it any wonder this country f**ked.

Thats pretty standard, a most european energy companies give a discount on power + gas to its employees.

Apple give a 27% discount on products.

Microsoft give upto 80% discounts to employees.

Aer Lingus give employee discounts on flights to family and friends of employees.

IMO All just a benefit thrown in to work for the company.

baldbear

cronin_j wrote: »

Instead of payrises, some staff opted to get the amount deducted from their ESB bills.

I think just because its a Semi-state body people are in uproar over it.. But no-one was giving out in the private sector when they had similar perks. I know until recently my job in the Private Sector had some good perks.

All ESB staff received the discount on top of annual increments. I think pay increases were suspended though.

No staff have taken a pay cut only a suspension in increases.(except maybe Mcmanus a tiny pay cut last year.)

The perks for ESB staff continue because there unions are so powerful. I think thats what annoys people in the private sector.

Tefral

Deutschlandfürimmer7 wrote: »

THANK YOU! most people think its the ESB's wish to charge higher prices, but being semi state they have to charge what the regulator tells them too! they also give in and around 200mill to the government every year in profits.

I posted this in another thread:

I wasnt gonna post in this thread but looking at some of the bull**** being posted here I felt I had to.

My Father works for the ESB. Some of the ****e people think they know about it is unreal, there are people calling for it to be sold when they havent a clue.

- The ESB pays a massive dividend to the government every year.
- The ESB is NOT allowed drop the price it charges its consumers for is service by a Goverment Appointed regulator. This is to reduce the monopoly that ESB had on the market. It has to drop its consumer base below 60% before it is allowed compete with prices.
- ESB is one of the most effecient utility companies in all of Europe. Ill dig out the article later that supports this..( I might actually have to scan it in if i cant locate it on the net)
- ESBI is one of the worlds leading authorities on power generation in the world. Is arm designs and runs power stations from America to the Far East. Its main office is in St.Stephens Green.
- ESB takes on many apprentices that have lost their jobs in Mechanics and Electrical trades and helps them to complete their on the job phases.
- The ESB was bound by the Government endorsed Union agreement on payrises for profitable companies. The ESB costs the Government **** all and actually gives money to the state as it is a profitable company, it has to therefore pay the increases as set out in the agreement.
- The ESB last year reduced the level of staff in the company by a voluntary redundancy scheme to shed the dead wood in the company and make it more effecient. To my knowledge this is the only company in the "Public" sector that did this without being forced to do so by the Government or any other outside pressue.
- The ESB has a pay freeze in place by agreement for 3 years starting this year.
- All ESB employees were subject to a reversal of a planned 2.5% payrise by ESB management
- The commission for Energy Regulation keeps a very close eye on the ESB much closer than the regulator did on the banks.
- ESB workers used to be allowed take their vehicles home, that policy has stopped bar those "on call" workers, this is to save the company money and also to free up the fleet whic is being reduced to a level of 0.9 vehicles per crew
- There is massive investment by the ESB in R&D into renewable and offshore energy which directly helps the taxpayer.

I could go on and on and on on how this company is effiencent in its nature, no doubt that its employees are well treated but so were alot of us Private sector workers when our companies were rolling in it..

Tefral

baldbear wrote: »

All ESB staff received the discount on top of annual increments.

Show me proof of this please because thats not what happened my father..

Thoie

cronin_j wrote: »

I know until recently my job in the Private Sector had some good perks.

I think that's the point though - your private sector employer has either done away with you, or done away with the perks on the basis that they now can't be afforded. I have no problems with either private, public or semi-state employees getting reasonable perks when and if their companies can afford them.

Tefral

Thoie wrote: »

I think that's the point though - your private sector employer has either done away with you, or done away with the perks on the basis that they now can't be afforded. I have no problems with either private, public or semi-state employees getting reasonable perks when and if their companies can afford them.

The ESB and its subsideries are hugely profitable, my company isnt. When my company was - and yours too, we got good perks. There is still plenty of examples of companies in the IFSC that provide Gyms etc to their workers etc etc.

Theres a "Perks of your job" thread in the afterhours forum and the stuff in there would make you jealous and most of the companies are private. If they are profitable then theres no reason why they shouldnt look after the people that make them profitable

Ardennes1944

cronin_j wrote: »

Show me proof of this please because thats not what happened my father..

nor mine

finbarrk

Get your facts right here lads.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/1201/1224284485802.html

Tefral

finbarrk wrote: »

Get your facts right here lads.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/1201/1224284485802.html

Who are you referring to with that article? If its to me then I know my facts are right and it wouldnt be the first time Irishtimes has been factually incorrect

View

cronin_j wrote: »

They would have got it in a payrise anyway so it makes no difference..

That would depend on whether they pay tax on the amount of electricity they receive at a comparable rate to which they would pay if they received the amount as cash....

finbarrk

cronin_j wrote: »

Who are you referring to with that article? If its to me then I know my facts are right and it wouldnt be the first time Irishtimes has been factually incorrect

No, you are fine. I was just clarrifying that it's not 55% of the workers bills thats discounted. The discount is on a certain amount of units, so on most workers bills it might work out as a 10 -20% discount.

jimmycrackcorm

I've no problem with ESB staff getting discounted electricity the same as clothes retail staff get a discount on the clothes they buy in-store or the discounts that Dunnes / Tescos give their staff on shopping. I also presume Dublin bus drivers get to travel free for example ( base don seeing off-duty staff showing the drivers their id's).

The problem I have with the ESB is that their staff are dis-proportionally paid in comparison with any other sector simply because of their ability to hold the country to ransom. This article states the average pay at being close to €100k: http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/average-pay-and-pension-of-esb-workers-near-euro100000-2065160.html

It's probably skewed upwards because of the pension benefits but there's no point anyone complaining about TD's pay nor public sector pay inequalities without including the ESB staff.

I take the point about the price for electricity being set by the regulator to encourage competition but staff costs for the competition are also being driven higher by matching the ESB staff also.

Heroditas

bamboozle wrote: »

sunday times did an interivew with the head guy in the company which owns Airtricity. they want to buy ESB and Bord Gais, in the interview this guy was saying the average salary in ESB was over 70k, whereas the average salary in Airtricity was under 35k.

Of course the average salary in Airtricity is far lower - their HQ in Sandyford is a glorified call centre. All their traders etc are now based in the UK.
There are a few senior management, policy staff, key account managers, business development people etc in Ireland but that's about it.
ESB have their networks crews, power generation crews on shift and it is a much more vast organization than Airtricity.
Maybe we should compare the wages of Airtricity to the ESB Customer Supply wing and then we'd get a clearer picture.

bamboozle wrote: »

flip side being Eamonn Ryan was saying this morning that we shouldnt sell either Bord Gais or ESB as they both invest about 2 billion annually into the rish economy and if they went private this may stop.

What he should have said was that there is no guarantee they would be bought.
Another energy company in this country has effectively been on the market for over two years and no-one has bought it. Just because something is up for sale and is valued at a certain amount, doesn't mean anyone wants to buy it.
Endesa are even reviewing their Irish operations at the moment.
We're a very small market and until the market becomes fully integrated into a pan-European grid/market, there's no real benefit in a large utility buying an Irish one.

baldbear

cronin_j wrote: »

Show me proof of this please because thats not what happened my father..

From personal experience annual increments were awarded around March every year, and also there were 55% discount on units off the bill.

I'm not an anti ESB private v semi state hater,the perks are good in the ESB and fair play to the workers for getting them.

The media love pitting people against the semi states, they are trying to get the public to turn against the ESB to eventually sell off state assets, IMO.

Heroditas

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

but staff costs for the competition are also being driven higher by matching the ESB staff also.

The competitors don't even vaguely match the ESB's wages, not in the slightest.
I can tell you that for a fact.

cson

I would imagine the high wage factor stems from it formerly being a State Company and it's monopolistic hold on the market until recently. The higher wages and benefits would be a legacy of this.

Also, once a Company is turning a profit it should pay whatever it wants to it's employees to be honest.

jd83

Nearly every job in the private sector i have held have offered staff substantial discounts on their products. So this is a non issue and normal practice in most companies.

Japer

bonzos wrote: »

I just read the article in todays indo where ESB employees get up to €480 worth of free electricity every year,this perk is enjoyed by over 99%of employees including the top executives who earn up to €700k per year PA!!!This is the same semi state that charges customers who are having difficulties in paying their bill a €100 "consultation fee" before the cut off their power....is it any wonder this country f**ked.

+1. Any of the people I have met who work in the ESB / have close relatives who work in the ESB, say the company is a doss to work for, and its the best / easiest job ever ! As they get to retirement age, they even get a two day seminar on how to spend their retirement ( a retirement planning course - how to spend your 70k a year pension as one retiring esb worker joked ).

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable. As it is, they are among the highest in the world. Shame on them.

Heroditas

Japer wrote: »

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable.

Again, their prices are set by the regulator for the domestic market.
In the commercial market, they are able to compete against their competitors and are now very aggressive on prices.
So to say that the wages contribute to high electricity costs is just pain worng, particularly when the kWh price here is very similar to the rest of the EU. The transmission and distribution costs are very high because investment is needed to upgrade the network.

Don't let facts get in the way of your rant though.

Tefral

If the government sell off the ESB all that the Government will then own is Eirgrid. Basically the lines that the Electricity Passes.

If that happens expect the standard you get from the electricity companies to drop dramatically.

The ESB will be downsized to maximise profits at the expense of the greater good. The staff will be all contractors who work for an hourly rate (the cheapest possible) quality will go out the window with work.

A few Christmas's ago the ESB sent workers to Scotland, France and England when they had a particular bad winter to help out over there. The were faced with a crew in the home countries utilities that were small and inadequate. There was no pulling machines, no cable drums nothing. People were left without Electricity in these countries all over the christmas. That wouldnt happen here, the ESB has stocks of the right equipment and materials on hand. How many of ye have known brownouts or prolonged periods of no electricity here in Ireland?

In America this is a regular occurance and in other EU Cities. The ESB when it was a monopoly in the market, was providing electricity at one of the cheapest rates in the EU.

Tefral

Japer wrote: »

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable. As it is, they are among the highest in the world. Shame on them.

Thats just wrong simple as that.

Bullseye1

jd83 wrote: »

Nearly every job in the private sector i have held have offered staff substantial discounts on their products. So this is a non issue and normal practice in most companies.

I doubt private sector companies are giving away these benefits now though. You have to adapt to the current economic climate. Most companies now no longer give Christmas bonus or hold Christmas parties.

baldbear

Japer wrote: »

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable. As it is, they are among the highest in the world. Shame on them.

The regulator sets the electricity prices. They won't allow the ESB reduce their prices because they want people to move to different electricity providers. It's not the ESB's fault that the regulator are setting prices so high.

Heroditas

cronin_j wrote: »

If the government sell off the ESB all that the Government will then own is Eirgrid. Basically the lines that the Electricity Passes.

If that happens expect the standard you get from the electricity companies to drop dramatically.

The ESB will be downsized to maximise profits at the expense of the greater good. The staff will be all contractors who work for an hourly rate (the cheapest possible) quality will go out the window with work.

That's a bit extreme.
I agree about the Customer Supply bit being downsized but the government could keep control of the ESB Networks wing, i.e. the part that maintains the transmission and distribution side of the business. Then they could guarantee the grid would be maintained properly.

Tefral

Heroditas wrote: »

That's a bit extreme.
I agree about the Customer Supply bit being downsized but the government could keep control of the ESB Networks wing, i.e. the part that maintains the transmission and distribution side of the business. Then they could guarantee the grid would be maintained properly.

Thats not what would happen at all. ESB networks would cease to exist.. Eirgrid is the company that controls the transmission network. ESB Networks only maintains that. If the ESB were to be sold Networks would be gone too.

I know this because a couple of years ago the ESB submitted the cost of all this to the Government.

Bullseye1

Not sure how I feel about privatisation of public utilities but they better not make the same mistake they did with Eircom. Keep the infrastructure sell the business.

Japer

Heroditas wrote: »

Again, their prices are set by the regulator for the domestic market.

two wrongs do not make a right.
The regulator looks at the costs incurs - including staff and workers salaries - before deciding on what to sell electricity for. If electricity could be produced more cheaply, by paying more realistic salaries, then the cost of electricity could be brought down. Or the ESB could give a dividend / payment to the govt of the cash saved, whatever. Paying people in the ESB up to 700,000.00 per year is simply ludicrous. No wonder we have the second most expensive electricity in Europe.

keithclancy

Japer wrote: »

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable. As it is, they are among the highest in the world. Shame on them.

no, in comparison to the other EU members its pretty much on par.

http://www.energy.eu/#Domestic

Ireland is pretty much the same price as Belgium, Cheaper than Germany, the Netherlands, Denmark, Italy and Sweden.

Ireland pays a bit more on Gas, mainly because it has to come via 1 pipeline through from the UK and Ireland has no Gas storage facilities so it cannot store Gas in the Summer to curtail high winter prices, unfortunately you cannot change where its Geographically situated.

Heroditas

cronin_j wrote: »

Thats not what would happen at all. ESB networks would cease to exist.. Eirgrid is the company that controls the transmission network. ESB Networks only maintains that. If the ESB were to be sold Networks would be gone too.

I know this because a couple of years ago the ESB submitted the cost of all this to the Government.

They can still sell off just ESB Customer Supply if they want, just like Viridian sold off NIE to ESB but kept Energia, NIE Energy, Eco Wind Power and Huntstown Power.
I don't agree that Networks would be gone.

And with ESB buying NIE, that would also be sold off.
So we would have a private company potentially controlling the network for the whole island. It's not a very edifying thought. Strong regulation would be needed to ensure investment was kept to a required level in the networks but I don't hold out much hope for the CER doing that.

skydish79

Bullseye1 wrote: »

I doubt private sector companies are giving away these benefits now though. You have to adapt to the current economic climate. Most companies now no longer give Christmas bonus or hold Christmas parties.

Bank employees are still getting their perks, reduced interest rates etc.

And they are still having their christmas parties, all they are doing is ringing up and organising them but not telling them they are from the banks

longhalloween

trad wrote: »

I get a 15% discount of all my puchases form my employer and the discount amounts to much more than the ESB gives it's employees. Whats the problem? It's less than a tenner per week.


Guinness used to give their employees free stout (probably still do), it's called being a good employer.

True enough.

Restaurant workers usually get free or discounted food, clothes shops offer massive discounts to employees.
Even Smyths give a 10% discount to all their Christmas staff.

It's just showing an appreciation to their employees, nothing more and its very common.

ardmacha

ESB salaries are excessive to be sure. However the focus of public comment is that they cut off people who don't pay while giving free electricity to their staff. Dublin Bus give free travel to their staff. O2 might give free phones to their staff, but they will cut you off if you don't pay them all the same.

Tefral

Heroditas wrote: »

They can still sell off just ESB Customer Supply if they want, just like Viridian sold off NIE to ESB but kept Energia, NIE Energy, Eco Wind Power and Huntstown Power.
I don't agree that Networks would be gone.

And with ESB buying NIE, that would also be sold off.
So we would have a private company potentially controlling the network for the whole island. It's not a very edifying thought. Strong regulation would be needed to ensure investment was kept to a required level in the networks but I don't hold out much hope for the CER doing that.

See thats the thing, Eirgrid is a completely seperate company to the ESB, ESB networks dont actually own any transmission lines, all the ESB Networks does is charge Eirgrid to maintain their transmission lines. ESB Networks contains all the vans, all the garages, all the Network Technicians etc, thats where the biggest expenditure in the ESB lays.

If the ESB were to be sold, you can bet your bottom dollar that the company that buys the ESB will want to do the work for Eirgrid as cheaply as possible

Heroditas

cronin_j wrote: »

See thats the thing, Eirgrid is a completely seperate company to the ESB, ESB networks dont actually own any transmission lines, all the ESB Networks does is charge Eirgrid to maintain their transmission lines. ESB Networks contains all the vans, all the garages, all the Network Technicians etc, thats where the biggest expenditure in the ESB lays.

If the ESB were to be sold, you can bet your bottom dollar that the company that buys the ESB will want to do the work for Eirgrid as cheaply as possible

Yeah food for thought there alright.
Anyway, good to have a nice discussion on the merits of the market without the usual rabble-rousing!

Tipp Man

People on here are completly missing the point. They are complaining about free electricity which is proably only worth 3-400 per employee per year.

What is a major major problem is that we have some of the highest energy and electricity costs in Europe and that the average salary in the largest provider of electricity in this country is over 70,000. That must be double the industrial wage now. Its pure madness the amount that they are paid, completly unjustified and quite simply outrageous that this level of salary is being paid whilst the customer (the people and businesses of Ireland) and being ripped off, and we are being ripped off good and proper

I don't care if it's the regulators fault, ESB's fault, or Gormless fault. It's a bloody disgrace and needs to be sorted if we are ever to have a competitive economy again

Monty Burnz

bamboozle wrote: »

so that's over 3 million a year wasted on this perk, so many state bodies have pointless expenses that need to be eradicated...will it ever happen? i doubt it.

sunday times did an interivew with the head guy in the company which owns Airtricity. they want to buy ESB and Bord Gais, in the interview this guy was saying the average salary in ESB was over 70k, whereas the average salary in Airtricity was under 35k.

Bear in mind there may be a different balance of clerical/engineering/IT staff in the two companies, so the comparison may not tell you too much. I think the power station staff in the ESB are certainly overpaid though, with overtime ordinary schmoes there are clearing €120k. Re. the 'free' electricity - it's actually discounted as others have observed, not free - you pay for every incremental unit. I don't see why this is such a big deal to be honest - most jobs have some perk or other.

The Nark

MidlandsM wrote: »

I started a thread about this story yesterday in After Hours and most of the posters to my thread thought it was OK and and perk of their jobs!
What a shower of clueless fools they are.......no wonder this countrys gone down the tubes.

Yeah... let's adopt the Michael O'Leary model altogether... minimum wage or less for all workers, no perks, longer working hours, 6 day working week, shorter holidays etc., etc., etc.

Meanwhile he's at Cheltenham or the like sipping champagne with his fellow billionaires thinking up other ways to screw the last drop of blood out of the working classes.

The country is going down the tubes because of corrupt bankers, corrupt property developers and corrupt politicians who bled our country's finances dry and eventually created this "recession".

Now its time to pay the piper... but who pays??? None of the corrupt gentlemen & women mentioned above. Oh no. Time again to screw the unemployed, those on minimum wage, lowly public servants, the elderly, the infirm, etc., etc. Let them eat cheese.

And typical of the Irish who accept and condone the criminal actions of Fianna Fail and their tent companions from Galway and indeed, the other corrupt politicians who make up Dail Eireann, we turn on one another.

Exactly as the people who caused this mess would want.

Today it's the ESB workers who got the perk of free electricity & are well paid. So what? Fair play to them.

Who will we turn on tomorrow?

Open you eyes folks. You're playing right into the hands of the people who would return us to a Dickensian work era where poverty was the tool of those who considered themselves "upper class".

johnnyskeleton

ESB makes a large profit and this can be distributed in a number of ways;

1) to the government as owners i.e. return on capital;
2) to the staff to share profits and to encourage better, more motivated workers;
3) to the customers, who are paying too much for electricity.

The government is entitled to make as much profit as it can from the firm as a way to ease the budgetary problems. Therefore, it could seek to reduce wages but only so long as this does not disrupt output.

The staff are entitled to a good wage for a good job, but they also must realise that in a recession their customers cannot pay as much and their owners need to make more revenue from less sales.

The customers are entitled to a good deal, but in fairness the only way this can be achieved is proper competition between the various parties. Two semi state companies and one private company but awful customer service (just try ringing Airtricity) is hardly a particularly competitive market and customers really deserve better than the forcibly high prices of electricity in Ireland.

IMO, so long as the government are happy and the service is competitive, then the staff can get paid as much as they can get. But if the government is unhappy they should try to make savings and if consumers are unhappy they should try to get another supplier, limited though the options may be.

Heroditas

Tipp Man wrote: »

What is a major major problem is that we have some of the highest energy and electricity costs in Europe

Due to transmission and distribution costs that are needed to upgrade the network that was neglected for about 20 years during which we enjoyed some of the cheapest energy costs in Europe.

You can't have it both ways.

Anyway, the cost per kWh in Ireland is comparable to most other European countries. Bundle in the extra TUoS and DUoS costs and the ttal cost rises, due to what I mentioned above.

Throw in the PSO levy and capacity payments and that brings up the cost even more.

the_syco

Japer wrote: »

If the ESB workers were not so overpaid then our electricity costs would be more reasonable.

The rate is set by the Energy Regulator. If it wasn't, the ESB could rop it's rates, and kill off any competition overnight.

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Keep the infrastructure sell the business.

I read this as: sell the part that makes the money, keep that part that spends the money. What do you get? A part that spends money. What happens? They pay money to a company, instead of gaining money from the business.

Kiki10

Count Dooku wrote: »

I presume that main purpose of Energy Regulator is to keep living standards of ESB staff :rolleyes:

the main purpose of all these regulators is jobs for the boys, we managed fine without them before the boom?