dog bit ,what would you do??

pokertalk

ok so a freind of a freind has a 12-13 year old terrier cross. she also has a 10 month baby girl. the dog likes to be on his own alot and does not really like kids that much. but a couple of days ago the dog bit the babys face whilst playing on the floor and left some bad teeth marks on the baby.as far as i know they said it was unprovoked and that as soon as it bit the dog let go.they are not going to get the dog put down because it was so quick and he stopped after one bite . im not too sure what i would do myself .the dog is blind and suffers from incontinence .what would you do??

astra2000

I am shocked. Why if they knew the dog didnt like children would they let the baby near the dog? Are they really planning on keeping the dog after it bit their baby in an unprovoked attack? Just saw the dog is blind and incontinent really really did not make any sense to have dog and baby near each other.

pokertalk

thats the first thing i thought when i heard it
so you think pts??

scudzilla

Firstly i'd try and discover what issues the dog has, i'd book it into training and also get the first available appointment with a dog therapist/counsellor.

pokertalk

i know it needs training but my question is regards to the dog being pts.

Stercus Accidit

WTF, a dog bit a baby and they are concerned for the dog?

It cant be kept in the same house as the baby, thats for sure. As a toddler I pulled the hair and ears of our dog until it would yelp (I was a toddler didn't know what I was at) and it never did a thing, it would follow me around and growl when strangers would go near me, it was protective of me no matter what I did even if I hurt it. This was a dog that had been rescued and it wasn't treated well before. It says alot about a dogs nature how it reacts to a child, not liking 'company' implies an anti-social dog, I hope its kept well away from that child.

Zapperzy

No it shouldn't be pts'd. No attack is completely unprovoked, if the dog is blind then the baby could have startled it somehow and it just gave a warning nip. Training and extra supervision most definitely needed, see what a behaviourist says but maybe a home with a young child isin't the best for a blind dog, children are too unpredictable and move too fast and can easily upset a dog with full vision nevermind a blind dog.

Taceom

scudzilla wrote: »

Firstly i'd try and discover what issues the dog has, i'd book it into training and also get the first available appointment with a dog therapist/counsellor.

I think it's the owner who is in need of therapy! Get rid of dog. Simple.

ISDW

So an old, blind dog comes across an obstacle on the floor that they've never come across before and gives it a nip. Definitely not a reason to put the dog to sleep. The dog has been a faithful companion for such a long time, now is the time to repay that loyalty.

Of course the baby has to be kept safe, but its not that difficult to do. All it takes is a baby gate or two in doorways, or even just keeping doors closed. Get the dog a crate if necessary, then when the baby is out crawling around, put the dog safely in the crate with a nice chew, or with its dinner.

The dog has only got a couple of years left, let the poor thing enjoy them in his/her own home with the people that it has loved for the last 12/13 years.

pokertalk

ISDW wrote: »

So an old, blind dog comes across an obstacle on the floor that they've never come across before and gives it a nip. Definitely not a reason to put the dog to sleep. The dog has been a faithful companion for such a long time, now is the time to repay that loyalty.

Of course the baby has to be kept safe, but its not that difficult to do. All it takes is a baby gate or two in doorways, or even just keeping doors closed. Get the dog a crate if necessary, then when the baby is out crawling around, put the dog safely in the crate with a nice chew, or with its dinner.

The dog has only got a couple of years left, let the poor thing enjoy them in his/her own home with the people that it has loved for the last 12/13 years.

yeah a re home would be out of the wuestion i think on this one

scudzilla

scudzilla wrote: »

Firstly i'd try and discover what issues the dog has, i'd book it into training and also get the first available appointment with a dog therapist/counsellor.

Taceom wrote: »

I think it's the owner who is in need of therapy! Get rid of dog. Simple.

i was taking the piss with my reply Seems that's the sort of thing that people want to hear, anything else is frowned upon

pokertalk

scudzilla wrote: »

i was taking the piss with my reply Seems that's the sort of thing that people want to hear, anything else is frowned upon

what would you really do

scudzilla

pokertalk wrote: »

what would you really do

Against my better judgement, and with the risk of getting flamed, i'd have give the dog an almighty slap (to let it know it's done wrong) then would probably have had it put down

Cherry Blossom

scudzilla wrote: »

i was taking the piss with my reply Seems that's the sort of thing that people want to hear, anything else is frowned upon

Clearly the owners are not responsible enough to have a dog or a baby, they should have both pts :rolleyes:

Serious answer, sounds like the poor dog probably hadn't a clue what it had come across investigated with a little nip, realised and let go. No way the dog should have been in the room with a baby crawling on the floor, the owners need to cop on and realise their mistake and take a bit of responsibility for it. My nephew is walking around the house at this stage and he has absolute minimal contact with the dog as even though she knows the rules at this stage he doesn't and has a tendancy to try to pull her hair and poke her in the eye anytime he gets an opportunity.

lrushe

pokertalk wrote: »

ok so a freind of a freind has a 12-13 year old terrier cross. she also has a 10 month baby girl. the dog likes to be on his own alot and does not really like kids that much. but a couple of days ago the dog bit the babys face whilst playing on the floor and left some bad teeth marks on the baby.as far as i know they said it was unprovoked and that as soon as it bit the dog let go.they are not going to get the dog put down because it was so quick and he stopped after one bite . im not too sure what i would do myself .the dog is blind and suffers from incontinence .what would you do??

My inital feeling on this is, no the dog should not be PTS.
The fault as I can see it lies on the parents of the child, as dog owners it is our responsibility not to put our dogs in situations where we know they will feel threatened or feel like they might need to defend themselves. The owners knew that the dog didn't like kids but felt it was ok to leave their 10 month old baby on the floor with it?
There is rarely a time when a bite is unprovoked, just because we can't initally see a reason for it doesn't mean there wasn't one. The bite to me sounds like a warning, it was a bite and release rather than repeated biting, not the actions of an aggressive dog in the true sense of aggression.
If I were in this situation I would get a crate and crate the dog while the child was on the floor. The dog will feel safer in it own little space and the child will not be in danger when on the floor. As an older dog it will probably spend most of the day sleeping anyway. The dog can be out when going for a walk or when the child is asleep or out of harms way.
As an older dog with medical problems he mightn't be around for much longer anyway. They should just let him live out the rest of his life in peace.

Whispered

They left a blind dog who doesn't like kids, with a 10 month old child? That is very irresponsible tbh. The dog should not be pts, the owners just need to make sure the child and the dog are not left unsupervised again. (That should really go without saying.)

How hygienic can be be to have a toddler (?) on the floor with an incontinent dog?

lrushe

Whispered wrote: »

How hygienic can be be to have a toddler (?) on the floor with an incontinent dog?

God I didn't even think of that!!!!:eek:

TooManyDogs

scudzilla wrote: »

Against my better judgement, and with the risk of getting flamed, i'd have give the dog an almighty slap (to let it know it's done wrong) then would probably have had it put down

Why would you slap it and then get it pts????? Why bother with 'letting it know it's done wrong' if you're going to kill it anyway?

It's an old blind dog, keep it seperate from the baby, no dog should be left unsupervised with any baby, regardless of the age of the dog.

The situation is very managable so no, the dog shouldnt be pts

Hellrazer

Ok as per my post in the feedback thread.Im replying here.

Scudzilla-Your slapping post has been reported.While Im not totally against giving a dog a tap I agree with the last post--Why give it a slap if youre going to put it down??

Can we try keep the comments considered by other posters to be cruel to a minimum?

scudzilla

TooManyDogs wrote: »

Why would you slap it and then get it pts????? Why bother with 'letting it know it's done wrong' if you're going to kill it anyway?

It's an old blind dog, keep it seperate from the baby, no dog should be left unsupervised with any baby, regardless of the age of the dog.

The situation is very managable so no, the dog shouldnt be pts

Hellrazer wrote: »

Ok as per my post in the feedback thread.Im replying here.

Scudzilla-Your slapping post has been reported.While Im not totally against giving a dog a tap I agree with the last post--Why give it a slap if youre going to put it down??

Can we try keep the comments considered by other posters to be cruel to a minimum?

I said the word 'PROBABLY', so that's not a certainty so reporting my post is complete and utter BS

The OP asked what i would do, i told him, andi get reported? some people on here are getting ridiculous, it's not as though i'm a rabid animal abuser!!

pokertalk

lrushe wrote: »

God I didn't even think of that!!!!:eek:

Whispered wrote: »

They left a blind dog who doesn't like kids, with a 10 month old child? That is very irresponsible tbh. The dog should not be pts, the owners just need to make sure the child and the dog are not left unsupervised again. (That should really go without saying.)

How hygienic can be be to have a toddler (?) on the floor with an incontinent dog?

not very i would of thought:eek:
crate is probably the best option for him

Whispered

Yes I think. The dog would probably really appreciate it's own "safe spot" too. They will need to be careful with the training, so the dog likes the crate instead of seeing it as a punishment.

pokertalk

Whispered wrote: »

Yes I think. The dog would probably really appreciate it's own "safe spot" too. They will need to be careful with the training, so the dog likes the crate instead of seeing it as a punishment.

lets hope they do it rite[dunno if they would put the time in do] il say it to them anyway

looksee

If I had an old, blind, incontinent dog I would have had it put to sleep anyway. How long do you wait, how frustrated does the dog have to get before you help it on its way? With a baby in the equation it seems like a no-brainer. (And I have had cats that got to 15 and 20 years so I don't say that lightly).

Whispered

Maybe you could offer to help? It should really only take a few hours with a lot of positive training.

If cost of a crate is an issue at the moment I can lend you one for a few weeks while they get money together. (it's damaged on one end but could be patched up with thick cardboard or plywood)

sharkbite1983

Like most other dog owners, I couldn't put my Buddy to sleep, but saying that, if he was unpredictable, especially with a child in the house, I'd strongly recommend taking serious action.

If he's that old & blind, the chances are his hearing ain't the best either, child probobly startled the dog, dogs instinct can't be helped. Be happy he let go as soon as he realised what he'd done.

Get a kennel for him and make sure he child is never left alone with him. Kids can be cruel to a dog without meaning it, pulling ears, hair and petting them too hard. It's dangerous and alot of people don't realise it untill the dog finally snaps or bites, and the dog gets blamed!!

challengemaster

Zapperzy wrote: »

No it shouldn't be pts'd. No attack is completely unprovoked, if the dog is blind then the baby could have startled it somehow and it just gave a warning nip. Training and extra supervision most definitely needed, see what a behaviourist says but maybe a home with a young child isin't the best for a blind dog, children are too unpredictable and move too fast and can easily upset a dog with full vision nevermind a blind dog.

You're trying to defend an animal attacking a baby. Unbelievable the things you read sometimes.

First off - I'd call child services, then get the dog put down.

pokertalk

Whispered wrote: »

Maybe you could offer to help? It should really only take a few hours with a lot of positive reinforcement.

If cost of a crate is an issue at the moment I can lend you one for a few weeks while they get money together. (it's damaged on one end but could be patched up with thick cardboard or plywood)

yeah will probably have to give em a hand. they are ok for the cash but it was a very kind offer .ty

CoalBucket

scudzilla wrote: »

Firstly i'd try and discover what issues the dog has, i'd book it into training and also get the first available appointment with a dog therapist/counsellor.

WTF, the dog bit a baby !!! I'd be making the first available appointment with a vet to have the dog put to sleep.

If the therapist route is hat you'd suggest i'd recommend the parents go there and try and teach them that they should be looking after their child instead of putting the child at risk with a dog which has already bitten.

pokertalk

CoalBucket wrote: »

WTF, the dog bit a baby !!! I'd be making the first available appointment with a vet to have the dog put to sleep.

If the therapist route is hat you'd suggest i'd recommend the parents go there and try and teach them that they should be looking after their child instead of putting the child at risk with a dog which has already bitten.

where does it say that the dog has already bitten
this is the dogs s first time to bite anyone from what i know he would just give a growl usually if he was not happy. there was supervision but it happened verry quick.im sure now they wont be in the same room anymore. well i hope

CoalBucket

scudzilla wrote: »

i was taking the piss with my reply Seems that's the sort of thing that people want to hear, anything else is frowned upon

Teaches me not to read the rest of the thread before flying off the handle

I couldn't careless what people frown upon though, I completely stand by my response above in relation to both the dog and the parents.

CoalBucket

pokertalk wrote: »

where does it say that the dog has already bitten

You said the dog bit the baby. What I was saying was that if they chose to leave the dog with the baby again the need some therapy.

andreac

challengemaster wrote: »

You're trying to defend an animal attacking a baby. Unbelievable the things you read sometimes.

First off - I'd call child services, then get the dog put down.

Call child services for what??

The dog is old and blind. It was left alone with a child which should never have happened so the parents were irresponsible and have realised what can happen when you are irresponsible.

The poor dog was probably scared and just reacted. It shouldnt have to pay the price for someone elses mistake.

pokertalk

andreac wrote: »

Call child services for what??

The dog is old and blind. It was left alone with a child which should never have happened so the parents were irresponsible and have realised what can happen when you are irresponsible.

The poor dog was probably scared and just reacted. It shouldnt have to pay the price for someone elses mistake.

i suspect child services would say.. god that was terrible and thats about it tbh

scudzilla

andreac wrote: »

Call child services for what??

The dog is old and blind. It was left alone with a child which should never have happened so the parents were irresponsible and have realised what can happen when you are irresponsible.

The poor dog was probably scared and just reacted. It shouldnt have to pay the price for someone elses mistake.

So why, when a dog bites, it seems to always be your opinion that somebody else is at fault, anybody or thing except for the dog?? Some dogs bite, they're animals, the sooner people start realising this the better

pokertalk

CoalBucket wrote: »

You said the dog bit the baby. What I was saying was that if they chose to leave the dog with the baby again the need some therapy.

oh soz . its just the way you worded it it kinda sounded like the dog had done this before

pokertalk

scudzilla wrote: »

So why, when a dog bites, it seems to always be your opinion that somebody else is at fault, anybody or thing except for the dog?? Some dogs bite, they're animals, the sooner people start realising this the better

she is not really defending the dog she already said that it was the owners fault

andreac

scudzilla wrote: »

So why, when a dog bites, it seems to always be your opinion that somebody else is at fault, anybody or thing except for the dog?? Some dogs bite, they're animals, the sooner people start realising this the better

Are you singling me out?? Where else have i said that its never the dogs fault.

Most dogs have a reason for biting and dont just do it for the fun of it. There is nearly always a reason for it and its almost clear why this dog lashed out.

The sooner people take responsibility for their stupid and irresponsible actions and stop putting blame on the dogs the better ,in my opinion.

This dog should have never been left unsupervised around the toddler and im sure the dog could have done a lot more damage but he backed off as soon as he realised what he had done. The poor thing cant even see so how was he to know it was a child, it could have been another dog for all he knew:(

challengemaster

andreac wrote: »

Call child services for what??

The dog is old and blind. It was left alone with a child which should never have happened so the parents were irresponsible

You just answered your own question.

pokertalk

andreac wrote: »

Are you singling me out?? Where else have i said that its never the dogs fault.

Most dogs have a reason for biting and dont just do it for the fun of it. There is nearly always a reason for it and its almost clear why this dog lashed out.

The sooner people take responsibility for their stupid and irresponsible actions and stop putting blame on the dogs the better ,in my opinion.

This dog should have never been left unsupervised around the toddler and im sure the dog could have done a lot more damage but he backed off as soon as he realised what he had done. The poor thing cant even see so how was he to know it was a child, it could have been another dog for all he knew:(

to be fair to them andreac they were there but it happened quickly ya know

Whispered

pokertalk wrote: »

to be fair to them andreac they were there but it happened quickly ya know

In that case I would say they need to invest in a crate or a babygate asap. The dog will likely be alot more careful now, I'm sure it got a fright. But if it was to happen again then the parents are going to feel so guilty.

andreac

pokertalk wrote: »

to be fair to them andreac they were there but it happened quickly ya know

They know the dog doesnt like children that much, so why put the dog in a situation then where hes not comfortable? They need to be a lot more careful and keep the dog totally away from the child then.

pokertalk

Whispered wrote: »

In that case I would say they need to invest in a crate or a babygate asap. The dog will likely be alot more careful now, I'm sure it got a fright. But if it was to happen again then the parents are going to feel so guilty.

yep totally agree .

pokertalk

most of us on this forum have dogs and although alot of our dogs may be great with children, if one of our dogs bit a child even though its so out of charactor are we being neglectfull. i know the dog in the original post was not great with kids and that he should be seperated at all times but im just wondering what some people think of a happy go lucky dog biting. should we all have our dogs seperate at all times even supervised things can go wrong as we truly do not know what the dog may be thinking. just thought i would put that one out there;)

sionnaic

I have to wonder sometimes if half the people on this forum actually even like animals.

It's clear in this case that the parents made an unfortunate mistake which they hopefully won't repeat. The elderly ailing dog hardly leapt like a slavering monster across the room to savage their baby. He got a fright and reacted naturally and let go immediately.

There are easy steps they can take to prevent any more accidents which do not involve killing their pet of 13 long years.

There are lots of people here who have given good advice re. keeping children and dogs separated, tips on positive use of a crate and toys to help with this. I personally think all the other kind of posts regarding killing and slapping and child services are sensationalist and unnecessary. Pets are not disposable to be discarded when things get difficult. The OPs friends have to take responsibility for their decision to have this dog and step up and put in the effort.

pokertalk

sionnaic wrote: »

I have to wonder sometimes if half the people on this forum actually even like animals.

It's clear in this case that the parents made an unfortunate mistake which they hopefully won't repeat. The elderly ailing dog hardly leapt like a slavering monster across the room to savage their baby. He got a fright and reacted naturally and let go immediately.

There are easy steps they can take to prevent any more accidents which do not involve killing their pet of 13 long years.

There are lots of people here who have given good advice re. keeping children and dogs separated, tips on positive use of a crate and toys to help with this. I personally think all the other kind of posts regarding killing and slapping and child services are sensationalist and unnecessary. Pets are not disposable to be discarded when things get difficult. The OPs friends have to take responsibility for their decision to have this dog and step up and put in the effort.

its not really advice i was seeking more so what people would do in the owners shoes.so in effect they are entitlled to theri opinion and debate it as long as it is within reason . the dog being pts or ringing social services is their opinion which they are entitled to dont you think?

Graces7

Please, can we distinguish between "bite" and "nip"?

This was a warning nip; had the dog wanted to bite it could and would have done so.

Some of the replies here! Maybe a wind-up fluffy toy is what some are seeking, a machine rather than a living creature?

There was a thread long ago when I said that our collie had once, greatly provoked, nipped someone. A BITER some said! Collie has never even tried to nip us not once; did not even attack the old man who beat her recently. Yet some here would label her as aggressive.

Every animal has its limits. These need respect.

Yes, it was the fault of the adults, once again. Totally. The dog did what was totally appropriate given the situation.

Wonderful some of the compassionate replies here; thank you. Poor old dog, needing and deserving peace in these last months.

sionnaic

pokertalk wrote: »

its not really advice i was seeking more so what people would do in the owners shoes.so in effect they are entitlled to theri opinion and debate it as long as it is within reason . the dog being pts or ringing social services is their opinion which they are entitled to dont you think?

Yes of course you're right - people are entitled to their opinion just as I am entitled to be horrified by some of those opinions. Having to have my 12-year-old dog pts due to a serious illness absolutely broke my heart and remains as one of the most upsetting times of my life so it truly disturbs me to hear people be so cavalier about it without even trying to address the problem.

As for me, I don't have to wonder what I would do in this situation because I have actually been in a similar situation and the way I handled it was by putting in the time, money and effort to address the problem

1. Keeping dog and human in question safely separated
2. Changing to a better vet who gave great advice on health tests and behaviour, even though it meant driving 40 minutes out of my way to her practice compared to the other vet just 5 mins down the road
3. Consulting with a great trainer who uses only positive methods
4. Putting in massive effort in special training every day before and after work and weekends, in rain, hail or shine, my own exhaustion notwithstanding
5. Keeping my temper even when the dog frustrated me to the point of breaking
6. Keeping my resolve, putting up with other people's (friends and family members included) "just get rid of him" attitudes
7. Driving a 100 mile round-trip every Tuesday evening after work to go to a good and suitable training class with the dog
8. Buying the necessary supporting equipment such as gates, toys, training tools
9. Sacrificing my own convenience for the good of both the dog and the human in question

And why did I put myself through all of this rather than just hitting him an almighty slap and throwing him into the vets to be pts?

Because I love my dog and when I chose to adopt him I took full responsibility for his health, behaviour and well-being.

Anyone who can't say the same thing about their pet then doesn't deserve the privilege of having one, and that's my opinion of course.

**Vai**

pokertalk wrote: »

ok so a freind of a freind has a 12-13 year old terrier cross. she also has a 10 month baby girl. the dog likes to be on his own alot and does not really like kids that much. but a couple of days ago the dog bit the babys face whilst playing on the floor and left some bad teeth marks on the baby.as far as i know they said it was unprovoked and that as soon as it bit the dog let go.they are not going to get the dog put down because it was so quick and he stopped after one bite . im not too sure what i would do myself .the dog is blind and suffers from incontinence .what would you do??

I'd have the mother put down.

People talking about putting a dog to sleep based on their own irresponsible actions are beyond belief. Completely.
The dog was BLIND. It NIPPED and moved off.
This is not some blood thirsty killer we have here.
Keep them separate from now on, as much for hygiene as anything else, and that's that.

If you can't be bothered to deal with a dog properly, if you view it as a nuisance and want it pts or give it away at the slightest provocation or lapse in your own judgement, then wtf do you have a dog for in the first place? Get a wind up toy or a stuffed animal!!
:mad:

dave1982

Sounds to me dog is suffering blind and incoherent,prob so used to life without a baby and now he's blind theres a new sound movement probably don't know whats happening.Dog is most likely scared
I'm a firm believer in introducing dogs to new children and not separating them as they will become jealous of the baby.