New gaming PC for under €550

Trevor451

Hey guys I am looking for a gaming pc that can run GTA 4, flight simulator x etc at high enough settings for less than €550 including shipping

Solitaire suggested me a build earlier on in the year but new components may have came onto the market so I may as well start from scratch

BTW I already have OS, VGA monitor and keyboard and mouse
Regards,
Trevor

cherryghost

I love a challenge



The Tri core can be unlocked to a quad core. The PSU may be overkill, but at least whenever you upgrade you could keep it :P A 550W one would be enough, and shave a tenner off that if you wanted.

Monotype

The F3 is only about €1 dearer, and the F3 ecogreen is 1c dearer than that.

I wouldn't be keen on the coolermaster GXs, they're known to be a bit dodgy.

Trevor451

Thanks for suggesting the build cherryghost I just have a couple more questions to ask I am such a newb when it comes to choosing out parts :pac:

Will this game definitely run GTA 4 and other modern games on high enough settings and will it last long before I have to upgrade it again?

Are all of the components compatible? (like for example case can house motherboard, correct motherboard for cpu? etc)

Are there any other cheap upgrades I could get that would improve the performance of the machine?

If the PSU is a bit doggy which one do you recommend?

Regards
Trevor

VenomIreland

cherryghost wrote: »

I love a challenge



The Tri core can be unlocked to a quad core. The PSU may be overkill, but at least whenever you upgrade you could keep it :P A 550W one would be enough, and shave a tenner off that if you wanted.

Mind if I "borrow" most of that build for a friend's build?

Jonny7

Trevor451 wrote: »

Thanks for suggesting the build cherryghost I just have a couple more questions to ask I am such a newb when it comes to choosing out parts :pac:

Will this game definitely run GTA 4 and other modern games on high enough settings and will it last long before I have to upgrade it again?

Are all of the components compatible? (like for example case can house motherboard, correct motherboard for cpu? etc)

Are there any other cheap upgrades I could get that would improve the performance of the machine?

If the PSU is a bit doggy which one do you recommend?

Regards
Trevor

The PC cherryghost has specced with run almost every single game on the market right now at good settings on a 22 inch monitor.

I say almost, because GTA4 is special.

Its a dreadful port from the console, badly coded etc. It's heavily CPU dependent. Basically its a pig of a game.

You might possibly want to consider reading the last few pages of the budget build sticky - adding 50 to 100 euros to your budget could result in a much more desirable PC

I believe a 6 core AMD with 6850 is possible for under 650 euros.

Or quad core AMD with 6850/460GTX for under 600 euros.

Either way, around 600 euros is really the sweet spot.

Oops little edit: the mentioned machine will still run GTA4 fine - just remember its a good bit more of a system hog than most other games

Monotype

Trevor451 wrote: »

If the PSU is a bit doggy which one do you recommend?

In the similar price region
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=19286
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=24479
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30069

The 550W is still more than enough. You could cut back as far as 450W to be honest.

cherryghost

Trevor451 wrote: »

Thanks for suggesting the build cherryghost I just have a couple more questions to ask I am such a newb when it comes to choosing out parts :pac:

Will this game definitely run GTA 4 and other modern games on high enough settings and will it last long before I have to upgrade it again?

Are all of the components compatible? (like for example case can house motherboard, correct motherboard for cpu? etc)

Are there any other cheap upgrades I could get that would improve the performance of the machine?

If the PSU is a bit doggy which one do you recommend?

Regards
Trevor

The CPU I listed there can be unlocked to a quad core in the bios settings of that motherboards, its basically extra grunt for free :P As jonny said, you could invest in an extra 40/50 euro and just get a quad core CPU as it is, but my build saves money if you wish to do so.

Imo the Coolermaster series of PSUs are fine. My mates been using a similar one for 2 years now with no issues, very quiet. Reviews are very good for that PSU also, the only criticism is the lack of modular design, but meh, its cheap what else do you expect?

All of the components are indeed compatible.

Maybe take up monotypes suggestion and get a slighty faster hard drive for a measily amount of cash :P Might speed up loading times in games a bit, but that's about it.

The build as it is with the CPU unlocked should play GTAIV no bother. It's got a high clock rate already and the overclocking headroom is huge on it, from what I've read. It really is a great processor for such little money.

Monotype

They're not terrible, but if they can't reach what they're labelled as, I'd tend to choose something else. Coolermaster's high end PSUs are very good - just the cheaper ones fall short.

PogMoThoin

These the best value for money psus on hdv.de that will actually do what its rated for:
http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=30069&agid=240
or stretching a little further:
http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=24479&agid=240

Hank Scorpio

fwiw gta4 runs pretty well on my pc ( specs in sig )

however the gpu usage jumps all over the place, resulting in funny fps drops

maxed out gpu usage i get 100fps + maxed out in 1080p resolution ( strangly this usually happens when im in doors in the game, rarely outside )

sometimes the gpu usage drops to 60 and the frames can go as low as 40, but this rarely happens!

all in all its a horrible port of a console game(and overrated!:p mafia too owns it even tho its so short)

jozi

I might go with the mobo, cpu and ram combo from this. Does hardware versandt still post to ireland, or do they not take credit card?

Maybe a little OT will my ati x800xl work alright with the above? I doubt I'll be gaming much with this setup but I like the sound and price listed.

cherryghost

jozi wrote: »

I might go with the mobo, cpu and ram combo from this. Does hardware versandt still post to ireland, or do they not take credit card?

Maybe a little OT will my ati x800xl work alright with the above? I doubt I'll be gaming much with this setup but I like the sound and price listed.

They still post to Ireland yep, and they do take credit card.

And yes, your card will work on that setup no problem

Trevor451

Hi I was doing some research today at school today about the case and on the Cooler master website it states that it has USB ports and audio jacks on the case itself? where abouts are these ports located?
http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=2908

EDIT: Found out that the ports were at the very top of the case :P

Should I get any more fans to keep the computer cool or are 3 fans included in the case enough to keep it cool even when running games?

EDIT (again) I was under the impression that hardwareversand does not take payments by credit card? when you go to the last page on the checkout it states "You complete the order followed by the payment at the PayPal-website. Note: Your order will be not processed until your payment was received at our PayPal-account. If your payment did not reach us within 7 Days, we will cancel the order. We deliever exclusively to the at address registered at PayPal. Important: At present we can''t accept PayPal transfers with credit card. "

cherryghost

Trevor451 wrote: »

Hi I was doing some research today at school today about the case and on the Cooler master website it states that it has USB ports and audio jacks on the case itself? where abouts are these ports located?
http://www.coolermaster.com/product.php?product_id=2908

There's 2 USB ports, 1 mic jack, 1 headphone jack and one SATA docking port on the top, towards the front.

jozi

cherryghost wrote: »

They still post to Ireland yep, and they do take credit card.

And yes, your card will work on that setup no problem

Thanks, and they are pretty much still the cheapest around then?

VenomIreland

Wait, HV.de accept credit and debit cards now? I thought it was only bank transfer and paypal.

Trevor451

VenomIreland wrote: »

Wait, HV.de accept credit and debit cards now? I thought it was only bank transfer and paypal.

+1 Last time I heard hardwareversand only accept paypal (but you cant use credit card through paypal) or you can use bank transfer which is slow and is risky to use

cherryghost

Sorry my bad, but sure you can add credit cards to your paypal account anyway :P

Trevor451

Hi I managed to get a extra €50 from somewhere What could I upgrade on this build that would increase performance greatly?




BTW will all of the components be compatible and fit properly in the case? For some reason all the psu units seem to be different sizes and I am really confused

deconduo

Change the processor to this:
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=37139&agid=1242
(Bit faster, worth the 3 extra euro)

Change motherboard to this:
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=34887&agid=1232
(USB3 support, same price)

Change DVD to this:
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=23095&agid=699
(Is in stock)

With the extra cash you can grab a 6850:
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=39511&agid=1004


-Your case is out of stock, so you'd want to change that

-You could probably drop down to the 550W PSU and put the money towards a case upgrade.

Solitaire

A decent 550W PSU would be plenty Not sure about that mobo unless you already have a decent soundcard though

Skerries

would he not be better off throwing the money into the best CPU he could get as the rest looks fine?

Curry Addict

heres what i would go for ... Article-No. Article Availability Delivery price
HV20I576DE Intel Core i5-760 Box 8192Kb, LGA1156
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 163,91 €
HV1131ILDE Gigabyte GA-P55A-UD3, Intel P55, ATX, DDR3, PCI-Express
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 113,72 €
HV20G303DE 4GB-Kit G-Skill Ripjaws PC3-10667U CL9
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
Delivery late, new date requested. 55,41 €
HV203GXQDE JCP Midi Tower ATX "Dark Crystal", schwarz, 500W Netzteil
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 40,79 €
HV1025SFDE Sapphire HD 5770 1GB GDDR5 PCI-Express
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 112,53 €
HV1310F3DE Samsung SpinPoint F3 1000GB, SATA II (HD103SJ)
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 48,07 €
HV207SC3DE Samsung SH-223C bare schwarz SATA
incl. VAT and excl. shipping costs
immediately available 14,82 €
Sum: 549,25 €

this build rox for the price

deconduo

Horrible advice. The case/PSU bundle is really terrible. You need a decent PSU or this will happen:

http://www.corsair.com/cinema/movie.aspx?id=622747

Curry Addict

deconduo wrote: »

Horrible advice. The case/PSU bundle is really terrible. You need a decent PSU or this will happen:

http://www.corsair.com/cinema/movie.aspx?id=622747

i know my stuff mate, enuf of the dumb founded bull****, if u want to go technical shoot. i have a similar build with a lot more power draw...

deconduo

Curry Addict wrote: »

i know my stuff mate, enuf of the dumb founded bull****, if u want to go technical shoot. i have a similar build with a lot more power draw...

So tell me the specs on it. Show me a review. Anyone can say 'I've used it before and its fine' when theres no evidence to show otherwise. On the HWVS site it says 500W PSU. NOTHING else, no specs, nothing. Add this to the fact that its a 20 euro PSU and you have a recipe for a dead build.

Solitaire

Curry Addict wrote: »

i know my stuff mate, enuf of the dumb founded bull****, if u want to go technical shoot. i have a similar build with a lot more power draw...

Careful now, don't get too personal with the remarks here, deconduo is in the right in this affair.

There's no guarantee that it won't work, but that case is mediocre and the PSU, while probably up to supplying the needs of an ultrabudget rig, could have a tantrum if loaded with an OCd quad and a gaming-grade GPU. Its a risk that, if you're already spending ~€500 on a rig, you'd be mad not to spend that extra €40 on a decent PSU.

Curry Addict

sorry a bit ott by me but i spent time specing that pc and then get this negative reaction with no techincal grounding. if u are going to rubbish someones time and energy i think its important to have solid grounds for it.
rather than a branded manufacturers porpaganda. as i said i have similar and
with at least 50watt higher load on the 12v rail.

i can put forward the technical detail on why this works grand but ill wait for decundos technical input here and explination on how hes worked out why this psu wont work in this application first.

Solitaire

He probably think it'll detonate. And it might, but IMHO its less likely to detonate - I think its a (very) low-end HEC/Hiroshi PSU - but I'm still worried that it'll be an unreliable inefficient PITA. I seriously doubt it has any PCIe connectors, nor an 8-pin EPS connector, nor Active PFC, and I'm fairly sure that unit maxes out at something like 336W IIRC? Its more like either a very old PSU or an overrated 350W unit. And if there is a PSU you really don't want to load by more than 50% of its true rating, its a cheapy casecombo PSU That rig could approach 200W at stock, which is well over the 50% mark for an overrated 350W model!!

Trevor451

Hi guys and thanks for the replys

Anyway I have chosen to go with the AMD X3 3.1GHZ and the PowerColor HD 6850.




BTW why is the soundcard on the ASUS M4A77T/USB3 meant to be bad? It seems to use the standard HD audio found on most motherboards?

And yeah I presume that all of the components are compatible with each other and fit in the case properly? (and also work with w7 64 bit) I cant be too careful :P

Regards,
Trevor

EDIT: oh yeah forgot to mention - would I need additional fans or would the ones included be fine?

Solitaire

RAM and graphics card are very out of stock And IMHO the Thermaltake V9 is a better case for a similar price (add the extra 140mm fan and its uber :D)

And the reason is that all low-and mid-range Asus and more and more low-end ASRock and (newer) MSI mobos use VIA sound codecs instead of Realtek. Sound quality is reduced slightly but the killer is that some mobos with VIA sound are known to have EMI issues, causing interference bad enough to force users to buy discrete soundcards. Listening to your network port is not acceptable Via!! :eek::p

Curry Addict

Solitaire wrote: »

He probably think it'll detonate. And it might, but IMHO its less likely to detonate - I think its a (very) low-end HEC/Hiroshi PSU - but I'm still worried that it'll be an unreliable inefficient PITA. I seriously doubt it has any PCIe connectors, nor an 8-pin EPS connector, nor Active PFC, and I'm fairly sure that unit maxes out at something like 336W IIRC? Its more like either a very old PSU or an overrated 350W unit. And if there is a PSU you really don't want to load by more than 50% of its true rating, its a cheapy casecombo PSU That rig could approach 200W at stock, which is well over the 50% mark for an overrated 350W model!!

i understand where u are coming from with all this. it is always good to go with overspec on psus because it does have its merits no doubt. why drive around in a lada when u can swan around in a merc and have so much more comfort and possabilities. with psus its more like driving around in a minibus when a small car will also get u there. power supply requirements are a dark mystery to most and most will go with caution, the lines of what suits where are not easily understood.
in the interest of best bang for the buck in system building, understanding what can work ok (for that build)can sometimes help u get a much better end result for your money. there maybe limitations such as upgradability and having to stick with lower powered graphics cards but if the OP doesnt mention it, its not on the menu.
here is a nice article that helps define the lines of what can be used where http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cases/display/system-wattage_6.html
here the HD4850 is a good comparision to the HD5770 as the power drawn at full load is less for the HD5770. this psu is definitely a goer in this application whereas if the graphics card was a 1792MB ASUS ENGTX295/2DI it certainly wouldnt be. note the psu does have overcurrent protection and will shutdown if its overloaded.
a build like this might be a bit hairy for some but it does have its merit imho.

Solitaire

For a sub-€450 ("ultrabudget") gaming rig I'd consider it, but such a build would have a slightly cooler CPU (only slightly - say 60-70W instead of ~80W) and a substantially cooler GPU (say a ~50W HD5750 instead of a 70-80W HD5770) and would be mostly living on a wing and a prayer anyway.

Its not overload that would make it blow (IMHO - HECs usually blow due to heat or failure rather than a lack of capacity and/or OCP, and don't do it too often either!) but I'd be concerned with rail stability, ripple voltage and severe inefficiency. A €40-50 Amazon would be 80-85% efficient. That cheapo PSU would be 70-75% efficient, which means a higher ESB bill for an electrical appliance which could be on for hours at a time and also causes more heat which makes cheapo PSUs much unhappier than overloading would! :eek:

Trevor451

wow thanks for telling me that :eek: What motherboard would you recommend then (that's in a similar price range)

Also would this case be good enough?
http://www2.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=25244&agid=631
It has 3 built in fans so I presume it can keep cool even with no additional fans?

deconduo

This is the same case, just without one extra fan:
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=23938&agid=631

Your ram is out of stock, grab this instead:
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=29670&agid=1192

That 6850 is out of stock, this one comes into stock tomorrow:
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=39499&agid=1004

As for the motherboard, you pretty much have to decide whether you want better sound quality or USB3. I have the Asus one and I'm fine with it, but I'm definitely no audiophile. The cheapest motherboard with the Realtek audio is this gigabyte one:
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=35051&agid=1232

Trevor451

Thanks for the advice!

[/IMG]


Everything looks good?

BTW since the only outputs on that graphics card are DVI and HDMI, will a DVI to VGA adapter work with one of these cards?
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20275

Solitaire

That's nearly €590 shipped And the PSU is way overspec anyway. You could get away with a decent 450W PSU if you're not OCing that build much, and a 550W PSU even if you do. The former (Amazon 450W) might be out of stock, but AFAIK the Amazon 550W is still in, and for €50 its a huge leap beyond the 300W-PSU-in-wolves-clothing we saw a page back!

Fairly sure I've seen the windowless version of the V9 a good €20 cheaper on HWVS too

Trevor451

Solitaire wrote: »

That's nearly €590 shipped And the PSU is way overspec anyway. You could get away with a decent 450W PSU if you're not OCing that build much, and a 550W PSU even if you do. The former (Amazon 450W) might be out of stock, but AFAIK the Amazon 550W is still in, and for €50 its a huge leap beyond the 300W-PSU-in-wolves-clothing we saw a page back!

Fairly sure I've seen the windowless version of the V9 a good €20 cheaper on HWVS too

I managed to get another 50 on to my budget so I am ok .

Anyway only reason I am choosing that case is because I think it includes enough fans to keep the build cool enough without purchasing more fans

I would also go for a lower watt PSU but I have heard that corsair do make good PSU and they don't have any 550W versions on HWVS

Do you know if the DVI - VGA adapter will work with the graphics card as I only have a VGA monitor ATM?


EDIT: I think that the corsair psu is not compatible with the case so I may as well go with the Super-Flower Amazon 80Plus 550W. Are you guys sure it wont blow up like in the video on the other page? :P

Solitaire

The Amazon PSUs are also decent, and they do have a 550W for just over €50.

My bad, just realised you're getting the Black Editon, which has an extra 230mm side fan. AFAIK all V9s are missing the 140mm front fan, you'll need to get one to complement the powerful exhaust (a 120mm at the back and a 230mm fan up top). I'd be tempted to get a NZXT Hades myself, for a lot less money it looks badass and comes with a full fan complement AFAIK including front and top 200mm fans. AFAIK it also has cable routing, which very few Thermaltake cases have

Amazon got good reviews, the exploding PSU in the video is a cheap RaidMax, to be fair even Curry's casecombo PSU wouldn't be that bad! :P

Trevor451

Thanks for all of the advice I should be able to order by the end of the week! Hardwareversand is quite annoying since one day all of the stock is available and then the next day its all out of stock :mad:

Tea_Bag

you should be able to unlock that athlon X3 to become a phenom 2 X4 with any luck!

Solitaire

More likely an Athlon X4, most of those chips have the L3 lasered off rather than disabled

Trevor451

Looks like I will be changing my case

Curry Addict

Solitaire wrote: »

RaidMax, to be fair even Curry's casecombo PSU wouldn't be that bad! :P

maybe i just like to live on the edge but i installed a power hungry GTX275
in my PC a few days ago. its running fine lol and im gaming like mad

OP i think your mad not to go for i5 760 and cheap ass case/psu combo with a 6850 because its such a low power draw gpu.
u will have way better performance overall than that donkey amd proecssor!

if u want to play it safe with the PSU then this is a good buy http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=23612&agid=240&pcconfAddUri=pcconfigurator.jsp%3FpcConfigurator.pwradaptor.pwradaptor.0%3D23612%3A3005&pcconfBackUri=pcconfselect.jsp?pcConfigurator.catid=44&pcConfigurator.maid=0&search.sKey=&rp=1

Solitaire

Fairly old and none too amazing Fortron unit. Amazon 550W thrashes that in both quality and capacity. AFAIK only the D-series Basiq units are much good (being made by Delta just like the Earthwatts-D, Signature and CPX-size units).

deconduo

Solitaire wrote: »

More likely an Athlon X4, most of those chips have the L3 lasered off rather than disabled

I dunno, maybe I'm lucky but 3 out of 3 of the X3s I've ordered from HWVS unlocked with no problem and had that juicy L3 cache.

Trevor451

Hi solitare I was watching a review on youtube about the NZXT hades case and the reviewer said that you might have trouble fitting some graphics cards and cpu heatsinks. Would my 6850 and the rest of the case fit in there perfectly?

deconduo

The Hades fits GPUs up to 12inches, and the 6850 is 9 inches so you'll be fine.

Solitaire

You might have trouble fitting a Noctua NH-D14 CPU cooler, but FFS its a midi-tower, it fits midi-tower coolers :rolleyes::P If you want to fit a maxi-tower cooler (140mm+ fans!!) get a HAF932 or larger!

Trevor451

Solitaire wrote: »

You might have trouble fitting a Noctua NH-D14 CPU cooler, but FFS its a midi-tower, it fits midi-tower coolers :rolleyes::P If you want to fit a maxi-tower cooler (140mm+ fans!!) get a HAF932 or larger!

Nah I will only be using the stock CPU cooler. Id take it that that fits?

Anyway somebody told me to use the exact same ram but use a CL7 version of it since it has faster times but the its about €20 more expensive :rolleyes: Should I really get the upgraded ram or is the ram I was going to go with good enough for gaming?

EDIT: Decided to go with this ram
http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=33149&agid=1192