Art O'Neill Challenge...

Anyone tried it? 55km from Dublin Castle into the Wicklow Mountains.

Seems like one heck of a test. Not sure it's for me, lots of it on tarred roads, not exactly bagging peaks, but interesting nonetheless.

www.artoneillchallenge.com

hmmm

I did it about 5 years ago, it is like you say one heck of a test. Took me about 10 1/2 hours I remember.

The first third is mostly on paved roads, so that can be hard if you're not used to it. The second third is hard because it's at night heading over Black hill and soft/boggy ground, the final third is hard because you're knackered. Most people will carry a pair of boots (essential) and also a pair of runners (for the road sections).

I like the history of the route and the story behind it. The night hike element is fun also, and although we didn't see the sun through clouds it was nice to see it coming up.

I was thinking of doing it again this year but I wouldn't do it unless I felt 100%. Leading up to it, I'd be doing 20k+ hikes once a week and staying off the chocolates over Christmas. For your sake make sure you have a lift home from Barravore, although some of the crazies do continue on walking further.

dogmatix

A big test to be sure - and one which poor old Art himself failed. Mind you, they did not have gore-tex boots and wind-proof fleeces in his days.

55k is doable at a walking pace if you are reasonable fit and used to hill walking but you would be well knackered afterwards. A couple of days with the radox bath salts would be a must.

It looks like it would be fun and a challenge. I'm tempted.

Like the long hard slogs myself, but usually that's about 7 hours, then spirit flags. As it's part of a group effort I guess that would take you through the last stages, but on the other hand having a pair of boots in backpack for first 25km would really bulk it out and would be draining.

Enduro

Its a super event. Lift back towards Dublin is included in the entry I think. I did it in about 6:40 two years ago, IIRC, but I ran it. Very enjoyable, and definitely felt like a real challenge.

paulocon

Enduro wrote: »

Its a super event. Lift back towards Dublin is included in the entry I think. I did it in about 6:40 two years ago, IIRC, but I ran it. Very enjoyable, and definitely felt like a real challenge.

How bad is the terrain on the night section and what level of navigation is required. Done the trailtrekker 100km a while back and it was enjoyable in a 'i'm doing something different here' sort of a way. Wouldn't mind doing the Art but not sure I'd be up to a navigational challenge..

Enduro

Nav courses are being organised before the race. walkers are encouraged to team up into groups with a competant navigator. two years ago volunteer navigators (orienteers etc) took groups out from kippure on.

The terraine an nav from kippure on is classic wiclow. once off road the terrane is a mix of easy walking, tufty grass, and bog. towards the end there is a few hundred metres of felled forest. The nav from kippure to art's cross is pretty straightforwars. mostly a matter of following valleys. art's cross to glenmalure is challenging nav in poor visibilty, but just following a bearing will get you there in the end (since you just have to hit a fireroad and follow it down). you'll hit that section in daylight though.

coalshed

There's a podcast up on RTE now about the Art O'Neill challenge

http://www.rte.ie/radio1/thehistoryshow/

It's an interesting listen to the historic and modern day background of the walk.

AngryLips

Okay, I thought it was just a hike but from reading this thread there seems to be a good bit of navigation skills needed too ...is that right? I was game when I heard about it but other than having a good sense of direction I've no nav experience to speak of. Is that going to be a problem?

Also, can anyone tell me; I've never really done any hiking but I did run a marathon recently so is that something that is going to put me in good condition for the challenge? ...I know from experience that running doesn't really equate to any sort of fitness when it comes to walking.

hmmm

AngryLips wrote: »

Okay, I thought it was just a hike but from reading this thread there seems to be a good bit of navigation skills needed too ...is that right? I was game when I heard about it but other than having a good sense of direction I've no nav experience to speak of. Is that going to be a problem?

I think the organised walk will have leaders that can look after navigation - I suggest you check out the website.

Also, can anyone tell me; I've never really done any hiking but I did run a marathon recently so is that something that is going to put me in good condition for the challenge? ...I know from experience that running doesn't really equate to any sort of fitness when it comes to walking.

I did a fair bit of running before taking up hiking but it still took me a while to get my muscles up to speed. Hiking seems to use muscle groups that cyclists use rather than runners.

I'm sure plenty have, but I wouldn't do the Art O'Neill if I had zero hiking experience. You'll probably be alright on the physical side, but you'll need to be used to wearing your boots and wearing them over rough and uneven ground. You'll want to make sure you have the appropriate kit for dealing with whatever the weather will throw at you - with the right gear you can avoid being either cold or wet, but sometimes it takes time to figure out what works for you. Someone I know did the AO'N and lost all their toenails

AngryLips

ew. I narrowly escaped losing one toenail preparing for the Dublin Marathon ...can't even imagine what losing all of them would be like.

I think I'm going to give it a bash. I've never hiked anywhere before except for Glendalough a few years ago. I'm guessing this is no comparison. It's been a pretty big learning curve for me just figuring out what sort of gear I'll need for it but come the end of the week I'll be giving it some serious thought as to how I'm gonna prepare for it. Just hope I'm not being naive.

Gravale

It's happening again 13th Jan 2012.

http://www.artoneillchallenge.ie/

Gravale

Head over to here where the main discussion is taking place:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056395270 <- folks this is for people who run, if you're walking stay here! <Evl Phil>

loobylou

Hello... went over there for the MAIN discussion but the superhero, marathon type discussion putting me right off.
Anything for hikers?

Gravale

Well I'll be walking it, LoobyLou, but still find the discussion useful, especially regarding the route.

So, are your preparations going well? Any questions?

PollyLee

I'm walking it. I do a lot of hill walking but am still daunted - finding it hard to gauge my fitness relative to others and some of the reports I've read sound pretty harrowing. That said I'm already very comfortable walking 40+ km so I think I am ok on the distance in theory - but the terrain and winter conditions are worrying me quite a lot!

Any other walkers looking to share training tips? I'd also like to exchange ideas about equipment - as a frequent walker I've got the usual kit but I am thinking I am going to have to upgrade some of it for this event - better quality waterproofs and base layers for example.

Gravale

If you're comfortable doing 40+ km then I suspect that you'll have no problem with the distance (53km).

The first three sections below and the last section are on roads or tracks.
The fourth section has about 4km on tracks.
The fifth section has about 4km on tracks.

That's about 38km on good terrain, with 15km on rougher ground. That's not too bad, is it? Also, there's relatively little ascent over 53km, so climbing will not be a problem overall.

Castle - Stone Cross - 15k
Stone Cross - Kilbride (CP1) - 5k
Kilbride - Ballynultagh Gap - 10k
Ballynultagh Gap - Ballinagee (CP2) - 9.6km
Ballinagee - Art's Cross - 5.9km
Art's Cross - Table Track - 3.5k
Table Track - Baravore (finish) - 4k

Total Distance 53km
Total Ascent 1670m

I suspect that you are knowledgeable enough to know that you should have good raingear and quality base layers and hiking clothes. Any sports shop such as Great Outdoors or 53 Degrees North will give you good advise on winter clothes. Bring some spare clothes too. Trekking poles make a big difference, so bring two if you really want to perform well.

Think of this as an extended Sunday hike and bring drink and food accordingly. The weather may be pleasant and dry or it might be the opposite. Check the forecast on the Thursday before the day.

PollyLee

Thanks Gravale, that information is reassuring!

Although I walk a lot, so far I've resisted spending money on waterproofs and have managed to get by with Aldi versions (not bad at all for the price, and ok for a 6-7 hour walk cos you don't get THAT cold and wet in that time generally unless it is a really terrible day). However getting cold and wet could make the difference between being able to complete the Art O'Neill or not, so it is probably time for me to invest. I don't like being cold and always carry a ridiculous amount of spare clothes (3 hats, 3 sets of gloves, at least 2 fleeces! - what's more, they do get used, but if I invested in better quality I'd probably need to carry less stuff). So, it looks like I am going to be spending a bit of cash, which isn't ideal at this time of year, but at least it is a one-off and once I've got the gear it should last me for years.

As to training, with the short days it is difficult to get in long enough walks just now and my usual walking companions are generally only up for 6-7 hours or so, so I've started running a little just to up my fitness a bit. Haven't done any running in years but I managed 8.5 km in an hour on my first go last weekend. That's on the slow side I know - but as I am not a runner naturally and it was my first time in ages I was pretty pleased with that. I meant to go again today but ended up going out last night and was in bits today!! (I'm just not that dedicated!) I'm out walking tomorrow so will do about 7 hours then - maybe will go for a run after that.

Would be interested to know what kind of training other walkers are doing? Also might do a bit of a long walk next Sunday (11th) so if anyone fancies it let me know.

Gravale

There's always the danger that you might be discouraged or, on the other hand, made falsely secure by the training that others do.

Generally speaking I've found that people with less training and ability than you can get through the Art Walk, with varying degrees of pain depending on how much training they've done. Some can get through on doing just a regular Sunday hike each week - and suffer more than those who do more training. I'd suggest that you at least do a 20+ km each weekend. There aren't many weekends left so you should strive for a 30+ km walk each week. Anything less will have an effect on the comfort at which you will do the walk.

Last Sunday I did 49km and on Tuesday I did 32km. Yesterday (Saturday) I did 24km and today (Sunday) I'm doing 21km. I'm mad, though.

chinomel

Hi Gravale.
Very impressed with your advise and help for those taking part also with the level of training you are putting in.
With that level of commitment and training what time do you hope to reach Barravore and what is your approx walking pace.
The reason I ask is that last year I completed my first Art in 14 hours and was wondering if that is average pace for the event.
Once again thanks for all the advice and hope night goes well for you.
w200

Gravale

Years ago I led this walk each year on the first Friday of each New Year. There was no organisation to it whatsoever. I just turned up shortly before midnight and led whoever turned up for the trek. Sometimes it was twenty, sometimes it was sixty. On the understanding that everyone had to provide for themselves (food, backup, transport home) we started together and remained together until the bitter end. We never had occasion to call Mountain Rescue, though there were dropouts at Stone Cross (the pace burned them off) and at Ballinagee. They simply called their backup to get them home.

And now to answer your question. Because we stayed together we generally arrived at Baravore around 2pm (14hrs). Some of us would then trek over the mountains to Glendalough and get the 5pm St. Kevin's bus back to Dublin. So, 14 hours would be the average finishing time for the ordinary moderately fit guy. I'll be leading a group this year so my finishing time will be dictated by the slowest person in the group. My personal best was 10hrs 15mins about five years ago, though these days I'd be doing well to break 12hrs. The knees ain't what they used to be.

Gravale

Ballynultagh Gap to Ballinagee:

Ballynultagh-Ballinagee 2012.jpg


Ballinagee to Baravore:

Ballinagee-Baravore 2012.jpg

Distances Breakdown

Dublin Castle - Stone Cross - 15k
Stone Cross - Kilbride Army Camp - 5k
(Checkpoint and Art's Kitchen)
Kilbride Camp - Ballynultagh Gap - 10k
Ballynultagh Gap - Ballinagee Bridge. - 9.6k
(Checkpoint and Art's Kitchen)
Ballinagee Bridge. - Art's Cross - 5.9k
Art's Cross - Table Track - 3.5k
Table Track - Barravore - 4k
(Checkpoint and Finish)
Total Distance 53k

Types of terrain

30km road walk to Ballynultagh Gap (includes 1km through fields)
9.6km hill walk to Ballinagee Bridge
5.9km hill walk to Art's Cross (includes 2.5km forest track)
3.5km hill walk to Table Track
4km track walk to Baravore

Gravale

It's 23k from Dublin Castle to the point, 3km after the Kilbride Army Camp checkpoint, at which participants first leave the road for the short 1km+ trip through private fields onto the road to Ballysmuttan Bridge. These private fields are not to be reccied beforehand as there will be excellent markings through them on the morning to clearly guide everyone.

This Wednesday I'll be leaving Dublin Castle (entrance to the right of City Hall) at midnight and walking (not running) the 23k out to that point - and back again. Reconnaissance of this road walk is not necessary, but if any walkers want to see how their feet (and footwear) will react to this type of terrain then this 46k trek might be of interest to them. Of course you don't have to do the return journey if walking home is nearer.

Weather is expected to be much milder than of late.

loobylou

Will there be changing facilities at Dublin Castle before the start?
Also, to be clear, its 20km by road to checkpoint 1 where we change to boots and then continue another 9km on road + 1km through fields? I presume people pick up their boots at the checkpoint and carry them to Ballynultagh?

Gravale

My procedure: On January 13th arrive at Dublin Castle dressed in your hiking gear and ready to go. You'll be checking in and leaving a bag for the first checkpoint with your boots, drinks and food, and a change of clothes for the finish. Changing facilities for 400 people at Dublin Castle might make such a facility a bit stressful. Also, you'll be changing into boots at the first checkpoint due to the fields you'll be going through 3km later. Then it's about 6km in boots to Ballynultagh Gap.

I'm not the organiser, but I presume you'll be given instructions by post or email soon.

Git101

loobylou wrote: »

Also, to be clear, its 20km by road to checkpoint 1 where we change to boots and then continue another 9km on road + 1km through fields? I presume people pick up their boots at the checkpoint and carry them to Ballynultagh?

Put your boots on at CP1, no point in carrying them to Ballynultagh and having to carry your road shoes to the finish.

Gravale

loobylou wrote: »

Also, to be clear, its 20km by road to checkpoint 1 where we change to boots and then continue another 9km on road + 1km through fields?

Yes, after you leave the first checkpoint it's 3km to the fields. You travel marginally over 1km down through the fields out onto the road. From there it's 6km on road around to Ballynultagh Gap.

Doing anything not very necessary at Ballynultagh Gap should be avoided. It's an unpleasant place to hang around in the darkness and very exposed to the weather. The last time it was like the Arctic, though this time the forecast is for milder but damp weather. I was there last Monday morning at 6am and the water in my bottle had lumps of ice in it!

Gravale

Gravale wrote: »

Head over to here where the main discussion is taking place:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056395270

Be mindful, though, that the above link is the Athletics/Running/Triathlon forum where the Ultra Runners for the event hang out. All of your Art O'Neill walking questions can be answered here.

chinomel

On the section down through the fields after CP1 were we meant to come out on the sally gap road on the right or left of the bungalow ?. Got to that point quite early so there was no one to follow and obviously could not have done a reccy.
Passed to the left of the house myself but felt as if I almost walked down the hall in the proccess :eek:

Gravale

There are two houses at the end of those fields, but you are naturally led to the one on the left. Someone went into the field behind the first on the right before coming out again and resuming the journey behind the second on the left and out over the gate further left again.

This map make it very clear how you should go:

Athdown - B'Smuttan (1).jpg

chinomel

The result sheets throw up some very interesting stats. Some of the walkers actually covered section one of the trek faster than many of the hybrids ie runners . This is a walking speed of about 5.5 MPH or 9 KPH which is approaching race walking speed.
Very impressive on hilly and at times slippery roads.
Well done