General Autumn Internationals Banter/Discussion Thread with prediction pool code!

thomond2006

This is the place to general autumn series discussion, probably more focused on other international teams/matches because I'm sure there will be enough threads on Ireland. :pac:

Fixtures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_end_of_year_rugby_tests

The pool code for the Boards.ie prediction pool is loonmoat
Link: http://www.sportguru.co.uk/autumn/default.asp

It all starts off when Australia face New Zealand in Hong Kong next weekend!

Of the SH sides, South Africa are there for the taking. The team look in disarray and are making more headlines off the pitch than on with Peter 'P Divvy' De Villiers in charge. They are also crippled with injuries: Guthro Steenkamp, regular captain John Smit, Andries Bekker, Heinrich Brussow, Fourie Du Preez, Jaque Fourie, Wynand Olivier and JP Pietersen are among those unavailable. Stand in captain Victor Matfield has a big job on his hands. They play all four home nations and all of them would have designs on beating the 'Boks this year.

The All Blacks looks as strong as ever but they will be without the likes of Israel Dagg and Piri Weepu. Like South Africa, this is a Grand Slam tour for them also and they look odds on to beat all the Home Nations again. If history counts for anything, they'll wipe everyone out in November and blow it next September.



My player to watch out for this autumn is Richie Gray for Scotland. Think Devin Toner with a turn of pace. With Kellock injured, I think this guy (6ft 10in, 19 stone, 21 years old) can step it up for the Scots.

Edit: How did I manage to forget Sonny Bill? :eek: Sorry Richie, you just got ousted.

sock puppet

I think SBW might have to wait until Scotland to get on the pitch if Henry picks first choice teams for the big games. Him coming off the bench would mean a lot of rejigging in the backline too.

thomond2006

sock puppet wrote: »

I think SBW might have to wait until Scotland to get on the pitch if Henry picks first choice teams for the big games. Him coming off the bench would mean a lot of rejigging in the backline too.

The guy is a freak of nature.

He'll have to be at his best to displace Nonu or Smith. Could be an option on the wing too.

thomond2006

Lee Byrne will miss the AIs with a hand injury. Bad news for Wales.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/welsh/9120272.stm

thomond2006

http://www.ercrugby.com/eng/news/12973.php

Benetton Treviso centre Tommaso Benvenuti, who lit up the opening two rounds of the Heineken Cup scoring four tries, is one of two uncapped players named in the Italy squad for autumn internationals.

Nick Mallett has named a 30-man squad which will meet for a three-day training camp in Verona this week that will be led by Stade Francais No8 Sergio Parisse, who has returned from injury.

I Cavalieri Estra's Italy sevens star Denis Majstorovic is the other new face as Italy prepare for three November tests against Argentina, Australia and Fiji.

Italy training squad:

Forwards:
Robert Barbieri (Treviso, 7 caps), Mauro Bergamasco (Stade Français, 84 caps), Valerio Bernabo' (Treviso, 15 caps), Lorenzo Cittadini (Treviso, 3 caps), Martin Castrogiovanni (Leicester , 68 caps), Carlo Antonio Del Fava (Aironi, 45 caps), Santiago Dellape' (Racing Metro , 57 caps), Paul Derbyshire (Treviso, 5 caps), Quintin Geldenhuys (Aironi , 13 caps), Leonardo Ghiraldini (Treviso, 31 caps), Andrea Lo cicero (Racing Metro, 78 caps), Fabio Ongaro (Aironi, 71 caps), Sergio Parisse(C) (Stade Français, 69 caps), Antonio Pavanello (Treviso, 5 caps), Salvatore Perugini (Aironi , 73 caps), Alessandro Zanni (Treviso, 44 caps).

Backs:
Tommaso Benvenuti (Treviso), Mirco Bergamasco (Racing Metro, 73 caps), Riccardo Bocchino (Aironi , 4 caps), Kristhoper Burton (Treviso, 4 caps), Gonzalo Canale (Clermont, 58 caps), Pablo Canavosio (Aironi , 30 caps), Denis Majstorovic (Estra I Cavalieri Prato ), Andrea Masi (Racing Metro , 52 caps), Luke Mclean (Treviso, 21 caps), Luciano Orquera (Brive, 14 caps), Michele Sepe (Treviso, 3 caps), Alberto Sgarbi (Treviso, 5 caps), Tito Tebaldi (Aironi, 13 caps), Giulio Toniolatti (Aironi, 5 caps),

lologram

No Gower in that squad? He's not injured afaik. Must be a move toward Burton, who looks a decent OH from what I've seen. Fairly good all-round player, Italian qualified, plays in Italy. That's what Italian national side have been looking for, and Gower is pretty limited anyway.

thomond2006

More bad news for Wales on the injury front.

Ryan Jones misses their opener against Australia while Leigh Halfpenny will miss all 4 games.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/welsh/9120272.stm

Judgement Day

Common sense would suggest on present form and unless the All Blacks lose any key members of their squad in the Hong Kong encounter with the Wallabies that they will achieve a clean sweep of the Home countries. Piri Weepu will be a big loss to them but Jimmy Cowen will hopefully rise to the occasion. I would have backed England to be the only country to cause them problems but now that it looks like Jonny Wilkinson may be missing due to a shoulder injury I will be going with the All Blacks to win all 4 games @ 8/15 on.

I fancy Ireland to beat the seriously weakened 'mighty' Boks -again - and also Samoa but reckon Australia and the All Blacks will prove too strong. I will be going with PP with 2 Irish wins @ 11/10 on.


Air New Zealand recently announced their commitment to supporting NZ rugby for the next 17 years and their new A320 fleet are to carry this eyecatching livery. Sorry for going off topic but I suppose it's better than my usual posting of the Haka.

lologram

Judgement Day wrote: »

and also Samoa but reckon Australia and the All Blacks will prove too strong.

It's the Argies not the Aussies that we're playing mate

Judgement Day

lologram wrote: »

It's the Argies not the Aussies that we're playing mate

Thanks for that - my head is elsewhere (no comments please!) and I'm glad that you drew my attention to it before I had a punt. So I'll change my prediction and and go with Ireland to win 3 games @ 5/4 - which is asking a lot but what the Hell.

PhatPiggins

Judgement Day wrote: »

Thanks for that - my head is elsewhere (no comments please!) and I'm glad that you drew my attention to it before I had a punt. So I'll change my prediction and and go with Ireland to win 3 games @ 5/4 - which is asking a lot but what the Hell.

Surely you'd get a better price on the outrights? At a guess: SA 1.7 , Argie 1.4 , Samoa 1.who knows depending on the team.

Are our good friends the bookies factoring in a potential win over the AB's ?

Teferi

I'm quietly confident for an Ireland win over the AB's. I can feel it in my waters. Yeah, I'm probably feeling a bit mad after a long day at work but there you go.

thomond2006

Teferi wrote: »

I'm quietly confident for an Ireland win over the AB's. I can feel it in my waters. Yeah, I'm probably feeling a bit mad after a long day at work but there you go.

All Blacks will complete the 'Grand Slam' IMO. I actually think England have the best chance of knocking them off if they select the right team. Still only a chance though. Scotland and Wales have key players missing through injury and I just don't think Ireland are good enough.

Hope I'm wrong. It would make the World Cup more interesting if the ABs went into the tournament in average form.

Gracelessly Tom

Looking forward to seeing if SBW will live up to the hype when it comes to the international stage.

I think SA could suffer some bad defeats, just hope their press doesn't turn on PDV, weakened squad and he has an eye on RWC next year.

Personally think Kidney should be leaving a lot of lads out of the squad and to hell with winning a few AI's. Rest the elder statesmen and develop a few fringe players. I know it's always our "best chance of beating the All Blacks" but does it really matter if next year we crash out early from the world cup due to overusing the players?

The SH teams use tours to develop, we always seem to use them to try and get a win over one of the big boys.

Realistically we ain't gonna win the WC but we can make the semi's (maybe final??:)) and finish 3rd (Argentina did it don't forget) but to do it we need all the top players in peak condition so why not give them a few weeks break now?? Let them play one or two AI's max, just to keep match fitness.

Joined up for the prediction comp, always adds a little something to these games.

thomond2006

The argument for not leaving the 'elder statesmen' out is they will be playing when it matters so it's best to go full throttle in the AIs and develop continuity in selection.

I would only go as far as giving another 13 a go against either South Africa or New Zealand.

I think in terms of depth we'll be ok for the World Cup. The biggest issue was tighthead but it looks like Hayes has been cast aside.

Gracelessly Tom

thomond2006 wrote: »

The argument for not leaving the 'elder statesmen' out is they will be playing when it matters so it's best to go full throttle in the AIs and develop continuity in selection.

Thats a fair point I suppose but could we not use the AI's to develop the younger/ less experienced guys and the 6N's for gearing up toward the world cup and getting the selection continuity going?

thomond2006

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

Thats a fair point I suppose but could we not use the AI's to develop the younger/ less experienced guys and the 6N's for gearing up toward the world cup and getting the selection continuity going?

To a degree we should give younger guys a shot, but let's not do a Marc Lievremont on it and use 40 or so players in 4 games. It doesn't work. We can only bring 30 players to the World Cup anyway.

Taking France as an example, they only became consistent when they became consistent in selection.

Don't forget there is another side to selection too. The normal fan wants to watch the best players on the field at the matches. When second string sides are put out, it affects ticket sales. It certainly will this year with the shocking price hikes.

thomond2006

http://www.rugby365.com/all_news/nbc/france/news/2655341.htm

France squad:

Forwards: Thomas Domingo (Clermont), Jerome Schuster (Perpignan), Luc
Ducalcon (Castres), Nicolas Mas (Perpignan), Guilhem Guirado (Perpignan), William Servat (Toulouse), Dimitri Szarzewski (Stade Français), Romain Millo-Chluski (Toulouse), Lionel Nallet (Racing Metro), Pascal Pape (Stade Français), Julien Pierre (Clermont), Julien Bonnaire (Clermont), Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse, captain), Alexandre Lapandry (Clermont), Fulgence Ouedraogo (Montpellier), Sebastien Chabal (Racing Metro), Imanol Harinorquy (Biarritz).

Backs: Morgan Parra (Clermont), Dimitri Yachvili (Biarritz), Damien Traille (Biarritz), Francois Trinh-Duc (Montpellier), Fabrice Estebanez (Brive), Yannick Jauzion (Toulouse), David Marty (Perpignan), Aurelien Rougerie (Clermont), Marc Andreu (Castres), Julien Arias (Stade Français), Yoann Huget (Bayonne), Maxime Medard (Toulouse), Alexis Palisson (Brive), Jerome Porical (Perpignan).

No Clerc, Basteraud or Poitrenaud. :eek:

Shocked about Poitrenaud's absence. He was one of the best players of the Six Nations last year. He's on top form atm too, had a stormer for Toulouse against Perpignan at the weekend.

sock puppet

Gracelessly Tom wrote: »

The SH teams use tours to develop, we always seem to use them to try and get a win over one of the big boys.

That's not strictly true. The ABs played a full strength team against us the last time iirc. The new guys usually play against the likes of Scotland or Italy. They also tend to win even when they do try new players. Some of the selections are also due to form. A player who had a poor Super 14 and didn't make the Tri-Nations squad could have played himself back into contention in the Currie Cup/ITM cup.

thomond2006

Saturday 9:30am (Irish Time)

Australia:
15 Kurtley Beale; 14 James O'Connor, 13 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 12 Matt Giteau, 11 Drew Mitchell; 10 Quade Cooper, 9 Will Genia;
1 Benn Robinson, 2 Stephen Moore, 3 Ben Alexander, 4 Mark Chisholm, 5 Nathan Sharpe, 6 Rocky Elsom (capt), 7 David Pocock, 8 Ben McCalman.

Replacements: 16 Saia Faingaa, 17 James Slipper, 18 Dean Mumm, 19 Richard Brown, 20 Luke Burgess, 21 Berrick Barnes, 22 Lachie Turner.

New Zealand:
15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Cory Jane, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma'a Nonu, 11 Josevata Rokocoko, 10 Daniel Carter, 9 Jimmy Cowan,
8 Kieran Read, 7 Richie McCaw (captain), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Tom Donnelly, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Owen Franks, 2 Keven Mealamu, 1 Tony Woodcock.

Replacements: 16 Hikawera Elliot, 17 John Afoa, 18 Samuel Whitelock, 19 Daniel Braid, 20 Alby Mathewson, 21 Stephen Donald, 22 Isaia Toeava.

http://www.rugby365.com/all_news/nbc/nz/news/2655501.htm

Mr.Applepie

thomond2006 wrote: »

http://www.rugby365.com/all_news/nbc/france/news/2655341.htm

France squad:

Forwards: Thomas Domingo (Clermont), Jerome Schuster (Perpignan), Luc
Ducalcon (Castres), Nicolas Mas (Perpignan), Guilhem Guirado (Perpignan), William Servat (Toulouse), Dimitri Szarzewski (Stade Français), Romain Millo-Chluski (Toulouse), Lionel Nallet (Racing Metro), Pascal Pape (Stade Français), Julien Pierre (Clermont), Julien Bonnaire (Clermont), Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse, captain), Alexandre Lapandry (Clermont), Fulgence Ouedraogo (Montpellier), Sebastien Chabal (Racing Metro), Imanol Harinorquy (Biarritz).

Backs: Morgan Parra (Clermont), Dimitri Yachvili (Biarritz), Damien Traille (Biarritz), Francois Trinh-Duc (Montpellier), Fabrice Estebanez (Brive), Yannick Jauzion (Toulouse), David Marty (Perpignan), Aurelien Rougerie (Clermont), Marc Andreu (Castres), Julien Arias (Stade Français), Yoann Huget (Bayonne), Maxime Medard (Toulouse), Alexis Palisson (Brive), Jerome Porical (Perpignan).

No Clerc, Basteraud or Poitrenaud. :eek:

Shocked about Poitrenaud's absence. He was one of the best players of the Six Nations last year. He's on top form atm too, had a stormer for Toulouse against Perpignan at the weekend.

I'm shocked Yachvili is in the squad - didn't he retire from international rugby last year?

twinytwo

i can see 3 wins,with the pumas game being a dirty episode as always. I would love a win over the abs.. id die a happy man. But unless we play our best game of rugby ever, i cant see it happening:(

team for ab game...
1healy
2best
3 buckley
4 doc/touhy
5 leo/touhy
6ferris
7wallace/sob
8 heaslip
9 boss
10 sexton
11 earls/fitz
12 darcy
13 drico
14 bowe
15 fitz/kearney

conf101

twinytwo wrote: »

i can see 3 wins,with the pumas game being a dirty episode as always. I would love a win over the abs.. id die a happy man. But unless we play our best game of rugby ever, i cant see it happening:(

team for ab game...
1healy
2best
3 buckley
4 leo/doc/touhy
5 poc/leo/touhy
6ferris
7wallace/sob
8 heaslip
9 boss
10 sexton
11 earls/fitz
12 darcy
13 drico
14 bowe
15 fitz/kearney

Touhy's not in the squad is he?

twinytwo

conf101 wrote: »

Touhy's not in the squad is he?

you will have to excuse me iv been up 48 hours.. re my edit i ever forgot poc was out till christmas.

conf101

Are you sure you don't mean Toner instead of Touhy?

corny

thomond2006 wrote: »

http://www.rugby365.com/all_news/nbc/france/news/2655341.htm

France squad:

Forwards: Thomas Domingo (Clermont), Jerome Schuster (Perpignan), Luc
Ducalcon (Castres), Nicolas Mas (Perpignan), Guilhem Guirado (Perpignan), William Servat (Toulouse), Dimitri Szarzewski (Stade Français), Romain Millo-Chluski (Toulouse), Lionel Nallet (Racing Metro), Pascal Pape (Stade Français), Julien Pierre (Clermont), Julien Bonnaire (Clermont), Thierry Dusautoir (Toulouse, captain), Alexandre Lapandry (Clermont), Fulgence Ouedraogo (Montpellier), Sebastien Chabal (Racing Metro), Imanol Harinorquy (Biarritz).

Backs: Morgan Parra (Clermont), Dimitri Yachvili (Biarritz), Damien Traille (Biarritz), Francois Trinh-Duc (Montpellier), Fabrice Estebanez (Brive), Yannick Jauzion (Toulouse), David Marty (Perpignan), Aurelien Rougerie (Clermont), Marc Andreu (Castres), Julien Arias (Stade Français), Yoann Huget (Bayonne), Maxime Medard (Toulouse), Alexis Palisson (Brive), Jerome Porical (Perpignan).

No Clerc, Basteraud or Poitrenaud. :eek:

Shocked about Poitrenaud's absence. He was one of the best players of the Six Nations last year. He's on top form atm too, had a stormer for Toulouse against Perpignan at the weekend.

Yachvili and Medard back in favour now. Lievremont always keeps it interesting anyway. They still have some squad though. I think they'll look to make a statement against the Aussies.

profitius

thomond2006 wrote: »

To a degree we should give younger guys a shot, but let's not do a Marc Lievremont on it and use 40 or so players in 4 games. It doesn't work. We can only bring 30 players to the World Cup anyway.

Big countries like France and England sometimes to that because their pool of players is so big. Maybe they wanted to see what type of character the players were too when they were giving away all those caps. Its a nice headache to have.

thomond2006

Jonny Wilkinson out for 4 weeks (thereby missing the AIs), according to SSN.

Hard luck Jonny (and Judgement Day).

Edit: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/english/9132368.stm

Judgement Day

thomond2006 wrote: »

Jonny Wilkinson out for 4 weeks (thereby missing the AIs), according to SSN.

Hard luck Jonny (and Judgement Day).

Edit: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/english/9132368.stm

Just saw that on scrum.com but in fact I'm not too upset as it saves him for the Six Nations/World Cup and it will make England's gutting by the All Blacks more bearable. Fingers crossed that Toby Flood and Charlie Hodgson don't get too seriously mangled by the ABs, Australia, South Africa and Samoa.

thomond2006

Judgement Day wrote: »

Just saw that on scrum.com but in fact I'm not too upset as it saves him for the Six Nations/World Cup and it will make England's gutting by the All Blacks more bearable. Fingers crossed that Toby Flood and Charlie Hodgson don't get too seriously mangled by the ABs, Australia, South Africa and Samoa.

Oh man they are doomed when he gets on the field. Ma'a Nonu will be salivating like a dog when he sees him.

thomond2006

Springbok touring squad

Backs: Gio Aplon, Bjorn Basson, Juan de Jongh, Jean de Villiers, Francois Hougaard, Bryan Habana, Elton Jantjies, Ricky Januarie, Patrick Lambie, Lwazi Mvovo, Ruan Pienaar, Frans Steyn, Morne Steyn.

Forwards: Willem Alberts, Bakkies Botha, Schalk Burger, Keegan Daniel, Bismarck du Plessis, Jannie du Plessis, Allister Hargreaves, Ryan Kankowski, Victor Matfield, Tendai Mtawarira, Connie Oosthuizen, Chiliboy Ralepelle, Juan Smith, Pierre Spies, Adriaan Strauss, CJ van der Linde, Flip van der Merwe.

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_6477496,00.html

Their original 39 man squad is cut to 30. Pat Lambie scored 25 in the CC Final today and is being tipped as one to watch. He has played at 10/12/15 this season.

Edit: Ricky Januarie ruled out.
http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,9817_6477965,00.html

sock puppet

Have only seen Lambie at fullback in the Super 14. Hope we get to see him play at 10 during the tour.

conf101

Flip van der Merwe - what a cool name!

Judgement Day

Stephen Jones helps stiffen All Blacks resolve to stuff England. Nobody more reliable than 'tabloid' Sunday Times rugby correspondent Stephen Jones to throw fuel on the fire ahead of Saturday's England vs All Blacks encounter and, yes, you guessed he's turned to the old reliable - "the Haka". In this piece - extracts here:

All Blacks: British writer takes aim at haka

A British rugby writer has labelled the All Blacks' haka as the 'instrument of the worst kind of sporting arrogance'.

Sunday Times writer Stephen Jones has slammed the All Blacks' traditional pre-match routine which is linked with the side as far back as 1884.

In his column for the English newspaper Jones says that the All Blacks have turned the haka into a ridiculous bout of pre-game posturing that has no place in rugby today.

"...the haka has changed, profoundly. The All Blacks and their followers have made it a self-important bore and instrument of the worst kind of sporting arrogance," Jones wrote in his column over the weekend.

"And symbolically, it sometimes stops just short of an exhortation to murder. In one of its versions, it ends with the players making graphic throat-cutting gestures."

Jones claims opposition towards the pre-match ritual is growing.

"One recent critic of the haka refers to a 'politically correct lunacy' and a 'cynical stage-managed circus'.

"Another calls the haka 'a bad joke' and another said the team performing it are like 'preening ninnies'."

The latest critique of the haka may be just what the All Blacks need ahead of Sunday's clash with England following their last minute loss to Australia in Hong Kong.

Jones takes issue with the All Blacks' view on teams approaching the haka stating 'the rules are always conveniently changing' and that 'one day they are happy when teams advance on them. Another day, they rage that this is disrespectful'.

Jones goes as far as suggesting the Welsh Rugby Union were 'courageous' for standing their ground in 2006 over a battle with the New Zealand Rugby Union to have the haka performed before the Welsh national anthem.

The All Blacks instead did the haka in the changing rooms. 'An insult to Wales' and 'to their anthem' Jones says.

Jones also implies the tackle that dislocated Brian O'Driscoll's shoulder in the opening British and Irish Lions test in 2005 was a reaction to the Irish centre picking up grass and throwing it after facing the haka.

Jones ends the column by saying: "When will New Zealand realise that nobody cares anymore? And that it is their fault for betraying their own ideal of the game."

- Herald online

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10684550

If the reaction in the NZ media is anything to go by the All Blacks are going to be more motivated than ever. Roll on Saturday! More worryingly it now appears definite that winger Corry Jane will miss the game after picking up an injury during the Hong Kong game.

thomond2006

lol at Stephen Jones talking about arrogance. :rolleyes:

JustinDee

As usual he talks about everything but the game.
The day he actually writes an analytical match preview or review is the day he admits that Brian O'Driscoll is actually a pretty handy player.
He's not even English. He's Welsh. Maybe he needs a reminder of this from time to time.

Gracelessly Tom

Have to say, I really like his articles, if nothing else they are very funny.:)
How he comes up with some of his theories is beyond me, his stories need to be taken with a big pinch of salt. Still entertaining to read mind you!

Shelflife

While i usually take sjones with a pinch of salt, he does have a point that the ABs have become very precious about the haka.

I enjoy it, i prefer the original haka , but it shouldnt take precidence over the national anthems nor should they restrict the opposition in the way that they recieve it.

if you want to throw down a challange, then you can expect one to be returned.

profitius

Judgement Day wrote: »

Jones claims opposition towards the pre-match ritual is growing.

"One recent critic of the haka refers to a 'politically correct lunacy' and a 'cynical stage-managed circus'.

"Another calls the haka 'a bad joke' and another said the team performing it are like 'preening ninnies'."

Jones takes issue with the All Blacks' view on teams approaching the haka stating 'the rules are always conveniently changing' and that 'one day they are happy when teams advance on them. Another day, they rage that this is disrespectful'.

I think SJ is mainly a professional WUM but I agree about the haka. Its a bit of a circus and the players doing it look ridiculous to be honest.

SARZY

England should respond with the whole stadium singing rule brittaia after the haka.
Scotland and Wales should do something similar with a rousing national tune.
Ireland could get Phil Coulter to spend 5 years writing a ditty that wont offend anybody.

In the end its not the haka that wins matches for NZ.

The haka they performed in the 70's was nothing like todays version but the words were the same.

The real NZ strength is bullying the IRB into changing 'law' interpretations to suit them.

Then getting them implemented in the Southern Hemisphere 6 months before everybody else.

Tweaking them to suit and then we know the rest.

profitius

How do you folks think the northern hemisphere teams will do against the southern hemisphere teams?

Its a good chance to judge the 6 nation teams. I think people are hyping up the southern hemisphere teams too much although they (NZ and Oz) are playing a new style of possession rugby that the 6 nation teams have not played yet.

As we know it was the Aussies and NZers who pushed for the law changes and it suits them fine. Another team who could really prosper with the law changes is France. The French have more talent than Australia and can score spectacular tries. Ireland lack the skill to play that type of game but theres other ways to win games.

thomond2006

What I'm interested in is if the SH sides can play at the same intensity and style with the NH interpretations.

I've seen nothing in the ML/HEC to suggest that the game has changed.

The challenged for the NH sides is to match the SH's intensity.

I think England are in a very good place atm and will fly the flag for the NH. Johnson has finally picked the right players and there is a good balance between youth and experience.

twinytwo

profitius wrote: »

How do you folks think the northern hemisphere teams will do against the southern hemisphere teams?

Its a good chance to judge the 6 nation teams. I think people are hyping up the southern hemisphere teams too much although they (NZ and Oz) are playing a new style of possession rugby that the 6 nation teams have not played yet.

As we know it was the Aussies and NZers who pushed for the law changes and it suits them fine. Another team who could really prosper with the law changes is France. The French have more talent than Australia and can score spectacular tries. Ireland lack the skill to play that type of game but theres other ways to win games.

SA will get hammered... Aus will win some and lose some and the abs will kill everyone

twinytwo

Judgement Day wrote: »

Stephen Jones helps stiffen All Blacks resolve to stuff England. Nobody more reliable than 'tabloid' Sunday Times rugby correspondent Stephen Jones to throw fuel on the fire ahead of Saturday's England vs All Blacks encounter and, yes, you guessed he's turned to the old reliable - "the Haka". In this piece - extracts here:

All Blacks: British writer takes aim at haka

A British rugby writer has labelled the All Blacks' haka as the 'instrument of the worst kind of sporting arrogance'.

Sunday Times writer Stephen Jones has slammed the All Blacks' traditional pre-match routine which is linked with the side as far back as 1884.

In his column for the English newspaper Jones says that the All Blacks have turned the haka into a ridiculous bout of pre-game posturing that has no place in rugby today.

"...the haka has changed, profoundly. The All Blacks and their followers have made it a self-important bore and instrument of the worst kind of sporting arrogance," Jones wrote in his column over the weekend.

"And symbolically, it sometimes stops just short of an exhortation to murder. In one of its versions, it ends with the players making graphic throat-cutting gestures."

Jones claims opposition towards the pre-match ritual is growing.

"One recent critic of the haka refers to a 'politically correct lunacy' and a 'cynical stage-managed circus'.

"Another calls the haka 'a bad joke' and another said the team performing it are like 'preening ninnies'."

The latest critique of the haka may be just what the All Blacks need ahead of Sunday's clash with England following their last minute loss to Australia in Hong Kong.

Jones takes issue with the All Blacks' view on teams approaching the haka stating 'the rules are always conveniently changing' and that 'one day they are happy when teams advance on them. Another day, they rage that this is disrespectful'.

Jones goes as far as suggesting the Welsh Rugby Union were 'courageous' for standing their ground in 2006 over a battle with the New Zealand Rugby Union to have the haka performed before the Welsh national anthem.

The All Blacks instead did the haka in the changing rooms. 'An insult to Wales' and 'to their anthem' Jones says.

Jones also implies the tackle that dislocated Brian O'Driscoll's shoulder in the opening British and Irish Lions test in 2005 was a reaction to the Irish centre picking up grass and throwing it after facing the haka.

Jones ends the column by saying: "When will New Zealand realise that nobody cares anymore? And that it is their fault for betraying their own ideal of the game."

- Herald online

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10684550

If the reaction in the NZ media is anything to go by the All Blacks are going to be more motivated than ever. Roll on Saturday! More worryingly it now appears definite that winger Corry Jane will miss the game after picking up an injury during the Hong Kong game.

Id love to see the guy be on the pitch when he says that...:pac:.... with or wothout the haka the chances are your going to get skull fcuked by them anyway.. so whats the big deal?

twinytwo

twinytwo wrote: »

Id love to see the guy be on the pitch when he says that...:pac:.... with or wothout the haka the chances are your going to get skull fcuked by them anyway.. so whats the big deal?

Heh. SJones: "We only lost cos of haka"

thomond2006

England: Ben Foden (Northampton); Mark Cueto (Sale), Mike Tindall (Gloucester), Shontayne Hape (Bath), Chris Ashton (Northampton); Toby Flood (Leicester), Ben Youngs (Leicester); Andrew Sheridan (Sale), Steve Thompson (Leeds), Dan Cole (Leicester), Courtney Lawes (Northampton), Tom Palmer (Stade Francais), Tom Croft (Leicester), Lewis Moody (Bath, capt), Nick Easter (Harlequins)

Replacements: Dylan Hartley (Northampton), David Wilson (Bath), David Attwood (Gloucester), Hendre Fourie (Leeds), Danny Care (Harlequins), Charlie Hodgson (Sale), Delon Armitage (London Irish).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/english/9149188.stm

I think England can give the ABs a good game, as long as Hodgson stays rooted to the bench.

Judgement Day

Not a bad looking English side - probably the best that they can manage in Jonny's absence. Still hopeful that the 'blacklash' will prove too much for them.

twinytwo

england have a team there to make it a good game.. still think the blacks will win though.. unless some funly vodoo strikes them down ...















.... i hope armitage comes on .. just so he can get served like!

thomond2006

thomond2006 wrote: »

England: Ben Foden (Northampton); Mark Cueto (Sale), Mike Tindall (Gloucester), Shontayne Hape (Bath), Chris Ashton (Northampton); Toby Flood (Leicester), Ben Youngs (Leicester); Andrew Sheridan (Sale), Steve Thompson (Leeds), Dan Cole (Leicester), Courtney Lawes (Northampton), Tom Palmer (Stade Francais), Tom Croft (Leicester), Lewis Moody (Bath, capt), Nick Easter (Harlequins)

Replacements: Dylan Hartley (Northampton), David Wilson (Bath), David Attwood (Gloucester), Hendre Fourie (Leeds), Danny Care (Harlequins), Charlie Hodgson (Sale), Delon Armitage (London Irish).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/english/9149188.stm

I think England can give the ABs a good game, as long as Hodgson stays rooted to the bench.

That has to be the worst centre pairing in international rugby.

thomond2006

Deleted User wrote: »

That has to be the worst centre pairing in international rugby.

Hape was very good in the 2nd test against Australia in the summer tbf and Tindall is strong pair of hands. They do lack pace though.

Not much options going at 12 anyway. Flutey is manure.

PhatPiggins

Deleted User wrote: »

That has to be the worst centre pairing in international rugby.

Was hoping Wynand Oliver would make the AI's so we could have the Oliver/Jacobs dream team against Ireland

Handy old back 3 for England, pity they won't get any ball in space. Hape is a real MJ player dumb, poor handling, not that fast but will go the full 80 and is ultra committed he's basically Dan Hipkiss with a tan.