Take back our Natural Resources

maxwell smart

I was sent this link a while ago and thought, what has happened to these resources? I know Shell have sown up a great deal for Corrib, but what about the rest of these prospective finds? We could do with the money if they were viable.
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/ireland-on-the-verge-of-an-oil-and-gas-bonanza-679889.html

Sponge Bob

maxwell smart wrote: »

I was sent this link a while ago and thought, what has happened to these resources?

Look at the date for gods sake , that was a pack of shyte fed to the media by then minister Noel Dempsey during an election campaign.

dunsandin

SpongeBob, thats shocking. Dempsey and sh1te in the same sentence. Now theres a first.:D

maxwell smart

Bah! I knew that guy who sent me the link was an FF'er!! And there is me, sold a pup again by them!!

Nolanger

We're on the verge of a whaling industry too but no-one talks about that either?

Nolanger

Nolanger wrote: »

We're on the verge of a whaling industry too but no-one talks about that either?

is this some joke about Harney or Cowen? I dont get it....or are you proposing we clone them for their blubber thus undercutting the Japanese whaling industry?

Genius

fontanalis

Well the independant covered it! How much oil did they find?

WalterMitty

Provedence resources was run/owned by Tony O'Reilly's son. Tony o'Reilly who owned most indo papers at time article was written.

Scofflaw

The claim that the Irish offshore has just masses of oil and gas waiting to be exploited by simply sticking a straw in the sand at Salthill is complete and utter rubbish, I'm sorry to say. It's talked up at intervals by companies trying to drum up a bit of interest in their shares, or by Ministers trying to drum up some interest before the latest licensing round, but the reality has remained pretty dismal for the the last 20 years of offshore exploration in Irish waters - small fields, poorly understood geology, deep waters, hostile natives, a hit rate of 1 exploration well in 30 showing anything at all. Exploitation of any finds would be at the edge of what is technologically feasible, and there really haven't been many finds either.

To be honest, there's likely to be substantial drilling in the Arctic before there's substantial drilling in the Irish offshore - it should be conveniently ice-free in summers some time in the next couple of decades.

cordially,
Scofflaw

dunsandin

You're probably right Scoff. I heard another mad claim that there might be commercial quantities of gold in Monaghan!!! Preposterouse. oh no, hang on...

Scofflaw

dunsandin wrote: »

You're probably right Scoff. I heard another mad claim that there might be commercial quantities of gold in Monaghan!!! Preposterouse. oh no, hang on...

Sure - that would really get us out of our current plight:

Costs of building and running the mine are estimated at around two-thirds of the value of the unexploited resources which, at present prices, could see a return of €190m.

I'm afraid the whole idea that we might suddenly come into new-found mineral or oil wealth (or that it's already been found, but it's being kept secret) is just another bit of wishfully thinking that there's some way out of this crisis that doesn't involve hard work. Many of the threads on this forum follow exactly the thought processes of someone unexpectedly presented with an enormous bill, for prompt settlement, after living the life of Reilly for several years:

1. "I can just refuse to pay!" - default threads, leave the euro threads, revolution threads, etc

2a. "it must be someone else's fault, I'm an innocent victim of circumstance" - the EU did it, it's the Germans' fault, the banks did it

2b. "someone else must have been running up these huge bills, and if I get rid of them, it'll all be fine" - it's the immigrants, dole spongers, TD's expenses, PS workers

3. "maybe I'll win the lotto tonight and pay it off" - oil & gas, gold reserves

4. "it's not my fault, I was badly advised" - economists, politicians

5. "I'll flee the country" - emigration threads

6. "it's a conspiracy!" - more for the CT forum, admittedly

Virtually every denial option has been used. It's kind of sad, really.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

dunsandin

Scofflaw wrote: »

Sure - that would really get us out of our current plight:



I'm afraid the whole idea that we might suddenly come into new-found mineral or oil wealth (or that it's already been found, but it's being kept secret) is just another bit of wishfully thinking that there's some way out of this crisis that doesn't involve hard work. Many of the threads on this forum follow exactly the thought processes of someone unexpectedly presented with an enormous bill, for prompt settlement, after living the life of Reilly for several years:

1. "I can just refuse to pay!" - default threads, leave the euro threads, revolution threads, etc

2a. "it must be someone else's fault, I'm an innocent victim of circumstance" - the EU did it, it's the Germans' fault, the banks did it

2b. "someone else must have been running up these huge bills, and if I get rid of them, it'll all be fine" - it's the immigrants, dole spongers, TD's expenses, PS workers

3. "maybe I'll win the lotto tonight and pay it off" - oil & gas, gold reserves

4. "it's not my fault, I was badly advised" - economists, politicians

5. "I'll flee the country" - emigration threads

6. "it's a conspiracy!" - more for the CT forum, admittedly

Virtually every denial option has been used. It's kind of sad, really.

cordially,
Scofflaw

I agree fully. The above have all been done to death by the present Govt. It really is time for a change.
I note that there has been no new thread to explore the oppositions assertion that having seen the figures, things in the economy are in fact WORSE than all to-date predictions, maybe we could hijack this thread to discuss this, seeing as how the original proposition has been condemned as the wishful thinking of a horseless beggar?

gleep

So we've a €15Bn hole in our finances. We also have Oil and Gas reserves worth approx €500Bn that are being tapped by multinationals to earn huge profits, which we will only see crumbs of.

Does anyone else think we should re-negotiate the terms of these agreements at least? I'm not saying kick Shell & Co out, but tell them we want more, much more. And if they refuse, send our garda, army & navy to escort them. It's our country, our resources and these are extraordinary times. I think we all know we were fooled by the oil companies, our next government should have the balls to put it right.

Where is this €500bln?

Shell haven't managed to bring a single barrel ashore.

Don't you think if there were billions of Euro just waiting to be brought ashore we would already have an oil industry like Scotland or Norway?

gleep

Then why are they building the Corrib pipeline? To pump air?

The wells have been found, they are just waiting to be tapped. Thing is, they are owned now by Oil companies, who are acting in their own interest. My guess is they're sitting on the resources till they need them.

maxwell smart

Scofflaw wrote: »

.....er living the life of Tony O' Reilly for several years:

I've fixed that there for you;)

Amhran Nua

gleep wrote: »

And if they refuse, send our garda, army & navy to escort them. It's our country, our resources and these are extraordinary times.

Or here's a better idea, we could go all out with the way the wind is blowing and invest heeavily in green energy and transportation initiatives? The sad thing is that even a constructive suggestion like this will raise more of a storm of protest among the right wing around these parts than the idea of nationalising whatever resources are out there.

jimmycrackcorm

I'd totally agree provided we could also go back in time before any exploration and tell shell that if you drill for oil or gas we will be taking it off you.

Then we wouldn't be having thus discussion now.

Amhran Nua

Scofflaw wrote: »

2a. "it must be someone else's fault, I'm an innocent victim of circumstance"

Actually for the majority of Irish citizens that might not be a bad description of the situation. Plenty of people haven't got an SUV and an investment property in Bulgaria. Not to blame the ECB or the Germans, but there could be a strong case made for failure to uphold the public trust in certain quarters.

gleep

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I'd totally agree provided we could also go back in time before any exploration and tell shell that if you drill for oil or gas we will be taking it off you.

Then we wouldn't be having thus discussion now.

Little cryptic there jimmy, but I get it. You're basically saying that without Shell etc we wouldn't have found the oil/gas?

Maybe so. I'm not arguing that, I'm saying we stand to gain only miniscule benefit from our resources, Shell etc will make billions. I'm saying we should tell them we want more.

gleep

gleep wrote: »

Then why are they building the Corrib pipeline? To pump air?

The wells have been found, they are just waiting to be tapped. Thing is, they are owned now by Oil companies, who are acting in their own interest. My guess is they're sitting on the resources till they need them.

Their own interest is to make a profit.

The fact that there have only been two serious attempts in the past 30 years to tap these resources suggest that the €500bln isn't as easy to get at as you seem to suggest.

Think of the positives - oil prices seem to be continuously rising - when the oil companies decide it is in their interest to extract this stuff it might be worth €1 trillion!

gleep

Deleted User wrote: »

Their own interest is to make a profit.

The fact that there have only been two serious attempts in the past 30 years to tap these resources suggest that the €500bln isn't as easy to get at as you seem to suggest.

Think of the positives - oil prices seem to be continuously rising - when the oil companies decide it is in their interest to extract this stuff it might be worth €1 trillion!

I'm sure Oil companies have everything going just how they want it. They are producing enough to meet demand, keeping prices high and everyone happy. I'll bet my life that if they needed to get to the Irish reserves they would, no problem.

Out of interest do you have access to any reports by geologists or exploration companies to back up the value of €500bln?

Ideally listing confirmed amounts of oil/gas and potentially confirming how easy they would be to get to.

gleep

Deleted User wrote: »

Out of interest do you have access to any reports by geologists or exploration companies to back up the value of €500bln?

Ideally listing confirmed amounts of oil/gas and potentially confirming how easy they would be to get to.

I'm looking. Although I'm pretty sure the only people who know what's there are the Oil companies!

I do know though, that back in the late eighties, we changed the law regarding Oil companies. Basically they could write off all exploration costs against profits and the exchequer would be entitled to far less of a cut.

Guess what happened then? The Oil companies reported finding new reserves (99% more) despite a 40% drop in exploration. Go figure.

Finding plenty of info like this, nothing concrete but seems to be based on actual data by PAD

gleep

Petroleum Affairs Division, govt dept. Lots of maps etc, no value. If anyone can work it out, please enlighten me!

http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/Natural/Petroleum+Affairs+Division/

Scofflaw

gleep wrote: »

Then why are they building the Corrib pipeline? To pump air?

The wells have been found, they are just waiting to be tapped. Thing is, they are owned now by Oil companies, who are acting in their own interest. My guess is they're sitting on the resources till they need them.

Reposted after thread merge:

The claim that the Irish offshore has just masses of oil and gas waiting to be exploited by simply sticking a straw in the sand at Salthill is complete and utter rubbish, I'm sorry to say. It's talked up at intervals by companies trying to drum up a bit of interest in their shares, or by Ministers trying to drum up some interest before the latest licensing round, but the reality has remained pretty dismal for the the last 20 years of offshore exploration in Irish waters - small fields, poorly understood geology, deep waters, hostile natives, a hit rate of 1 exploration well in 30 showing anything at all. Exploitation of any finds would be at the edge of what is technologically feasible, and there really haven't been many finds either.

To be honest, there's likely to be substantial drilling in the Arctic before there's substantial drilling in the Irish offshore - it should be conveniently ice-free in summers some time in the next couple of decades.

Much of the exploration drilling in the Irish offshore was done when I was still in the oil industry, and friends of mine were on the exploration rigs. The figure of €500bn is meaningless, I'm afraid. The idea that the oil companies have found stuff out there and kept it secret is also not a runner - wells are drilled by consortiums of companies large and small, with PAD observers on hand. The small companies involved immediately trumpet any find they make, because they need the immediate boost - and the large companies do the same. They can't make money out of a field that's not being exploited except by telling everyone and raising their share prices - and you can't secretly exploit an oil field.

There are no secret oil reservoirs to bail us out of our mess, I'm afraid.

cordially,
Scofflaw

gleep

Scofflaw wrote: »

Reposted after thread merge:

The claim that the Irish offshore has just masses of oil and gas waiting to be exploited by simply sticking a straw in the sand at Salthill is complete and utter rubbish, I'm sorry to say. It's talked up at intervals by companies trying to drum up a bit of interest in their shares, or by Ministers trying to drum up some interest before the latest licensing round, but the reality has remained pretty dismal for the the last 20 years of offshore exploration in Irish waters - small fields, poorly understood geology, deep waters, hostile natives, a hit rate of 1 exploration well in 30 showing anything at all. Exploitation of any finds would be at the edge of what is technologically feasible, and there really haven't been many finds either.

To be honest, there's likely to be substantial drilling in the Arctic before there's substantial drilling in the Irish offshore - it should be conveniently ice-free in summers some time in the next couple of decades.

Much of the exploration drilling in the Irish offshore was done when I was still in the oil industry, and friends of mine were on the exploration rigs. The figure of €500bn is meaningless, I'm afraid. The idea that the oil companies have found stuff out there and kept it secret is also not a runner - wells are drilled by consortiums of companies large and small, with PAD observers on hand. The small companies involved immediately trumpet any find they make, because they need the immediate boost - and the large companies do the same. They can't make money out of a field that's not being exploited except by telling everyone and raising their share prices - and you can't secretly exploit an oil field.

There are no secret oil reservoirs to bail us out of our mess, I'm afraid.

cordially,
Scofflaw

OK Scofflaw, point taken. You have worked in the Oil industry so will obviously know more than me.

I'm not saying that our resources could save our bacon over night. I just want our politicians to grow a set and demand more than the country is currently getting for whatever is actually being extracted. And to demand more in the future.

Nody

gleep wrote: »

I just want our politicians to grow a set and demand more than the country is currently getting for whatever is actually being extracted. And to demand more in the future.

So you want a bigger percentage from the zero money coming in currently then the Irish state is currently getting? Got ya and you got it! Instead of getting 30% of zero you can now have 60% of zero!

dunsandin

If every small step in the right direction is rejected as being too small, you know where we will get? Nowhere.
Yes, we have natural rescources, zinc and lead in meath, same in tipp, gold in the north, oil and gas to the west, and no doubt more if we really went looking. Scoff, with respect, you are a master at producing an evenly argued post about what cannot be done, Any about what can be done? Now that might be interesting.
Your argument that all the posts about the economy are boring and repetitive, well would you mind enlightening the rest of us as to what kind of thread you yourself might find less boring and sad? And we are not all waking up after the big party, finding a bill and running around like chickens. Some of us stayed in watching tv that night, and life has not really changed much for us.
What you are espousing is the line the govt's of the last few years have pursued - go for the big fish(FDI) and ignore the small. Well the small are easier landed and carried, and you are no less full if you have enough of them. DS

Nolanger

Deleted User wrote: »

is this some joke about Harney or Cowen? I dont get it....or are you proposing we clone them for their blubber thus undercutting the Japanese whaling industry?

Genius

Nope, we restart our fishing industry and develop a whaling industry for Ireland. Surprised no-one else will suggest this?

fontanalis

gleep wrote: »

Then why are they building the Corrib pipeline? To pump air?

The wells have been found, they are just waiting to be tapped. Thing is, they are owned now by Oil companies, who are acting in their own interest. My guess is they're sitting on the resources till they need them.

Shock horror, business acts in it's own interest. I'd say the Shell reps were delighted they ran into a fcukwit like Ray Burke.

gleep

Nody wrote: »

So you want a bigger percentage from the zero money coming in currently then the Irish state is currently getting? Got ya and you got it! Instead of getting 30% of zero you can now have 60% of zero!

Drink much?

Ireland has no natural resources currently being exploited? OK son, OK

AlekSmart

I'd say the Shell reps were delighted they ran into a fcukwit like Ray Burke.

Hmmmm,Fontanalis,I`d be more inclined to think Raphael P Burke,his family and associates are only bursting with pride at the wonderful job they did in protecting their...oops sorry,Irelands future wealth through the association with Shell plc...;)

Mr Burke and reps deserve our fulsome praise and thanks !!

Scofflaw

dunsandin wrote: »

If every small step in the right direction is rejected as being too small, you know where we will get? Nowhere.
Yes, we have natural rescources, zinc and lead in meath, same in tipp, gold in the north, oil and gas to the west, and no doubt more if we really went looking. Scoff, with respect, you are a master at producing an evenly argued post about what cannot be done, Any about what can be done? Now that might be interesting.
Your argument that all the posts about the economy are boring and repetitive, well would you mind enlightening the rest of us as to what kind of thread you yourself might find less boring and sad? And we are not all waking up after the big party, finding a bill and running around like chickens. Some of us stayed in watching tv that night, and life has not really changed much for us.
What you are espousing is the line the govt's of the last few years have pursued - go for the big fish(FDI) and ignore the small. Well the small are easier landed and carried, and you are no less full if you have enough of them. DS

Fair points, but I'm not arguing here against upping the tax take from any resources we do have - I'm just trying to correct the very popular misconception that we have vast untapped and definite resources to do it with.

Admittedly, that is part of the argument against any sort of punitive tax on oil brought ashore - we're not some kind of Mecca for oil companies, that they'll happily accept swingeing tax hikes in order to get their grubby paws on our untapped wealth.

But that's about punitive taxation - it's no reason to immediately oppose a reasonable raise in the tax rate, assuming that's legally possible.

As to getting out of the mess we're in - what else is there that we can do but make cuts, raise taxes, borrow money, and accept that that in itself puts a dampener on our recovery rate which delays our return to effective growth? I don't have any suggestions for a secret weapon to win that war, because I don't think there is any such thing - we get to knuckle down and slog it through. If we'd wanted a different outcome, we should have paid attention over the last decade.

Nor am I going to call for heads to roll for what was legal at the time, or retroactive sanctions - the things that were done shouldn't have been legal, but they were, and making them illegal retroactively opens an enormous can of worms for no other reason than the brief warm glow of vengeance. No amount of punitive action now will pay our debts, or bring back the horse. We shouldn't waste this crisis, though - we should be trying to make sure we come out of this with better regulation, more transparency, and more accountability. People can call that shutting the door after the horse has bolted if they like, but I'm presuming that we plan on owning another horse when we can afford it again - so there's future value in fixing the door now.

I appreciate that's pretty lukewarm counsel, but then I don't really do outrage, and I don't really see the value of wishful thinking or revenge.

cordially,
Scofflaw

cc-offe

I believe the oil is there, they don't need it yet which is why it is still there, it is sickening with the state of the country that they will not try to force a better deal

kadman

If there is nothing of much value out there for Shell, they wont mind giving it back then.:)

griswald

kadman

Article says figures quoted are from the dail, but I have not had a chance to check that out yet,

kadman

http://www.anarkismo.net/article/5260


Ireland was robbed of over E400 billion in natural gas and oil deposits. How did this come to pass?
ireland / britain | economy | opinion/analysis Friday March 30, 2007 20:08 by Fin Dwyer - WSM findwyer at gmail dot com
.

The two most well known Irish hydrocarbon deposits: the Corrib field and the Dunquin prospect are collectively worth at least E400 billion euros. They contain around 33trillion cubic feet of gas and between 2.5 and 4 billion barrels of oil. The gas in the Corrib belong to Shell, Statoil and Marathon and the Dunquin prospect is totally controlled by Exxon Mobil and Providence . The people of Ireland will end up buying back our oil and gas and they (Shell Statoil Exxon Marathon etc.) will be charged pitiful tax rates as they can write all exploration and construction costs over the past twenty-five years against tax. How did this happen?

A history of gas exploration before and after 1987 (courtesy of John Monaghan)



The two most well known Irish hydrocarbon deposits, the Corrib field and the Dunquin prospect, are collectively worth at least €400 billion euros. They contain around 33 trillion cubic feet of gas and between 2.5 and 4 billion barrels of oil. The gas in the Corrib belongs to Shell, Statoil and Marathon while the Dunquin prospect is totally controlled by Exxon Mobil and Providence. Ordinary Irish workers will end up buying back our oil and gas while the companies will be charged pitiful tax rates against which they can write off all exploration and construction costs over the past twenty-five years. How did this happen?

Kinsale and the original terms

Gas and oil exploration began in Ireland In the 1960’s and in 1973 Marathon Oil found the first field off the coast of Cork. This became known as the Kinsale field. The Fianna Fail government of the time gave Marathon a once off deal in which Bord Gais bought the field at a reduced rate. Gas and oil exploration continued throughput the 1970’s but little was found.

This exploration was coupled with a change in the political landscape. In 1973 the “National Coalition” government was elected. This compromised Fine Gael and Labour. Fine Gael’s Liam Cosgrave became Taoiseach and Labour got seven ministerial posts. Labour’s Justin Keating, a former lecturer in UCD, became minister for industry and commerce.

Keating, ideologically a social democrat, was critical of the terms granted to Marathon Oil. The social democratic model being applied in Norway which was taxing the oil majors up to 90% tax heavily influenced Keating. The initial find occurred in1973 which coincided with the first major oil crisis. This made oil a very valuable commodity and also should have made the Irish fields more lucrative and exploitable.

Keating introduced new terms for exploitation based on three principles what became known as the Keating principles:
1.The State, acting for the people as owners of the resource, should be paid for the resources.
2. Companies engaging in offshore development on the Irish continental shelf should be subject to Irish taxation.
3.Since the resources are public property, the State must have the right to participate in their exploitation.

The main points of the terms were:
(A.) Up to 50% stake find in any commercial field
(B.) 8-16% royalties would be taken.
(C.) 50% Corporation tax.
(D.) The drilling must take place within three years.
(E.) The companies give up to 50% of the field to the State in 4 years.
They also laboured all costs of exploration on the companies.

A Rosy Irish Future?
So by 1974 oil had just rocketed to $12 a barrel (cheap it seems but this was a 400% increase than) and it seemed Ireland with its new terms was in for a windfall, but the oil companies were not so easily beaten. In his own words to Primetime in 2001 Keating had brought in the legislation because “I remember being terrified because I thought they [the companies] held all the cards” (CPI report, the great Corrib gas controversy, 55). This was quite understandable as the oil companies had just formed the Irish off shore operators group (later to become association) to lobby in their interests.

Fianna Fail take over

Before Keating could push forward with his ideas and set up a state oil company the so called national coalition was voted out in 1977 and the boys were back in town, that is Fianna Fail were in government again. Jack Lynch was Taoiseach and Dessie O Malley (later founder of the Progressive Democrats) became minister for Industry and Commerce. Ironically O’Malley’s main act in relation to natural resources was to set up the Irish national petroleum company- a State oil company. The company’s articles of association are interesting as they limit the company from exploring or exploiting oil or gas. (The INPC was later privatised and bought by Conocco-Phillips.)

Although this may seem insignificant, O’Malley by preventing the company from exploring or exploiting, severely limited Keating’s original idea; by setting up the INPC it almost made certain the Irish State would never have a National oil company along the lines of Statoil. It seems O’Malley free market ideology was very influential in this move.

Indeed the very idea of setting a national oil company didn’t sit well with O’Malley and he later said to the Dail the only he reason he did so was because Iraq would only sell oil to a State oil company (CPI report, the great Corrib gas controversy, 13).

Throughout the 1980’s the Irish state had little idea of what was the results of the exploration in Irish waters were as there were no independent tests carried out. The oil companies continued to say that finds were minimal. By the mid 1980’s 96 oil gas wells had been drilled and amazingly knowing what we know now about what lies off the west coast little was found. The oil companies moved into action and started to push that the terms instituted in 1973 be altered so they were more favourable toward the companies.

Dick Spring's true colours
In 1985 Dick Spring as minister for Energy in Garret Fitzgerald’s coalition government began to cede ground to the oil companies. He granted special terms to fields that were under 75million barrels. This included a reduced royalty rate and a sliding scale for state participation rights. In 1986 Spring removed all state participation rights on what were termed marginal fields.

Enter Fianna Fail stage right
By 1987 the government had nominally changed. Fianna Fail were back at the helm. Charles Haughey had entered his third term as Taoiseach of a country plunging further and further into crisis. Ray Burke was made Minister for Energy.

The oil companies through their Irish Offshore Operators Association were seriously lobbying for change arguing that the Irish terms were too harsh. Burke acquiesced and started to dismantle the basis of Keating’s ideas. He allowed the companies to write 100% of tax off against all exploration and construction costs over the past 25 years.

Even Ray Burke felt it would be over generous to reduce the 50% corporation tax (something Bertie Ahern would disagree with 5 years later, see below) so it remained. This was a good start for the oil companies as all costs of exploration were effectively transferred onto the people of Ireland as the companies were paying less tax on something that belonged to the people of the country. The reasons stated by Bertie Ahern (then Finance minister was to improve Ireland’s “competitive position in attracting oil and gas exploration” (CPI report, the great Corrib gas controversy, 13. Ahern went on to express concern for the “intense pressure on oil companies' exploration budgets” on the 22nd of October 1987 in reference to the new terms (www.oireachtas-debates.gov.ie) Seamus Brannan articulated the state’s position well:
“In the area of oil exploration, it is quite clear that it is too muddled, too complex, too protective, too timid, too cautious and, in effect, useless, because courage is not being taken in one's hands with the idea of getting the oil, the gas, out of the ground, and improving the intensity of the search” Dail Eireann 28th of June 1985 www.oireachtas-debates.gov.ie).

It is clear that by the mid eighties the government wanted more exploration and hoped success rates would then increase. To do this the costs of exploration were written off against tax. It appears the logic was if we drill more holes something would eventually be found. This is clear from Burke and Ahern’s statements.

Effects of the change in terms

Amazingly, after 1987 success rates rocketed by 99%. This was really odd as actual exploration rate fell by 41%. The formula worked but in a very illogical way. Something wasn’t right. This rate is obviously unbelievable and wasn’t just co-incidence. After drilling for years and finding nothing suddenly the companies struck gold at a time when they cut back on exploration. The most plausible reason is that the oil companies were sitting on information and waiting for the better terms to come along and from 1987 the government was beginning to answer their prayers. When these new and disimproved terms were brought in to legislation by Burke they then selectively drilled in places they knew they would be successful.

Things manage to get worse!
In 1992 Bertie Ahern (current Taoiseach) was the Minister for Finance. Ahern totally dismantled the 1975 terms introduced by Keating. There was to be no state involvement and royalties were abolished. In the 1992 terms, gas and oil were to be sold to the highest bidder (whereas at Kinsale they were sold at a reduced rate to Bord Gais). Licensing agreements were extended from three to sixteen years. At this point Ahern disagreed with Burke as he reduced to the corporation tax to 25%. He had widespread support for these measures. His Taoiseach of the time, Albert Reynolds, bemoaned the fact that there was not “a clear recognition by the Government that risks must be rewarded and enterprise encouraged in relation to the oil and gas industry”. (Dail Eireann 30th October 1985, www.oireachtas-debates.gov.ie)

This created what are widely felt as the best conditions for oil companies in the world, but that in effect means the worst terms for people of Ireland. This is astounding as the finds had dramatically increased since Burkes 1987 deal.

Who is to blame?
The point of this article is not to let the politicians off the hook but rather to point out that it wasn’t just one bad egg or corrupt party who got us in this dire situation. It is highly unlikely that Dick Spring or Dessie O Malley were corrupt. Rather they followed the rules of capitalism – they facilitated those trying to accrue capital. Neither is it written to lump all the blame Shell totally. As one Shell to Sea campaigner commented on the Shell/ Corrib scenario“if you put a lion in a cage with a sheep you can’t give out to the lion when it tries to eat the sheep”.

What the terms throughout the years seem to indicate is that the much used analysis of blaming corrupt politicians is wrong. To say no corruption was involved may be excessive but it seems unlikely that it wasn’t the prime factor. There are three possibly more influential reasons as to why the people of Ireland now find themselves with their in resources in the hands of multinational corporations.

The first is right wing ideology is and has been hegemonic over the Irish political spectrum. Keating seems to have been one of the few in favour of a State oil company. Dessie O’Malley was fervently against it and effectively stopped any future moves by establishing a very limited oil company the INPC. Future moves to maintain the resources oil Ireland for the people of Ireland were absent. The political will to do so didn’t exist in any of the main political parties. It was Labour through the auspices of Dick Spring got the ball rolling on the issue in 1985.

The second reason seems to have been a genuine fear of the oil companies. This seems to have been real and if we look at Keating’s comments to primetime (cited above) there was a genuine fear that the companies would leave altogether. Strangely at the time no one seems to have asked the question “what were they contributing”? Courage seems to have been lacking, but also while Keating may have had some progressive ideas he was in a coalition with Fine Gael and the idea of standing up to international capital which is what was needed would obviously be horrifying. Politics for public interest in Ireland is treated like a nice idea but not something politicians are really interested in.

The third and possibly most important reason was we had no control over our national resources. We were and are looking from crumbs off our own table. This was fuelled by the fear of the companies and international capital by the few in favour of nationalisation even in a limited whilst there was a willingness to support private capital by the vast majority . They held all the cards and the politicians would not or more accurately did not want to stand up and tell them to pay up or get out. Unfortunately they stayed and now we must fight them for fields about to go into production.

The fourth and final reason supplements the first two is that the state was not carrying out any independent test the drilling by the multinationals. This then led the state to be in a position that all its information was coming from oil companies. It was obviously in the oil multinationals’ interest to down play what they found and in fact Dick Spring’s terms (introduced in 1985) must have only encouraged it where the smaller the field, the better terms the companies received .

What we can see is that the Irish state allowed itself to be hoodwinked. This situation must have been obvious to successive energy and finance ministers since 1988 at the latest. Since then as free market ideology dominates there was no political will to challenge it.

The blame for this situation lies with the entire political establishment and system. All the major parties have been in power (except Sinn Fein and The Socialist Party and the Greens) since 1988. They facilitated this as they allowed it to continue. The past politicians allowed themselves to be hoodwinked in some cases (did they honestly think they could believe be the likes of Shell, Marathon and Exxon?), as it appears they didn’t have the will to rock the boat. They sold our resources in some cases for ideological reasons. The current politicians are possibly more to blame. They are aware of exactly what happened. They can see the unbelievable surge in productivity in exploration in 1987. They are probably muted by the fact that very prominent politicians took bribes at some point or were facilitated or thanked for introducing legislation. Why Bertie Ahern introduced more favourable legislation in 1992 is quite strange.

The nominal parties of the left, Labour and the Greens are equally compliant. Pat Rabitte is desperate to prove to big business that Labour can be trusted with the economy of the rich so will never challenge Exxon or Shell even to the extent Justin Keating was willing to. The Greens still have to state their policy which means they’ll blow with the wind and in Ireland it’s blustering right towards continued privatisation.

The future

However this is changing rapidly. The Corrib Field is between 6-11TCF (trillion cubic feet the equivalent of well 1.4 billion barrels of oil). In the average scenario the field is worth in the region of €50 - €60billion. The Dunquin field is probably worth at least around €400 billion. Opposition has a very limited time to rectify the legalised theft of our resources. Exxon and Providence will attempt to pump the gas and oil in Dunquin in the next ten years, Shell will pump Corrib once they realise an inland refinery is not a runner. In thirty years they will potentially have pumped 500 billion euros out of the country. And there are other potentially valuable fields off Donegal, Wexford and in Cavan/Leitrim. The question for the next twenty years is whether the people of Ireland will act or do our usual moaning when it’s too late to act.

Note on Sources
All the figures cited are from the Dail website, the Irish times website based on Providence figures and providences own website.

On the the Dunquin prospect the figures fluctuate drastically. A Dail debate of 4 may 2006 cites there being 25TCF of gas and only 4 million barrels of oil ( the 4 million barrels seems highly unlikely as such a small amount would not be at all profitable to extract and must be an error), the Irish times of the Thursday, May 18, 2006 cited Providence as saying that Dunquin has the potential to produce 160 million barrels of oil and 1.4 trillion cubic feet of gas

kadman

I see the confidentiality period has been extended to from 7-10 years. Why should it be there at all. What dont they want us to know. Closes 31st may.
So we have til then to lobby our politicians to stop giving away our resources.
Why cant we know ,
Who,s bidding,
How much,
Who ultimately has control,
How will the irish people benefit.

kadman

http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/Natural/Petroleum+Affairs+Division/2011+Atlantic+Margin+Licensing+Round.htm

Oil and Gas Exploration Irish Offshore Open for Business
Minister Conor Lenihan announces details of new exploration opportunities in Irish waters – the “2011 Atlantic Margin Licensing Round”
Dublin, 16th June 2010

Minister Conor Lenihan today announced details of new exploration opportunities in Irish waters – the “2011 Atlantic Margin Licensing Round”.

The Minister also announced details of a new joint Ireland/Newfoundland-Labrador research project involving a plate reconstruction of the North Atlantic.

The 2011 Atlantic Margin Licensing Round is an invitation for oil and gas exploration companies to apply for new authorisations in Ireland’s Atlantic Margin.

This round is different from previous licensing Rounds and is designed to boost the level of exploration activity off the Irish coast.

Minister Lenihan stated “Having considered the lessons to be learned from recent licensing rounds and having consulted with industry, I believe it is time for Ireland to take a new approach to attracting exploration investment to the Atlantic margin. I am proposing a licensing initiative that is simple, yet innovative.

It is an initiative with the clear objective of significantly increasing the level of exploration activity in the Irish offshore. It is an initiative that will fit different company sizes and corporate strategies. As a result, it should be of real interest to the industry at large, contractors included.”

It opens up Ireland’s entire Atlantic – the Atlantic Margin - seabed for exploration (apart from existing licensed areas) rather than specific basins (or blocks).

In the past 15-year licences were granted but they required that a significant investment had to be made within the first phase of the licence (usually four years). In this Round, two year Licensing Options will be on offer to allow exploration companies assess the potential of the area and therefore do not require a large up-front cash investment. A fifteen year licence can then be secured if desired, provided an appropriate work programme is agreed.

In order to encourage the acquisition of new seismic data by seismic acquisition contractors, Minister Lenihan had decided to extend the confidentiality period that will apply to new acquisition in the Licensing Round area, from 7 to 10 years.

This round will be the largest licensing round to date, covering an area of just over a quarter of a million square kilometres, comprising 996 full blocks and 58 part blocks. The area on offer extends from about 30-380 km from shore with water depths typically ranging from 200m, or less, to over 3000m.

Trans Atlantic Research Initiative

Minister Lenihan also announced details of a new trans-Atlantic research corroboration involving a range of Irish and Newfoundland-Labrador research institutes and private enterprise.

This two-year research project will use sophisticated computer modelling software to generate plate reconstruction models showing Irish and Canadian sedimentary basins in their original positions from millions of years ago when Ireland and Canada were near neighbours. By doing this we can identify areas in Ireland with similar geology that might be rich in petroleum too.

Irish Atlantic waters have traditionally been inhospitable areas for petroleum exploration. Circa 150 wells have been drilled in the last 30 years with a less than 1 in 30 success ratio (discovery of commercial fields).

Yet, it is estimated that the area is likely to be rich in petroleum reserves. There are potential reserves of 10 billion barrels of oil equivalent (oil or gas) in the Irish Atlantic Margin.

Minister Lenihan said “I believe that offering Licensing Options, on the basis I have outlined, will attract an increased interest in exploration offshore Ireland and I look forward to the receipt of a good number of quality applications when the Round closes on the 31st of May of next year”

Ends

Notes for Editors:

• The Atlantic basins to the west of Ireland are a “closed area”, and companies can only apply for licences when the Minister runs a licensing round competition.

• For the first time ever the area covered in the 2011 Round includes all of Ireland’s Atlantic sedimentary basins (map available on request). The area on offer extends from about 30-380 km from shore with water depths typically ranging from 200m, or less, to over 3000m.

• Licensing Options granted under the 2011 Licensing Round will be valid for maximum period of two years and may not be extended. The actual duration of each Licensing Option issued will be determined by the detail of the work programme agreed with the Minister.

• The closing date for receipt of applications for the 2011 Atlantic Licensing Round is 31st May 2011.

• Each application shall be for a minimum of one block and for a maximum of six blocks.

• Licensing Option holders will be required to hold a Petroleum Prospecting Licence for the full duration of the Licensing Option

RichardAnd

Scofflaw wrote: »

Sure - that would really get us out of our current plight:



I'm afraid the whole idea that we might suddenly come into new-found mineral or oil wealth (or that it's already been found, but it's being kept secret) is just another bit of wishfully thinking that there's some way out of this crisis that doesn't involve hard work. Many of the threads on this forum follow exactly the thought processes of someone unexpectedly presented with an enormous bill, for prompt settlement, after living the life of Reilly for several years:

1. "I can just refuse to pay!" - default threads, leave the euro threads, revolution threads, etc

2a. "it must be someone else's fault, I'm an innocent victim of circumstance" - the EU did it, it's the Germans' fault, the banks did it

2b. "someone else must have been running up these huge bills, and if I get rid of them, it'll all be fine" - it's the immigrants, dole spongers, TD's expenses, PS workers

3. "maybe I'll win the lotto tonight and pay it off" - oil & gas, gold reserves

4. "it's not my fault, I was badly advised" - economists, politicians

5. "I'll flee the country" - emigration threads

6. "it's a conspiracy!" - more for the CT forum, admittedly

Virtually every denial option has been used. It's kind of sad, really.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Possibly the best post I've ever seen to describe the recession and Ireland.

But I guess it's a little slice of irish history. 100 years ago, all our problems were caused by the english. Then is was the church, causing hardship for the goo people of the nation. Now they're both gone so who is it now that's making life hard....the bankers! It was them wot done it!!