Clinton Official Suggested Letting U.S. Plane Be Shot Down To Provoke war with Iraq

WakeUp

robtri wrote: »

nope that why i said talk has it... not its a fact...

can you back up your statement that shows that clintons sanctions directly killed hundreds of thousands

I can yeah, I don’t really want to derail the thread anymore apologies for going off topic here OP, will give you a few quick examples though.
The US and British were the chief architects and administrators of the crippling UN sanctions directed against Iraq from the early 90’s up to the illegal, immoral lie based invasion of 2003.

These are the comments of Denis Halliday, an Irishman, who was the former UN Assistant Secretary General and the UN Humanitarian Coordinator for Iraq 1997-98. He resigned his position in 1998 after 34 years in the UN.

Accepting the Gandhi International Peace Award in 2003, I explained my resignation from the United Nations as head of the UN Humanitarian Program in Iraq at the end of 1998. I indicated that resignation was necessary because of my refusal to accept Security Council orders that continued to impose genocidal sanctions on the innocent of Iraq. My continuation would have implied my complicity in human catastrophe. And, in addition, my innate sense of justice was outraged as yours would have been in my position by the violence that UN sanctions had brought upon the lives and wellbeing of children, families, and the many loved ones of Iraq. There can be no justification for killing the young, the aged, the sick, the rich, the poor anywhere, under any circumstances, least of all by the United Nations.
Some will tell you that the Iraqi leadership was punishing the Iraqi people. That was not my perception or experience when living in Baghdad in 1997-98 and traveling throughout the country. And were that to be the case, how could that possibly justify collective punishment that is sanctions, by the United Nations? The UN Charter and international law have no provision for the murderous consequences of a UN embargo, over 12 long years in the case of the people of Iraq.
After leaving, sometimes I explained the impact of sanctions to the media, and to university and public meetings by describing Iraqi children as being on death row without hope of reprieve. By the end of 1998, we the UN had killed hundreds of thousands without any apparent hesitation on the part of the permanent member states of the Security Council.
The illegal invasion and occupation of Iraq in 2003 has only worsened the overall situation for Iraqi children, women and men. Contrary to what the mainstream media has been and is reporting, a whole nation is being terrorized, killed, driven into exile. The humanitarian situation in Iraq is catastrophic according to the ICRC (The Red Cross) and other international organizations. American imposition of democracy and freedom has failed as law, order and economic and social wellbeing is increasingly elusive. Health and educational systems are about to collapse; the human rights situation is disastrous; human security and opportunities have vanished; the fearful, the refugees and the displaced outnumber those enjoying normal lives.(link)

Hans von Sponeck replaced Mr. Halliday in 1998 but also resigned his position in disgust 2 years later saying - “How long should the civilian population of Iraq be exposed to such punishment for something they have never done?”

When asked on US television if she [Madeline Albright, US Secretary of State] thought that the death of half a million Iraqi children [from sanctions in Iraq] was a price worth paying, Albright replied: “This is a very hard choice, but we think the price is worth it.”

The sanctions imposed were evil, horrible, and vicious in there nature. The figure of 500,000 dead children originated from a Unicef report on infant mortality in sanctions-era Iraq. The US State Dept commented at the time that the sanctions where “the toughest, most comprehensive sanctions in history”. Apart from targeting imports and exports of all sorts of everyday stuff in and out of the country, they also focused on food, medical supplies and their water system which is against article 54 of the Geneva Convention. The UN has never formally adopted the Geneva Convention in its entirety which is a loophole they ruthlessly exposed as they implicated those murderous sanctions.

robtri

WakeUp wrote: »

I can yeah, I don’t really want to derail the thread anymore apologies for going off topic here OP, will give you a few quick examples though.
The US and British were the chief architects and administrators of the crippling UN sanctions directed against Iraq from the early 90’s up to the illegal, immoral lie based invasion of 2003.

These are the comments of Denis Halliday, an Irishman, who was the former UN Assistant Secretary General and the UN Humanitarian Coordinator for Iraq 1997-98. He resigned his position in 1998 after 34 years in the UN.

Accepting the Gandhi International Peace Award in 2003, I explained my resignation from the United Nations as head of the UN Humanitarian Program in Iraq at the end of 1998. I indicated that resignation was necessary because of my refusal to accept Security Council orders that continued to impose genocidal sanctions on the innocent of Iraq. My continuation would have implied my complicity in human catastrophe. And, in addition, my innate sense of justice was outraged as yours would have been in my position by the violence that UN sanctions had brought upon the lives and wellbeing of children, families, and the many loved ones of Iraq. There can be no justification for killing the young, the aged, the sick, the rich, the poor anywhere, under any circumstances, least of all by the United Nations.
Some will tell you that the Iraqi leadership was punishing the Iraqi people. That was not my perception or experience when living in Baghdad in 1997-98 and traveling throughout the country. And were that to be the case, how could that possibly justify collective punishment that is sanctions, by the United Nations? The UN Charter and international law have no provision for the murderous consequences of a UN embargo, over 12 long years in the case of the people of Iraq.
After leaving, sometimes I explained the impact of sanctions to the media, and to university and public meetings by describing Iraqi children as being on death row without hope of reprieve. By the end of 1998, we the UN had killed hundreds of thousands without any apparent hesitation on the part of the permanent member states of the Security Council.
The illegal invasion and occupation of Iraq in 2003 has only worsened the overall situation for Iraqi children, women and men. Contrary to what the mainstream media has been and is reporting, a whole nation is being terrorized, killed, driven into exile. The humanitarian situation in Iraq is catastrophic according to the ICRC (The Red Cross) and other international organizations. American imposition of democracy and freedom has failed as law, order and economic and social wellbeing is increasingly elusive. Health and educational systems are about to collapse; the human rights situation is disastrous; human security and opportunities have vanished; the fearful, the refugees and the displaced outnumber those enjoying normal lives.(link)

Hans von Sponeck replaced Mr. Halliday in 1998 but also resigned his position in disgust 2 years later saying - “How long should the civilian population of Iraq be exposed to such punishment for something they have never done?”

When asked on US television if she [Madeline Albright, US Secretary of State] thought that the death of half a million Iraqi children [from sanctions in Iraq] was a price worth paying, Albright replied: “This is a very hard choice, but we think the price is worth it.”

The sanctions imposed were evil, horrible, and vicious in there nature. The figure of 500,000 dead children originated from a Unicef report on infant mortality in sanctions-era Iraq. The US State Dept commented at the time that the sanctions where “the toughest, most comprehensive sanctions in history”. Apart from targeting imports and exports of all sorts of everyday stuff in and out of the country, they also focused on food, medical supplies and their water system which is against article 54 of the Geneva Convention. The UN has never formally adopted the Geneva Convention in its entirety which is a loophole they ruthlessly exposed as they implicated those murderous sanctions.

last comment on this as it is a bit OT...
thats an opinion piece... shows or proves nothing

Mahatma coat

Its a First hand Eye Witness Account of the Damage the Sanctons caused in Iraq.

Was Mr Haliday in a positon to give an informed Opinion???????

robtri

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Was Mr Haliday in a positon to give an informed Opinion???????

imho... NO

he was there looks like less than a Year as a rep for the UN.. which means he was shown all the stuff saddam wanted him to see...

WakeUp

robtri wrote: »

last comment on this as it is a bit OT...
thats an opinion piece... shows or proves nothing

I dont see how it is over the top at all and to be honest Robtri with all due respect I'm going to take Hallidays, Van Sponeck and Unicef's word over yours any day of the week with regard to sanctions-era Iraq.

robtri

WakeUp wrote: »

I dont see how it is over the top at all and to be honest Robtri with all due respect I'm going to take Hallidays, Van Sponeck and Unicef's word over yours any day of the week with regard to sanctions-era Iraq.

i havent given any words or opinions on the sanctions....
i asked for support on how they effected and killed thousands and thousands... and the evidence is an opinion piece

i personally have no idea the effects of the sanctions and am curious to know more..

WakeUp

Have a read of this Robtri if you get a chance will give you an idea of what the sanctions entailed. (link)