EU proposed 70km/h speed limit for N roads

jock101

I heard today on the radio, that the EU wants to impose a 70km/h speed limit on single lane N roads. Are they taking the michael or what?:mad:

jock101

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/eu-wants-to-slash-rural-speed-limit-2376195.html

Anan1

On what radio station and what programme did you hear this? To the best of my knowledge the EU do not set national speed limits.

ronkmonster

Anan1 wrote: »

On what radio station and what programme did you hear this? To the best of my knowledge the EU do not set national speed limits.

I heard it on Newstalk around lunchtime.

Anan1

It says in the article that the European Road Safety Council (ERSC) recommends that the speed limit should not exceed 70kmh on roads without median barrier and 100kmh on roads with median and side barriers?

kasper

a bit about it on breakingnews.ie today

jock101

What side barriers on N roads? I drove from Londonderry to Dublin on the N2 today, I saw no side barriers!

Anan1

jock101 wrote: »

What side barriers on N roads? I drove from Londonderry to Dublin on the N2 today, I saw no side barriers!

Have you read the article that you posted a link to?

Hal1

Typical EU shoving their noses in where it's not wanted. As if things weren't bad enough with talks of tolling roads, now they want us to crawl on them too. :mad:

jaffa20

jock101 wrote: »

I heard today on the radio, that the EU wants to impose a 70km/h speed limit on single lane N roads. Are they taking the michael or what?:mad:

Well most of your previous posts seems to point out that we all drive too fast so i don't see what your problem is here?

lau1247

80 feels like forever already.. at 70 i can just see more people breaking the rules and that means more fines for the gov

jock101

jaffa20 wrote: »

Well most of your previous posts seems to point out that we all drive too fast so i don't see why your problem here?

Please!!!!:rolleyes: Reducing a National roads 100km/h speed limit to 70km/h is just stupid. Which will encourage reckless speeding. Doing 120km/h plus on a national road is too fast not 100km/h.:rolleyes:

Del2005

jock101 wrote: »

Please!!!!:rolleyes: Reducing a National roads 100km/h speed limit to 70km/h is just stupid. Which will encourage reckless speeding.

How will it encourage reckless speeding? Surely all speeding is reckless:D

Doing 120km/h plus on a national road is too fast not 100km/h.:rolleyes:

It all depends on the road. There are some sections of N roads where 80km/h is way to fast and others where 140km/h is reasonably safe.

jock101

Del2005 wrote: »

How will it encourage reckless speeding? Surely all speeding is reckless:D



It all depends on the road. There are some sections of N roads where 80km/h is way to fast and others where 140km/h is reasonably safe.

The real question is will you stick to the 70km/h speed limit if its introduced?:D

jaffa20

jock101 wrote: »

Please!!!!:rolleyes: Reducing a National roads 100km/h speed limit to 70km/h is just stupid. Which will encourage reckless speeding. Doing 120km/h plus on a national road is too fast not 100km/h.:rolleyes:

Certain N roads should be 70km/h. I agree that not all should be but there are some speed limits out there that are just ridiculous.

60km/h on parts of the n11 and then compare that to 80km/h on local roads that a tractor couldn't even fit on!!

Also, 100km/h on the m50 with more proprosed tolling. Once of the safest roads on the country which should be safe to travel at 140km/h at least. But no, the speed cameras will soon prevent that!

Lets just keep those 80km/h speed limits on the bendy country roads instead where most of the accidents occur and let the speed cameras create the revenue on the major safe road networks like the m50.

johnos1984

jock101 wrote: »

The real question is will you stick to the 70km/h speed limit if its introduced?:D

jock101 in his past life wrote:

Just look at the threads on or related to Speeding here, and all you read is peoples contempt for the Laws of this State regarding the safe use of the roads.

jock101

johnos1984 wrote: »

That was in regard to speeding! Not ultra low speed limits on N roads which this thread is about!

Please stick to the topic!:rolleyes:

Del2005

jock101 wrote: »

The real question is will you stick to the 70km/h speed limit if its introduced?:D

Of course I will

johnos1984

So the law doesn't apply to you if you don't agree with the limit? I believe thats very much ON TOPIC

Thats what I'm trying to point out.

Your a mixed bag Jock I'll give you that, unfortunately the rules of the road aren't like a bag of pick and mix.

Just reminding you of your previous stated position BTW

Del2005

jock101 wrote: »

That was in regard to speeding! Not ultra low speed limits on N roads which this thread is about!

Please stick to the topic!:rolleyes:

Speeding is breaking the posted speed limit. It doesn't mater if you think it's too low.

jock101

Del2005 wrote: »

Speeding is breaking the posted speed limit? It doesn't mater if you think it's too low.

I never break speed limits, even if I dont agree with them.

This thread is about the pros or cons of a 70km/h national speed limit!
Which I think is low!

jock101

Del2005 wrote: »

Speeding is breaking the posted speed limit. It doesn't mater if you think it's too low.

I never said or suggested breaking speed limits, I request you edit or remove that accusation you made about me:mad:.

jaffa20

jock101 wrote: »

I never break speed limits, even if I dont agree with them.

This thread is about the pros or cons of a 70km/h national speed limit!
Which I think is low!

And it may be high too high for some places and 100km/h may be low in some places or high in other places etc etc

How about just driving at a safe speed according to the conditions,location etc...?

johnos1984

jock101 wrote: »

I never said or suggested breaking speed limits, I request you edit or remove that accusation you made about me:mad:.

What accusation?

jock101 also said in his past life as a hater of speeding wrote:

The RSA and Gaybo have my full support!

I fail to see why you would question a lower and thus statistically safer speed limit?

Del2005

jock101 wrote: »

I never break speed limits, even if I dont agree with them.

This thread is about the pros or cons of a 70km/h national speed limit!
Which I think is low!

It doesn't mater if you think 70km/h on a N road is too low, if it's posted and you exceed it then you're speeding.

jock101 wrote: »

NO, the motorway speed limits should be reduced to 80km/h, to save fuel and to increase safety for emergency braking and overtaking. 120km/h is to fast for Irish drivers.

You want the Motorways to be dropped to 80km/h but don't want much more dangerous roads at 70km/h


Why do you think it's safe to do 100km/h on an N roads yet dangerous to do 100km/h on a M roads?

jock101 wrote: »

I never said or suggested breaking speed limits, I request you edit or remove that accusation you made about me:mad:.

What accusation did I make?

corktina

what nonsense.Your speed is governed by your assesment of what is safe, so nomatter what the speed limit is, you shouldnt be doing an unsafe speed.The alternative is speed limit signs on every bend and junction, pure lunacy.

Leonard Hofstadter

A lot of roads in this country have too low a speed limit(IMO) and anyway this being Ireland even if they did reduce the speed limits to 70 everyone would just ignore them, I know I certainly would.

It never fails to amaze me the lack of knowledge Treacy Hogan displays on a regular basis on anything speed camera or road safety related.

The speed limits on rural roads are already 80 km/h last time I checked, and to be honest on a lot of these 80 is far too low, some rural roads, especially those that used to be main roads with 100 km/h speed limits, should be increased to 100 as soon as possible.

In relation to the M50 I could not possibly make a case for increasing the limit there to 120, such is the level of gross incompetance displayed by Irish drivers on three lane motorways it would be suicidal to increase the speed limit here until such time as the Irish actually do proper lane discipline. When I asked someone recently who were they overtaking(because they were in the middle lane when the left lane was empty) my response was 'everyone else is in the middle lane, what would I be doing over in the left lane':(!

Atomic Pineapple

Del2005 wrote: »

It doesn't mater if you think 70km/h on a N road is too low, if it's posted and you exceed it then you're speeding.

I disagree, your breaking a speed limit set for that particular road, but whether your actually speeding should be governed by road state, weather conditions, amount of traffic, car and driver ability etc...

Too many people see someone breaking a speed limit as speeding these days which in many cases it shouldn't actually be described as speeding.

I mean for example the road from Slane to Drogheda, is a twisty, bumpy, uneven piece of crap road with no straights and an accident black spot yet its 100 km/h.

Just down the road if you travel from Collon to Drogheda your restricted to 80km/h on a much better road with several straight bits, much more even surface, less bends and less bumps.

I'd consider someone doing 100km/h on the Collon road to be doing a safe speed, yet they can be done for "speeding", while I'd consider someone doing 100km/h on the Slane road as pushing it a bit yet they aren't "speeding".

keithclancy

captainspeed wrote: »

A lot of roads in this country have too low a speed limit(IMO) and anyway this being Ireland even if they did reduce the speed limits to 70 everyone would just ignore them, I know I certainly would.

It never fails to amaze me the lack of knowledge Treacy Hogan displays on a regular basis on anything speed camera or road safety related.

The speed limits on rural roads are already 80 km/h last time I checked, and to be honest on a lot of these 80 is far too low, some rural roads, especially those that used to be main roads with 100 km/h speed limits, should be increased to 100 as soon as possible.

In relation to the M50 I could not possibly make a case for increasing the limit there to 120, such is the level of gross incompetance displayed by Irish drivers on three lane motorways it would be suicidal to increase the speed limit here until such time as the Irish actually do proper lane discipline. When I asked someone recently who were they overtaking(because they were in the middle lane when the left lane was empty) my response was 'everyone else is in the middle lane, what would I be doing over in the left lane':(!

Some of the back roads in Cork with the 80km/h speed limit are death traps. I drive at 50km/hr on them, mainly because theres f* all space for two cars to pass each other.

langdang

They own our asses! They can do what they like!
To be fair - they are only poking their nose in because of our own local councils inability to apply sensible and appropriate speed limits by assessing individual stretches of road - "grass up the middle - hmmm 80kph seems about right? That's us done for the day - Time for a cup of tea and a spot of golf maybe?"

Leonard Hofstadter

keithclancy wrote: »

Some of the back roads in Cork with the 80km/h speed limit are death traps. I drive at 50km/hr on them, mainly because theres f* all space for two cars to pass each other.

Indeed, the road to Bantry when you go the quickest way(turn off before Lissarda and go via Crookstown) is 100 most of the way and to be honest 90 is about the maximum speed you could go and anything over 80 really is not safe.

On the other hand the Galway-Sligo road is seriously narrow and twisty in places; you wouldn't hit 100 in a month of Sundays up by Tubbercurry(and further north) but it has a limit of 100. Yet when you're on the Dual Carriageway just outside Sligo it is still 100 when it is well capable of 120 or more! That really should be reclassified as motorway though.

Similarly the old Cork-Dublin road should of course be 100(instead of 80) and I can't understand why the first bit of the Motorway to Dublin is only 100 instead of 120.

Anan1

It mightn't be a hysterical enough proposition for this thread, but we could keep the 100km/h limits, install central barriers and still satisfy the recommendations of the ERSC.

Del2005

draffodx wrote: »

I disagree, your breaking a speed limit set for that particular road, but whether your actually speeding should be governed by road state, weather conditions, amount of traffic, car and driver ability etc...

My posts are in response to Jock101's idea that reducing the speed limit on N roads to 70km/h is silly. I'm just pointing out that on nearly every other thread on this forum when exceeding the posted limit is discussed it's always black and white to Jock101, while many of us can see the silliness of the posted limit Jock101 can't. Now that it appears that something may actually personally affect Jock101, their point of view has changed considerably.

draffodx wrote: »

Too many people see someone breaking a speed limit as speeding these days which in many cases it shouldn't actually be described as speeding.

I mean for example the road from Slane to Drogheda, is a twisty, bumpy, uneven piece of crap road with no straights and an accident black spot yet its 100 km/h.

Just down the road if you travel from Collon to Drogheda your restricted to 80km/h on a much better road with several straight bits, much more even surface, less bends and less bumps.

I'd consider someone doing 100km/h on the Collon road to be doing a safe speed, yet they can be done for "speeding", while I'd consider someone doing 100km/h on the Slane road as pushing it a bit yet they aren't "speeding".

There is a difference between speeding, which IS exceeding the posted limit, and driving dangerously/without due care, which is driving at a speed not safe for road conditions.

The problem in this country is that Gaybo, the RSA, the Gardaí etc have decided that there are only 2 dangers on our roads which are DUI and exceeding the posted speed limit. You rarely hear of people being done for anything else yet anyone who's driven on the roads knows that lots of things that happen every day are much more dangerous then the latter, like your example above.

keithclancy

Anan1 wrote: »

It mightn't be a hysterical enough proposition for this thread, but we could keep the 100km/h limits, install central barriers and still satisfy the recommendations of the ERSC.

Only a bicycle would fit down alot of them then

They have a central barrier on the Cork - Mallow road, the wire ones that have a tendancy to cut bikers in half

Have a look at some of the vids:
http://www.brifenusa.com/files/brifen_video.html

Tigger

captainspeed wrote: »

Indeed, the road to Bantry when you go the quickest way(turn off before Lissarda and go via Crookstown) is 100 most of the way and to be honest 90 is about the maximum speed you could go and anything over 80 really is not safe.

On the other hand the Galway-Sligo road is seriously narrow and twisty in places; you wouldn't hit 100 in a month of Sundays up by Tubbercurry(and further north) but it has a limit of 100. Yet when you're on the Dual Carriageway just outside Sligo it is still 100 when it is well capable of 120 or more! That really should be reclassified as motorway though.

Similarly the old Cork-Dublin road should of course be 100(instead of 80) and I can't understand why the first bit of the Motorway to Dublin is only 100 instead of 120.

the dual carraigeway was built as a motorway but classified as a n road , donno why
the n 17 from tubbercurry to ballinacarrow is constantly being driven at 100kmph nd i'd question the confidence of any driver that feel thats impossaible

Hal1

Hal1 wrote: »

Typical EU shoving their noses in where it's not wanted. As if things weren't bad enough with talks of tolling roads, now they want us to crawl on them too. :mad:

That's what you get with a Yes vote to Lisbon.

Del2005

Anan1 wrote: »

It mightn't be a hysterical enough proposition for this thread, but we could keep the 100km/h limits, install central barriers and still satisfy the recommendations of the ERSC.

Can you imagine the cost and disruption that this would cause. If they did do this you'd always be stuck behind the 80km/h brigade as there will be no overtaking, till you reach a town and You slow down.

A more sensible approach would be to reduce the limit on the dangerous sections and increase it when back on the safer sections. If they did this then people driving the roads would know they are approaching a more dangerous section and slow down.

If it was properly planned, using crash statistics/road conditions/etc, and communicated people would believe the limits have been lowered for safety rather the revenue reasons and may actually adhere to them! Of course you'll still get muppets, but proper enforcement would hopefully reduce there numbers.

johnos1984

Del2005 wrote: »

My posts are in response to Jock101's idea that reducing the speed limit on N roads to 70km/h is silly. I'm just pointing out that on nearly every other thread on this forum when exceeding the posted limit is discussed it's always black and white to Jock101, while many of us can see the silliness of the posted limit Jock101 can't. Now that it appears that something may actually personally affect Jock101, their point of view has changed considerably.

Couldn't of said it better myself

Anan1

keithclancy wrote: »

Only a bicycle would fit down alot of them then

Might roads that narrow actually be unsuitable for 200km/h closing speeds?;)

Del2005 wrote: »

Can you imagine the cost and disruption that this would cause. If they did do this you'd always be stuck behind the 80km/h brigade as there will be no overtaking, till you reach a town and You slow down.

According to the article jock101 posted, the report also suggests more safe overtaking areas on two-lane roads.

Del2005

Anan1 wrote: »

Might roads that narrow actually be unsuitable for 200km/h closing speeds?;)According to the article jock101 posted, the report also suggests more safe overtaking areas on two-lane roads.

If they put safe overtaking lanes on roads why would we need barriers down the centre?

Most head on crashes are caused by dangerous overtaking, if people know that they only have to stay behind a slow moving vehicle for a few km's then the vast majority of people will wait.

There are serious safety issues with putting wire ropes down the middle of every road in the country for motorbikes and I can't see concrete barriers being used.

Then there are access issues for farmers and residents along these roads, how many km will farmer Joe have to travel to access his field across the road? If they don't have long sections, several km, without breaks they could be more dangerous then not having them at all.

johnos1984

Del2005 wrote: »

Most head on crashes are caused by dangerous overtaking, if people know that they only have to stay behind a slow moving vehicle for a few km's then the vast majority of people will wait.

Have you ever driven on the ones in Cork?

Everyone seems to wait until the last 200m to overtake.

I hated driving on them before the motorway was built as I encountered to many bad head on collisions. Tailgating was also very bad and nobody had patience

Del2005

johnos1984 wrote: »

Have you ever driven on the ones in Cork?

Everyone seems to wait until the last 200m to overtake.

I hated driving on them before the motorway was built as I encountered to many bad head on collisions. Tailgating was also very bad and nobody had patience

No don't do Cork:D

I've driven on 2 lane roads with overtaking lanes in the US and they worked fine. As you near the end of the 2 lane section there's a sign saying next over taking lane in X miles.

It would take a while for people to get used to them and if they knew that there will be another one in 2 or 3 km it may change peoples mindset. But I'd rather this then cheese graters down the middle of all our roads.

Leonard Hofstadter

The 2+1s have been shown to be more dangerous on Irish roads than regular single carriageway because of the fact that everyone tries overtaking on the 2 lane stretch and won't pull in right until the very last second.

People are less prone to overtaking on single carriageway roads which is why they are considered to be safer and you won't 'run out of road' when overtaking someone either on a wide single carriageway, unlike in a 2+1 where it switches every 2 km from 1 lane to 2 lanes and vice versa.

ardmacha

The 2+1s have been shown to be more dangerous on Irish roads than regular single carriageway because of the fact that everyone tries overtaking on the 2 lane stretch and won't pull in right until the very last second.

This "problem" can be easily addressed. Simply position a camera there and ticket everyone that drives on the hatched lines at the end until people get the message.

D_murph

lau1247 wrote: »

80 feels like forever already.. at 70 i can just see more people breaking the rules and that means more fines for the gov

Thats exactly what I was thinking myself too and they do need the money now also :rolleyes:.

opinion guy

jock101 wrote: »

The real question is will you stick to the 70km/h speed limit if its introduced?:D

The only people who will obey it are the hazardous people who already drive 70km/h on those roads.

opinion guy

Del2005 wrote: »

if people know that they only have to stay behind a slow moving vehicle for a few km's then the vast majority of people will wait.

Oh haven't you figured this out yet ? I've observed over the years that when on a national road you come up behind someone doing20kph slower than the legal limit - don't bother passing them out because they are always ALWAYS local drivers who will pull off onto an R road within 5 to 10 minutes. I came up with this theory about ten years ago and in all that time I ahve only once found this not to happen and the rolling hazard numpty stay on the national route. I believe they behave this way because they do not get enough driving experience to drive at safe speeds i.e speeds within 10kph of the limit

Try it out. Next time you come behind someone - don't pass them. stay behind them until they pull off. Guaranteed its sooner than you think:D

challengemaster

I'd agree there's a lack all over the place of slow/overtaking lanes. After doing a 1200km drive around Ireland, and seeing how well implemented they are up north... then crossing the border and you could easily see that overtaking became a greater risk.

Anan1

opinion guy wrote: »

Oh haven't you figured this out yet ? I've observed over the years that when on a national road you come up behind someone doing20kph slower than the legal limit - don't bother passing them out because they are always ALWAYS local drivers who will pull off onto an R road within 5 to 10 minutes. I came up with this theory about ten years ago and in all that time I ahve only once found this not to happen and the rolling hazard numpty stay on the national route. I believe they behave this way because they do not get enough driving experience to drive at safe speeds i.e speeds within 10kph of the limit

Try it out. Next time you come behind someone - don't pass them. stay behind them until they pull off. Guaranteed its sooner than you think:D

10 minutes is a long time to be part of a rolling roadblock, i'd pass if it's safe to do so.

Of inappropriate speed limits, this is my favourite:

http://maps.google.ie/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.776882,-10.048327&spn=0.011431,0.025599&z=16&layer=c&cbll=51.777062,-10.048481&panoid=xtoMJ8VGtFoYFRTKOOAs3w&cbp=12,346.01,,0,-8.43

opinion guy

Anan1 wrote: »

10 minutes is a long time to be part of a rolling roadblock, i'd pass if it's safe to do so.

Lol - I hear ya. But test out the theory for me would ya ?????