Londonderry car bomb

Your Airbag

This in conjunction with the car bomb outside the police station two months ago would indicate the RIRA or CIRA have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now.

Can we expect this to be the start of a return to dark days of Northern Irelands past or simply a group wanting to remind us all that they are still operational?


http://www.londonderrysentinel.co.uk/news/Londonderry-pipe-bombing-a-39return.6301834.jp

FlutterinBantam

Your Airbag wrote: »

This in conjunction with the car bomb outside the police station two months ago would indicate the RIRA or CIRA have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now.

Can we expect this to be the start of a return to dark days of Northern Irelands past or simply a group wanting to remind us all that they are still operational?


http://www.londonderrysentinel.co.uk/news/Londonderry-pipe-bombing-a-39return.6301834.jp

We could be on the long road indeed friend.

As long as there are apologists ,not for this deed, but for the men of violence and the dark forces who lurk between and around criminality and terrorism, not for the gain of the nation,but for themselves and their cohorts to move under the cloak of freedom fighters when in reality they are worse than common criminals.

We saw them gun down Jerry, and we won't be coerced or intimidated by thugs who fail to recognise the will of the nation.

They will have their defenders and fellow travellers and idealists,both covertly and in the open, but rest assured the nation will find them and put their evil deeds under lock and key.

They won't succeed.

OhNoYouDidn't

Your Airbag wrote: »

This in conjunction with the car bomb outside the police station two months ago would indicate the RIRA or CIRA have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now.

Can we expect this to be the start of a return to dark days of Northern Irelands past or simply a group wanting to remind us all that they are still operational?


http://www.londonderrysentinel.co.uk/news/Londonderry-pipe-bombing-a-39return.6301834.jp

Such a lot wrong with such a short post.

Lononderry? Really?

RIRA and CIRA "have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now. ". Dear oh dear. If thats your understanding of the situation, you are a long way short of basic.

KeithAFC

They won't win. Londonderry won't let them.

Einhard

Your Airbag wrote: »

This in conjunction with the car bomb outside the police station two months ago would indicate the RIRA or CIRA have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now.

Eh they never signed up to it in the first place. It's the very point of their existence.

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Such a lot wrong with such a short post.

Lononderry? Really?

Yes, really. There's nothing wrong with him (or her) referring to it as such. Not everyone should have to share your sensibilities.

Mr.Micro

The Real Ira have claimed responsibility according to RTE news.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1005/derry.html

Contemptible scumbags who take it upon themselves to destroy what the vast majority of normal people Protestant and Catholic in the north and here in the south want is decent life. Bored were they......? I hope the authorities catch them quickly so that normal life can continue on this Island.

PeterIanStaker

Great. More guys blowing sh*t up. The anti GFA people in the media are secretly loving it though.

Wolfe Tone

Your Airbag wrote: »

This in conjunction with the car bomb outside the police station two months ago would indicate the RIRA or CIRA have decided to abandon the Good Friday agreement for now.

Lol! They never signed up to it ffs.


All this means is that their capabilities(still extremely limited) are growing.

Wolfe Tone

Anyway, I would say that this attack shows a willingness of the dissidents to actually back up their words with actions. We all remember a few weeks ago when they said they would target banks? Well now they have.

Seems to be a clear attempt to gather support from the growing number of disillusioned socialist republicans. And it can easily be seen that many members of the public would either support an attack on the banks, or at least not shed any tears over a banks destruction.

Clearly the dissidents in question did not intend to kill anyone, ample warning was given, everyone was evacuated. This lends further weight to my theory that the dissidents have absolutely no aim under any circumstances to either harm or kill innocent civilians. Seemingly the dissidents have embarked on a campaign to gather public support. This attack coupled with the increase in "policing" and the dealing with of drug dealers clearly illustrates that.

oscarBravo

I'm closing this thread for now. I'll probably delete some of the stupider posts, which will probably leave the thread about a quarter of its current length.

In the meantime, everyone would do me a favour by (a) not pretending to be so ignorant as not to know what another poster means by the word "Londonderry", and (b) not getting their knickers in a twist over the fact that some people actually use a different name for a town than they themselves do.

Some terrorists just detonated a bomb that could have killed innocent people, and that has damaged business premises and will quite possibly cost people their livelihoods. In that context, arguing over the name of the town is - to be charitable about it - pretty silly.

oscarBravo

Re-opening this now. The topic of the thread is a terrorist bombing in a city in Northern Ireland. Off-topic bickering and thread derailing will not be tolerated.

southsiderosie

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Anyway, I would say that this attack shows a willingness of the dissidents to actually back up their words with actions. We all remember a few weeks ago when they said they would target banks? Well now they have.

Seems to be a clear attempt to gather support from the growing number of disillusioned socialist republicans. And it can easily be seen that many members of the public would either support an attack on the banks, or at least not shed any tears over a banks destruction.

Clearly the dissidents in question did not intend to kill anyone, ample warning was given, everyone was evacuated. This lends further weight to my theory that the dissidents have absolutely no aim under any circumstances to either harm or kill innocent civilians. Seemingly the dissidents have embarked on a campaign to gather public support. This attack coupled with the increase in "policing" and the dealing with of drug dealers clearly illustrates that.

Given the long history of disastrous "warnings" before car bombs, I don't think the fact that there was a warning call in any way mitigates the fact that any time a large bomb goes off, there is a strong likelihood that people will get hurt. And this particular bomb apparently went off near a nursing home - the residents weren't exactly going to be sprinting down the stairs to safety. Not to mention the fact that if 'socialist republicans' care about workers, why are they blowing up people's workspaces? The last bomb that went off in Derry destroyed an immigrant man's kebab stand - wtf did he have to do with anything?

Also, I notice that you say they don't want to harm "innocent civilians". Is that to say that this action would be acceptable if members of state security forces had been killed or injured?

If the bank had blown up because of a gas leak or had been hit by lightning, perhaps there would have been some public schadenfreude - if nobody got hurt. But attacking banks is an obvious ploy for sympathy by dissidents, and it has a very limited audience. More broadly, why would anyone want to support a group that is so actively acting against the democratically expressed interests of the republican community - on both sides of the border - that it claims to represent?

There is no way on God's green earth that this bombing can be justified.

Bottle_of_Smoke

Any carbomb is incredibly risky. Omagh killed off anti-gfa millitant republicanism for a long time. I don't trust the British security agencies enough to be sure they wouldn't sacrifice civilians to kill it off for another few years.

After the GFA militant attacks are pointless. You just have to watch an episode of 24 to see the technology republicans would have to take on. Then there's informants. To be honest wouldnt be surprised if this was allowed to happen as MI5 want to keep their budgets.

And all that is on top of moral and democratic arguments against them. Just ridiculous.

Jaap

I sometimes think TV stations by sending reporters up to bomb scenes (such as in Londonderry yesterday)...and going into great detail and having analysis from security experts...it is sort of giving these dimwits who claim to love Ireland and continue to bomb it publicity.
Yes...make people aware of the security situation...but giving dissidents probably a third of all news airtime...it is playing in to their hands!

karma_

Yes, this bombing is disgraceful. I mentioned on the other thread that Derry has enough issues without this, unemployment levels are sky high, Derry and the whole Northwest has been ignored financially for the last 30+ years, and we have people who don't even live in the damn city (probably never even been to it) and they tell us what we should call our city, and now dissidents start detonating bombs.

Police Chief Wiggum

MUSSOLINI wrote: »

Anyway, I would say that this attack shows a willingness of the dissidents to actually back up their words with actions. We all remember a few weeks ago when they said they would target banks? Well now they have.

Seems to be a clear attempt to gather support from the growing number of disillusioned socialist republicans. And it can easily be seen that many members of the public would either support an attack on the banks, or at least not shed any tears over a banks destruction.

Clearly the dissidents in question did not intend to kill anyone, ample warning was given, everyone was evacuated. This lends further weight to my theory that the dissidents have absolutely no aim under any circumstances to either harm or kill innocent civilians. Seemingly the dissidents have embarked on a campaign to gather public support. This attack coupled with the increase in "policing" and the dealing with of drug dealers clearly illustrates that.

what about the psychological harm to ordinary people worried about the next bomb, worried about will these small numbers of people follow 'best practice' and work with the psni to clear areas, I know some children in Sligo who are not visiting their very lonely granny at her nursing home in the north because the two parents do not want to 'hope for the best' in the relationship between children trying to live their lives and the unsupported actions of a fragment of Ireland's many and varied peoples

OhNoYouDidn't

karma_ wrote: »

Yes, this bombing is disgraceful. I mentioned on the other thread that Derry has enough issues without this, unemployment levels are sky high, Derry and the whole Northwest has been ignored financially for the last 30+ years, and we have people who don't even live in the damn city (probably never even been to it) and they tell us what we should call our city, and now dissidents start detonating bombs.

Lets be clear, I don't especially give a damn what people call the place, my point was that the OP was riddled with ignorance and going to cause a flame war.

I have been to Derry on numerous occasion.

But here we are with the usual trite soundbites about 'scum' etc and no attempt to even analyse why the Cokes are up to what they are up to. One poster suggested boredom ffs. "Look at 24 to see what they are up against"? Give me strength.

Being a Derry native, what level of local support is there, if any?

OhNoYouDidn't

Police Chief Wiggum wrote: »

what about the psychological harm to ordinary people worried about the next bomb, worried about will these small numbers of people follow 'best practice' and work with the psni to clear areas, I know some children in Sligo who are not visiting their very lonely granny at her nursing home in the north because the two parents do not want to 'hope for the best' in the relationship between children trying to live their lives and the unsupported actions of a fragment of Ireland's many and varied peoples

Then the family are idiots. Simple as that.

Iwasfrozen

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Then the family are idiots. Simple as that.

Aren't you a plesent fellow?

karma_

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Aren't you a plesent fellow?

Anyone seriously suggesting that it is correct to stop coming across the border to see family, especially elderly family need to seriously reassess that decision because it is simply wrong on a lot of levels. Even at the height of the troubles the same would have applied.

As regards to support in Derry for the dissidents, there is hardly none. Like any other place Derry has its share of idiots, thankfully they are in a tiny, tiny minority.

OhNoYouDidn't

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Aren't you a plesent fellow?

Yes, I am.

But if people are not willing to visit family in Derry because of these bombs that are clearly not designed to kill visitors to the town strikes me as idiotic and risk averse to the point of insanity.

Even in the 70's that decision would have been bone headed.

Bottle_of_Smoke

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

"Look at 24 to see what they are up against"? Give me strength.

LOL. Was out on the piss last night and went on boards when I came in. No more drunk posting on the politics forum I promise.

Pace2008

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But if people are not willing to visit family in Derry because of these bombs that are clearly not designed to kill visitors to the town strikes me as idiotic and risk averse to the point of insanity.

Good to see the eminent scientists of the IRA have devised a type of explosive, hitherto seen as the most indiscriminate form of weaponry, that injures only their targets whilst leaving civilians unscathed.

Mr.Micro

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Yes, I am.

But if people are not willing to visit family in Derry because of these bombs that are clearly not designed to kill visitors to the town strikes me as idiotic and risk averse to the point of insanity.

Even in the 70's that decision would have been bone headed.

I love this bit in your post

these bombs that are clearly not designed to kill visitors to the town

you mean presumably designed not to kill visitors ?
the next bit clearly sums up what you posted

strikes me as idiotic

..... that's the only bit of your post that makes sense.

OhNoYouDidn't

Pace2008 wrote: »

Good to see the eminent scientists of the IRA have devised a type of explosive, hitherto seen as the most indiscriminate form of weaponry, that injures only their targets whilst leaving civilians unscathed.

Of course not, and while not belittling the threat the dissidents pose, or at least are trying to pose, you are still statistically more likely to killed in a train crash or by a loose roof slate than by a bomb.

OhNoYouDidn't

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I love this bit in your post you mean presumably designed not to kill visitors ?
the next bit clearly sums up what you posted ..... that's the only bit of your post that makes sense.

If the RIRA wanted to kill random people, they would do so by planing no warning bombs in crowded areas. But they don't. Bad and all as they are, the object of the excercise isn't mass indiscriminate killings. Every bomb is phoned in, the targets are generally obvious.

Now I am not saying its not a bloody dangerous game, but its not so dangerous that people can't visit Derry to see family.

Pace2008

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

If the RIRA wanted to kill random people, they would do so by planing no warning bombs in crowded areas. But they don't. Bad and all as they are, the object of the excercise isn't mass indiscriminate killings. Every bomb is phoned in, the targets are generally obvious.

Now I am not saying its not a bloody dangerous game, but its not so dangerous that people can't visit Derry to see family.

I'm aware of this (or that one's very unlikely to be killed by a bomb, at least) but that is not how many people think, and what matters is the public's' perception of the situation.

The reality is that if this turns out to be anything more than a one-off occurrence, Northern Ireland is going to be a very unattractive destination in the future.

Denerick

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But here we are with the usual trite soundbites about 'scum' etc and no attempt to even analyse why the Cokes are up to what they are up to. One poster suggested boredom ffs. "Look at 24 to see what they are up against"? Give me strength.

By all means, place them in their proper context. Perhaps they were taken away from the mother's tit a bit early? Perhaps they didn't get enough attention in school? Perhaps their father shouted at them when they were crap at football? Or maybe some people are simply scum.

Being a Derry native, what level of local support is there, if any?

I can think of one.

Mr.Micro

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

If the RIRA wanted to kill random people, they would do so by planing no warning bombs in crowded areas. But they don't. Bad and all as they are, the object of the excercise isn't mass indiscriminate killings. Every bomb is phoned in, the targets are generally obvious.

Now I am not saying its not a bloody dangerous game, but its not so dangerous that people can't visit Derry to see family.

I am sorry but your post is absolute nonsense. People cannot be blamed for not visiting relatives if there is a prospect of car bombs etc. Why would any parent risk their children?

The IRA/RIRA never worried about who they killed discriminate or indiscriminate. Enniskillen remember that, ordinary people out shopping children women and men. There is no justification for bombs of any sort at any time no matter what you say .....not now, not then, not ever.

OhNoYouDidn't

Denerick wrote: »

By all means, place them in their proper context. Perhaps they were taken away from the mother's tit a bit early? Perhaps they didn't get enough attention in school? Perhaps their father shouted at them when they were crap at football? Or maybe some people are simply scum.

Thank you for your deep and well forumlated insight into the psychology of people you have never met, but you do know calling people 'scum' is a potential red card offence now? Check your stickies on the top ot he page.

Denerick wrote: »

I can think of one.

Who?

OhNoYouDidn't

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I am sorry but your post is absolute nonsense. People cannot be blamed for not visiting relatives if there is a prospect of car bombs etc. Why would any parent risk their children?

The IRA/RIRA never worried about who they killed discriminate or indiscriminate. Enniskillen remember that, ordinary people out shopping children women and men. There is no justification for bombs of any sort at any time no matter what you say .....not now, not then, not ever.

I'm not justifying a damn thing. I'm saying that refusal to visit family in the 6 because of this threat is irrational and lets them win.

You are more likely to be killed by a dog, choke on a peanut or on a rollercoaster than be killed by a bomb.

FlutterinBantam

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Yes, I am.

But if people are not willing to visit family in Derry because of these bombs that are clearly not designed to kill visitors to the town strikes me as idiotic and risk averse to the point of insanity.

Even in the 70's that decision would have been bone headed.

Forgive me for being incensed here.

So now we have bombs which can distinguish between tourists and locals.??

I think that point of view is asinine in the extreme.

RDM_83 again

Denerick wrote: »

By all means, place them in their proper context. Perhaps they were taken away from the mother's tit a bit early? Perhaps they didn't get enough attention in school? Perhaps their father shouted at them when they were crap at football? Or maybe some people are simply scum.
.

Thats some great analysis there, since they give warnings presumably though they are actually less "scum" than the pipe-bombers in the ROI that don't*

[QUOTE=Denerick;I can think of one[/QUOTE]. ????????????

On a serious note though this is a bad turn for the north as the dissidents have become more active, at least they have learned the lesson from the Omagh atrocity and appear to be making a serious effort at making sure there warnings get through (3 separate calls an hour ahead).

I am curious to know though if there was a reason for targeting a G.O'doherty business.

I remember reading about a study which showed that travellers were more likely to take out terrorism insurance if offered to them than a general policy that covered more stuff including terrorism.

On another note every time I see Easty (Colm Eastwood) being interviewed it makes me cringe and thank god being registered down south I no longer have to vote for a party that thinks making him mayor is the way to rejuvenate themselves


* I'm not saying they aren't, there less publicized actions like this are what shows it though.
http://www.u.tv/News/Bradley-attacked-in-Derry-bar/a9a1f94b-693e-49c7-890d-f6d2947e285f

ps The OP was clearly trying to flame in thread title L/Derry (even Ulster Bus call route the maiden city flyer)

RDM_83 again

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Forgive me for being incensed here.

So now we have bombs which can distinguish between tourists and locals.??

I think that point of view is asinine in the extreme.

Do you also not go to Limerick or Dublin because of there pipe bombings. How many people have been killed by bombs in the last 10 years? I think you'l find its zero.
I'd also be curious of how many countries are deemed safe enough for you to travel too (or maybe its only explosives than can harm you so the states with its massive gun crime is ok)

OhNoYouDidn't

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Forgive me for being incensed here.

So now we have bombs which can distinguish between tourists and locals.??

I think that point of view is asinine in the extreme.

Sigh. We are into set piece words in mouth mode again.

I am simply saying that any rational risk assesment of the danger to your family should not include avoiding the 6 counties full stop. You are more likely to fall off a horse and be klled / injured.

There are more pipe bombings in gangland Dublin and Limerick than attacks in the 6.

It is 12 years since the last fatal bombing in Ireland and even that wasn't intented to kill civilians (not that it matters much) and to the best of my knowledge no civilian has been seriously injured in a bombing since either. And that was the first fatal bombing since the Shankill Road attack in 1993. Thats 18 years.

The intent of these attacks is not to kill civilians. Thats not to excuse, condone or in any way talk down the danger, but can we cut the hyperbole before you hand the Cokes the credibility as hard men they crave?

Denerick

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Thank you for your deep and well forumlated insight into the psychology of people you have never met, but you do know calling people 'scum' is a potential red card offence now? Check your stickies on the top ot he page.

I didn't but I do now. Its unfortunate because I know fine well the calibre of person involved in dissident activity, and I cannot think of any other word to properly convey their intellectual and emotional vacuousness. You seem intent on making excuses for these extremists. Tell me, do you adopt such a line when in the near vicinity of a relative of someone who died in Omagh in 1998? Or are pithy justifications and 'rationalisations' irrelevant when actually talking face to face to someone who lost someone they loved as a result of insane violence and carnage? When will the likes of you accept that these people are completely unjustifiable and incapable of rationalisation?

Who?

There is this fellow who drinks in our local, always screaming 'ra songs and dreaming of a united Ireland. He seems to symbolise the intellectual vitality of dissident republicanism.

Denerick

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

The intent of these attacks is not to kill civilians. Thats not to excuse, condone or in any way talk down the danger, but can we cut the hyperbole before you hand the Cokes the credibility as hard men they crave?

Damn. I forgot that a policeman isn't a person and therefore deserves death.

KeithAFC

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Sigh. We are into set piece words in mouth mode again.

I am simply saying that any rational risk assesment of the danger to your family should not include avoiding the 6 counties full stop. You are more likely to fall off a horse and be klled / injured.

There are more pipe bombings in gangland Dublin and Limerick than attacks in the 6.

It is 12 years since the last fatal bombing in Ireland and even that wasn't intented to kill civilians (not that it matters much) and to the best of my knowledge no civilian has been seriously injured in a bombing since either. And that was the first fatal bombing since the Shankill Road attack in 1993. Thats 18 years.

The intent of these attacks is not to kill civilians. Thats not to excuse, condone or in any way talk down the danger, but can we cut the hyperbole before you hand the Cokes the credibility as hard men they crave?

I absolutely cringe when people say 'it wasn't meant to kill anyone'. F*ck sake, its a bloody bomb. What do people expect when a bomb goes off when not everyone knows there is a bomb planted?

People SHOULD NOT be planting bombs at all. That is the bottom line of it. This petty thing of 'well it wasn't meant to kill'. As far as im concerned, every bomb planted is intended to create havoc and destroy anything, even human beings.

Bottle_of_Smoke

http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Shock-as-dissident-support-revealed.6567211.jp

Published Date: 06 October 2010
ALARMING new figures show that 14 per cent of nationalists sympathise with dissident republican terrorists.
The disturbing findings come amid fears of an escalation in dissident attacks following the overnight car bomb which wrecked buildings near the centre of Londonderry early yesterday.

According to research to be unveiled by Professor Jon Tonge of Liverpool University at a conference at Queen's University tomorrow, 14 per cent of those identifying as nationalists in a survey have "sympathy for the reasons why some republican groups (such as the Real and Continuity IRAs) continue to use violence".

The findings are clearly at odds with the views of Londonderry's police commander Stephen Martin who yesterday said the terrorists "had no support" or "legitimacy".

Warning this is a strongly unionist paper. Possible the question was put to people in a dishonest way. Prob more to follow when the study is published

karma_

Denerick wrote: »

I didn't but I do now. Its unfortunate because I know fine well the calibre of person involved in dissident activity, and I cannot think of any other word to properly convey their intellectual and emotional vacuousness. You seem intent on making excuses for these extremists. Tell me, do you adopt such a line when in the near vicinity of a relative of someone who died in Omagh in 1998? Or are pithy justifications and 'rationalisations' irrelevant when actually talking face to face to someone who lost someone they loved as a result of insane violence and carnage? When will the likes of you accept that these people are completely unjustifiable and incapable of rationalisation?



There is this fellow who drinks in our local, always screaming 'ra songs and dreaming of a united Ireland. He seems to symbolise the intellectual vitality of dissident republicanism.

He seems?

Is he from Derry and does he support the dissidents?

OhNoYouDidn't

Denerick wrote: »

Damn. I forgot that a policeman isn't a person and therefore deserves death.

Don't be trite. He isn't a civilian.

Police Chief Wiggum

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Of course not, and while not belittling the threat the dissidents pose, or at least are trying to pose, you are still statistically more likely to killed in a train crash or by a loose roof slate than by a bomb.

so 200 pound bombs that will lead to the demolition of a few buildings in derry are just a feature of modern life in a typical european country?:rolleyes: Martin Mcguinness called the dissadents 'conflict junkies' yesterday , does he see them as a dimension to life similar to heroin junkies in dublin, persistent, low level, unwanted, hard to eliminate, once helpful, helpful no more?

OhNoYouDidn't

KeithAFC wrote: »

I absolutely cringe when people say 'it wasn't meant to kill anyone'. F*ck sake, its a bloody bomb. What do people expect when a bomb goes off when not everyone knows there is a bomb planted?

People SHOULD NOT be planting bombs at all. That is the bottom line of it. This petty thing of 'well it wasn't meant to kill'. As far as im concerned, every bomb planted is intended to create havoc and destroy anything, even human beings.

Agreed. But there is a distinction to be made with a bomb that is planted without warning to kill as many civilains as possible and one that isn't.

Einhard

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But here we are with the usual trite soundbites about 'scum' etc and no attempt to even analyse why the Cokes are up to what they are up to.

Labelling those who detonate car bombs in built up areas as scum is a "trite soundbite"? seems a perfectly apt description to me. One can analyse their motives all day, and even put them in some form of context, but at the end of the day, they are risking the lives of innocent civilians. Indeed, they have a track record in targetting innocent civilians. Doing something for a cause other than personal gain can't be used to legitimise such actions.

karma_

Einhard wrote: »

Labelling those who detonate car bombs in built up areas as scum is a "trite soundbite"? seems a perfectly apt description to me. One can analyse their motives all day, and even put them in some form of context, but at the end of the day, they are risking the lives of innocent civilians. Indeed, they have a track record in targetting innocent civilians. Doing something for a cause other than personal gain can't be used to legitimise such actions.

They may be as you say, but it's also against the rules in this forum to do so.

Police Chief Wiggum

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Don't be trite. He isn't a civilian.

Garda Paul Moran, whose dad used to be the commisioner of the Gardai, is the first garda who is allowed carry a hand gun and he works throughout the 32 counties as part of the new northern ireland,

would he be a legitimate target to be murderered by dissadents?

OhNoYouDidn't

Denerick wrote: »

I didn't but I do now. Its unfortunate because I know fine well the calibre of person involved in dissident activity, and I cannot think of any other word to properly convey their intellectual and emotional vacuousness.

But the point is you don't. You have never met one, you cannot read interviews with them. Calling them 'scum' and making no deeper effort to analyse why the conflict is ongoing is a cop out.

Denerick wrote: »

You seem intent on making excuses for these extremists.

Ding ding, round 2. Here we go again, can you find me one of these excuses please?

Denerick wrote: »

Tell me, do you adopt such a line when in the near vicinity of a relative of someone who died in Omagh in 1998? Or are pithy justifications and 'rationalisations' irrelevant when actually talking face to face to someone who lost someone they loved as a result of insane violence and carnage? When will the likes of you accept that these people are completely unjustifiable and incapable of rationalisation?

Again, find me a 'justification'. Otherwise you are simply a zealot labelling anyone who isn't as vitriolic in their condemnation as you as a supporter. I have said NOTHING that could be construed as supporting the dissidents, the opposite in fact and quite frankly the mods should have dealt with you on this by now.

Denerick wrote: »

There is this fellow who drinks in our local, always screaming 'ra songs and dreaming of a united Ireland. He seems to symbolise the intellectual vitality of dissident republicanism.

My hole there is.

OhNoYouDidn't

Police Chief Wiggum wrote: »

Garda Paul Moran, whose dad used to be the commisioner of the Gardai, is the first garda who is allowed carry a hand gun and he works throughout the 32 counties as part of the new northern ireland,

would he be a legitimate target to be murderered by dissadents?

Of course not, what a bizarre question.

But he would not be classed as a civilian if he was.

karma_

Police Chief Wiggum wrote: »

Garda Paul Moran, whose dad used to be the commisioner of the Gardai, is the first garda who is allowed carry a hand gun and he works throughout the 32 counties as part of the new northern ireland,

would he be a legitimate target to be murderered by dissadents?

This is getting way out of hand. OhNoYouDidn't only raised the issue as you implied in your post that in teh current situation, people would not come across the border to visit their grandmother.

Now he is being portrayed as some kind of fringe dissident supporter, all he was trying to do was make a point at how utterly ridiculous your suggestion was, which it is.

OhNoYouDidn't

Einhard wrote: »

Labelling those who detonate car bombs in built up areas as scum is a "trite soundbite"? seems a perfectly apt description to me. One can analyse their motives all day, and even put them in some form of context, but at the end of the day, they are risking the lives of innocent civilians. Indeed, they have a track record in targetting innocent civilians. Doing something for a cause other than personal gain can't be used to legitimise such actions.

I haven't seen anyone try and legitimise them on here.

But the idea that they are doing this out of boredom as put forward by some posters is the same analysis a cabbage could give and will get us nowhere.

Einhard

karma_ wrote: »

They may be as you say, but it's also against the rules in this forum to do so.

Well then the rules ought to be changed. "Scum" may be an over used term, but it's still an adjective that has its uses in certain contexts. What other words are we censoring as a matter of interest?