Contador Suspended

The Crunch

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/5836/Alberto-Contador-positive-for-clenbuterol-at-Tour-de-France-team-claiming-food-contamination.aspx

Esroh

Interesting as under EU veterinary regulations its banned from use in the production of beef.

It is used on Competition Horses for respiratory diseases. But I doubt he was having Horse Steak:D and would be banned in horses destined for Human Consumption.

'Traceability' should be easy as its one of the things that the EU has been Spending millions on for years even if it was fine Argentine/Brazillian beef

IM0

interesting given the last RS guy to get caught with this got a 2 year ban, athletes are responsible for what goes in their mouth so its back to can the organisation let another star rider choke, or will they save his bacon instead

c montgomery

Andy Schleck is 15/8 to win next years tour on paddy powers. If your of the opinion that contador will be banned and you have some spare cash this could be easy money:D

Dinging

According to Euronews Contador is attributing the failed test down to a suspect "steak".

kenmc

oh no I hope they don't have to strip his title, cos then schleck will be the new champ. boring.

Lumen

Neigh, neigh and thrice neigh!



On a more serious note, it's almost October now. Moaning from ignorance here, but surely it's technically possible to turn around these tests within a day or two? House would have it done in a jiffy.

uberwolf

Dinging wrote: »

According to Euronews Contador is attributing the failed test down to a suspect "steak".

at least this explains why Roche sticks to pasta during grand tours

aidandoyle

Quote from BBC
"The UCI followed Contador's statement with its own, confirming that the rider had been "formally and provisionally suspended as is prescribed by the World Anti-Doping Code" after both his A and B urine samples tested positive in a laboratory in Cologne, Germany.
However, the UCI said the concentration found by the laboratory was estimated at 50 picograms - 400 times less than anti-doping laboratories accredited by the World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada) must be able to detect."


Makes strange reading, I would have thought that what is important is where the values are with regards to the actual enforceable positive / negative threshold not where the value is with regards to the level that the lab must be able to detect. I wonder why the last sentance is even in the report - possible defence regarding minimal detectable levels etc.. being prepared?

Brian?

aidandoyle wrote: »

Quote from BBC
"The UCI followed Contador's statement with its own, confirming that the rider had been "formally and provisionally suspended as is prescribed by the World Anti-Doping Code" after both his A and B urine samples tested positive in a laboratory in Cologne, Germany.
However, the UCI said the concentration found by the laboratory was estimated at 50 picograms - 400 times less than anti-doping laboratories accredited by the World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada) must be able to detect."


Makes strange reading, I would have thought that what is important is where the values are with regards to the actual enforceable positive / negative threshold not where the value is with regards to the level that the lab must be able to detect. I wonder why the last sentance is even in the report - possible defence regarding minimal detectable levels etc.. being prepared?

What I find very strange is that he tested positive for a stimulant on a rest day.

Was he wearing yellow at the time? If so he would have been tested the day before and after, the days he would have actually gotten some benefit from a stimulant. This is something going on here that isn't being said.

Could it be such a small amount that he is actually innocent???

amacachi

I'm shocked.

TheBlaaMan

Here

"Without knowing what the level [of clenbuterol] in his sample is, it's impossible to say," Catlin said. His laboratory works with supplement makers to detect drug contaminants, and Catlin said that clenbuterol is one of the more common contaminats found in supplements."

"However, the UCI's statement issued early Thursday, which made public the level of the drug (50 picograms/millilitre, or 400x less than the required limit of detection) indicates that the contaminated supplement defense may have some weight to it."

Diarmuid

It's a stimulant which promotes muscle growth and fat loss.
It's also only detectable for 4 days in your body. (Source 2)

Doesn't look good for Contador.

Very strange how the UCI felt they needed to clarify how "little" clenbuterol was in his body. Fuyu Li didn't get the same treatment and he had 50-100pg/ml

Sound familiar? :

Fuyu Li - Response to Positive Test
Food Contamination of Clenbuterol may have sidelined the popular Chinese Champion - Expert backs claim of innocence...

Fuyu Li claims innocence, expert says contamination likely
Fuyu Li, the Chinese rider of team RadioShack, who was tested positive at Dwars door Vlaanderen (23rd of March), claims he did not knowingly take any banned substance. Li was tested positive for Clenbuterol.

The value that was found in Li’s sample, is extremely low. Ten to twenty times lower then a WADA/UCI laboratory must be able to detect, according to anti-doping expert Douwe de Boer:

“Laboratories must be able to find 1.00 ng/mL, while a normal threshold value is considered to be 2.00 ng/mL. The value of 0.05-0.10 ng/mL that was found in Fuyu Li’s body points clearly in the direction of a contamination. On top of that, such a low dose would not help his performance in any way.”

Fuyu Li got 2 years
.

Jawgap

Explains why he was able to horse it up the mountains......






........I'll get me coat

Lumen

TheBlaaMan wrote: »

"However, the UCI's statement issued early Thursday, which made public the level of the drug (50 picograms/millilitre, or 400x less than the required limit of detection)

That's the gas chromatograph Lance bought for the UCI.

It has a sensitivity dial that goes all the way up to "Contador".

Dave11

Can't believe this news! Is it ever going to stop. Going to be very interesting to see what they do to him....

RichTea

Diarmuid wrote: »

It's a stimulant which promotes muscle growth and fat loss.
It's also only detectable for 4 days in your body. (Source 2)

Doesn't look good for Contador.

Very strange how the UCI felt they needed to clarify how "little" clenbuterol was in his body. Fuyu Li didn't get the same treatment and he had 50-100pg/ml

Sound familiar? :


Fuyu Li got 2 years
.

Thanks for that. Was wondering if Fuyu Li had a similar amount in his system. Well, the precedent is there so. It's going to be an interesting couple of weeks.

MrCreosote

Oh dear.

Rookie mistake from Alberto! You've just got to make sure your tranfusion blood is clean BEFORE you pump it in! I'd recommend a diary in future- then you can remember what you were juicing on when it was drawn off.

Tsk tsk!

Fender76

Bjarne Riis must be kicking himself....!

ednwireland

amacachi wrote: »

I'm shocked.

what no wink smiley ?
really your shocked that a proffesional sportsman possibly doped (not i didnt say cyclist - i think that most profesional sports are affected by this problem)

will he get a suspension for that amount, i'm guessing the tour is out again next year (god we will have to put up with the schleck brothers complaining its too wet, bumpy or whatever)
surely riis is f***ed his new team is surely going to struggle now

my guess is that the defence will be based around contamination and that its not far above the noise level of the instruments, that sort of level needs a few labs to retest to confirm the level methinks (desperatly trying to remember analytical chemistry from my degree )

guardian website front page

Junior

Its and interesting case alright, its a low level detection, it looks like it's a food contamination, but history is on the side of a 2 year ban, if he doesn't could Li appeal his ban ?

CheGuedara

NickDrake knew all this last month....

[runs, hides]

TinyExplosions

Lumen wrote: »

On a more serious note, it's almost October now. Moaning from ignorance here, but surely it's technically possible to turn around these tests within a day or two? House would have it done in a jiffy.

House might have it done in a jiffy, but then it'd be all over the news that Contador has in fact got Lupus... no cancer.... no a rare Lymph condition.... no, a bad cold

RobFowl

Boll*cks not again :mad:

ednwireland

ffs another one
mosquera 2nd in the vuelta positive

http://www.biciciclismo.com/cas/site/noticias-ficha.asp?id=31033

signed for vacansoleil didnt he

Russman

RobFowl wrote: »

Boll*cks not again :mad:

Exactly

TinyExplosions

Hmmm, so Bertie is claiming a contaminated Spanish steak... them bloody farmers don't know what they're doing I tell ya!

The part that's slightly worrisome for me is that the UCI are making a big fuss over the amounts found, which makes me wonder if they're pre-preparing for the criticism they'll face when they don't ban him, regardless of Fuyu Li's fate.

Vélo

The dirty lying cheat.

Go Armstrong:D.

Chips Lovell

When Fuyu Li got done for it, I remember thinking that it appeared a bit of an amateurish doping effort. The Contador thing is odd.

On the one hand, it has been documented that Clenbuterol can contaminate food.

On the other, two riders, in two top level teams test positive for exactly the same drug in exactly the same amounts. Hmmm.

mitresize5

Shock, Horror - Top cyclist in doping scandal.

While I love watching cycling as a spectacle the sport is completely discredited (at the pro level anyway) for a long time now and will be for a long time in the future.

Not until I see normal sized men, not heroin chiq thin skeletons hauling there asses over mountain ranges in hours more than it is taking them now will I believe the sport is clean.

Lumen

mitresize5 wrote: »

Not until I see normal sized men, not heroin chiq thin skeletons hauling there asses over mountain ranges in hours more than it is taking them now will I believe the sport is clean.

What's thinness got to do with doping?

There are some boardsies who are borderline TdF-skinny. Are you suggesting they dope?

RobFowl

Lumen wrote: »

There are some boardsies who are borderline TdF-skinny. Are you suggesting they dope?

RAAM has to be on the gear then...

Chips Lovell

I think he was saying that its the fatties going fast up the hills that's suspicious, not the stickmen.

Brian?

el tonto wrote: »

When Fuyu Li got done for it, I remember thinking that it appeared a bit of an amateurish doping effort. The Contador thing is odd.

On the one hand, it has been documented that Clenbuterol can contaminate food.

On the other, two riders, in two top level teams test positive for exactly the same drug in exactly the same amounts. Hmmm.

It sounds like they have found a way to mask Clenbuterol use, but something slipped.

I started the day thinking he must be innocent, it sounds too strange. I have changed my mind now, I think he must have been up to something. No idea what though.

furiousox

F..k Contador and his dodgy steak, it's the sport that's the victim here.
His victory is now forever tarnished and because of episodes like this, cycling and doping will be headline news all over the world....again.

mgmt

Is it not more suspicious when TDF mountain goats beat Fabien Cancellara in a TT??? Alberto Contador in 2009.

Beasty

RobFowl wrote: »

RAAM has to be on the gear then...

No speculation allowed .....

Brian?

mitresize5 wrote: »

Not until I see normal sized men, not heroin chiq thin skeletons hauling there asses over mountain ranges in hours more than it is taking them now will I believe the sport is clean.

Does Contador not count as a stick man?

It's his TT that's the suspicious part not the climbing.

mgmt

briankeating wrote: »

It sounds like they have found a way to mask Clenbuterol use, but something slipped.

I started the day thinking he must be innocent, it sounds too strange. I have changed my mind now, I think he must have been up to something. No idea what though.

Blood Doping. He forgot what was in his blood.

cormpat

mgmt wrote: »

Is it not more suspicious when TDF mountain goats beat Fabien Cancellara in a TT??? Alberto Contador in 2009.

Damn you Mgmt! I was just about to say that.

RobFowl

Beasty wrote: »

No speculation allowed .....

After the pasting you gave me on Tuesday I'd say Beasty is defo on the hot sauce....

TinyExplosions

el tonto wrote: »

When Fuyu Li got done for it, I remember thinking that it appeared a bit of an amateurish doping effort. The Contador thing is odd.

On the one hand, it has been documented that Clenbuterol can contaminate food.

On the other, two riders, in two top level teams test positive for exactly the same drug in exactly the same amounts. Hmmm.

You see, that's actually the thing that may sway my view the other way... do/did Li and Contador share a chef? It could be that if they do, he always sources his meat from the same place, and it's possible (though maybe not probable, and also fairly easy to check if this is the case) that it was actually contaminated food -in which case, Li should be completely pardoned

JOHN_70

TinyExplosions wrote: »

Hmmm, so Bertie is claiming a contaminated Spanish steak... them bloody farmers don't know what they're doing I tell ya!

The part that's slightly worrisome for me is that the UCI are making a big fuss over the amounts found, which makes me wonder if they're pre-preparing for the criticism they'll face when they don't ban him, regardless of Fuyu Li's fate.

Heh, like those contaminated pigeons many years ago.... scroll down to number 5 on the link.

Chips Lovell

TinyExplosions wrote: »

You see, that's actually the thing that may sway my view the other way... do/did Li and Contador share a chef? It could be that if they do, he always sources his meat from the same place, and it's possible (though maybe not probable, and also fairly easy to check if this is the case) that it was actually contaminated food -in which case, Li should be completely pardoned

Different teams, different race programmes. I doubt it.

However, if the UCI thinks this positive warrants further investigation, then Li's does as well.

mitresize5

Lumen wrote: »

What's thinness got to do with doping?

There are some boardsies who are borderline TdF-skinny. Are you suggesting they dope?

big jump there to accusing some boardies of doping - no?


The steroid Clenbuterol is used as a weight-loss drug which builds muscle while burning fat. It is commonly given to horses to treat breathing problems.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Alberto-Contador-Tests-Positive-For-Banned-Steroid-At-Tour-De-France-And-Is-Suspended/Article/201009415748451?f=rss

concussion

Minute concentrations like this do not automatically mean contamination was the source - it's just as feasible that the sample was provided a significant (for the particular drug) time after administration and there was only a trace amount left in the body, the bulk of it being already metabolised and excreted. More important than the low concentrations in this case would be reporting cut-off levels - do they exist for clenbuterol?

100Suns

Irrespective of the UCI posturing (go Pat!!) and the spirited defence which will be mounted by Contador and Riis :rolleyes: the story was getting national and international headline coverage this morning. The public are not interested in 'below detectable levels' and 'possible contamination'. Given the track record of pro cycling this story reinforces the conventional wisdom that cycling is rotten, and more rotten than any other sport (with the possible exception of female bodybuilding but it's a close call). Any small gains cycling has made in recent years will be undone by this.

Can Contador be given the benefit of the doubt given how professional the approach of pro teams is to every aspect of the athlete's existence? It pains me to say it but I'm finding it difficult to find any sympathy for the position Contador finds him self in. This has the potential to be turned into a circus by the UCI and Contador as there is too much at stake. This will further damage the credibility (what's left of it) of pro cycling which is tragic for the sport, the clean riders in the pro peloton and for aspiring and neopros.

Another sad day for cycle racing.

MrCreosote

concussion wrote: »

More important than the low concentrations in this case would be reporting cut-off levels - do they exist for clenbuterol?

No. Positive is postive for clenbuterol, no cut-off. The labs have to have an ability to detect above a certain minimum level to be certified, but can detect below that if they want.

The sportsscientists blog has already had an update on this:
http://www.sportsscientists.com/

The readings were negative on Tourmalet/aubisque stage, positive on rest day, positive (though lower) on Tourmalet stage, then negative for the rest of the tour.

TinyExplosions

el tonto wrote: »

Different teams, different race programmes. I doubt it.

Rookie mistake by my part, I thought Li was done last year when they were both with Radioshack....

leftism

el tonto wrote: »

When Fuyu Li got done for it, I remember thinking that it appeared a bit of an amateurish doping effort. The Contador thing is odd.

On the one hand, it has been documented that Clenbuterol can contaminate food.

On the other, two riders, in two top level teams test positive for exactly the same drug in exactly the same amounts. Hmmm.

+1

You make a very good point. It cannot be coincidental that 2 riders from 2 of the worlds top teams test positive for this within 6 months of each other. I think the food contamination story is null and void due to the recent case involving Fuyu Li. The low levels of the drug, and the type of drug found would simply suggest to me that the teams are refining their methods, switching to drugs with an extremely fast halflife (4 days for clenbuterol)....

I was at a talk recently given by an Australian doctor very high up in WADA and he was saying that the sensitivity levels in these tests are statistically verified in order to make absolutely sure that false positives are not detected. In other words, WADA reduce the sensitivity of their own tests in order to assure no innocent athletes get burned. WADA's own accepted standard is 1:10,000 for a false positive (in blood doping).

Now i'm not sure what the ratio is for steroid abuse but you can be sure that if Contador was above the limit set by WADA, then he's either guilty or one of the unluckiest men ever to step on a bike....

RobFowl

FTR

http://www.wada-ama.org/Documents/World_Anti-Doping_Program/WADP-Prohibited-list/WADA_Prohibited_List_2010_EN.pdf

Section 2 Clenbuterol is banned completely at any detectable level