Luas fine

Lemmiwinks91

Hey just posting up this question to see if there are any suggestions. I am a student and I buy the monthly bus/luas tickets, I have been doing this for a year and I have had no trouble until today I was asked for a student travel card. I got the fine but the inspector said that if I did have one to ring up the luas number and site the number on the card to verify that I have one. At the moment I am thinking what If I just pick one up tomorrow and call, or is it branded the day I get it on a database or something along those lines.

recylingbin

meh, it's alright, I suppose.

Goldenegg

That's such a asshole thing to do! You have your valid ticket, you paid to get the transport! I would have just gave a fake name and address! Don't pay it!

TheZohanS

Goldenegg wrote: »

That's such a asshole thing to do! You have your valid ticket, you paid to get the transport! I would have just gave a fake name and address! Don't pay it!

Incorrect, the ticket isn't valid without a student travel card.

starviewadams

Do the inspectors not have some way of verifing you're identity before they issue the fine though?

Otherwise everybody could just give false details and no one would ever pay.

McDougal

Buying tickets is for knobs. I just ignore the inspectors

gsxr1

McDougal wrote: »

Buying tickets is for knobs. I just ignore the inspectors

No. Buying a ticket is for normal folk.

Not buying a ticket is for cheap feckers who intent to freeload their entire KNOB life.

McDougal

gsxr1 wrote: »

No. Buying a ticket is for normal folk.

Not buying a ticket is for cheap feckers who intent to freeload their entire KNOB life.

No, buying tickets is for people who enjoy being raped. Public transport should be free. 50billion will go into NAMA to bailout backers yet you think I'm a freeloader because I won't pay for the luas? You're a pathetic peasant. The luas and dublin bus should be funded by the state.

TouchingVirus

McDougal wrote: »

No, buying tickets is for people who enjoy being raped. Public transport should be free. 50billion will go into NAMA to bailout backers yet you think I'm a freeloader because I won't pay for the luas? You're a pathetic peasant. The luas and dublin bus should be funded by the state.

A point for another topic to be honest. The ticket is invalid without a current student card.

OP, the student travelcard has the date you got it printed on it, or the expiry date anyways, so the issue date is 1 year before that. You could be caught out, there must be some way for the Luas folk to check validity of cards otherwise you could call up and quote any old number.

h8scobes

lol i took the dart to and from school for 6 years and must have raked up over 50 fines in that time and never paid any of them. was never chased for them either. perhaps the inspector feared what would result from fining a boy in michaels

Rycn

h8scobes wrote: »

lol i took the dart to and from school for 6 years and must have raked up over 50 fines in that time and never paid any of them. was never chased for them either. perhaps the inspector feared what would result from fining a boy in michaels

Oh hai d10carter, is it getting cold under that bridge?

Tar.Aldarion

TouchingVirus wrote: »

A point for another topic to be honest. The ticket is invalid without a current student card.

OP, the student travelcard has the date you got it printed on it, or the expiry date anyways, so the issue date is 1 year before that. You could be caught out, there must be some way for the Luas folk to check validity of cards otherwise you could call up and quote any old number.

It will have the end of this year as an expiry, so he should be able to get it fine, or simply lie and say it wasn't him. I'd just walk off the dart, what will he do, restrain me?

Chorcai

Lemmiwinks91 wrote: »

Hey just posting up this question to see if there are any suggestions. I am a student and I buy the monthly bus/luas tickets, I have been doing this for a year and I have had no trouble until today I was asked for a student travel card. I got the fine but the inspector said that if I did have one to ring up the luas number and site the number on the card to verify that I have one. At the moment I am thinking what If I just pick one up tomorrow and call, or is it branded the day I get it on a database or something along those lines.

Act like a 1st yr and say ya didnt know, thinking your college ID was enough. Better yet get a country lad from Kerry/Cavan/Meath/Louth with a thick accent to ring up saying it's my 1st time away from home and mammy said to do this, and make sure he throws in about how much ya miss home and the hang-sambo with tea.

wolfpawnat

You get the student card and it lasts you til Dec next year if you get it in college. so you get it for 15 months really. Not bad for 15e, also you can get cheaper trains with it (sometimes). He cannot prove when you got it, that is not printed on it!

It is wrong though you should have to pay for a card! You are giving on by college so that should suffice!:mad:

My ex and I get the Luas all the time with our son. I refuse to pay on political grounds! Were on one day and a ticket fella came round, we took 5e out of our pockets and when he came over my ex said, "Two to Heuston please" He was wearing a Clare jersey, with his Munster accent. We got away with it too, yer man explained we had to get off and pay at the next stop, so we alighted, waited for the next Luas and hopped on! Now I don't used the Luas as the 145 brings me from my house to there. But I am conflicted on the new green line extention from my house to town should I use it and pay, or just get the bus.

biko

AH -> Commuting & Transport

axer

wolfpawnat wrote: »

I refuse to pay on political grounds!

:eek: You don't pay on political grounds? I must use that one the next time I go to a restaurant or to a pub or everywhere I have to pay to use a service.

wolfpawnat

axer wrote: »

:eek: You don't pay on political grounds? I must use that one the next time I go to a restaurant or to a pub or everywhere I have to pay to use a service.

The company that runs the Luas is connected to Israel. I am one of those that are boycotting ALL Israeli products, but that is not for this thread

mickydoomsux

wolfpawnat wrote: »

The company that runs the Luas is connected to Israel. I am one of those that are boycotting ALL Israeli products, but that is not for this thread

So don't use it then rather than not paying for it. Would you think it acceptable to shoplift an item just because it's made/grown in Israel?

As for the OP, pay your fine. You were caught, do the mature thing and pay it instead of trying to scheme your way out of it. People like you are why we are in the situation we are in today.

axer

wolfpawnat wrote: »

The company that runs the Luas is connected to Israel. I am one of those that are boycotting ALL Israeli products, but that is not for this thread

but you used their service? Surely if you were boycotting them you wouldn't use their service - otherwise you are not boycotting you are just stealing

Cookie_Monster

Lemmiwinks91 wrote: »

Hey just posting up this question to see if there are any suggestions. I am a student and I buy the monthly bus/luas tickets, I have been doing this for a year and I have had no trouble until today I was asked for a student travel card. I got the fine but the inspector said that if I did have one to ring up the luas number and site the number on the card to verify that I have one. At the moment I am thinking what If I just pick one up tomorrow and call, or is it branded the day I get it on a database or something along those lines.

:rolleyes:
another smart student in our smart economy who did not even understand the basic concepts of public transport ticketing (or deliberatly tried to ignore them).

you got caught, pay the fine and get a card.

Cookie_Monster

McDougal wrote: »

No, buying tickets is for people who enjoy being raped. Public transport should be free. 50billion will go into NAMA to bailout backers yet you think I'm a freeloader because I won't pay for the luas? You're a pathetic peasant. The luas and dublin bus should be funded by the state.

they are funded by the state and if people like you refuse to buy tickets and fare evade then all of us have to pay more to support services, even if we don't use them. :mad:

Zebra3

wolfpawnat wrote: »

The company that runs the Luas is connected to Israel.

Not just "connected to Israel", but it is involved in a light rail system in Occupied East Jerusalem which is breaking international law.

corktina

McDougal wrote: »

No, buying tickets is for people who enjoy being raped. Public transport should be free. 50billion will go into NAMA to bailout backers yet you think I'm a freeloader because I won't pay for the luas? You're a pathetic peasant. The luas and dublin bus should be funded by the state.

I bet you'd complain like feck if they raised the taxes to pay for it wouldn't you? Or maybe you aren't a tax payer...:(

schemingbohemia

wolfpawnat wrote: »

You get the student card and it lasts you til Dec next year if you get it in college. so you get it for 15 months really. Not bad for 15e, also you can get cheaper trains with it (sometimes). He cannot prove when you got it, that is not printed on it!

It is wrong though you should have to pay for a card! You are giving on by college so that should suffice!:mad:

My ex and I get the Luas all the time with our son. I refuse to pay on political grounds! Were on one day and a ticket fella came round, we took 5e out of our pockets and when he came over my ex said, "Two to Heuston please" He was wearing a Clare jersey, with his Munster accent. We got away with it too, yer man explained we had to get off and pay at the next stop, so we alighted, waited for the next Luas and hopped on! Now I don't used the Luas as the 145 brings me from my house to there. But I am conflicted on the new green line extention from my house to town should I use it and pay, or just get the bus.

Great example to set your son, you must be so proud. Your son is bound to turn into a fine upstanding citizen.

Cookie_Monster

Zebra3 wrote: »

Not just "connected to Israel", but it is involved in a light rail system in Occupied East Jerusalem which is breaking international law.

how is the light rail system breaking international law?

Cookie_Monster

wolfpawnat wrote: »

The company that runs the Luas is connected to Israel. I am one of those that are boycotting ALL Israeli products, but that is not for this thread

but the Luas is not an Isreali product
by your logic you shouldn't be travelling on public ground as the Irish gov has diplomatic link to Israel too.

Such a childish viewpoint, and at the end of the day it's nothing more than fare evasion however you try to justify it to yourself, you sicken me.:mad:

AlekSmart

By your logic (:rolleyes: ) you shouldn't be travelling on public ground as the Irish gov has diplomatic link to Israel too

Hmmm Logic Jim,but not as we know it....I wonder if this individual is a Dalkey Resident ?

Cookie_Monster

AlekSmart wrote: »

Hmmm Logic Jim,but not as we know it....I wonder if this individual is a Dalkey Resident ?

:pac::pac::pac:

AlekSmart

Such a childish viewpoint, and at the end of the day it's nothing more than fare evasion however you try to justify it to yourself, you sicken me

Ah Cookie,my oul Monster,don`t let them break you down..:)

I do hope however that wolfpawnat`s colourful description of their highly charged political focus helps you to understand what Front Line Public Transport staff are encountering every working day...:rolleyes:

If anybody happened to be out`n about the Belfield Entrance of UCD last night they might have had a wide-screen dolby surround-sound opportunity to experience wolfpawnat`ism in full technicolour as the booze sodden Lads and Ladette`s (Yahoo,ya boy ya!..anybody for The Fields of Athenry ?) strutted their Knowledge Based Stuff whilst attempting to get a Bus into The City to find another wall to pyss up against.

This State is rapidly,and thats a very rapid Rapidly,descending into social turmoil as the ever decreasing numbers of those with the Work-Ethic struggle on with a big fat ever increasing burden of highly motivated,politically sassy,knowledge filled activists who know :eek: EVERYTHING :eek: about their entitlements and sweet shagg all about responsibilities or the awful notion that they, at some point,might be required to contribute something to the greater good....:o

Great Balls of Fire,just take a moment to review some of the RPU,Free Pass,Fare Payment posts over the past few weeks......Nobody appears to have the remotest concept of the notion of paying the correct fare for a journey or of understanding the implications of being caught if you decide to chance it coz they did`nt know,were only a student,did`nt read the instructions on the box etc etc.....

Mods.....When are we going to get a Headbanging against the Wall smiley ...?

Zebra3

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

how is the light rail system breaking international law?

Because it is being used to connect illegal settlements that are built on occupied territory.

-Chris-

This is not the politics forum, please drop the discussion re: Israel.

The analogy has been made.

angel01

This thread sickens me. Noone has the right to sit there and travel for free. I have never travelled on either the bus/luas without a valid ticket and seeing scumbags like those who posted earlier claim they never pay sickens me to the core and it is the people who law abide that have to fork out when they end up putting the prices up.

I can't stand it and sorry but I feel so strongly on this. :mad::mad: In my eyes, they are downright stealing.

Goonerette

This thread sums up everything that's wrong with this country. It sickens me. Irish people refuse to pay for a service they've used because

"public transport should be free anyway" :rolleyes:
"the company that runs the Luas is (tenuously) linked to Israel"
"I'm too stupid/unwilling to figure out the Student Travelcard system, shuure who cares, I'll get away with it anyway with my culchie accent" :eek:

It's stealing, plain and simple. Attempting to justify it with some crypto-communist bulls**t rationalisations only makes things worse.

Just shoot me. :mad:

Terrontress

There have been many times that I have resented the cost of my monthly short hop ticket, given the service received.

I think the younger me might have been tempted to have jumped the fare in silent protest but the older me is too lazy to do it and would be too embarrassed as well!

I think the evasion of fare due to Veolia being in Israel might have a point if the Luas was privately owned.

I've known anarchists and crusties in the past who would jump fares based on so-called political beliefs. Freeganism apparently. But these lads lived in squats and claimed the dole. Pure dropouts. Living a normal life and protesting about one company by doing something in your favour seems a bit wishy washy to me.

devnull

angel01 wrote: »

This thread sickens me. Noone has the right to sit there and travel for free. I have never travelled on either the bus/luas without a valid ticket and seeing scumbags like those who posted earlier claim they never pay sickens me to the core and it is the people who law abide that have to fork out when they end up putting the prices up.

I can't stand it and sorry but I feel so strongly on this. :mad::mad: In my eyes, they are downright stealing.

Totally agree - if you don't want to pay don't use the service, end of.

AlekSmart

Totally agree - if you don't want to pay don't use the service, end of.

Ah now Devnull...ye can`t be saying that....there are plenty of poor people out there unable to fund their public transport requirements from their own resources,and is it not only right and proper that those better off than them would step up to the plate and fund it for them...?

Caring Society an all that ?

foggy_lad

AlekSmart wrote: »

Ah now Devnull...ye can`t be saying that....there are plenty of poor people out there unable to fund their public transport requirements from their own resources,and is it not only right and proper that those better off than them would step up to the plate and fund it for them...?

Caring Society an all that ?

there are plenty of people that are unable to get to their local train station or bus stop without getting a lift or taxi due to mobility issues, are these the same people you are referring to?

devnull

I was referring to the people who can, and are able to pay, but refuse to do so

Karmaman

Would a dedicated transport police save more money than it would cost to set-up and run?
I don't think the fare evaders worry too much about inspectors or fines.
And the anti-social thing is getting a bit out of hand.

foggy_lad

Karmaman wrote: »

Would a dedicated transport police save more money than it would cost to set-up and run?
I don't think the fare evaders worry too much about inspectors or fines.
And the anti-social thing is getting a bit out of hand.

the police would be no more effective than the current security, procedures are already in place to deal with these people but veolia rpa etc chose not to use them, and there was a promise of 2000 extra guards made several years ago as an election promise that has been shelved and guardai numbers continue to drop so i doubt there will ever be a dedicated transport police, more likely just more hot air from the usual politicians and maybe a redirection of current guardai resources which are unsuitable and already way overstretched!

Terrontress

I know the answer to this question as I have seen it happen before but...

What happens if someone has no ticket, is up front about it and casually strolls off. Obviously the Gardai are not going to come on blue lights. Do the ticket checkers utilise their powers of a citizen's arrest? Or can someone just stroll off. I think the current system is based on people who have been caught being jolted in to playing ball.

A transport police would enable proper arrest.

And by the way, don't forget that if a monthly ticket costs 120, fine is 50 and people are checked on average less than twice per month then it makes perfect sense to evade.

dowlingm

If a transport cop was a sworn officer he could simply haul the guy off the train in handcuffs PDQ, whereas private security has to call for assistance which means disruption to the service which would quickly get more expensive than the fare lost.

In Toronto the cops have recently taken over the unarmed transport constables, and in Vancouver the Translink police are armed.

foggy_lad

Terrontress wrote: »

I know the answer to this question as I have seen it happen before but...

What happens if someone has no ticket, is up front about it and casually strolls off. Obviously the Gardai are not going to come on blue lights. Do the ticket checkers utilise their powers of a citizen's arrest? Or can someone just stroll off. I think the current system is based on people who have been caught being jolted in to playing ball.

A transport police would enable proper arrest.

And by the way, don't forget that if a monthly ticket costs 120, fine is 50 and people are checked on average less than twice per month then it makes perfect sense to evade.

afaik the ticket chekers have the power to detain those suspected of fare evasion/not paying the correct fare

foggy_lad

dowlingm wrote: »

If a transport cop was a sworn officer he could simply haul the guy off the train in handcuffs PDQ, whereas private security has to call for assistance which means disruption to the service which would quickly get more expensive than the fare lost.

In Toronto the cops have recently taken over the unarmed transport constables, and in Vancouver the Translink police are armed.

maybe there are sworn officers in canada but ireland does not operate the same and hauling people off in handcuffs rarely happens unless they become aggressive and even then only as a last resort

mickydoomsux

foggy_lad wrote: »

afaik the ticket chekers have the power to detain those suspected of fare evasion/not paying the correct fare

And how do they do that?

We can't lay a hand on any passenger to remove them, if we did we'd end up in court pretty quickly. All we can do is ask them to leave and if they don't we have to ring the police.

It's all well and good saying that there are certain 'powers and procedures' available to checkers but in reality they are in a postion where they have to rely on people being civilised about their fine or about being asked to leave the vehicle.

Terrontress

foggy_lad wrote: »

maybe there are sworn officers in canada but ireland does not operate the same and hauling people off in handcuffs rarely happens unless they become aggressive and even then only as a last resort

But why not? If I went in to a shop and was caught trying to steal a €20 garment, I'd expect to be hauled off in handcuffs.

If I took the Commuter train from Dundalk to Sydney Parade, got off and told a ticket collector to get stuffed and kept walking, I bet I'd get off scott free.

Put a sworn constable with handcuffs, radio and truncheon in there and then see what happens.

foggy_lad

Terrontress wrote: »

But why not? If I went in to a shop and was caught trying to steal a €20 garment, I'd expect to be hauled off in handcuffs.

If I took the Commuter train from Dundalk to Sydney Parade, got off and told a ticket collector to get stuffed and kept walking, I bet I'd get off scott free.

Put a sworn constable with handcuffs, radio and truncheon in there and then see what happens.

it would be your word against the shop or train ticket checker and the guards only get involved when the ticket checker insists on pressing charges, they then take statements and release the suspected fare evader and that is most likely the end of the matter.

guards can do nothing unless they themselves witness the crime taking place.

Terrontress

foggy_lad wrote: »

it would be your word against the shop or train ticket checker and the guards only get involved when the ticket checker insists on pressing charges, they then take statements and release the suspected fare evader and that is most likely the end of the matter.

guards can do nothing unless they themselves witness the crime taking place.

Well, I suppose my point hangs on my assertion that there are those who when detected without a ticket stroll off regardless.

I've seen Leaving Cert result night kids without tickets on the Luas who refused to buy one and refused to get off. Eventually the ticket checker, who was on his own, gave up!

I can't imagine the Gardai would react quickly to news of a fare evader trying to get away. Transport police accompanying the ticket checkers, powers of arrest, permitted use of force. Just an idea.

I would say though that in order for it to be successful it would need to be properly resourced. In London I have seen the BTP with dogs, riot vans, decent cars, metal detectors. That is what must be aspired to if such a system is employed here. Not Garda-lite.

foggy_lad

Ireland is broke penniless heading back to the early 70s as far as money goes so where is all the cash for more police and police training etc etc going to come from?

The country can't afford to deal with the number of criminals before the courts and can't afford the police already in place, transport police is not the answer but a zero tolerance of drug users and anti social behaviour with "in their face" policing is the answer and if people break the law they should be locked up in prison no matter how crowded it gets!

Being a junkie drunk or schizophrenic should be no defence and should not entitle anyone to special favours or treatment!

Victor

As I understand it, Veolia are no longer associated with the Jerusalem tram project. End of discussioon.

Terrontress

Victor wrote: »

As I understand it, Veolia are no longer associated with the Jerusalem tram project. End of discussioon.

You can be sure they'll find some other operation to justify fare dodging. Iraq, Tibet, Moldova. It's not the objection that's important, it's not paying the fare!