Some Mods should be Banned !!!

Stu

Seriously guys, this is not even funny. What is going on over at the dental forum. I asked a perfectly legitimate question and MOD "Fitzgeme" decided to block the name of the Dentist i am looking for opinions on. I then decided to take him to task on this via PM and he then puts all my PMs on the Dental Forum and blocks any replys to my thread.

The guy is a Pompous idiot who shouldn't be a MOD. There are good Mods like Beruthial and Wibbs and then there are guys like Fitzgeme who think they know best and fob me off with "read the charter" nonesense. The posting rules on the Dental Forum are completely over the top and need to be amended. There seems to be too many cooks on in Boards towers making silly rules for no justifiable reason.

People are giving opinions in the Broadband forum about who should be avoided and who provides good broadband but this isn't allowed in the Dental Forum, absolutely ridiculous over the top censorship. I was banned for being forthright in my opinion, sorry but i will always call a spade a spade. "THE RULES FOR POSTING ON THE DENTAL FORUM NEED TO BE REVIEWED"

Zaph

It appears that the mods have misinterpreted the rules regarding PMs. They are permitted to post them in this forum should it be necessary to resolve an issue, but they shouldn't be posted outside of DR. I've PMd them requesting that they be removed.

Regarding your complaint, I don't want to bypass the agreed procedure, so while admin input may be required at a later stage, I'm going to leave this for the CMods for the time being.

Scofflaw

Thread is incorrectly labelled - should be [Science] not [Soc]!

Spent at least ten minutes writing up a response before I noticed - for what it's worth it looks like an open and shut case. Thread in question is here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056044279

moderately,
Scofflaw

Zaph

Scofflaw wrote: »

Thread is incorrectly labelled - should be [Science] not [Soc]!

Fixed

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Ok guys the story here is fairly simple.

Stu posts a fairly normal question, however he names a clinic in the question contrary to the forum charter. We imposed the no names rules after a number of previous incidences with clinics not liking their names being up and also the ammount of spam and shilling going on. THis rule works very well and posters can ask for reccomendations by PM for say a dentist in a certain area etc....

Stu's post is edited by Big_G to remove the name, no infraction or ban is given as he is a first time poster on DI. He replied with this on the thread...

Stu wrote: »

Thanks for your help Big G :rolleyes:. Have you no cop on. I can't get an opinion on the place if you remove the name of the dentist but i'll try again anyway.
- Let me re-word the question. Has anybody been to the Dentist at 43 Lower Dorset Street and had an implant done. Thanks.

Again this is clearly identifing a clinic, I reply on threadthat naming or identifing clinics is not allowed, also his tone is a bit off so I give an infraction for the second breach of forum charter.

By PM i get this

Stu wrote:

Hang on, I asked a perfectly reasonable question and can't get an answer because of a censorship happy mod telling us all what we can and can't talk about.

Some of you Mods seem to have a superiority complex and a patronizing "we know best" attitude. If i can't ask a perfectly normal question on an open forum without being censored then why have the Dental Forum in the first place.

I'm not trying to be confrontational by the way. I just feel that you need to take a step back and look at the rules you are implementing. Some of these silly rules are ruining an otherwise great Forum.

Giving me a warning, come on now, i'm not an unruly schoolkid throwing a pencil at the blackboard.

to which I reply by PM

Colton Late Nutrient wrote:

No names are allowed on the dental issues forum, this is in the forum charter which all poster should read before posting. Addresses are identifying are are also not allowed. This rule is not for negotiation. You question while valid is not for the dental issues forum.

If you have a problems with this take it to the helpdesk. No further PM's to me please.

I then recieve the following PMS in quick succession

Stu wrote:

I have read the charter. Change the rules, they are counterproductive and draconian. Have a nice day.

And on the thread he post this

Stu wrote: »

Even if i was a shill, so what. Everybody has an opinion about the dentists they've been too but you are preventing free speech by blocking peoples attempts to talk about their experiences at a particular dentist.

The best thing for you MODS to do is close down the "Dental Forum" completely. There is no point is anybody asking for reccomendations of a good dentist or views on a particular dentist anymore. It's censorship gone mad in my opinion.

Seriously, some Mods on Boards have lost the plot. I asked a perfectly reasonable question and now i can't get any advice and have to take my chances. Absolutely ridiculous .

I issue a one week ban and reply on thread here

Colton Late Nutrient wrote: »

Stu the PM I sent you was before I read this last post.

The rule are there for a reason, they have developed over the years on this forum and they work pretty well. Naming specific clinics, or dentists causes more trouble than its worth and that why we dont allow it. Try the region specific forums. Now please leave this alone, we are not changing the forum charter to suit you. Your post are not going to get you anything except a ban if you continue. This is your final warning.

BTW you can ask for a good dentist in an area and people will PM you. Thats how most people seem to do it without throwing their toys out of the pram. It matters a great deal if your a shill, shills pretend to be patients in order to give FALSE reccomendations or ask questions in order to generate self serving answers. If you want a shill opinion just go to the company website.

I get the following PM's

Stu wrote:

You banned me for disagreeing with you . Seriously, Grow Up.

Have a look at the rules and try to come to some sort of compromise between advice offered on Boards.ie and the Censorship being applied. At the moment, the rules being applied to the Dental Forum are over the top and without any real foundation.

That is my opinion and if you want to throw your toys out of the pram and ban me indefinately then go ahead, it's not a problem.

Take it easy, Stu.

I perma ban him as per request, this is the 3 PM since I asked him not to PM me further on this topic.

I get this by PM

Stu wrote:

I never abused you. I told you i wasn't trying to be confrontational but you appear to have taken my comments personally judging by what you typed on my thread in the dental forum.

I say what i feel and in this case you haven't given me a single legitimate reason as to why i can't get feedback from other posters about a particular dentist.

You said it causes more trouble than its worth. I've never heard of any posters getting into heated debates about who is a better dentist on the Dental forum so i don't know what your getting at with that comment.

The charter does not work pretty well on the Dental Forum. It works well on some forums but definitely not the dental forum. It needs to be amended or at the very least, looked at.

Banning people for being forthright in their opinion is immature and a good Mod will take on board constructive criticism and take the positives from it. You haven't done that and by dismissing what i've said, more silly rules will be introduced and forums like the Dental Forum will be pointless.

Take care, Stu.

I add him to my ignore list.

Seems simple engouh to me, this guy cant live within the forum charter, so posting on Dental issues is not possible for him. Most users seem to be happy enough to work within the rules and there has been little trouble on the forum since the rules were introduced.

Sorry for the long post. I will stay out now, just wanted to show you the PM's goning on behine the scene.

Stu

Fitzgeme, i have a word for people like you but i'm going to keep this civilised.

Tell me this brightspark .......... How come i can go onto the Broadband Forum or other forums and give my opinion on a particular broadband service whether it be good bad or indifferent and my thread won't be censored.

Are you seriously telling me because 1 or 2 dental practises don't agree with free speech, the brains at Boards.ie have decided that this is a good enough reason to censor peoples opinions.

If this is the case then it beggars belief but then with people like you given a job as a moderator, nothing should surprise me.

Stu

.

Big_G

Simple answer is yes, because boards.ie doesn't want to get sued. And if you don't like it you don't have to post there. There are plenty of other places on the net where you can get these 'opinions', their in/validity notwithstanding.

Stu

Big G, can you read the last post i made and come back with an answer to the question i asked. What is the Difference between the Broadband Forum and the Dental Forum, why are there different rules regarding opinions given?

Nobody is going to sue a boards.ie poster (or boards.ie itself) for offering an opinion on a service lol. Somebody at Boards Towers has a very high opinion of what is basically an open forum for discussing anything and everything. Please, get real. If this was a potential reality, there would be very few online forums.

"There are plenty of other places on the net where you can get these 'opinions', their in/validity notwithstanding."

Yes there is, indeed there is. Why? Because everybody is entitled to express an opinion on an open forum and because nobody is getting sued for offering an opinion and this is because common sense prevails.

Big_G

Actually, what is written here can be used in a court of law and boards is regularly threatened with legal action due to the opinions posted here. The DI forum is no different. The difference I suspect in Broadband is that the companies involved choose not to take legal action against the opinions given. It is a complex issue. Suffice to say we've had trouble in the past and so decided to change the rules to prevent that from happening again. The dental issues forum is not about seeking opinions good or bad about various dentists it is about asking questions regarding the validity of various treatments, scientific discussions and experiences of various procedures.

It is not a consumer forum, there is another forum for that here on boards.

By the way, Fitzgeme is a brightspark - he has a doctorate.

Stu

Ah Listen, its not a complex issue at all. Boards.ie is making it a complex issue. For as long as i can remember, you could ask for an opinion about a dental practise. Sure, how do you think people from down south decided on which dentist to use up north, a lot of the time it was via recommendations from people posting their opinions on Boards. Anyway, i'm not going to labour the point anymore.

Regarding your doctorate friend, Fitzgeme. He blanked out the Name of the Dentist i was asking opinions on and then told me that people could PM me their opinions if i wished. How can somebody PM me their opinion when hes blanked out the name of the dentist as soon as i put the thread up lol. They wouldn't know what dentist i'm referring to. Hes a real gem.

He posted every private message i sent him on the dental forum when he had no right to do that. He doesn't even know the rules he is supposed to abide by as a MOD. I couldn't care if he has a PHD, ABC or XYZ beside his name, hes a pompous idiot who shouldn't be moderating. Hes banned me from the Dental Forum for 7 days lol. :rolleyes:

Anyway, i'll leave it at that.

tbh

Ok, I've taken a look at the thread, and this isn't the first time this has happened to be honest.

Here's what happened as I see it.

-User wanted to ask what, to him, is a reasonable question.

-The question is reasonable to the user, because the user doesn't have the same experience of the problems these questions can bring as the mods or I do.

-The problems that can be caused by the naming or identification of clinics led to this entry in the charter:

• 4) We can no longer allow the name, address, website, clinic name, or dentist name on the public forum. Recommendations can be sought however they must be handled via PM.

-When this was pointed out to the user, the user lost their temper and started abusing the mods, out of frustration.

These things happen in a lot of the sci forums, where people ask for rec's about surgeons, doctors, dentists etc. These type of questions are very troublesome for us because if someone posts something bad about the person in question, we could get into trouble - this has happened already, more than once. On the other hand, if someone posts something good and the op doesn't have the same good experience, we could get into trouble - again, this has happened already.

The only thing we can do is to ban it altogether - not for the good of our health (if you'll pardon the pun) but for the good of boards. If it were up to me, I'd allow all comments, good or bad, but I don't pay the legal bills.

Anyway, Stu, I think you'll find your experience would have been different if you'd pm'd the mods and said "look, I understand where you're coming from, but I would like to find out more about this person - any ideas?"

Instead, you started slagging them publicly for doing what they've been told to do to protect the site you've been posting on for seven years.
In fairness, you know and I know that they shouldn't have to accept that.

I'll state here that fitz shouldn't have posted the PM's but I also believe that it was a genuine mistake. I would hope that if you sent the lads a message and aplogised for losing your temper, they'd help you as much as they could and certainly wouldn't hold it against you.

At the end of the day, you're entitled to your opinion about what *should* be allowed in the DI forum, but the simple fact is, the questions you were asking were never allowed in a sci forum and will never be allowed in a sci forum. How you deal with that information is totally up to you.

Stu

TBH, i take on board what you've said but i don't agree with it. Why are other well known forums not being threathened with legal action because of comments posted on their Forums. The amount of abuse certain Broadband services get on the Boards.ie Broadband Forum would be 10 times worse than any negative comments made about a dentist on the Dental Forum but you have different rules for both forums.

Look, i'm a Pragmatist and if i see a conflict within the charter i will point it out and asked it to be looked into and changed for the benefit of the majority and if i have to listen to a MOD talking ****e then i'll tell them they are talking ****e. I'm sorry that i don't tippy toe around things incase i upset or annoy a MOD but thats just me.

Take it easy.

tbh

Stu wrote: »

TBH, i take on board what you've said but i don't agree with it. Why are other well known forums not being threathened with legal action because of comments posted on their Forums. The amount of abuse certain Broadband services get on the Boards.ie Broadband Forum would be 10 times worse than any negative comments made about a dentist on the Dental Forum but you have different rules for both forums.

I don't know man, all I can tell you is that's the way it is. I think there were some problems with one of the hosting forums, but even if there weren't, I can only comment on the sci forums. I

Look, i'm a Pragmatist and if i see a conflict within the charter i will point it out and asked it to be looked into and changed for the benefit of the majority

changing this rule would eventually lead to the closure of the forum - that's a promise. Look if I were you, I'd have asked the question in the DI forum, and I'd have struggled to understand why the rule is there. I do get it. However, the rule is clearly stated in the charter. I also get that people don't read the charter, and that's cool too.
But when the rule you broke is pointed out to you, you had two choices.
You could have said "my bad, what I can do?" which would have led to you potentially getting help, or you could have said "yeah well it's a stupid rule and you're a dick for enforcing it" which would have led you....here.

I'm sorry that i don't tippy toe around things incase i upset or annoy a MOD but thats just me.

That's your call, and neither I nor the mods take these things personally. The forum is still there, the mods are still there, I'm still here, the only thing that has changed is that you can't post there anymore. You get me? You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
Anyway - hope you can see things from our point of view, even if you don't agree, and that you come back to the sci forums if you need help in future.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

I will leave the ban at 7 days (having forgotten to extend it), after that If you want to ask your question you are free to do so, I actually know a good bit about what is going on in that clinic and the implants they place. Just ask it in general without identifing a clinic or dentist.

"Anyone know where I can get a implant on Dorset street/city center. Advice reccomendations (by PM) please"

Boards protects not only your right to free speach, but the rights of business and people not to be defamed on a public forum, or gain a false advantage by manipulating boards.ie. The rules are a balance between these factors. What goes on on other forums is not my concern.

Stu

Fitgeme, what you are saying is farcical. Don't name the dentist, don't name the commercial property number of the dentist, just give the general area that the dentist is in and hope that people know who you are talking about and PM you back. Come on man, this is just getting plain silly now.

The fact is, there are daft rules implemented in the Dental Forum, end of story. Fitgeme, you may know a bit about the dentist i want info on but no offense, i couldn't take anything you say seriously after having dealt with you so i won't ask you for an opinion on the dentist in question thanks.

I'm going to arrange an appointment anyway and i'll have a good idea of the standard of dentisty after the consultation. Over and Out.

tbh

cool, alls well that ends well admins, I reckon we're done here.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

indeed

Asiaprod

tbh wrote: »

cool, alls well that ends well admins, I reckon we're done here.

Thank you.

[Edit]
I'm marking this as "resolved"and closing the thread.