Type of swa cable for garage sockets/lights?

paddy147

Can I ask what type of SWA cable would be ok to use for a garage.Cable is to go from the main fuseboard of the house out to the garage,and would be used for 2 double sockets,2 ceiling lights and also an single phase electric garage door?

One chap said to me 3 core,but another chap said to me 4 core.

Can anyone tell me the exact space and type of SWA cable that would do the above safely??

Thanks.:)

Carlow52

What distance is involved and will the cable be buried or exposed, will be back with a link

paddy147

Carlow52 wrote: »

What distance is involved and will the cable be buried or exposed, will be back with a link

about 35-40 meters meters distance wize (house fuse board to inside of block garage)

cable would be on surface,partly in conduit.

Carlow52

the link below can be used to make sure you consider all the issues but get a sparks to sign off

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technical/Charts/VoltageDrop.html

The 4 core idea was sometimes used, before we had 13 amp fused plugs etc, to allow the lights be on a separate power supply (but share the return and earth with the sockets) in case u blow the power circuit, however whether this is kosher in 2010 I dont know. If u do go 4 core, AFAIK the lights mcb will need to be on the elcb that the sockets are on.

Am not a sparks so u need to get proper advice

M cebee

6sq will just do it

at least 10 if there's any heavy/disturbing loads

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

6sq will just do it

at least 10 if there's any heavy/disturbing loads

Im not an electrician,so can you tell me more please

What do you mean by 6 square?

Thanks.:)

M cebee

3*6 swa

i would advise at least 3*10

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

3*6 swa

i would advise at least 3*10

So thats 3 core 10 square,am I right in saying that?

Thanks.

Bruthal

3x6 square should do for that. 3x10 square covers better for any future additional loads.

3 core is all thats needed. You put a small sub board in the shed/garage and connect different circuits into that. And electrician should do that.

Bruthal

paddy147 wrote: »

Im not an electrician,so can you tell me more please

What do you mean by 6 square?

Thanks.:)

6 square is the surface area of the copper conductor when your looking at the end of the cable, the bigger the surface area the higher the current capacity of the cable. 3x6 is 3 conductors each 6 square mm`s.

paddy147

Thankyou for the advice and help.Much appreciated indeed.:)

brinks_18476

Hi guys,

When we built our house some 4core SWA cable was put in. It is coming from a light switch to outside (not fuseboard).

I now need to extend this swa cable to a new shed.

1. Because it is wired back to a light switch in house, can i install both lights and sockets in new shed?

2. From above posts Looks like 3 core 6sq swa will suffice for a few lights and couple of sockets on a 40m run. Do you agree?

Thanks

leeomurchu

brinks_18476 wrote: »

Hi guys,

When we built our house some 4core SWA cable was put in. It is coming from a light switch to outside (not fuseboard).

I now need to extend this swa cable to a new shed.

1. Because it is wired back to a light switch in house, can i install both lights and sockets in new shed?

2. From above posts Looks like 3 core 6sq swa will suffice for a few lights and couple of sockets on a 40m run. Do you agree?

Thanks

The simple answer is no.

You can wire a light off a socket feed via a switched spur if your power to the shed was coming off a socket feed.

I'd imagine if it's wired back to a light switch it was only ever intended for lights and will probably be 1.5sq and not suitable for sockets.

You can't use a larger diameter cable to extend the existing cable. (3x1.5 - 3x6 ) is a no no might be best for you to pick up a supply off an existing socket if it's just for a couple of lights or if you can wire it back to the board even better.

leeomurchu

paddy147 wrote: »

Can I ask what type of SWA cable would be ok to use for a garage.Cable is to go from the main fuseboard of the house out to the garage,and would be used for 2 double sockets,2 ceiling lights and also an single phase electric garage door?

One chap said to me 3 core,but another chap said to me 4 core.

Can anyone tell me the exact space and type of SWA cable that would do the above safely??

Thanks.:)

3x6sq swa will do the job if you're only putting in a couple of general services (lights and sockets)

If you're planning on using it as a work shop or intend on doing so one day then go with the 3x10sq swa

Either way put in a small sub board it'll make it easier to divide the services for lights and sockets instead of using switched spurs etc.

You could probably manage the shed part yourself if you've a bit of common sense and someone on here pointing you in the right direction but it'd be advisable to get a spark to connect the cables at the live end.

brinks_18476

leeomurchu wrote: »

The simple answer is no.

You can wire a light off a socket feed via a switched spur if your power to the shed was coming off a socket feed.

I'd imagine if it's wired back to a light switch it was only ever intended for lights and will probably be 1.5sq and not suitable for sockets.

You can't use a larger diameter cable to extend the existing cable. (3x1.5 - 3x6 ) is a no no might be best for you to pick up a supply off an existing socket if it's just for a couple of lights or if you can wire it back to the board even better.

Ok. Thanks for that. So i will work on being able to provide lights only to shed from this swa cable connected to house light switch.

I will get the same size cable to extend the run.

As mentioned existing length of swa is 4 core. Do i need to extend this with 4 core or can i use 2 or 3 core for lights only as it would be cheaper. Will probably have 2 or 3 light switches in shed.

Also if the swa wired back to the light switch was say 6sq cable rather than 2.5sq, could it then be used to power sockets as well as lights?

How do i know size of swa cable that is wired back to light switch? Is it the diameter of the cores? Why is it called eg 6sq?

Thanks!!!!! N

Avns1s

Not wishing to be smart but going on the questions you have just asked, you really need to get an electrician!

leeomurchu

brinks_18476 wrote: »

Ok. Thanks for that. So i will work on being able to provide lights only to shed from this swa cable connected to house light switch.

I will get the same size cable to extend the run.

As mentioned existing length of swa is 4 core. Do i need to extend this with 4 core or can i use 2 or 3 core for lights only as it would be cheaper. Will probably have 2 or 3 light switches in shed.

Also if the swa wired back to the light switch was say 6sq cable rather than 2.5sq, could it then be used to power sockets as well as lights?

How do i know size of swa cable that is wired back to light switch? Is it the diameter of the cores? Why is it called eg 6sq?

Thanks!!!!! N

Yes it will only be suitable for lighting if it is fed from the lighting circuit in the house.

They probably aren't using the 4th core for anything whoever wired it originally probably had 4 core spare you will only need 3 sore to extend the cable for lighting.

You can never use a lighting circuit to feed 13A sockets regardless of cable size but it's unlikely that the cable is 6sq as it wouldn't fit in the switch terminal. If it was wired to a socket you could pick up say a socket and light in the shed you'd have to break the feed for the light through a switched spur at some point but if you're planning on wiring much more in the shed i'd run a cable back to the board and install a sub board.

If you can see the cable it should have the capable size on the side of the outer sheath somethin along the lines of 4 x 1.5 swa.

The first number is the amount of cores and1.5/2.5/6 sq(millimeters squared) is the diameter of the cable.

leeomurchu

brinks_18476 wrote: »

Will probably have 2 or 3 light switches in shed.

I missed that bit 2/3 light switches or 2-3 switched lights?

What kind of lights are you planning on putting in there?

brinks_18476

leeomurchu wrote: »

I missed that bit 2/3 light switches or 2-3 switched lights?

What kind of lights are you planning on putting in there?

I hope to install Up to 4 wall lights outside, couple of internal ordinary lights and maybe an external PIR halogen.

Thanks for response

brinks_18476

Avns1s wrote: »

Not wishing to be smart but going on the questions you have just asked, you really need to get an electrician!

I will be getting an electrician. Just needed answers to those queries out of curiousity and before i run swa to shed myself during groundworks

leeomurchu

brinks_18476 wrote: »

I hope to install Up to 4 wall lights outside, couple of internal ordinary lights and maybe an external PIR halogen.

Thanks for response

Might be an idea to see what other lights are fed off the circuit you're planning on connecting into.

I wouldn't go to mad with the lights what you've described there I'd almost be putting on it's own circuit hard to know without total wattage.

Instead of a halogen maybe consider an LED flood light and possibly LED wall lights otherwise I think you'll be over your limit I don't have the numbers to hand but someone will be along to clear that up

leeomurchu

brinks_18476 wrote: »

I will be getting an electrician. Just needed answers to those queries out of curiousity and before i run swa to shed myself during groundworks

I might be an idea to run 4 core so then you can switch the external lights from in the house while bringing a feed down to switch the internal lights.

brinks_18476

leeomurchu wrote: »

I might be an idea to run 4 core so then you can switch the external lights from in the house while bringing a feed down to switch the internal lights.

Perfect! Will do thanks

paddy147

leeomurchu wrote: »

3x6sq swa will do the job if you're only putting in a couple of general services (lights and sockets)

If you're planning on using it as a work shop or intend on doing so one day then go with the 3x10sq swa

Either way put in a small sub board it'll make it easier to divide the services for lights and sockets instead of using switched spurs etc.

You could probably manage the shed part yourself if you've a bit of common sense and someone on here pointing you in the right direction but it'd be advisable to get a spark to connect the cables at the live end.

Old thread and its been done and sorted ages now.;):D

Thanks though.


The 2 outdoor sockets in the back garden are fed with 2.5 x 5 core SWA on their own trip switch from the mains fuseboard in the house.

Theres a single gang double pole switch on the kitchen wall for both back garden sockets (1 switch for lights and 1 switch for pond pump).

Theres a double socket in the front garden,again on its own trip switch and its also has a fused spur switch in the porch,to turn on and of power to the garden socket when needed (large outdoor christmass tree and its lights)

The garage is fed with 3 core 10 square (underground) from the mains fuseboard and theres a small IP rated fuse board in the garage that has 5 double sockets,2 lights,electric garage door and alarm system on it.

The garage also had 2 outdoor Cat5E and 2 co ax cables ran underground to it aswell.

M cebee

did you change that rcd incommer setup paddy or leave it the way it was?

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

did you change that rcd incommer setup paddy or leave it the way it was?

House or garage end??

M cebee

paddy147 wrote: »

M cebee wrote: »

did you change that rcd incommer setup paddy or leave it the way it was?

House or garage end??

garage

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

garage

Never got around to it,to be honest.

Whats the 63 amp fuse being swapped for again?:)

M cebee

paddy147 wrote: »

M cebee wrote: »

garage

Never got around to it,to be honest.

What is the 63 amp fuse being swapped for again?:)

you need an additional isolating switch and rejig the wiring
there's no benefit having the rcd incomer-but it can be a nuisance

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

you need an additional isolating switch and rejig the wiring
there's no benefit having the rcd incomer-but it can be a nuisance

Tell me more,or show me please.:)

So the 63 amp fuse comes out of the garage fuse board then?

And gets replaced with what?

M cebee

paddy147 wrote: »

M cebee wrote: »

you need an additional isolating switch and rejig the wiring
there's no benefit having the rcd incomer-but it can be a nuisance

Tell me more,or show me please.:)

So the 63 amp fuse comes out of the garage fuse board then?

And gets replaced with what?

you don't take anything out-you'd need to add an isolating switch

Bruthal

A 32 amp MCB would probably do as a switch. And then move the lighting MCB off the RCD.

2011

In my opinion this work should only be carried out by a qualified electrician or at least under the direct supervision of one.

Bruthal

Well they can supervise from here, when paddy puts up a load of foto`s of progress.

M cebee

2011 wrote: »

In my opinion this work should only be carried out by a qualified electrician or at least under the direct supervision of one.

ya i didn't mean for paddy to make the alteration

if he decides it's worth the bother

M cebee

robbie7730 wrote: »

A 32 amp MCB would probably do as a switch. And then move the lighting MCB off the RCD.

i would use isolating switch
mcbs can be used -i think if they're EN60898
the 32 would derate the supply-although it hardly matters much here

paddy147

M cebee wrote: »

i would use isolating switch
mcbs can be used -i think if they're EN60898
the 32 would derate the supply-although it hardly matters much here

This then?
What amp?

http://www.hager.co.in/energy-distribution/power-interface/switch-disconnectors/3607.htm

2011

paddy147 wrote: »

Im not an electrician,so can you tell me more please

What do you mean by 6 square?

This then?
What amp?

http://www.hager.co.in/energy-distribution/power-interface/switch-disconnectors/3607.htm

Paddy, no offence intended but the questions that you are asking suggest to me that it is time for you to hire the services of a registered electrical contractor.
You have been given some great advice on this thread, so you should be able to negotiate a good price.

Remember, you are dealing with a lethal voltage.

BTW the isolator in your link is 3 pole so I would not to use it

paddy147

2011 wrote: »

Paddy, no offence intended but the questions that you are asking suggest to me that it is time for you to hire the services of a registered electrical contractor.
You have been given some great advice on this thread, so you should be able to negotiate a good price.

Remember, you are dealing with a lethal voltage.

BTW the isolator in your link is 3 pole so I would not to use it

Yep,Im in the IT/Construction sector,but Im not a sparks.

I never ever said that I did the work though.;)

Can you show me a pic of the correct isolator,so that I know what it looks like,and what to ask for in the electrical wholesalers.

Thanks.:)

leeomurchu

http://www.juiceelectricalsupplies.co.uk/catalogue/products/circuit-breakershager-32a-single-pole-and-switched-neutral-fuse-carriers.asp

Something along the lines of this but I'd listen to 2011. The work should be carried out by a competent qualified electrician.

paddy147

leeomurchu wrote: »

http://www.juiceelectricalsupplies.co.uk/catalogue/products/circuit-breakershager-32a-single-pole-and-switched-neutral-fuse-carriers.asp

Something along the lines of this but I'd listen to 2011. The work should be carried out by a competent qualified electrician.

Is that the correct isolator/circuit breaker?

Thanks.

M cebee

paddy147 wrote: »

leeomurchu wrote: »

http://www.juiceelectricalsupplies.co.uk/catalogue/products/circuit-breakershager-32a-single-pole-and-switched-neutral-fuse-carriers.asp

Something along the lines of this but I'd listen to 2011. The work should be carried out by a competent qualified electrician.

Is that the correct isolator/circuit breaker?

Thanks.

a single or double is ok
some fit an mcb

it's not great design the rcd incomer but might not cause problems

paddy147

Right so......


The 3 core 10 square SWA has a 63 amp fuse on the house fuseboard and also the one in the garage fuseboard.


What exactly do I need to ask for in the local electrical wholesalers then...with regards the garage fuse board?

Thanks.

Pic of 63 amp in garage fuse board attached.

Also pic of 63 amp at main fuseboard for the 3 core 10 square SWA down to garage.

maxfresh

You could get the same switchfuse unit that is in the board in your house feeding the garage and get a 32 amp fuse instead of the 63 amp that comes with it, the 32 amp can go in at the garage board

2011

A fuse rated at 63A will only provide short circuit protection to a 3 x 10 sq. cable. It will not provide discrimination or overload protection.

M cebee

2011 wrote: »

A fuse rated at 63A will only provide short circuit protection to a 3 x 10 sq. cable. It will not provide discrimination or overload protection.

3 by 10 swa buried in soil is good for well over 63amp if i recall

2011

M cebee wrote: »

3 by 10 swa buried in soil is good for well over 63amp if i recall

For a run that long?
I did not look it up so you may be correct, but I doubt it.
The smallest cable that I would protect with only a 63A fuse on is a 16sq.

Either way if the cable is only supplying 2 lights and 2 double sockets I would select a fuse rated far lower than 63A even if it was a 25sq.

Besides a 63A fuse would not provide discrimination.

Bruthal

Not much chance of it ever getting overloaded*



* once he avoids 2 triple skts

2011

robbie7730 wrote: »

Not much chance of it ever getting overloaded*



* once he avoids 2 triple skts

M cebee

80 and 101 amp capacity for pvc and
xlpe seemingly

re: overload protection

Bruthal

If the shed 63 amp fuse was at capacity or overloaded, the house one would be carrying combined loads, and likely go first.