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"The Origin of Specious Nonsense"

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    #8492
    Sonics2k
    Registered Users Posts: 8,237 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    Stop playing computer games dead_one.


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    #8493
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    hi koth
    isn't homo sapiens another name for Chimps?

    Homo sapiens is another name for humans.

    Pan Trogolodytes is another name for chimps.


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    #8494
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    Sonics2k wrote: »
    Stop playing computer games dead_one.
    Their chains are so deep in my soul, can't break these fetters.The Fettered believe in these games and willingly bind themselves to them.
    Will human become extinct or evolve into other forms? Easy question, What does evolution say about this?


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    #8495
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    Guys you'll have to forgive dead one's questions. They just are that uneducated. I don't know what country they grew up in, but science certainly wasn't part of their education.


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    #8496
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    Homo sapiens is another name for humans.
    Pan Trogolodytes is another name for chimps.
    Thanks dlofnep, Now would you please guide me. Who are common ancestors? What has become of those, Are they extinct/evolved or what


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    #8497
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    Guys you'll have to forgive dead one's questions. They just are that uneducated. I don't know what country they grew up in, but science certainly wasn't part of their education.
    So it is very easy for you to answer them? Why had you failed to answer


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    #8498
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    Will human become extinct or evolve into other forms? Easy question, What does evolution say about this?

    Nobody can predict that. Humans control the environment around them, and have access to medicine, ample supplies of food and water. Selection doesn't play as much in humans as it does in other animals.

    When a species is successful in their environment, very little change occurs. See crocodilia for example - they have only changed marginally over 84 million years. This is because they are good at what they do, in the environment that they live in.

    Humans just so happen to also be good at what they do. It is not possible to predict if humans will see any major changes over the next million years.


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    #8499
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    Thanks dlofnep, Now would you please guide me. Who are common ancestors? What has become of those, Are they extinct/evolved or what

    If you are genuinely interested about biological ancestry of humans, I suggest reading a book called The Ancestor's Tale. Common ancestors of whom? I don't think you understand the term - So perhaps you should start with - 'What are common ancestors'.

    A common ancestor is shared ancestor between two different species.


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    #8500
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    Nobody can predict that. Humans control the environment around them, and have access to medicine, ample supplies of food and water. Selection doesn't play as much in humans as it does in other animals.
    if that is case then what makes you to predict Past. Can't evolution predict future on base of past.
    dlofnep wrote: »
    When a species is successful in their environment, very little change occurs. See crocodilia for example - they have only changed marginally over 84 million years. This is because they are good at what they do, in the environment that they live in.
    B$, If change occurs very little then why there is lot of difference between species.
    dlofnep wrote: »
    Humans just so happen to also be good at what they do. It is not possible to predict if humans will see any major changes over the next million years.
    How old are humans?


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    #8501
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    if that is case then what makes you to predict Past. Can't evolution predict future on base of past.

    You don't predict the past. You examine the past. And no, you cannot make predictions of the future based on the past - because the future is unpredictable.
    dead one wrote: »
    B$, If change occurs very little then why there is lot of difference between species.

    I never stated that little change occurred. I stated that with respect of Crocodilia - little change has occurred because they have been successful in their environment. If you understand the process of natural selection, you'd understand why this is the case. Huge change has occurred in other species. If you take one more quote of mine out of context or do not read it correctly, you will be blocked. This is your only warning.
    dead one wrote: »
    How old are humans?

    Approximately 200,000 years.


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    #8502
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    You don't predict the past. You examine the past. And no, you cannot make predictions of the future based on the past - because the future is unpredictable.
    What do you have to examine Past? faith
    dlofnep wrote: »
    I never stated that little change occurred. I stated that with respect of Crocodilia - little change has occurred because they have been successful in their environment.
    Are you croc? or have/had been living with them... When did last change occur, please
    dlofnep wrote: »
    correctly, you will be blocked. This is your only warning.
    You think i am idiot. My English is poor but brain isn't
    dlofnep wrote: »
    Approximately 200,000 years.
    who are the first humans?


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    #8503
    Bannasidhe
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    dead one wrote: »
    if that is case then what makes you to predict Past. Can't evolution predict future on base of past.

    dead one. I am a historian and I have spent the last 30 odd years studying the past using the principles of cause and effect. This involves tracing back through the evidence to try and discover what lead to the end result. We do this by looking at what already happened.
    Despite all of my experience in investigating the past - I am incapable of predicting the future. I can learn from the past and point out when humans are repeating errors made before and advise not repeating those errors but I have no way of predicting exactly what will happen in the future as unexpected events can and do occur.
    200 years ago who knew that not only would humans develop a means to fly but put a man on the moon. 100 years ago who knew that we would develop antibiotics. 50 years ago who knew that we would have not only mobile phones, but mini computers in our pockets...

    In terms of the possible extinction of the human race - we simply do not know what will happen in the future. There could be a global nuclear war, a meteor strike, a devastating pandemic coming down the line in 100 years, 1000 years, 100,000 years - we have no way of knowing.


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    #8504
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    What do you have to examine Past? faith

    No, you examine it with evidence.
    dead one wrote: »
    Are you croc? or have/had been living with them... When did last change occur, please

    This question is too stupid to answer. If you're interested in learning about the evolution of Crocodilia (not crocodiles), then read a book. But you're simply too uneducated to formulate a logical question.
    dead one wrote: »
    You think i am idiot. My English is poor but brain isn't

    I don't care about your grasp of English. I care about whether someone has enough knowledge in an area to have a reasonable discussion with them about it. My little sister knows more about this topic than you do. I'd be shockingly embarrassed if I was you. Unless of course, you're only 12 - then I'll excuse your ignorance.
    dead one wrote: »
    who are the first humans?

    There were never first humans. Humans just didn't appear out of nowhere. The evolved from an earlier member of the Homo genus.


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    #8505
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    If you are genuinely interested about biological ancestry of humans, I suggest reading a book called The Ancestor's Tale. Common ancestors of whom? I don't think you understand the term - So perhaps you should start with - 'What are common ancestors'.
    I don't have any time to read the ancestor's b$, I have my games
    dlofnep wrote: »
    A common ancestor is shared ancestor between two different species.
    Where is that goddamn shared ancestor, today, forgive my ignorance?


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    #8506
    Bannasidhe
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 19,219 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe


    dead one wrote: »

    Where is that goddamn shared ancestor, today, forgive my ignorance?

    Dead. As are most of our goddam ancestors...:rolleyes:


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    #8507
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    I don't have any time to read the ancestor's b$, I have my games

    So don't come on here wasting our time with stupid questions if you're not willing to educate yourself.
    dead one wrote: »
    Where is that goddamn shared ancestor, today, forgive my ignorance?

    Dead, gone - like 99.9% of all species that have ever lived in Earth.


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    #8508
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    No, you examine it with evidence.
    So what is evidence
    see, you said, human are 200000 years old. Can't evolution predict next 50000 or 100000 year on this history of 200000. If evolution can't then there is something suspicious in evolution. It means your knowledge is weak. You said i am an uneducated person the reason for this is only, I don't follow your faith/creed...
    dlofnep wrote: »
    This question is too stupid to answer. If you're interested in learning about the evolution of Crocodilia (not crocodiles), then read a book. But you're simply too uneducated to formulate a logical question.
    Who has written that book? What is faith behind that book.
    dlofnep wrote: »
    I don't care about your grasp of English. I care about whether someone has enough knowledge in an area to have a reasonable discussion with them about it. My little sister knows more about this topic than you do. I'd be shockingly embarrassed if I was you. Unless of course, you're only 12 - then I'll excuse your ignorance.
    I don't have time to waste times in these complex b$ theories. Even You can't answer what i am saying. I simply believe God is creator and has given predefined intelligence to human race. I tell you the future of human. Humans race won't extinct or evolve. They will remain human even after next 5000000000 years. Can't you tell me like this... you can't because you faith is based on accident and random chance.
    dlofnep wrote: »
    There were never first humans. Humans just didn't appear out of nowhere. The evolved from an earlier member of the Homo genus.
    Where did homo genus came from.


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    #8509
    dead one
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭dead one


    dlofnep wrote: »
    Dead, gone - like 99.9% of all species that have ever lived in Earth.
    you think i am unedcuated. Let see
    Hominidae.PNG
    on base of this what can you tell me future of evolution of human.


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    #8510
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    Can't evolution predict next 50000 or 100000 year on this history of 200000.

    The future is not predictable.
    dead one wrote: »
    If evolution can't then there is something suspicious in evolution.

    The only thing suspicious around here is your abysmal understanding of very basic science.
    dead one wrote: »
    Who has written that book?

    What book?
    dead one wrote: »
    What is faith behind that book.

    I don't read books driven by faith, I read book driven by evidence.
    dead one wrote: »
    I don't have time to waste times in these complex b$ theories.

    Then why do you continue to ask stupid questions?
    dead one wrote: »
    Even You can't answer what i am saying.

    When you learn how to formulate an intelligent question, I'll be happy to answer it.
    dead one wrote: »
    I simply believe God is creator and has given predefined intelligence to human race.

    Yes - you believe. You take your beliefs from a prophet (Muhammad), that raped children. I'll stick with my science texts if you don't mind.
    dead one wrote: »
    I tell you the future of human. Humans race won't extinct or evolve. They will remain human even after next 5000000000 years. Can't you tell me like this... you can't because you faith is based on accident and random chance.

    Evolution through natural selection has nothing to do with chance.
    dead one wrote: »
    Where did homo genus came from.

    From Australopithecus most likely.


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    #8511
    dlofnep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,759 ✭✭✭✭dlofnep


    dead one wrote: »
    you think i am unedcuated. Let see
    Hominidae.PNG
    on base of this what can you tell me future of evolution of human.

    Nope - because the is simply a taxanomic tree. It doesn't make a claim about the future. Nor would someone expect to retrieve anything from it that would tell us about the future of any species.


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    #8512
    shizz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭shizz


    dead one wrote: »
    So what is evidence
    see, you said, human are 200000 years old. Can't evolution predict next 50000 or 100000 year on this history of 200000. If evolution can't then there is something suspicious in evolution. It means your knowledge is weak. You said i am an uneducated person the reason for this is only, I don't follow your faith/creed...

    You simply do not understand the process of evolution. Your Knowledge is weak because you simply choose to ignore it as you consider them "complex b$ theories". Evolution cannot predict the future. It is the surroundings that the species lives in which ends up determining how it will evolve. It may be a faith but it is a faith in science and evidence. I dare say whatever you have faith in produces no evidence what so ever.
    Who has written that book? What is faith behind that book.

    Evidence is the faith behind the book.
    I don't have time to waste times in these complex b$ theories. Even You can't answer what i am saying. I simply believe God is creator and has given predefined intelligence to human race. I tell you the future of human. Humans race won't extinct or evolve. They will remain human even after next 5000000000 years. Can't you tell me like this... you can't because you faith is based on accident and random chance.

    You have been answered but you refuse to accept the answer because you, for an uneducated reason, expect evolution to be able to predict the future.
    The human species will become extinct unless WE do something about it. In the time frame you suggested the sun will expand and engulf the earth and eventually die itself. This will end our species unless we bugger off somewhere else.

    Where did homo genus came from.

    I'm not educated enough in this to know exactly where it came from but I can safely tell you it was not zapped here by a magical overseer.


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    #8513
    swampgas
    Registered Users Posts: 3,535 ✭✭✭swampgas


    dead one wrote: »
    So what is evidence
    see, you said, human are 200000 years old. Can't evolution predict next 50000 or 100000 year on this history of 200000. If evolution can't then there is something suspicious in evolution. It means your knowledge is weak.

    You can have a very accurate and solid theory that cannot make specific predictions, but can still be very useful.

    It's a bit like predicting the weather. We understand the basic physics behind it, but because of non-linear behaviour tiny random changes in the initial conditions can mean huge differences some time in the future.

    The same applies with evolution in nature - small random changes now can mean big changes in the future. If you want to know more, try reading up on chaos theory. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory)


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    #8514
    Galvasean
    Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    So, why has the topic changed to trying to predicting the future?


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    #8515
    Doctor Jimbob
    Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Doctor Jimbob


    Galvasean wrote: »
    So, why has the topic changed to trying to predicting the future?

    Because dead one doesn't understand science I think.


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    #8516
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,399 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Galvasean wrote: »
    So, why has the topic changed to trying to predict the future?
    Because creationists appear to believe that knowledge of the future is possible, while knowledge of the past is impossible.

    Welcome to the splendidly topsy-turvy world of creationism.


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    #8517
    shizz
    Registered Users Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭shizz


    robindch wrote: »
    Because creationists appear to believe that knowledge of the future is possible, while knowledge of the past is impossible.

    Welcome to the splendidly topsy-turvy world of creationism.

    Brilliant description. Although I do think it may be slightly unfair to tar all creationists with the same brush that smacked the sense out of Dead One.


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    #8518
    Doctor Jimbob
    Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Doctor Jimbob


    shizz wrote: »
    Brilliant description. Although I do think it may be slightly unfair to tar all creationists with the same brush that smacked the sense out of Dead One.

    Nah.


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    #8519
    RichieC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,334 ✭✭✭RichieC


    shizz wrote: »
    Brilliant description. Although I do think it may be slightly unfair to tar all creationists with the same brush that smacked the sense out of Dead One.

    I've never seen a rational argument from a creationist. I've seen some well produced clips on the internet that certainly look credible but, as with right wing think tanks, the credibility is only skin deep.


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    #8520
    Musiconomist
    Registered Users Posts: 176 ✭✭Musiconomist


    I think the whole attempt of "educating creationists/fundamentalists" is flawed, personally. The reason that someone believes in a religion, or whatever it may be, is usually cultural, and intertwined with numerous assumptions about the world and one's self.

    I'm not sure how people can really become open to this stuff. The underlying reasons normally rest upon irrational personal beliefs (not to be confused with irrational religious beliefs). I've become less convinced that this struggle is important, either way.


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    #8521
    Doctor Jimbob
    Registered Users Posts: 7,631 ✭✭✭Doctor Jimbob


    Musiconomist wrote: »
    I think the whole attempt of "educating creationists/fundamentalists" is flawed, personally. The reason that someone believes in a religion, or whatever it may be, is usually cultural, and intertwined with numerous assumptions about the world and one's self.

    I'm not sure how people can really become open to this stuff. The underlying reasons normally rest upon irrational personal beliefs (not to be confused with irrational religious beliefs). I've become less convinced that this struggle is important, either way.
    This is basically why Creation "Science" isn't really science. Science seeks to discover why things occur as they do. It seeks to find the truth.
    Creation science seeks to prove the bible is correct. That bias is always going to be there. If any evidence is found against the bible, it's going to be ignored by creation "science".


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