The Roadside Rest Area: for off-topic chit-chat

Amtmann

nordydan wrote: »

Thanks for the responses lads, think I'll definitely hit Rotheburg on Wednesday night (looks great), and wing it after that - got two free nights before I have to leave the car back in Munchen on Sat afternoon.

Quick question about driving in the snow in Germany, how does it compare to here? I would imagine they are somewhat more organised than we are, but just any general advise as the combination of the ∞ speed limit, the weather and (as stated above) the 8 lane A5 autobahn might be a bit of a step up from Irish driving! Thanks

Have you ever driven in Germany before? Autobahns are stressful to drive on in my opinion, well, the busy ones anyway. Watch out for traffic zipping out of LILOs, and beware when moving into the overtaking lane to facilitate them merging, as lunatics will be tearing up at outrageous speeds. You will encounter traffic jams (called 'Stau', pronounced 'shtow'). On skyscrapercity on the Deutsche Autobahnen thread there were reports of several severe tailbacks.

My friends in Nuremberg tell me it's started to snow quite heavily in Franconia. You could also nip over to Bamberg for a classical music concert. It's about 1.5 hours from Rothenburg and is a beautiful little city. Both it and Rothenburg have loads of parking by the way. Here's a link to the carparks in Rothenburg - many are free and are located right outside the old town walls. Alternatively, head due east of Rothenburg to Nuremberg, which is a truly brilliant city with loads to do. I'd definitely take in Nuremberg if I were you!

nordydan

Furet wrote: »

Have you ever driven in Germany before? Autobahns are stressful to drive on in my opinion, well, the busy ones anyway. Watch out for traffic zipping out of LILOs, and beware when moving into the overtaking lane to facilitate them merging, as lunatics will be tearing up at outrageous speeds. You will encounter traffic jams (called 'Stau', pronounced 'shtow'). On skyscrapercity on the Deutsche Autobahnen thread there were reports of several severe tailbacks.

My friends in Nuremberg tell me it's started to snow quite heavily in Franconia. You could also nip over to Bamberg for a classical music concert. It's about 1.5 hours from Rothenburg and is a beautiful little city. Both it and Rothenburg have loads of parking by the way. Here's a link to the carparks in Rothenburg - many are free. Alternatively, head south to Dinkelsbuehl or due east of Rothenburg to Nuremberg, which is a truly brilliant city with loads to do. I'd definitely take in Nuremberg if I were you!

Thanks again Furet. I think Rothenburg>Bamberg>Nurmeberg>Munich may be a plan. Regensberg I have since heard is also good, but not viable to do them all in essentially 4 days.

I haven't driven in Germany before, but I have managed to drive in USA (including LA), Malta, Spain, France, Uruguay, Italy, Sicily & Brazil (in order of increasing madness). I hope that will be adequate preparation, TBH its the speed limit that is of most concern. We'll be driving outside of peak commuter hours, hope that helps the traffic situation.

Heard about the snow, but its is predicted to clear up towards the end of next week, as reliable as these things can be.

Going to bring my garmin with me, I use OSM in general. I'd imagine the Germans have their bit mapped very well!

Can't wait to go and get out of this country. Last time I was in Germany was in Stuttgart for the world cup in 2006 where I ruptured my appendix and nearly died back in Belfast. At least that can't happen again!

Amtmann

nordydan wrote: »

Thanks again Furet. I think Rothenburg>Bamberg>Nurmeberg>Munich may be a plan. Regensberg I have since heard is also good, but not viable to do them all in essentially 4 days.

I haven't driven in Germany before, but I have managed to drive in USA (including LA), Malta, Spain, France, Uruguay, Italy, Sicily & Brazil (in order of increasing madness). I hope that will be adequate preparation, TBH its the speed limit that is of most concern. We'll be driving outside of peak commuter hours, hope that helps the traffic situation.

Heard about the snow, but its is predicted to clear up towards the end of next week, as reliable as these things can be.

Going to bring my garmin with me, I use OSM in general. I'd imagine the Germans have their bit mapped very well!

Can't wait to go and get out of this country. Last time I was in Germany was in Stuttgart for the world cup in 2006 where I ruptured my appendix and nearly died back in Belfast. At least that can't happen again!

Good itinerary. If starting out at Rothenburg you could take the A7 northbound and then the A70 east to Bamberg. That's about 90 minutes usually. The A70 isn't a busy motorway. That's the way I used to go when I was there.

Alternatively, do Rothenburg to Nuremberg first via thisaway, and then move onto Bamberg, which is little more than 40 minutes north of Nuremberg. I'd probably do Rotheburg - Nuremberg - Bamberg if I were you because you won't have to drive for so long in one go.

Amtmann

By the way, I think it's possible to get a night-time tour of Rothenburg by guides dressed in medieval garb. In any other city it would be twee, but Rothenburg pulls it off because the city hasn't really changed since medieval times (barring one serious air raid in 1945). I used to work in the town's archive, which was actually the old prison and torture chamber. You could be reading an old manuscript from 1525 about some poor bugger having his eyes cut out with a dagger, and in the corner of the room would be the fetters that held him. BTW: You really should go to the Kriminalmuseum - it's a great exhibition full of original medieval masks, cloaks and torture instruments. Only about €2 to get in the door.

nordydan

Furet wrote: »

By the way, I think it's possible to get a night-time tour of Rothenburg by guides dressed in medieval garb. In any other city it would be twee, but Rothenburg pulls it off because the city hasn't really changed since medieval times (barring one serious air raid in 1945). I used to work in the town's archive, which was actually the old prison and torture chamber. You could be reading an old manuscript from 1525 about some poor bugger having his eyes cut out with a dagger, and in the corner of the room would be the fetters that held him. BTW: You really should go to the Kriminalmuseum - it's a great exhibition full of original medieval masks, cloaks and torture instruments. Only about €2 to get in the door.

Brilliant stuff thanks, tour sounds excellent. Must try that schneeball! At this stage I might hold onto the car and skip Munich entirely and spend an extra day somewhere else (nordingen/regensburg/augsburg). Can always return to the Bavarian capital for a beer trip in the future.

munchkin_utd

nordydan wrote: »

Quick question about driving in the snow in Germany, how does it compare to here? I would imagine they are somewhat more organised than we are, but just any general advise as the combination of the ∞ speed limit, the weather and (as stated above) the 8 lane A5 autobahn might be a bit of a step up from Irish driving! Thanks

to be fair, when it snows heavily it takes a little while to be cleared. Theres no magic button.
So the best advice if you arent in a rush, is to take it easy and avoid if possible being on the road during snow.
http://www.wetteronline.de/ is a crap site with very good info. The radar is a great self diagnosis tool to see what youre going to be hit with in the way of rain/ snow/ storms in the immediate future.

Re existing road conditions.
My bible is www.bayerninfo.de/vib/traffic
Its pretty much exactly what is announced on the radio, so for a non german speaker invaluable. Any time I hop in the car I always check it to see what traffic jams are on the route.
Unfortunately it only covers Bavaria.

For traffic info for all germany you have http://www.verkehrsinfo.de/
but I cant vouch for its up-to-date-ness or correctness.

AND - if your sat nav has inbuilt TMS traffic warning reception, then this is available for free too nationwide. (dont forget to bring the ariel, its needed too!)

Amtmann

Sigh. Does he expect every dead-end boreen to be salted?

John C

nordydan wrote: »

Thanks for the responses lads, think I'll definitely hit Rotheburg on Wednesday night (looks great), and wing it after that - got two free nights before I have to leave the car back in Munchen on Sat afternoon.

Quick question about driving in the snow in Germany, how does it compare to here? I would imagine they are somewhat more organised than we are, but just any general advise as the combination of the ∞ speed limit, the weather and (as stated above) the 8 lane A5 autobahn might be a bit of a step up from Irish driving! Thanks

This is off topic from Roads and Infrastructure. In the Forum Rec-Travel there are entries about Menmmingen. It is about 110 km from Munich. It is near the A96 Autobahn. This connects Munich with Lindau am Bodensee (Lake Constance).
The IATA code for Memmingen Airport is FMM.

If you book a "rental vehicle" online be careful that you do not book a car to be collected at Munich's big Airport. Its IATA code is MUC.

The biggest car rental firm in Germany is Sixt.

Roads were usable in Upper Bavaria today. There were some accidents and jams but the main roads were open.

Greetings from Oberbayern

KevR

Furet wrote: »

Sigh. Does he expect every dead-end boreen to be salted?

Ugh! This guy is deluded if he thinks it's practical/sustainable to salt all roads.

I do think we need a change in government but the alternatives to what's in power at the moment don't exactly fill me with confidence..

"Serious questions must now be asked" - it's easy to ask a few serious questions but what would he really do different if in power? Probably very little to be honest.

John C

nordydan wrote: »

...
We are flying into Frankfurt and back from Munich West. Going to spend 4 nights there ending up in Munich after driving down there (hiring a car - looking forward to driving on the Autobahn). Any suggestions (ie hidden gems)? She is into medieval towns (like Bruges) and was looking a Bavarian equivalent. Here Regensburg is good. Thanks

Ryanair fly into Hahn which is 120 km west of the city Frankfurt on Main. Hahn has IATA code HHN.
Aer Lingus and Lufthsansa fly into Frankfurt Airport, IATA Code FRA.

Today road traffic has been moving. At the Bavarian airports weather related delays are minimal.

This week in Germany new regulations for winter tyres have been introduced. When there is snow and ice on the road,
winter tyres with 4 mm thread are mandatory. A winter tyre is identified by a snowflake symbol; or by the letters M + S on it.
M+S is mud and snow ( Matsch und Schnee).

You should look at the tyres and measure the profile before taking the car. If there is an accident with sub standard tyres the renter and not the rental firm is legally responsible. In winter full insurance waiver CDW is advisable.

Most car rental companies go for all year tyres (alljährliche Reifen) on most cars.

wellbutty

nordydan wrote: »

Brilliant stuff thanks, tour sounds excellent. Must try that schneeball! At this stage I might hold onto the car and skip Munich entirely and spend an extra day somewhere else (nordingen/regensburg/augsburg). Can always return to the Bavarian capital for a beer trip in the future.

Your next trip then will be to fly to Munich, head down around Lindau, Konstanz, then over to Fussen, then to the Versailles replica on Chiemsee island and back to Munich

nordydan

Thanks for the airport (and other) advice John C, I had indeed made an error at the Frankfurt end so that has been rectified. Memmingem I got right! Luckily I have a contact in Avis so I have obtained a good rate. Munich will be avoided. Depending on how I get on I may return and tour in the direction of the Alps at a future date!

munchkin_utd

nordydan wrote: »

....We are flying into Frankfurt and back from Munich West. ...

A tour of airports which are nowhere near where they claim to be!

Well spotted John C for noticing that!

And I'd agree on the sixt tip. They are good BUT make sure to have the car back on time you agreed as they do penalise you if you are late with the drop off, no excuses allowed.

Amtmann

How did you get on Dan? I'm just back from Nuremberg. What a great city it is. Very cold and snowy there at the moment. About 40cm or more fell on Thursday night. The trams weren't running on Friday morning, but the council had everything operational by the afternoon.

L1011

Admit it, who here works in the bookings department of then Clayton Hotel in Galway? They're doing an "M6 first birthday" room rate of 66 quid (down from, erm, 69 it seems...).

Chris_5339762

Doesnt Spongey live in Galway? Has to be him

L1011

Whats with the name change Fur... Tremelo?

Amtmann

MYOB wrote: »

Whats with the name change Fur... Tremelo?

I got sick of the old name so I asked the Gods of Boards.ie to change it, and they did.

nordydan

Tremelo wrote: »

How did you get on Dan? I'm just back from Nuremberg. What a great city it is. Very cold and snowy there at the moment. About 40cm or more fell on Thursday night. The trams weren't running on Friday morning, but the council had everything operational by the afternoon.

Furet/Tremelo - a month on and I get round to replying! Sorry about the delay. Thanks for your advice beforehand. Bavaria was excellent, we stayed 4 nights in total

We spent one night in Rothenburg ob der Tauber, and the next in in Bamberg. Nice wee towns. Tried the schneeball, not a great fan to be honest but no hassle. Didn;t make the night tour unfortunately. Beer in Bamberg was good. tried a few. One tasted like smoked ham. Nuremburg was the highlight of the trip. Two days there, up at the castle and in the brauhauses and out at the Nazi rally. There was an Irish bar downstairs somewhere. Generally strolling about. Relaxed.

The winter markets on in all the places so nice time to visit. A half meter long hotdog/mulled wine was the norm. Towns were jammed.

The car was hired from Frankfurt Main airport (Avis). You certainly hit the ground running - straight onto a busy autobahn. We had the winter tyres which were a bonus, although part of the reason I wanted to hire a car was to get up to speed on the autobahn - an impossibility with this setup. German drivers are no better than Irish ones IMHO, there are many impatient drivers in the autobahn. In the towns they seem more controlled than their Irish counterparts. Driving was easy, the only dodgy part was exiting from Rothenburg onto the A7 northbound, I was nearly taken off the road by a lorry. Conditions were bad, the sliproad was short and uphill and the lorry refused to pull out. Not a great experience. Bar that highway maintenance was excellent, all roads including country ones were in great nick. No traffic problems.

Stopped off in Nordlingen on the way back to Memmingem.One piece of advice, be careful leaving an Avis car hire back at Memmingem. the rental is basically just a man's house. We were caught on the hop. He offered us a lift back into the airport for the standard taxi rate €18, which we had no option at that stage. He then tried to charge a full tank of fuel, which we had just filled up (€78). Luckily a family member of SWMBO is high up in Avis Ireland so it was "rectified". I am not sure if it is common practise in Germany, but a cautionary tale nonetheless.

All in all a very good trip, great to be in a well country for a change.
I would definitely head back to Nuremberg at least, although my next trip to bavaria will be further south including Munchen. Mind you I am off to Berlin for a stag for two days tomorrow and looking forward to it!

Amtmann

nordydan wrote: »

Nuremburg was the highlight of the trip. Two days there, up at the castle and in the brauhauses and out at the Nazi rally. There was an Irish bar downstairs somewhere. Generally strolling about. Relaxed.

Finnegans. Known locally as the money pit People heading out of the Bahnhof just gravitate towards it. Yeah, I love Nuremberg too. Hoping to get a job there towards late summer if I'm lucky.

nordydan

Tremelo wrote: »

Finnegans. Known locally as the money pit People heading out of the Bahnhof just gravitate towards it. Yeah, I love Nuremberg too. Hoping to get a job there towards late summer if I'm lucky.

That's the one, was near an Indian restaurant we dined in beforehand. We stayed in Obere Kanalstrasse so the other side of town for us. I think there is another "type" of Irish bar not too far away, very poor job. The small taverns were great. I wouldn't blame you for wanting to head over again, its a great spot.

Teddy455

Whats the point of having a off topic chit chat?? Why????
It has nothing to do with it.

If people want to discuss things they can find them on other threads in different catagories.

nordydan

Teddy455 wrote: »

Whats the point of having a off topic chit chat?? Why????
It has nothing to do with it.

If people want to discuss things they can find them on other threads in different catagories.

Well I personally certainly appreciate the help I got on my recent trip to Bavaria. Maybe people with similar interests in topics in say infrastructure also share similar interests such as travel?

Amtmann

Teddy455 wrote: »

Whats the point of having a off topic chit chat?? Why????
It has nothing to do with it.

If people want to discuss things they can find them on other threads in different catagories.

Because many of us have been posting here for a few years and in that time have gotten to know each other to an extent. Sometimes we like to talk about things other than roads here in this forum, which we're used to.

Chris_5339762

Also a lot of us barely ever venture outside the C/T, Infra and Roads forums.

Except maybe to watch people give out about UPC in the broadband forum when mine is working fine.

Amtmann

Dubhthach: What's the story with that interesting DNA-related signature you have at the bottom of your posts? What does it mean and where did you get the test done?

dubhthach

Well it's complicated

Couple months ago I supplied a DNA sample (cheek swab) to FamilyTreeDNA, they tested my Y-Chromosome for both STR (Short tandem repeats -- you get a numerical value for each position tested) and for SNP's (single nucleotide polymorphism -- specific mutation on Y passed down father -> son)

The Y is passed down Father -> son without change (male chromosome), it's broken into a bunch of different "haplogroups", each one represents a different branch of males descended from a common male ancestor. If you carry a specific SNP and someone else carries same one it shows common ancestory in ancient times.

For example 90% of men in Ireland belong to haplogroup R1b, the original man to carry this marker probably lived 25-30k years ago in central Asia. I specifically carry a marker further downstream (L21), here's a pic of the R branch:



Majority of Western Europeans males are R1b*, most Eastern European (slavic) and higher caste Indians are R1a. In comparison most west africans belong to haplogroup E, and the oldest branch is A which is found among the San (hunter gathers) of southern africa.

Anyways the above test was purely on my Y-Chromosome (male) so there was a sale offer on 23andme for $99 they would test 1million markers across all 23 pairs of Chromosomes (Humans carry 46, 2 are sex-lined -- X/Y) as well as tell me my mitochondrial lineage (female line -- passed down through mothers).

Based of those 1million markers and comparing to the rest of their database they could tell that I was part of Irish population cluster. The "raw data" (1 million markers) I then submited to a "Population genetics project" called Dodecad where it's futher analysised to show the exact "admixture" components in my makeup. Like most Europeans who speak an Indo-European language I carry a certain amount of markers (SNP's) that are more common in west asian populations (Armenians, Georgians, Assyrians etc.) this is probably due to the fact that our linguistic ancestors spent some time in and around the Caucasus.

Anyways you could write a book on this topic, it's fairly intense!

munchkin_utd

its pretty cool stuff all right.

Here in south germany there are a right amount of "irish" looking heads, rarely as pasty white as thoroughbred irish, but theres a deffo some class of common genetics there way back. Possibly through common descendants 1000s of years back OR what were those missionaries doing 500+ years ago in Germany?
It'd be cool to see where the connections are, genetic wise, or is it just chance that theres a pocket of pasty white freckly people in southern germany??

dubhthach

munchkin_utd wrote: »

its pretty cool stuff all right.

Here in south germany there are a right amount of "irish" looking heads, rarely as pasty white as thoroughbred irish, but theres a deffo some class of common genetics there way back. Possibly through common descendants 1000s of years back OR what were those missionaries doing 500+ years ago in Germany?
It'd be cool to see where the connections are, genetic wise, or is it just chance that theres a pocket of pasty white freckly people in southern germany??

Well for Genetic variability it looks like L21 has higher variety in France and over into souther Germany/Rhineland. The higher the varience the older the population.

The germans appear to have a fairly equivalent mix of "North European"/"South European"/"West Asian" admixture as us. Generally it's about 60-65% North European, 20-30% South European and 5-10% West Asian.

In comparison the population of:
Sardinia is 96.5% "South European"
Lithuanian is 88.7% "North European"
Georgia is: 75.2% "West Asian"

Some have theorized that the "South European" mix found in Northern populations is due to migration of farmers from the Mediterranean basin north bringing agriculture. Likewise it's been theorised that "West Asian" component is due to spread of Indo-European languages.

My signature is based off analysis of my sample against 10 population groups. There was also some finer grained analysis done by same project before where they managed to spilt the "west asian" component into two component populations. One that was 90% plus found in a population in Dagestan the other been found among rest of "west asian" population groups.

This Dagestan cluster was then looked for across all Eurasian samples and was found from Atlantic in west to borders of Burma in the east.

Anyways the field of population genetics is changing at a very fast rate. There is a new discovery made every 6months, if you look at research papers from 5-7 years ago they are already outdated as the "resolution" of testing has improved so much over time.

Dodecad Ancestory Project (Good blog): http://dodecad.blogspot.com/
Dienekes Anthropology blog (Dienekes runs Dodecad project): http://dienekes.blogspot.com/

Chris_5339762

Look at this geocache

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?wp=GC2M8D2

See what motorway its next to

http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=52.6163899898529&lon=-7.7752947807312&zoom=15

Now look at the cache code

GC2M8D2

Someone else is a road nut