Root canal treatment for molar - crazy price

Preciousmims

Hi

I'm just looking for some advice.
I need to get root canal treatment done on a molar and have been quoted €950 for the treatment and an extra €250 for a crown if needed, €1200 in total. (Practice is in Dublin) I feel that this amount of money seems crazy to be paying for this treatment and should be able to get a better price for good quality work elsewhere in rep of Ireland. Am I right?

georgieporgy

which molar is it?

Preciousmims

It's the back right molar.

georgieporgy

there are generally 3 upper and 3 lower molars on each side in a full dentition.
the complexity of rootcanal treatment varies depending on which tooth. (that's why i'm asking)

other factors like age and how heavily filled or decayed the tooth is has a bearing also. and is your quote from a specialist or a gp?

Preciousmims

Its the lower back right molar. The quote is from a specialist but he hasn't seen me yet. I said to the receptionist that the price may change when he sees it but she said "no thats the price".The consultation is €100 and now I'm thinking that prices may be extra high because it's Dublin. I really don't know what to do. Thanks for your replies

Big_G

250 seams inordinately low for a crown...

georgieporgy

950 for a lower molar by a specialist sounds middle of the range. A gp would probably be 6-800. (we charge 750, not in Dublin)

the 250 sounds like a fee for a core build up by the same specialist?

a crown would tend to be 6-900 depending on a variety of things.

(for example i charge 800 for crowns and that includes any necessary postcore buildups) somme dentists price these things separately.

Preciousmims

Big_G : This was quoted to me by the same specialist.

Georgieporgie: I think I'll shop around and see. Even €100 cheaper would make a difference. There are so many different guys out there providing the treatment though!

Thanks.

Stheno

Price sounds pretty normal to me I paid €900 for a root canal on a molar two years ago.

brianon

I had a tooth pulled today. Was given option of tooth extraction or root canal/crown.

Was told a root canal would be 750 and the crown would be 800. Sounds like your getting a good deal !

Bicycle

I had a lower middle molar root canalled and crowned earlier this year.

The RCT was by a specialist (in the Wesht) and cost €900 for consultation plus RCT. The tooth did not need a build-up and the endodontist did the amalgam filling. The crown done by my own (lovely) dentist cost €1,200.

I think you've got a real bargain.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

I wouldnt want a crown in my head that cost only 250 euro, thats really cheap. Are you sure its a crown and not a big filling.

Molar root canal is expensive and complex the price is about correct for a specialist endodontist.
If its a specialist carrying out the treatment, then you WILL find it cheaper eslewhere not with a specialist. If you value the expertise the specialist brings then its money well spent. Best to it right and do it once.

day dreamer

It sounds like about the right price the root canal treatment and maybe a post (replaces the missing core of the tooth after the root canal treatment and is cemented into the root) or a large filling.

for a crown €250 would be very cheap, it would barely cover the lab costs of getting it made up. You save a little by shopping around but not very much i would think. It is a big investment but worth it to keep the tooth

Preciousmims

Thanks everyone for your advice.
Just to clarify the prices that I mentioned above incase anyone is doing a search on this topic ,the €250 is indeed for a core build up and not for a crown as I initially thought.

Thanks again.

recedite

I paid €470 for RCT plus a ceramic inlay on a molar, lower 7, this time last year in a prime dental practice in Budapest. Excellent work, no problems.
I had to stay there for a week though, eating out, seeing the sights, and enjoying the hot springs. At the end of all that we (2 people) had spent just over a grand in total, inc the dentist and flights and accommodation, so its gonna cost you either way. But a much better way to spend a grand IMO.
Also they don't have pure endodontists over there; instead dentists who have additional training/ experience in endodontics. Their standards are very high IMO, better than here.

foret

"Their standards are very high IMO, better than here."


I am glad you had a good experience. Budapest I agree is a
wonderful city.

However i disagree that root canal treatment is better.

My experience is that it is not up to treatment carried out by endodontists in
ireland.

Not by a country mile ,IMHO.

That is not saying you didnt have competent treatment.

henryporter

Can't beat the endodontists for root canal work - I had two done in the US about 10 years ago, both pain free during treatment and trouble free since then. Cost about $350 each at the time.

alex73

Preciousmims wrote: »

Hi

I'm just looking for some advice.
I need to get root canal treatment done on a molar and have been quoted €950 for the treatment and an extra €250 for a crown if needed, €1200 in total. (Practice is in Dublin) I feel that this amount of money seems crazy to be paying for this treatment and should be able to get a better price for good quality work elsewhere in rep of Ireland. Am I right?

I went to get a Root canal treatment done 10 years ago, A dentist on Fitzwilliam Square can't remember her name, £500 just for the treatment not even a crown. But the treatment was very well done.

Did one in sligo 4 years ago and was not half as good. Paid less and the filling was not that good.

Personally I would pay the 1000 euros IF the treatment is top class and lasts.....

recedite

foret wrote: »

"Their standards are very high IMO, better than here."

However i disagree that root canal treatment is better.

My experience is that it is not up to treatment carried out by endodontists in
ireland.

Just to clarify; I mean that in my experience their standards of general dentistry are better, such as in regard to preparatory procedures, the inlay, surgery and equipment, general attitude to patients etc.
I would imagine that an Irish endodontist would be as good or better at just RCT, seeing as he does nothing else. However, that does not seem to me to justify the prices he charges. Then you would have to go back to your general purpose dentist afterwards for all the restoration work.

georgieporgy

recedite wrote: »

I paid €470 for RCT plus a ceramic inlay on a molar, lower 7, this time last year in a prime dental practice in Budapest. Excellent work, no problems.
I had to stay there for a week though, eating out, seeing the sights, and enjoying the hot springs. At the end of all that we (2 people) had spent just over a grand in total, inc the dentist and flights and accommodation, so its gonna cost you either way. But a much better way to spend a grand IMO.
Also they don't have pure endodontists over there; instead dentists who have additional training/ experience in endodontics. Their standards are very high IMO, better than here.

Sounds good. did the inlay cover the cusps? What occlusal thickness of ceramic?

recedite

georgieporgy wrote: »

Sounds good. did the inlay cover the cusps? What occlusal thickness of ceramic?

Then it would be an onlay, but I don't think there is any point to your query other than a vain attempt to undermine my credibility, and distract from the issue raised by the OP.

georgieporgy

recedite wrote: »

Then it would be an onlay, but I don't think there is any point to your query other than a vain attempt to undermine my credibility, and distract from the issue raised by the OP.

There is a point. I had actually hoped for your sake you had meant onlay.:)

btkm8unsl0w5r4

All root canal treated molars should have full coverage, inlays don't cut the mustard for coronal reinforcement. Chance of having that tooth in you head in 5 years is 50%.

I dont think that getting dental treatment cheaper in a low cost economy is a shock to anyone. In fact, I bet that the jobs, services or goods of any poster on here can be done cheaper by somebody in eastern europe.

recedite

It is technically an onlay, not an inlay, due to the extent and volume of occlusal coverage of vitreous material. But the fact that a patient's knowledge of the technical terminology is limited is no reflection of the quality of the treatment. I wouldn't really call it a low cost economy, any more than Spain. Definitely slightly lower than here, but not like say, India or Vietnam. Most things are a bit cheaper but dentistry is about five times cheaper for some reason.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Eh hungary is a low cost economy and Dental work is no more than half the price, and in my experiences it the quality thats 5 times less.....but thats just my experience.

I dont know what vitreous material is, virtuous silica is a clear ceramic not used in dentistry. Root treated molars should receive full coverage crowns, either a inlay or onlay is not suitable.

recedite

Also, I am always slightly amused at the slightly condescending catch all term "eastern Europeans" being applied to countries as far apart as Estonia and Poland in the north and Bulgaria in the east. There was a point to it in the days of the Iron Curtain, but not now. The term was adopted by Irish people during the Celtic tiger years to label the novelty immigrants, along with that other tautology the "Non-National" (which thankfully has now largely been replaced with "foreign national".
Similarly, in Cold War terminology Italy is part of western europe, but a quick look at your atlas will reveal that it lies in the south.

The Austro Hungarian empire was of course at the cultural heart of Europe for much of European history. We are the ones on the fringes.

recedite

Veda Large Tombstone wrote: »

Eh hungary is a low cost economy and Dental work is no more than half the price, and in my experiences it the quality thats 5 times less.....but thats just my experience..

..and your opinion.

Veda Large Tombstone wrote: »

I dont know what vitreous material is..

see here;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitreous_enamel
(porcelain)

btkm8unsl0w5r4

recedite wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitreous_enamel
(porcelain)

Did you read that link? Vitreous enamel has nothing to do with dentistry, Thats porcelain like on sink or enamel like on a bathtub, felspathic procelain among others are used in dentistry, your points are best made without misusing technicial words lifted from google or wikipedia.

Hungary is a eastern European country and a low cost economy compared to ireland.....these are facts, you points while verbose do not take away from this truth.

My opinions like yours are borne from my experience.

recedite

Veda Large Tombstone wrote: »

Hungary is a eastern European country and a low cost economy compared to ireland.....these are facts

Yes, its definitely a slightly cheaper place and east of Ireland.
As to whether a porcelain onlay is made of "a vitreous material", well I thought it was, but maybe some dentist could give a verdict on that?
These are not really major issues of disagreement anyway.

annieoburns

another option to consider for that kind of money is an implant.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

I am a dentist, and virtuous means clear, and root treated molars should all have crowns. An implant will be more than than if you take the extraction, crown and abutment into account. Probably twice that.

The average wage in Ireland is 47000 UDS and in Hungary is 15300 USD (OECD figures)....

watch the hop

I have been quoted a similar - though slightly lower price for root canal and crown work as the OP. I have been told I need it on two teeth - both adjoining upper pre-molars LHS. I want to keep my teeth and am going to get the treatment as the toothache is driving me nuts.

I may need to get a short term loan to pay for it though and was wondering what would somebody that was not in a position to borrow the price of it, do. Would they have to resign themselves to extraction of the teeth?

recedite

Veda Large Tombstone wrote: »

virtuous means clear, and root treated molars should all have crowns. .

Virtuous means good, and vitreous means glassy. Not transparent, but smooth as glass. So all dental porcelains and ceramics that are baked at high temps. are vitreous.

watch the hop wrote: »

what would somebody that was not in a position to borrow the price of it, do. Would they have to resign themselves to extraction of the teeth?

My Irish dentist presented me with the choice of extraction, or a trip to the endodontist for RCT followed by a return visit to him for restoration with a composite filling.
I found a third option (as described earlier) which was a better treatment, and in-between in price.

recedite

Some other related discussion here;

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056038891

Big_G

Its not actually a related discussion. And lets keep that discussion in that thread please.

Also the point is vitreous ceramics as classified in materials science are not used in dentistry. We use reinforced ceramics such as feldspathic, lithium disilicate reinforced, zirconia reinforced, alumina reinforced, etc.

It's interesting to note that the moderator that you are arguing this point with has forgotten more about ceramics than you will ever know and has a masters degree in prosthodontics. I think he knows what he is talking about.

Finally we are all glad that you feel you got a superior treatment for a lesser price, all of the dentists on this forum feel you got an inferior treatment at a lesser price, which backs up the statement you get what you pay for.

In your experience you got superior treatment. That's great, we're all delighted, there's no need to keep ramming the point home about how crap you think Irish dentists are. WE GET THE IDEA.


That is all.

recedite

Eh.. pulling rank does not alter the facts. The terms vitreous and reinforced are not mutually exclusive. All those materials can be classified with either or indeed both labels. No amount of jargon changes that.

I said Irish dentists were too expensive, not that they were crap.
However some other posters on here, apparently dentists, said that all RCT molars should be restored using a crown and not an onlay, apparently in an attempt to discredit Hungarian dentists.

When I mentioned that the original dental plan proposed by the Irish dentist involved a composite filling restoration after RCT on a molar, there was no comment. I myself am not qualified to speculate on whether this would have succeeded. One year on, I am confident that the onlay as recommended and provided by the dentist in Budapest is a success.

That is all.

flahavaj

recedite wrote: »

One year on, I am confident that the onlay as recommended and provided by the dentist in Budapest is a success.

That is all.

One year survival is not necessarily success.

It just hasn't failed.

Yet.

Big_G

recedite wrote: »

Eh.. pulling rank does not alter the facts. The terms vitreous and reinforced are not mutually exclusive. All those materials can be classified with either or indeed both labels. No amount of jargon changes that.

I said Irish dentists were too expensive, not that they were crap.
However some other posters on here, apparently dentists, said that all RCT molars should be restored using a crown and not an onlay, apparently in an attempt to discredit Hungarian dentists.

When I mentioned that the original dental plan proposed by the Irish dentist involved a composite filling restoration after RCT on a molar, there was no comment. I myself am not qualified to speculate on whether this would have succeeded. One year on, I am confident that the onlay as recommended and provided by the dentist in Budapest is a success.

That is all.

Actually they are mutually exclusive. Vitreous ceramics are amorphous (non-crystalline). All of the ceramics we use in dentistry are crystalline, and reinforcable with other particulate.

Maybe the access cavity that your original irish dentist was thinking of was small enough as to not necessitate cuspal coverage, and when the other dentist in Budapest accessed the root canal the hole was slightly larger therefore necessitating cuspal coverage.

I certainly wouldn't restore a root canal treated tooth with a feldspathic stacked porcelain onlay as they are notoriously brittle and fail under occlusal loading.

You insinuated that Irish dentists were crap by saying that the level of treatment you got in Budapest was superior. I have disagreed with that.

You don't know what you don't know about dentistry. You are not a dentist (even though you seem to think you know as much or more than one).

btkm8unsl0w5r4

All root treated posterior teeth should have full coverage. Without it the chance of fracture within 5 years is greatly increased. Its doesnt matter that you seem to think that kitchen sink ceramic was put in the hole, it makes no difference, it will still fracture.

On the vitreous point, I do have extensive knowledge of dental material science and the term vitreous is not used. Your trying very hard to convince us it is, however it think the use of technicial words to lets us all know you know what your talking about has backfired. Dentists dont expect patients to know technicial terms, so dont bother,

And Big_G its a doctorate I have......

georgieporgy

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recedite wrote: »

Eh.. pulling rank does not alter the facts. The terms vitreous and reinforced are not mutually exclusive. All those materials can be classified with either or indeed both labels. No amount of jargon changes that.

I said Irish dentists were too expensive, not that they were crap.
However some other posters on here, apparently dentists, said that all RCT molars should be restored using a crown and not an onlay, apparently in an attempt to discredit Hungarian dentists.

When I mentioned that the original dental plan proposed by the Irish dentist involved a composite filling restoration after RCT on a molar, there was no comment. I myself am not qualified to speculate on whether this would have succeeded. One year on, I am confident that the onlay as recommended and provided by the dentist in Budapest is a success.

That is all.

You make a good point here. I have found that some Irish (and English) dentists are slow to crown root filled molars. They fill it and say 'you should get that crowned sometime'. Such advice goes over the patient's head.I think they are worried about scaring the patient away with price.So to encourage them to save the tooth they recommend root canal now and crown later.
There is one instance where a crown may not be necessary - if the access hole is confined to the occlusal surface (marginal ridges remain intact) but even this depends on lots of other issues. (agreed doctor Fitz?)

btkm8unsl0w5r4

On posterior teeth I would always reccomend a crown. Oven if the marginal ridges are intact. The depth of the pulp chamber will lead to a lot of unsupported tooth structure. Its is highly unlikely a posterior teeth would need a RCT with only and occlusal access in general. Generally agreed georgie.

Having said that, would rather a tooth in the head with a rct than one in the bucket without.

georgieporgy

Yes I agree with all that. But there are those odd exceptions where teeth are unopposed or just opposed by denture etc. Or a geriatric patient. (or a medical card patient)

There is of course the question of needing a good coronal seal for the endo.

I favour crowns 95% (of the time)

lee4892

<snip>
Thanks for that but you obviously not only did not read the rest of this thread but you haven't read the rules of the charter.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Of course there are exceptions Georgie, but these prove the rule.

Snake Plisken

So just back from the dentist and he took an X-ray of my molar's on the left hand side, x-ray showed up decay at gum level betwen 6 & 7 on the front one, the tooth has a big enough filling in it, so plan is he is going to remove the old filling try and removed the decayed part of the tooth and then try and fill it, but he did mention the dreaded root canal, and from reading this thread looks like it could cost up to 1000 euros for this work.
Is the root canal work done over a couple of visits, or one sitting? Besides rooth canal or removal could an implant be done? Are we talking the same kind of cost or more? Might be cheaper as my brother in law in spain makes up ceramic crowns/implants in Spain. Any advise Appreciated.

recedite

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Is the root canal work done over a couple of visits, or one sitting? Besides rooth canal or removal could an implant be done? Are we talking the same kind of cost or more? Might be cheaper as my brother in law in spain makes up ceramic crowns/implants in Spain. Any advise Appreciated.

One sitting is needed, although the endodontists I rang wanted to charge for two (the first is a "consultation").
If you are using a spanish crown you would want to get the impression taken there too. RCT could be done anywhere and sealed up temporarily. An implant is dearer.

Snake Plisken

recedite wrote: »

One sitting is needed, although the endodontists I rang wanted to charge for two (the first is a "consultation").
If you are using a spanish crown you would want to get the impression taken there too. RCT could be done anywhere and sealed up temporarily. An implant is dearer.

I don't know if this is right or not but my wife had to have a tooth removed but she had a pin inserted (not titanium) with what she classes as a crown rather then an implant, now it fell out once tooth and pin but they managed to stick it back in, she reckons that it was a crown I'd call it an implant but maybe someone would clarify this for me.

Thanks

recedite

That pin was glued into the stump of a tooth under the crown, whereas the pin in an implant is fused directly with the bone in the skull, ie no tooth left at all.

Big_G

recedite wrote: »

One sitting is needed, although the endodontists I rang wanted to charge for two (the first is a "consultation").
If you are using a spanish crown you would want to get the impression taken there too. RCT could be done anywhere and sealed up temporarily. An implant is dearer.

Sometimes root canal can take more than one visit.

res ipsa

Big_G wrote: »

Sometimes root canal can take more than one visit.

Where I work it always does.

davo10

Guys, just noticed this website now advertising on boards, terrible dental clinic in eastern europe , I am dumbfounded. This is a clinic in Budapest advertising cheap dental prices, take a look a the pictures section and remember that generally clinics post their best patients on their website. To think that irish people are going there to have this type of work done and slag dentists here off about charging more here for quality work, the mind boggles.