Upgrade or build ?

RobertM

First of all, I`m kind of a thick when it comes to computers. I love playing games on my PC, especially FPS and RTS. With the recent games, my pc is struggling a bit and I don't know what to do with it, upgrade or build.

The current spec is:

Dell Inspiron 530

Processor: Intel core2duo e4500 2.2 Ghz
Video: ATI x1950 pro
Memory: I think it's this one
HDD: 320 Gb Sata
Monitor: 19"

What should I do with it ? Also the budged build/upgrade would be around 700€

Thank you.

massy086

build sell your current pc in either parts or as whole on adverts then add that to ur budget and your flying

Monotype

RobertM wrote: »

First of all, I`m kind of a thick when it comes to computers.

For starters, use the apostrophe key when typing I'm and not the grave accent key (`) and you're halfway there.

It's not a terrible computer and you could probably upgrade it into something a bit more powerful, but I wouldn't spend €700 on upgrading.

You might be able to pick up a nice quad core socket 775 CPU from adverts (some good deals since it's a dead socket now) for €150, but there's still some left in some places (make sure you shop around).
You should be able to upgrade this assuming your power supply unit can take the extra pressure and that dell haven't made the CPU inaccessible.

That motherboard has 4 ram slots by descriptions (but maybe double check), so you could probably pick up and extra 2GB fairly cheaply (€50).

The 5770 has a similar range of power consumption but would be the biggest boost to your games (€150).


Spending €700 on a new system would probably get you something similar, but maybe a better motherboard and a better power supply unit, unless you sell what you have and add it to the budget.

uberpixie

RobertM wrote: »

First of all, I`m kind of a thick when it comes to computers. I love playing games on my PC, especially FPS and RTS. With the recent games, my pc is struggling a bit and I don't know what to do with it, upgrade or build.

The current spec is:

Dell Inspiron 530

Processor: Intel core2duo e4500 2.2 Ghz
Video: ATI x1950 pro
Memory: I think it's this one
HDD: 320 Gb Sata
Monitor: 19"

What should I do with it ? Also the budged build/upgrade would be around 700€

Thank you.

Options

1) Massey's option is pretty much the standard response here. Ditch the old rig and build a good rig from scratch with a good case and power supply that will make your future upgrades easy. This can be easily done for under €700. Budget gaming builds are always better going the self build route than buying new. OEMs charge a fortune for rubbish builds that the label "gaming" pcs.

A little bit of research is all that is required to properly spec something for around €700.

You current rig is pretty much dead from an upgrading point of view: cramped case, low power supply and a limited Dell motherboard along with the fact trying to get a better core2duo or core2quad for your rig will be difficult as these parts are end of life.

2) Upgrade the gfx card in your current rig with a radeon 5770. The new gfx card will make a big difference in performance how ever your low speed CPU is going to let you down long term.

A fast Dualcore (core2duo 3.0ghz in intel) is required for good gaming performance in most games, after that a good quad core cpu is needed for a few games.

Depending on your motherboard, you may only be able to upgrade to a q6600 (quad 2.4ghz) which you can no longer buy first hand they are end of life. Also with a Q6600 you would ideally overclock it to around 3Ghz to get good performance out of it which will not be possible on a bog standard Dell motherboard.

It really comes down to the games you play and the performance you expect. Your present rig with a 5770 might be enough to play the games you want to play and get you by for another year or so.

You could always buy the the 5770 and add it to your current rig, test the waters and if you are still not happy, build a new pc and transfer over the 5770.....

RobertM

@massy086 Good point made. Completely forgot about selling this current setup.

@Monotype Yeah I know about that . I'm so used to play Counter-Strike and use the ` (console) everytime, that I simply forget the ' in sentences.

@uberpixie Do you have any idea how much I could sell this current setup for ? I'd rather get a new one, knowing that this has limited upgrade parts available.

Also from this pc I would keep the soundcard and CD-Rom. So anyone could "build" me a new pc ? Without monitor, keyboard and mouse.

Lu Tze

Monotype wrote: »

You might be able to pick up a nice quad core socket 775 CPU from adverts

The motherboard in the inspiron 530, if it is shipped with a dual core, won't support quads (looked into it when was looking to upgrade my own)

I seocnd the 5770 recommendation, mine worked out well when i had a low powered core 2 duo, it played most things at 1080p at medium to high settings.

Solitaire

1) Look at this
2) Remaining ~€200 plus what you get from selling the Dell on cheap 1080p monitor and Win7
3) ???
4) Profit! :pac:

If you can free up some more money feel free to get a slightly better CPU and/or GPU, particularly the GTX460...

RobertM

Nice . I would probably get a bigger hard drive, and I would say a minimum 450W power supply (good one). Had a problem in the past where someone suggested I should get a 550W power supply (made in china) because he reckoned it was good, and ended up frying my Pentium 4

Solitaire

Never ever listen to amateurs trying to "save you money" when it comes to PSU's, explosions are always the result! :o

Besides, that CX400 has more juice in its little finger than that "550W" unit would even claim to have, and the amount it could actually supply would likely be half that!! The only time I'd recommend a bigger one with that setup above would be if you intend to OC it to the very brink... and then you'd need a better cooler anyway!

Monotype

Lu Tze wrote: »

The motherboard in the inspiron 530, if it is shipped with a dual core, won't support quads (looked into it when was looking to upgrade my own)

Wow, that's crap.

Skerries

it's actually not bad a machine and should still play a lot of modern games with just a new GPU
maybe buy the GPU first, a 5770 as the lads suggest and see how much that improves the speed and if it is not up to scratch then build a new rig and use the GPU
I have a similar self made build and replaced the same GPU card nearly 2 years ago and it is still playing everything on max which is annoying because i want to justify a new build

RobertM

Skerries wrote: »

it's actually not bad a machine and should still play a lot of modern games with just a new GPU
maybe buy the GPU first, a 5770 as the lads suggest and see how much that improves the speed and if it is not up to scratch then build a new rig and use the GPU
I have a similar self made build and replaced the same GPU card nearly 2 years ago and it is still playing everything on max which is annoying because i want to justify a new build

I was thinking about that as well. Ok, I'm not playing everything on max, but I want it to be able to play smooth even with settings on low. Anyway I will keep an eye on adverts, to check if a 5770 pops up . Otherwise I think I will surprise myself with a birthday present in October, a new build :pac:

Lu Tze

RobertM wrote: »

I was thinking about that as well. Ok, I'm not playing everything on max, but I want it to be able to play smooth even with settings on low. Anyway I will keep an eye on adverts, to check if a 5770 pops up . Otherwise I think I will surprise myself with a birthday present in October, a new build :pac:

Mine was very similar to yours, inspiron 530 which i sold a while back, the original advert i threw up a benchmark from just cause 2 which might give you an idea of the difference upgrading to a 5770 would do. Average frame rate of 42, with settings at medium to high on a 1080p monitor

Benchmark in a pic on the advert here
http://adverts.ie/245518

Solitaire

Monotype wrote: »

Wow, that's crap.

Yep. Newer 530's had a G33 mobo, but most existing ones had an old 945G for quads and an even older 915G for dualies - and the 915 chipset can't handle even 65nm quads

RobertM

Hey guys, so as not to make another new thread, could you englighten me ?

Was in maplins today, just looking around and some graphics cards got my attention.

nVidia gt220 - 115 euro
ati hd5550 - 150e
hd5450 - 100e
hd4850 - 170e
4670 - 135e

Opinions ? I've no idea what differences are between them. Also if I'm getting a new card, the current one (powercolor x1950 pro) is going to be sold, what price should I advertise it for ?


Thanks

marco_polo

RobertM wrote: »

Hey guys, so as not to make another new thread, could you englighten me ?

Was in maplins today, just looking around and some graphics cards got my attention.

nVidia gt220 - 115 euro
ati hd5550 - 150e
hd5450 - 100e
hd4850 - 170e
4670 - 135e

Opinions ? I've no idea what differences are between them. Also if I'm getting a new card, the current one (powercolor x1950 pro) is going to be sold, what price should I advertise it for ?


Thanks

Promise you won't do that again for a start :pac:.

Horrible prices are horrible.

For the price they are charging for a HD4670 you could get a HD5770 online, or for 5-10 euros more a GT 460

Jonny7

RobertM wrote: »

Hey guys, so as not to make another new thread, could you englighten me ?

Was in maplins today, just looking around and some graphics cards got my attention.

nVidia gt220 - 115 euro
ati hd5550 - 150e
hd5450 - 100e
hd4850 - 170e
4670 - 135e

Opinions ? I've no idea what differences are between them. Also if I'm getting a new card, the current one (powercolor x1950 pro) is going to be sold, what price should I advertise it for ?


Thanks

If you want an absolutely no nonsense solution to your problem, then go online, order an ATI 5670 from komplett.ie or pixmania.ie. Sell your old card for 10 or 20 euros.

The ATI 5670 won't require you to change your power supply unit.

It will be about 3 or 4 times faster than the x1950 and will run most games comfortable on medium to high settings on a 22 inch monitor.

I have a slower dual core with a slower 4670 that runs most games fine on medium to high settings. If you are more obessed with getting higher and higher fps on higher resolutions then perhaps a more powerful card, but you may have to change the power supply unit in the pc as well which would cost about 50 or 60 euros

RobertM

I`m not after performance gaming for the moment. But some games that I have, it's quite unplayable after a while, frames after frames. So a new video card is good for the moment.

Anyhow, suggest me a new graphics card at around 150-170euro. Don't want anything fancy, just something that will work for the moment.

Thanks

EDIT: A graphics card compatible with the system mentioned in the 1st post.

Unregistered.

RobertM wrote: »

4670 - 135e

I bought a new 4670 (passive, might I add) online for half that price!

Solitaire

Even for Craplins those prices are beyond rancid :eek:

If you need a bit more grunt than a HD5670 then grab a HD5750 for €100-ish, they can handle everything up to nearly 1080p with ease and don't draw much more juice than a HD5670

RobertM

Solitaire wrote: »

Even for Craplins those prices are beyond rancid :eek:

If you need a bit more grunt than a HD5670 then grab a HD5750 for €100-ish, they can handle everything up to nearly 1080p with ease and don't draw much more juice than a HD5670

This ?

http://komplett.ie/Komplett/product/ZKB_01COM/10_GRPCARD/04_PCI-E/productdetails/10022835/Asus_Radeon_HD5750_1024MB_PCI_E_VGA_DVI_HDMI/90_C1CNU0_L0UAY0BZ/default.aspx

Solitaire

That's only €30-something overpriced :rolleyes::p

RobertM

Was looking on elara as well. But what's the difference if it's a Powercolor, Saphhire or Asustek ?

game4it70

RobertM wrote: »

Was looking on elara as well. But what's the difference if it's a Powercolor, Saphhire or Asustek ?

Warrenty length,
Bundled software,
Cables/adaptors,
Most of the time its the same PCB but cooler may be different.

RobertM

Oh ok. I'll decide on a 5750 in a couple of days, now have to check to see one at a lower price

Thanks.

RobertM

It seems that the video card has died last night. The fan refuses to start and I'm not even going to try and repair/change it, so it's time to splash out on a new system.

So build me a new gaming system at around 750-800euro. I won't need a hard drive, cd/dvd-rom, and RAM. Thanks.

Scorpion venom

just build

RobertM

Scorpion venom wrote: »

just build

Sorry ? Didn't understand that.

Monotype

When you say you don't need RAM, does this mean that you intend to reuse your existing DDR2?
You could build a system around that but I think that you might be better off considering selling the RAM and building a system around DDR3.

RobertM

Yep, sorry, just realised now that they are DDR2 . I was thinking about this.

What do you think ?

http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp;jsessionid=4D06EDAA2911D1683161931861B6F1AA.www3?aid=24487&agid=1010
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=37458&agid=1004
http://www3.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=22467&agid=689
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=22380&agid=282
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=18598&agid=240
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=26909&agid=631
http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=34888&agid=1232
http://www2.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp;jsessionid=293F4DE80E843856D4604925FA266F6C.www2?aid=38875&agid=1242

Monotype

The hard drive is a bit old, I'd go for the newer model at least.
http://www2.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=37168

PSU - It's one of coolermaster's better ones, but maybe consider the XFX 650W.
http://www4.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=36372

The RAM is slightly expensive. There's others for the same speed with better timings in that range. Most of the brands of RAM are ok.

Motherboard - You could probably do a bit better than that if there's money to spare. There's 880 and 890 boards for similar.

RobertM

MB:

http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=36060&agid=1232

http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=38185&agid=1232

http://www1.hardwareversand.de/articledetail.jsp?aid=38301&agid=1232

Which one ?

Monotype

The ECS comes with DVI, VGA, HDMI and display port, which is interesting. Probably not much use to you since you'll be putting in a graphics card.
The gigabyte is 790X + SB850, but I don't see any major differences because of it, apart from it not having onboard graphics.
The Asrock Extreme 3 seems to have good reviews and a good price. Possibly because there's an Extreme 4 now with USB 3 headers. The only possible downside I see is the eSATA is only 3Gbps, but you'd need to have an external SSD to notice the difference. You can also connect one of the internal ones to get 6Gbps.

I've read some stories commenting on ECS's poor quality but these were bottom end boards, so this one is likely to be better. I haven't seen enough on their recent boards to comment. With Gigabyte and Asrock, you should be reasonably safe.

RobertM

I think this is it

Any other thing to add ?:o

Solitaire

I was about to say "horrible build is horrible" but its improved immensely in that last post

Three things -

Swap the HD5830 for, well, anything else The GTX460 threashes it into next week, and those can be picked up for under €150! The 1GB version is more expensive but is close to HD5850 performance levels. AMD has no presence in that market segment at the moment (the HD5830 is a joke. A bad one ) and won't fix that until they hit out with the HD67*0 in a couple of months

That RAM is still pricey. You can get medium-latency 4GB 1333MHz kits for around €65 now, so a CL7 or medium-latency 1600MHz kit should be much cheaper

Do you really need a SATA3 HDD?!? No mechanical drive can really utilize it, hell they can barely saturate SATA1 fully! The Samsung F3 1GB is a little bit faster IIRC and only costs a little over €50!

Monotype

Haha, I misread it as a 5850 and was thinking it was going for a very good price.

RobertM

1.I don't get it with the graphics card. I thought it was a 5850. Why does it say EAH5830, then ATI 5850 ?

2. Does the name matter with the RAM ? Like Corsair and the rest are expensive, but does a lower brand offer the same performance ?

3. When it comes to the HDD, I'm really lost, never ever understood them Could you tell me specifically a good one at around 1TB ? Except the one you mentioned earlier, just wanna compare them. And I think as always, bigger brands are more expensive, Seagate, WD etc.


EDIT: The total budget is 900 including delivery. So if you wanna change something in the config, just go ahead

RobertM

Right, I think this is it. Opinions ?

Solitaire

Looking good IMHO

RobertM

Solitaire wrote: »

Looking good IMHO

Just a quick question. Between a AMD and Intel which is better at overclocking ? AFAIK the AMD's use less power than Intel's is that right ?

Solitaire

Intel?

In terms of power draw its i3 > X3 > i5 > X4 > X6 > i7

In terms of platform cost its X3 > X4 > i3 > i5 > X6 > i7

RobertM

Sweet, last question, I promise :pac:. Someone told me that with the the Phenom II x4 black edition can be "unlocked" from the bios, thus making it a x6, is that true ? Could save some money if it's true

Solitaire

Lies! The next refresh will be cut-down X6 dies, but all the current models on the market are quad-core, born and bred

RobertM

Thanks for that. So all being said, will order this in the next few days Cheers for all the help lads.

RobertM

Was kind'of bored now and made a intel based system.

Which is better out of them two ?

Solitaire

First one would be better at multitasking and apps performance. Second one might OC a little better and use less juice, but as it is you've specced a case that is not only inferior to the V9 but which is also too physically small to fit an ATX mobo, which you have specced. And mobo is LGA1156, while CPU is LGA1366! :eek::o Plus that cheap little cooler isn't much good for keeping a 95W CPU in check, so it wouldn't stand a chance against a 130W LGA1366 behemoth! Revoltec still don't stock any LGA1156/1366 120mm tower coolers which is a real shame, as the CM Hyper 212+ is gone so there's no decent heatsink for LGA1366 under the Mugen 2's €33 price-point and feck-all for LGA1156 on HWVS now

RobertM

Going to order the "comp2" one then. Thanks for all the help so far. Still got a lot to learn

RobertM

After receiving the parts this morning tried to assemble it today but with no luck. When I push the power button, the fans start, but the monitor says "No signal" and then goes black.

The wires I've done are:

ATX - 24 pins
ATX - 8 pins
CPU fan plugged in
Video card - 2x6 pins

As I said, if I turn it on it just says "No signal" and then nothing, no beeps or anything.

Opinions ?

Thanks

Solitaire

Try resetting the CMOS. If it still isn't working, remove the mobo from the case and put it on an insulated anti-static surface (most likely the bag it came from!) and test with just one stick of RAM and either onboard video or a graphics card if neccessary.

RobertM

Just my luck.. Look what happened Am I fcuked ?

Solitaire

Yep. Something's gone spectacularly wrong - looks like the entire 24pin socket literally cooked off :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek: Massive, massive mobo or PSU issue. That's not your fault unless you dumped the contents of a two-litre bottle of Coke on top of it prior to trying to power it up! :eek::eek::eek: