I fail at zerg

Tyrant^

Been playing the n00b(Practice) league just to get used to everything.
Doing ok with Protoss / Terran

Lost all games ive played zerg so far. Playing against Protoss and Terran mostly.
These games usually end up with everyone going for mass air tech units bc/carrier

Tried to counter this with mass corrupters just is not working out for me I keep getting spanked

Any ideas ?? Could of been just my economy or the fact im pretty clueless with zerg :rolleyes:

Dacian

Tyrant^ wrote: »

Lost all games ive played zerg so far. Playing against Protoss and Terran mostly.
These games usually end up with everyone going for mass air tech units bc/carrier

Tried to counter this with mass corrupters just is not working out for me I keep getting spanked

Any ideas ?? :rolleyes:

Not really sure. It seems zerg are the 'weaker' race at the moment. Personally I think this is partly due to the difficulty in playing with them. I find you need to be extremely good at multitasking to play zerg effectively.

In SCI going to mutas was a great tactic. They are not as good in SCII but they are very good to let you have map vision and a bit of control.

Have you tried using infestors with mind control against the BC/carriers?

Xios

Dacian wrote: »

Have you tried using infestors with mind control against the BC/carriers?

Can you MC air? what about a mothership
You distract the enemy with a lot of mutas while MC the mothership, that would then make all your units invisible?

seraphimvc

i am a zerg user and boy there are a lot of changes to zerg i must say in sc2!

i played a few practice matches in 2v2 mode mostly will win if the teammate is not a noob.the practice mode gave me an impression of they want us to get used to the multiplayer mode, ie you will see most players are just like playing a C&C game, mass produce army,send them to enemy base,gg. no real strategy at all. so go easy with the practice mode, try to just focus on practicing your best on macro management, ie build alot of units(roaches/hydralisk) as quick as possible.

i also found that when in a long game(lasts more about than 25minutes), is a straight gg if the opponents are terran/protoss against me zerg. i ask around the friends and basically what they tell me is atm in a high level match zerg just has no way to beat protoss/terran heavy army.

i think zerg player needs to constantly harass the opponents - the same strategy in sc1 but this time an extreme version. you cant sit in your base build up tonnes of ultralisk to win. what works for me is scout the opponent at around the time you get your first overlord, If he's not pushing, then go for a late spawning pool at 14 supply and then an early hatchery at 15 supply and usually i just harass them with zerglings(take down some probe/scv) and make hydralisk asap and send them off as soon as i think i can take him down. generally a win match for me is around 15-20mins - which is slow, i think pro player usually gg in 10mins :pac:

Stingerbar

Build up a big army and drop it in the back of his base, zerg is about expanding, pumping drones. Learn those hotkeys makes a big difference

Nody

seraphimvc wrote: »

i also found that when in a long game(lasts more about than 25minutes), is a straight gg if the opponents are terran/protoss against me zerg. i ask around the friends and basically what they tell me is atm in a high level match zerg just has no way to beat protoss/terran heavy army.

It is very possible; you can also see that in the pro tournaments but it comes down to micro and unit composition. Zerg is weaker but far from impossible (if I remember correctly 7 out of 50 top Diamond players in NA was Zerg with ~1/3 being zerg over all Diamond).

i think zerg player needs to constantly harass the opponents - the same strategy in sc1 but this time an extreme version. you cant sit in your base build up tonnes of ultralisk to win.

This goes for ALL races; if you sit back with out harrassing your opponent you're giving them freedom to do what they want. By harrassing them you force them to react to you and your forces (or he can kiss his mineral line good bye!) and keep on his toes and if lucky over pump defences (you out macro him) or not enough (you out micro him by killing workers).

This is also why scouting is so important to see what your opponent is building so you can ensure you have the appropiate counter units ready for when the harass comes; if not it will be gg.

TheDoc

The strength of the Zerg seems to lie in their fast pace in movement and unit production. This seems like they are tailored around being a harrassing race, similar to Night Elves in the WC3 vein.

If you harass your enemy, you are drawing their attention away. While they should be building something or units, they are watching a battle, remember most players you will face won't have the skillset to build units and waypoint them while microing a fight, SC2 is increasingly difficult because of general units low health compared to other RTS games.

If you can develop a way to multi task whilst harassing, you will gain the advantage. Zerg seems very much a race you need to do well with first half. The target of your harrasment should be enemy mineral gatherers and supply depots.

This will hamper them developing, advancing or even building an army.

Zerg are fast and mobile, get into your enemy close, when one of your units takes big damage, move him completely out of battle. This is micro, with the idea being if your opponent cant micro as well, their units will be following a retreating enemy, doing no damage, while your units can pick them off.

I've played tow Zerg players so far, and they didn't harass me and let me very much gain a major advantage in building an army of steel, which quickly destroyed everything he had.

Overheal

Tyrant^ wrote: »

Been playing the n00b(Practice) league just to get used to everything.
Doing ok with Protoss / Terran

Lost all games ive played zerg so far. Playing against Protoss and Terran mostly.
These games usually end up with everyone going for mass air tech units bc/carrier

Tried to counter this with mass corrupters just is not working out for me I keep getting spanked

Any ideas ?? Could of been just my economy or the fact im pretty clueless with zerg :rolleyes:

you're attacking the carriers, not the Drones, right? On straight auto attack your corruptors will just shoot down drones.

If they are just going straight tech to air then you need to be disrupting their economy earlier. Sending a couple earlier zerglings just to kite their probes/scvs away from the minerals for a minute will be plenty to give you an edge. Sending in roaches would cause plenty of havoc too.

Gummy Panda

I'm trying to get use to zerg as well as I haven't decided which race fits me best. I need to check out some zerg build orders for beginners.

#Daniel

I find Zerg rather cumbersome to play. I don't like having to get the queen to vomit over the base all the time, I usually forget. I also dislike the way units are made. Having to select the larvae, morph units into other units etc... I find the other two races easier to produce and build with.

That being said, I dislike playing against zerg. I get caught out a lot of the time with zergling rushes, and I absolutely hate the mutalisks - they are so powerful in numbers. What is the protoss counter to mutalisks btw?

RoyalMarine

#Daniel wrote: »

I find Zerg rather cumbersome to play. I don't like having to get the queen to vomit over the base all the time, I usually forget. I also dislike the way units are made. Having to select the larvae, morph units into other units etc... I find the other two races easier to produce and build with.

That being said, I dislike playing against zerg. I get caught out a lot of the time with zergling rushes, and I absolutely hate the mutalisks - they are so powerful in numbers. What is the protoss counter to mutalisks btw?

what i usually do is hotkey the queen's to say 1, 2, 3 and so on for all my bases.
double tap the number, and you zoom to the base.
i then have my resource spawn points set, and i select all hatchery's and hotkey them to 9.
once all hatchery's have produced the larvae, i just press 9, s, d and i make all my units.
i also have a communal military spawn point, so its the same routine.

9, s, t etc.

works a treat, and i can have my army building in the stroke of 3 keys.

Overheal

#Daniel wrote: »

What is the protoss counter to mutalisks btw?

http://sc2armory.com/game/protoss/units/phoenix

been getting my ass fedex'd to me all week, decided to play some zerg and go figure its a match. love sending zerglings in early just to keep drones etc. off of mining and the players attention away from building. By which time all my excess minerals go into another hatchery and another batch of lings. Throw in a Roach Den and Extractors and you're flyin. That is unless you get ****ed which is why i love this game.

seraphimvc

:pac: decided to skip practice to try abit of real action! attached a replay here for anyone who have no idea how zerg works bear in mind that i made tonnes of mistake so the replay should be only seen as a very basic zerg tutorial lol

Kulas Ravine.SC2Replay1v1 against terran(prob not noob), about 8minutes match. the strat is ling+roaches rush

Tyrant^

skipped the practice league too.... had like 20 more left.

first 2 matches both opponents going mass t1 units Marines and Zealots !

Was playing protoss and got colossus both times

Thought I was playing a silly AI for a moment

Replays attached if anyone can be arsed !

Gummy Panda

seraphimvc wrote: »

:pac: decided to skip practice to try abit of real action! attached a replay here for anyone who have no idea how zerg works bear in mind that i made tonnes of mistake so the replay should be only seen as a very basic zerg tutorial lol

Kulas Ravine.SC2Replay1v1 against terran(prob not noob), about 8minutes match. the strat is ling+roaches rush

Main things i noticed:

No scouting with overlords or drone.
Didn't get Zergling speed at 100 gas.

I do like zerglings with roaches against terran. I just did one of my placement matches against terran. I went zerglings (with speed) > banelings > roaches.

seraphimvc

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Main things i noticed:

No scouting with overlords or drone.
Didn't get Zergling speed at 100 gas.

I do like zerglings with roaches against terran. I just did one of my placement matches against terran. I went zerglings (with speed) > banelings > roaches.

ye panda i totally forgot about the speed tech. everything in my mind was about pumping out roaches i feel so bad about i didnt scouting early as i keep thinking this is like practice match the opponent is always opposite me(is my first league match ), that actually delayed me big time as i can actually gg him before his marauders out.

Gummy Panda

I love banelings against terran bio balls.
"hello marauders, say hello to my acid exploding friends"

seraphimvc

Gummy Panda wrote: »

I love banelings against terran bio balls.
"hello marauders, say hello to my acid exploding friends"

ye banellings are awesome,they are a must for terrans pumping teir 1 units what i tend to suffer now is terran with bunker chokepoint+banshee and protoss with mass stalkers(blink tech). and dont get me started on terran siege.gay.

Xios

seraphimvc wrote: »

ye banellings are awesome,they are a must for terrans pumping teir 1 units what i tend to suffer now is terran with bunker chokepoint+banshee and protoss with mass stalkers(blink tech). and dont get me started on terran siege.gay.

Yeah, got raped by stalkers, what's our counter for them? can hardl be ultralisks they're t3. roaches are armoured so they get raped and hyrdas/zerglings have too low health

Overheal

Gummy Panda wrote: »

I love banelings against terran bio balls.
"hello marauders, say hello to my acid exploding friends"

yes i just got wiped thinking roaches were the great counter to 50 marines... banelings next time.

Nody

Xios wrote: »

Yeah, got raped by stalkers, what's our counter for them? can hardl be ultralisks they're t3. roaches are armoured so they get raped and hyrdas/zerglings have too low health

Speedlings are cheap and fast enough to catch up to them (surround them and go to town).

Gummy Panda

Well i suck at zerg. Think its back to Terran for me.

I seem to find it easier to play them as they are very similar to most RTS units.

EDIT: I'm now in bronze league where i belong

Jonny7

Xios wrote: »

Yeah, got raped by stalkers, what's our counter for them? can hardl be ultralisks they're t3. roaches are armoured so they get raped and hyrdas/zerglings have too low health

Shouldn't really be asking for a 'counter', its more a question of how to deal with X or Y.

If a Protoss guy is your exact same level, they try to hit him with a combination, either zerglings/roaches, or zerglings/hydras or roaches/hydras..

Practice from just one base to see how many you can build up while still building drones. Banelings aren't so great against protoss. Also zerglings with speed are very effective. If you can click fast enough, you can hide some 'speedlings' near his base, then when he moves out, you can backstab him and run the speedlings in and massacre his mineral line.

Of course, as you get better, you will learn to scout your opponent and figure out if he is going zealot/stalker.. or early voidray.. or early dark templar and you'll find as you get more confident with zerg that you can deal with anything he can throw at you.. you just have to develop your own build that can be flexible to deal with what he is trying to do..

Basically to sum up, the best 'counter' to mass stalkers is your own strategy and skill and coordination. Reading tactics and listening to casters like day9 also helps a lot

Gummy Panda

Hmmm not so great at terran either. having a really bad day with quick matches.

I can't remember the name of the map but its basically the two bases are beside each other but u need follow a road around to the other one. in the centre is a xel'naga tower.

The ramp is very big so i had depot and barracks going down with a slightly gap. Opponent gets a probe into my base which i chase with scv. Bastard sneaked another one in and did a pylon in the corner i didn't see.

He then cannon rushed me

B00MSTICK

I'm finding the skill level is rising quickly, I've played 3 ranked 1v1s and won them all but I find myself getting creamed in custom 1v1s now

seraphimvc

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Hmmm not so great at terran either. having a really bad day with quick matches.

I can't remember the name of the map but its basically the two bases are beside each other but u need follow a road around to the other one. in the centre is a xel'naga tower.

The ramp is very big so i had depot and barracks going down with a slightly gap. Opponent gets a probe into my base which i chase with scv. Bastard sneaked another one in and did a pylon in the corner i didn't see.

He then cannon rushed me

hehe wait till you see terran+protoss crazy cannon rush lol

1v1 i am in silver 2v2 me and the friend actually love it to stay in bronze :pac: funny to crack these turtle people hehe

Xios wrote: »

Yeah, got raped by stalkers, what's our counter for them? can hardl be ultralisks they're t3. roaches are armoured so they get raped and hyrdas/zerglings have too low health

stalkers(+blink) is deadly only if you didnt see that coming and get caught by surprise and lack of units. mass zerling with roaches/hydra backup with a reasonable micro should be able to kill them. and yes ultralisk is best for them:P

Overheal

lately I've been ten-pooling and going Speedlings early. Seems to be a winner, then again we're in the bronze ling cos our 4th player is completely new. But having said that I've ripped through a couple proxy-marine/reaper attempts thus far. The Only problem I've been having so far is supply-locking myself: I can spawn lings faster than I can supply them

I swear though, after days of using reg. lings and going to speedlings: the upgrade is Night and Day. It's the difference between trash and triumph.

Xios

Ok, so i've been playing zerg a lot, on a steak, 8 wins in a row so far, i'm now 1st in my division.

My build order is now
Drones till 10 supply,
Then extrator, get 11th drone, then cancel extractor, so i then have 11 supply. (1 over the limit)
Then Spawning pool.
Extractor cancel trick again, so on 11 supply.
then overlord.
when overlord pops, 1 more drone, then just as my spawning pool is done, i have 3 larvae, pop 3 lings.
Then queen,
1 drone,
1 spine crawler for anti-rush and then either roach or banes and game ensues, unless i haven't won already.

Overheal

apparently eleven-pool is as old school as original SC but news to me


http://www.starcraft2strategymasters.com/zerg-rush-11-pool-versus-terran-replay-video/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cePKIZOuneA

seraphimvc

Xios wrote: »

Ok, so i've been playing zerg a lot, on a steak, 8 wins in a row so far, i'm now 1st in my division.

My build order is now
Drones till 10 supply,
Then extrator, get 11th drone, then cancel extractor, so i then have 11 supply. (1 over the limit)
Then Spawning pool.
Extractor cancel trick again, so on 11 supply.
then overlord.
when overlord pops, 1 more drone, then just as my spawning pool is done, i have 3 larvae, pop 3 lings.
Then queen,
1 drone,
1 spine crawler for anti-rush and then either roach or banes and game ensues, unless i haven't won already.

i do the very similar procedure for a standard 10 pool, except i click to spawn an overlord at 9/10, and then i hit a drone at 10/10,then i make 2 extractors when you nearly have 100mineral, click 2 drones, cancel extractors (supply is at 12/10:D), now make sure you have 300mineral 3 larvae to spawn 3 lings+ queen when the pool is done(can build extra drone while pool is building in early). usually is a 100% gg to nooby terran player :pac:

xios have you seen the bunker choke point terran? basically he built 2 bunkers very early and get marines(also very early,i checked the replay:pac:) in them right before i arrive, and then he mass marine+banshee :pac: i still havent figure out how to counter that - i quckly upgrade overlord to carry roaches/lings to his base but he has tonnes of marines there. maybe should carry banneling next time...

however i must say i will go 6/7 pool when against zerg player,especially in 2v2 situation,have the teammate make anti-air units.

saw some mass banelling harasser in some big choke point map for 2v2(he row alot banneling into our base and straight to worker lol and protoss tower rush is sick.

also, wanna try a 2v2 together next time?:D

Gummy Panda

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-Lv0TTMi1o

seraphimvc

Gummy Panda wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-Lv0TTMi1o

lol the cheesy zerg player said at the start of the game

Gybe

lol love the zoom in at the end, Bronze league! no wonder these guys failed to the zerg rush