Swordscc League Race tonight - Garristown

07Lapierre

Just a reminder:

Sign-on in Garristown this evening 6.30-7pm.
The race is listed as 3 laps of the Garristown - Ardcath circuit.(uuugh!)

See you there!

kennyb3

Hopefully the weather stays dry, few clouds lurking. Looking forward to it.

RobFowl

Ahh Garristown
Lap 1 get dropped over Ardcath then get back on
Lap 2 get dropped over Ardcath then get back on.
Lap 3 get caught by scratch shelled out over Ardcath then roll in with the other stragglers .....
A beautiful way to spend a Wednesday evening

(at that's when I'm going well :rolleyes:)

07Lapierre

RobFowl wrote: »

Ahh Garristown
Lap 1 get dropped over Ardcath then get back on
Lap 2 get dropped over Ardcath then get back on.
Lap 3 get caught by scratch shelled out over Ardcath then roll in with the other stragglers .....
A beautiful way to spend a Wednesday evening

(at that's when I'm going well :rolleyes:)

Thatrs not bad compared to my last attempt.

Beasty

RobFowl wrote: »

A beautiful way to spend a Wednesday evening

And to make things worse you'll have shaungil and me hurling abuse at you from one of the corners ...

Good luck to everyone giving this a go tonight - Staro must have a chance on this one, having placed in one of the early season races on this course.

07Lapierre

kennyb3 wrote: »

Hopefully the weather stays dry, few clouds lurking. Looking forward to it.

you haven't raced this circuit before then?

kennyb3

07Lapierre wrote: »

you haven't raced this circuit before then?

No so im probably being naive. I like hills though, they are actually my favourite part. I tend to struggle more on the flat/descents. Not saying they are easy just a good challenge!

PS I have absolutely no doubt i will come to regret saying this later and laughing at myself as im in a world of pain

English Bob

Hope the weather stays dry as hate racing in the wet!!
Prob gonna stay at the back as don't want to cough up a lung on anyones shiny carbon forks!!
Q like this circuit myself although it always seems longer to the end than I imagine.
Remember thinking I'd took a wrong turn the first time did this circuit as there was nobody in-front or behind me for ages!!
See you all tonight!!

07Lapierre

English Bob wrote: »

Hope the weather stays dry as hate racing in the wet!!
Prob gonna stay at the back as don't want to cough up a lung on anyones shiny carbon forks!!
Q like this circuit myself although it always seems longer to the end than I imagine.
Remember thinking I'd took a wrong turn the first time did this circuit as there was nobody in-front or behind me for ages!!
See you all tonight!!

Nice one Bob..get your excuses in early!

shaungil

Putting on my abuse hurling trousers as we speak. Hopefully will get on the first left turn to scoot back for the finish. Good luck to everyone.

Probably won't be doing many more laegue races for rest of season as have a lot going on and need to pick my races a bit more carefully.

07Lapierre

kennyb3 wrote: »

No so im probably being naive. I like hills though, they are actually my favourite part. I tend to struggle more on the flat/descents. Not saying they are easy just a good challenge!

PS I have absolutely no doubt i will come to regret saying this later and laughing at myself as im in a world of pain

You'll love it so. I'm looking forward to reading your report already! Though i have to say, i do prefer this circuit to the corduff circuit. Corduff is a longer, fairly flat route and then BANG, you hit the Nags head! ( 2 or 3 times) at least Garristown has hills everywhere!:D

chakattack

[QUOTE=
Remember thinking I'd took a wrong turn the first time did this circuit as there was nobody in-front or behind me for ages!!
See you all tonight!!/QUOTE]

That's my signature move

Beasty

chakattack wrote: »

That's my signature move

Now tonight it's complicated, as there is a right turn involved (but only one, fortunately). If there's no-one there with a red flag, blame shaungil:)

chakattack

Beasty wrote: »

Now tonight it's complicated, as there is a right turn involved (but only one, fortunately). If there's no-one there with a red flag, blame shaungil:)

I know - I made a point of checking out the course on Sunday evening but now I can't make it tonight

Best of luck to all.

English Bob

Dissapointed tonight with the lack of effort in group 2 to work together. Myself and maybe 4 others done most of the work on first lap with a few sandbaggers only showing themselves on the downhill sections. After working my nuts off for the first lap I realised my fitness was still compromised from last weeks chest infection. Anyway still managed to stay with main bunch when caught until getting dropped just before the school. Hard course made harder by carrying a certain number of scrubbers who obviously don't realise there's no I in t-e-a-m!!!

kennyb3

Well i ll cut straight to the point - was guaranteed 1st or 2nd after a break with Velo Bro and punctured with 750m to go. absolutely gutted to be honest, can defo see myself spending some time thinking about this one over the winter. Wanted it so bad i tried cycling on for about 200m on the rim but i was going nowhere fast and i could see scratch a 500m down the road so i had to pack it in. promptly f'ucked the helmet in the ditch in disgust.

Anyway, firstly congratulations to Velo Bro on a great win, and thanks for all the help/advice, it was pleasure to ride with you. We broke away on the big hill the first time around after 16k and stayed away for the other 29k (well he did anyway:(). I think your days are numbered in that group to say the least, as are mine based on what was being said after. I'll let you away with them jibes about my hairy legs at the start.

unfortunately i wont get a chance to make up for it as marshalling next week, then off on holidays.

Really enjoyed the race, great to make a break and get away like that in only my 3rd race. hill intervals in howth are really helping and racing is the best workout you can getI must say Velo bro did about 60% of the work, at times i just wasnt able to come through. I thought we rode very strong though and worked well all the way until i punctured. We keot the pace at around 33.5km/ph for each lap.

I would of happily taken second, i was mainly concerned about staying away as drilling myself to stay away and getting second was way better than messing around in last km and getting caught and coming 8th or so.

Still plenty of positives, feel im improving and enjoyed being in a break. Learned loads too again, such as that im hammering constantly like it's a TT and what gears suit me etc. Confidence is another thing, in my first two race breaks went and i didnt have the confidence to go with them. I probably caused the split going up the hill but once i seen Velo Bro go with me i just kept going. momentarily i thought about keeping the group together but thought sod it i ll go for it.

Thanks to all the marshals again and nice to meet Beasty after. Got some nice club kit too!

Beasty

Absolutely tremendous performance by you kennyb3 and Velo Bro - staying away for 2 laps on that course is no mean feat. Gutted for you about the puncture - Velo Bro was full of praise for you after the race.

Definitely think the pair of you are due "promotion" to Group 2 - that's 4 races limit have won this year - that group (or I should say some of the members of it) are way too strong for the handicap you've been getting:)

Sounds like the groups behind you could not get well enough organised, and by the last lap Group 1 had split up completely, leaving you guys about 90s ahead, and the other groups had dropped a number of riders also

Congratulations to Ryaner also, with a 6th place this week

RobFowl

English Bob wrote: »

there's no I in t-e-a-m!!!

There is an i in equipe though

kennyb3

Savage result Ryaner, did he finish with scratch as there were very few in that group at the end? If he did he was the best handicapped horse rider ever in group 1 a couple of weeks ago.

English Bob

Great effort by the riders who placed. it's one hell of a finish. I love the buzz I get from joining in these races and the main thing for me is seeing how I'm improving within the dynamics of the group I'm in. Think the handicap will prob need to be reviewed as there appears to be some savage riders in group 1. Well done to all who finished & thanks again for the time given up by those who marshalled & to Sam for organising the sign on etc.,

Velo Bro

Now now!!! Let’s not be too hasty about the handicap system. Both “KennyB3” and I feel it’s working quite well……….:D

It’s a really nice circuit plenty of drags and bends so you can be out of sight quickly if you get the chance. Started off in the group doing peel offs but it just wasn’t working well. I think it was a combination of too many and some uncertainty about what to do. On the hill in Ardcath we got away and just rode steady for the second lap, pushed it a bit more on the third lap when it looked like we could stay away. We worked well together all the way round. To be honest I was swinging the last couple of km’s and “KennyB3” seemed to be getting stronger.
I couldn’t believe it when you got a flat at that point, absolutely gutted for you!!!! I would have been happy with either 1st or 2nd after the evenings work. Can’t believe it’s only your 3rd race "KennyB3" I think the intervals in Howth are working out very well for you indeed!;)

Cheers and thanks to all who helped out again last night.

Velo Bro!

RobFowl

I'm so old can remember Velo Bro winning an open crit in 1989 !!

The first group was riding quite erratically all right up to the hill the first time. After you 2 got away we actually started to work better although there is quite a mix of abilities.

Well done on the win and it's been due for a while now....

PS you've been tagged and recognised by the handicappers

Hungrycol

English Bob wrote: »

there's no I in t-e-a-m!!!

These is a "me" though

Velo Bro

Ah!!! 1989 was a good year!!:).............

Velo Bro!

cyclegal

Originally Posted by RobFowl
I'm so old can remember Velo Bro winning an open crit in 1989 !!

So am I :eek:

kennyb3

RobFowl wrote: »

I'm so old can remember Velo Bro winning an open crit in 1989 !!

Velo Bro wrote: »

Ah!!! 1989 was a good year!!:).............

Velo Bro!

feck sake lads, i started school that year:D

RobFowl

kennyb3 wrote: »

feck sake lads, i started school that year:D

I left school the year before :eek:

07Lapierre

RobFowl wrote: »

I left school the year before :eek:

I left school in 1985!...left college in 1990!.....

Planet X

Jasus lads. Did the Leaving in '78.

Ryaner

English Bob wrote: »

Dissapointed tonight with the lack of effort in group 2 to work together. Myself and maybe 4 others done most of the work on first lap with a few sandbaggers only showing themselves on the downhill sections.

Group 2 shot off right from the start. Pace was very choppy too during the time before I broke away. But yes there were quite a few who only moved to the front during the descents. Kind of pointless. It did show too when the time gap to group 1 went up during the second result.

kennyb3 wrote: »

Savage result Ryaner, did he finish with scratch as there were very few in that group at the end? If he did he was the best handicapped horse rider ever in group 1 a couple of weeks ago.

I did finish with scratch, sort of. A few of them were ahead and I cracked about half a km from the end, but on the last kick up I recovered and made back a place, almost two.
When they caught us we thought we were going to lose getting a place completely, especially annoying having been out on our own for a lap and a bit.

Full report up at http://blog.stephenryan.ie/2010/07/race-report-garristown-ardcath/ but my stats as follows.

The Stats:

Distance: 44.05km
Time: 1:14:38
Avg Speed: 35.4km/h
Calories: 1183
Avg Power: 266watts
Normalised Power: 312watts

Think I'll be trying group 3 next week. :rolleyes:

kennyb3

Ryaner wrote: »

I did finish with scratch, sort of. A few of them were ahead and I cracked about half a km from the end, but on the last kick up I recovered and made back a place, almost two.
When they caught us we thought we were going to lose getting a place completely, especially annoying having been out on our own for a lap and a bit.

Think I'll be trying group 3 next week. :rolleyes:

Great stuff you are obviously very strong to finish with them guys on that hill. group 3 will be no problem to you

Beasty

Ryaner wrote: »

It did show too when the time gap to group 1 went up during the second result.

Group 1 normally start with about 6 minutes handicap, and by the first left-hander (where I was marshalling) this was down to 5 minutes. By the 2nd lap you had brought down the gap to the main part of Group 1 to less than 3 mins, although Velo Bro and kennyb3 were about 45s ahead of that. The interesting thing was that those 2 were riding at the same speed as the whole of Group 2 did in the first 2 races on this course earlier this season - more evidence they should be promoted to Group 2;)

I'm not too surprised therefore that some of Group 2 were only going to the front on the descents - I suspect they were hanging on for dear life on the rest of the course!

Ryaner wrote: »

Think I'll be trying group 3 next week. :rolleyes:

You stay where you are for another week, and remember to wait for the rest of us at the top of the Nags Head - I'm more than happy to pull you down the other side;)

kennyb3

Beasty wrote: »

The interesting thing was that those 2 were riding at the same speed as the whole of Group 2 did in the first 2 races on this course earlier this season - more evidence they should be promoted to Group 2;)

You need a new watch beasty:D all i can say is get lost! Ah no the only race i ve left anyway that i can do this year is the hill TT. Good winter training and start in group 2 next year!

Beasty

kennyb3 wrote: »

We keot the pace at around 33.5km/ph for each lap.

Beasty - first Garristown race report wrote:

Average speed - 33.3kph

Beasty - second Garristown race report wrote:

Average speed - 33.5kph

kennyb3

Different wind speeds obviously;)

RobFowl

Feeling a bit naked doing this but ...
Here's my stats , the average speed is probably a bit higher as I only stopped it a few minutes after the finish



And this was the last race where I was in group 2 and finished in much the same position but didn't ride hard into the finish.


I suppose this says Group 1 is going at the same pace as group 2 was a few weeks ago. Less depth and only a max of 8 doing regular turns but the defections from group 2 to group 3 has definitively wekened it while the influx and development of group 1 has improved it markedly.

kennyb3

Ah man all this gadgetery is sick. im with shaungil on this one, im happy to ride my bike as fast as i can. seriously tho, i ll have to start analysing my own performance next year

GlennaMaddy

RobFowl wrote: »

Feeling a bit naked doing this but ...

Is that the best you could do!!! FFS try harder next time, you're putting us all to shame

RobFowl

GlennaMaddy wrote: »

Is that the best you could do!!! FFS try harder next time, you're putting us all to shame

Could be worse....

I have polar stats from the time I crashed badly, speed went from 45kph to 0 and my HR didn't drop for the next 40 mins (Was out cold during this :rolleyes:).

Also have stats from the Bog course last eyar when sprinting against Staro for 2nd (was beaten) hit 52kph and with a HR of 197 at the finish..

mc2000

I was in group 2 last night, and for sure the pace setting was a bit hap-hazard/choppy, and I think it was down to a few factors; there were 2/3 lads who were very strong, [hadn't seen them in group 2 before, although I was away the last fortnight] and would, I imagine, find group 3 well within their abilities. The 2/3 are the same 2 who broke away, and its also down to the way they broke away, they more like drifted off the front [just after going thru Ardcath the 2nd time] and then worked together to keep their advantage, and then the third lad attacked and might have bridged across on the last lap - this all shows that those 3 lads certainly have plenty of strength over and above the rest of the group.

I also think this course is quite tight, and that makes it a bit harder for a group to get organised, and with it being so lumpy a lot of lads might be on the rivet a good bit of the time esp. when you've got lads who are a good bit stronger.

Myself, I was finding it hard as hell just to hang on for the first 2 laps, and onto the 3rd lap as well, and then we were caught by all the other groups, held on as far as the school in Ardcath but then the elastic snapped, came in with a few others after the bunch - could see them finishing up the road, but no way was I going to be able to catch them up again after getting dropped.

Ryaner

mc2000 wrote: »

I was in group 2 last night, and for sure the pace setting was a bit hap-hazard/choppy, and I think it was down to a few factors; there were 2/3 lads who were very strong, [hadn't seen them in group 2 before, although I was away the last fortnight] and would, I imagine, find group 3 well within their abilities. The 2/3 are the same 2 who broke away, and its also down to the way they broke away, they more like drifted off the front [just after going thru Ardcath the 2nd time] and then worked together to keep their advantage, and then the third lad attacked and might have bridged across on the last lap - this all shows that those 3 lads certainly have plenty of strength over and above the rest of the group.

I was the guy in red who broke away. If it looked like we drifted away, let me tell you it was the hardest drifting I've ever done :eek:
Really was the wrong place for me to go - I hate the flats and was dying during them last night.
Oh and that was my 3rd ever race thus group 2.

shaungil

kennyb3 wrote: »

Ah man all this gadgetery is sick. im with shaungil on this one, im happy to ride my bike as fast as i can. seriously tho, i ll have to start analysing my own performance next year

I feel like a fraud. I got a loan of a powermeter for a week. I swear it means nothing I was just curious and wanted to try it out. It's going to Staro next.

I feel dirty.

Homme Enigmatique

Tough race last night, very windy. The circuit is very much an undulating one and really exposes the different levels of fitness in each group. A lot of guys have to sit on for different parts of the circuit to let them recover before certain hilly parts on it & then as always on the last lap once the last turn is made it is tough all the way to the line with a long hard drag up to the finish. The groups & different compositions in each of them are very much one of the ever changing variables that make up the club league. Next week will be once again a hard race & I think the last 2 races are a little easier. It appears that the numbers every week for this year are up on last year. It proves that the league is going from strength to strength. It was a good win for Velo Bro last night on what was a tough circuit & himself & Kennyb3 have only ridden a few of the races too.

BTH

Quick question. Are these club league races a closed shop or are other cycling club members allowed take part? I'm in a cycling club down the country, but for mid-week racing/training it's a bit too far to travel after work. I do get out for the weekend spin with them tho.

Cheers

Beasty

BetterThanHoyte wrote: »

Quick question. Are these club league races a closed shop or are other cycling club members allowed take part? I'm in a cycling club down the country, but for mid-week racing/training it's a bit too far to travel after work. I do get out for the weekend spin with them tho.

Cheers

Technically we are limited to 5 clubs participating, and there are open invites to certain clubs (Dublin Wheelers, Stamullen and Navan being the main ones that riders turn up from). I would suggest you drop 07Lapierre or RobFowl a PM if you are interested in taking part in Swords races, as there may be scope if you ask in advance, and they are probably the boardsies with the best understanding of the situation concerrning the club

abc_xyz

Quick stats for the 3rd group from my Garmin (no power) for those interested in comparing groups:

Avg/Max speed: 36.9km/h, 63.7km/h
Avg/Max HR: 168, 185
Time 1h11m20s
Distance 43.91km

I managed to stay with the group the whole way around until the left turn just before the school when I got caught out on the climb. Took a while (and a lot of effort and all that was left in my legs) to get back to the group but the leaders had already gone by then. Finished at the back of the very splintered main group. Happy i survived another week in group 3 especially as the legs and body didn't feel up to it at the start. Heart rate average and max were both 5 beats lower then last week.

GlennaMaddy

Lads, due to last minute illness, we need a Swords A2,A3 or A4 rider to complete a team for the TainTeamTour which starts tonight (finishes Sunday afternoon).

Let me know if you're interested (PM me)
Glenn

English Bob

How come if your new to racing you get put into group1?!! My first year this year and didn't get the chance to try-out in group1.
After a bit of begging was able to be put into group2 instead of originally being told to start in group3!! Reckon group3 wouldv'e put me off racing for life!!
Reckon there's a few guys that have some great ability and are underestimating themselves re racing. Results show that whether or not you are new to racing there is no way you should feel threatened in any way about going into a harder group. if you can ride with a group that is a similar ability to yourself then that will really give you a true experience of how to race.
This is a great league and am sure that's why it's so popular.
Great to see those new cyclists doing so well and it's encouraging to those of us who've only began racing this year also.

Beasty

English Bob wrote: »

How come if your new to racing you get put into group1?!! My first year this year and didn't get the chance to try-out in group1.
After a bit of begging was able to be put into group2 instead of originally being told to start in group3!! Reckon group3 wouldv'e put me off racing for life!!
Reckon there's a few guys that have some great ability and are underestimating themselves re racing. Results show that whether or not you are new to racing there is no way you should feel threatened in any way about going into a harder group. if you can ride with a group that is a similar ability to yourself then that will really give you a true experience of how to race.
This is a great league and am sure that's why it's so popular.
Great to see those new cyclists doing so well and it's encouraging to those of us who've only began racing this year also.

Same here - put straight into Group 2, despite being a novice vet! - My problem was I'd been doing some work with shaungil and the guys over the winter, and did OK in the hill climb at the start of the season

TBH, I am grateful I was put in Group 2, as there are some pretty experienced guys in there who showed me the ropes. The problem with Group 1 earlier in the season was there were few riders in it, with vastly different experience and ability, and we were catching them very quickly in most races

I guess the newer guys who have come along had no track record, or anyone to comment on their ability. Anyway they have done wonders for Group 1, and some of the other guys in there seem to have a new lease of life.

The good thing is that the new guys are getting promoted and will eventually settle in the appropriate group. If they manage to get some extra points on the way there, good luck to them - hopefully it will encourage them to get even better, and make the league even stronger. I don't think anyone goes out to undersell themselves when starting out - until you have tried the racing, you really don't know how you will cope.

One great example is kennyb3, who had a bad experience last year, which seemed to put him off, but has come back clearly much stronger and given it a go, and has, I suspect, significantly surpassed his expectations.

shaungil

Ah the old I've been shafted with my group discussion rears it's ugly head. I really think that most people are able to move up a group and hang in if they're contributing work to their current group. And if you don't know there is only one way of finding out.

Personally I feel I get a harder workout in an easier group cos I can do longer and more turns on the front but have tried a harder group once which I was able to hang on in. Bog of the Ring best place to try this of course not Corduff.

Also it depends what you want from the league do you use it for training for open races (my choice) or is this your main competition or are you just figuring it all out. Currently I believe group 3 and 4 are mixed which puts a wide range of guys so to move from group 2 to this would be tough.

However after seeing the club champs and often being in groups where we catch groups ahead there's plenty of guys well able to move up if they wish to try it out.

kennyb3

Beasty wrote: »

One great example is kennyb3, who had a bad experience last year, which seemed to put him off, but has come back clearly much stronger and given it a go, and has, I suspect, significantly surpassed his expectations.

Thanks beasty, yeah i started in group two last year as id been sighted at a couple of the half 8 spins, but if the truth be known i only did 3 of them - first one dropped, 2nd wheel trouble and just about held on 3rd time. i found my first race really tough and was dropped after about 10k of 50k. not a good experience. id only been cycling 6 weeks and done about 1000k, i wasnt ready at all. never went back.

Anyway, this year i ended up back in it, although belatedly (my first spin was only 1st May), done more structured training and as beasty says have been very surprised - i expected to be dropped for few races. Its funny because i barely finished the first race and felt like death all the way through it trying to hang on esp on the flats.

Amazingly my big worry was about being put in group 1 and never being noticed enough to get out of it - something i definitely want to do. Personally i cant wait to get up to group 2 and maybe further up the groups eventually.
I ll be training like hell to make sure i come back one of the better lads in group 2 in the hope i can get up to group 3 by the end of next season.

id rather be riding well in group 3 than winning races by sandbagging in group 1.

Also here is my 2c on scrubbers and the like - personally i think when your having that little chat at the start, round up a few lads that want to work and just get 5-6 together and try catch the group in front. ignore the scrubbers ride your own race and hopefully if you's work hard enough you ll get rid of them. Anyway by working hard you ll be all that bit stronger for open races and the other lads will be struggling. thats the way i see it and how i ll always approach racing.

Would have been nice to win the other night but in hindsight im glad it went well, i proved im too strong for that group and can get my free transfer.:)