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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭cushtac


    Not Norway,but then again i don think they are planning on going to war either,maybe thats why its called defence forces
    icon12.gif

    Norway is a NATO member, it had troops in Iraq and currently has troops in Afghanistan.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 56 ✭✭Captainship


    cushtac wrote: »
    Norway is a NATO member, it had troops in Iraq and currently has troops in Afghanistan.
    So Whats that got to to with it,they still use conscripts,which make up their defence forces.
    I thought that was what this thread was about!!!!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭cushtac


    So Whats that got to to with it,they still use conscripts,which make up their defence forces.
    I thought that was what this thread was about!!!!

    You brought it up, I would have thought you'd know what it has to do with it.

    You said they weren't planning on going to war, I pointed out two recent conflicts they've taken part in.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 56 ✭✭Captainship


    cushtac wrote: »
    You brought it up, I would have thought you'd know what it has to do with it.

    You said they weren't planning on going to war, I pointed out two recent conflicts they've taken part in.

    I know they are part of Nato,and i know they have troops in Afghanistan,but the soldiers abroad are not part of the Conscript defence forces,they are professionals.icon7.gif


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,663 ✭✭✭Cork24


    professionals.. if you were Conscript into the Army it is now you job. you job is to serve your Country in any shape or form. if it goes to work then you do your bit.

    Ireland are in Afghan.. for a country that had Men in almost Every War their was, we don't act like it. For a Country as Small as Ireland we need a bigger voice in Europe.. We just a ****ing Mouse In a Dogs World when it comes to Europe. We Voted No to the last Treaty.. Hell Europe was going to push on with out us. that's how little we are to them. We need Europe. we need to grow a bigger pair of Balls and Join NATO put more money into our Forces, Show the rest of Europe were Ready to more with you in keeping Euro Zone Safe and Free from anykind of Attack..

    We Cant even Stop a couple of guys running around with masks calling them self's the Real IRA.. so how are we meant to stop some Muslim who would love to kill Every one that makes fun of the Muslim World?

    Holland is just as Small as Ireland and Yet it seems to have more of a voice in Europe why as it all comes down to Power in which Power we dont have and people are saying we dont need a bigger Army Navy or Air.

    Nato was build to stop Russia now Russia are apart of it. What does it tell us? if were not in it we can not Ask for their help if we ever need it?

    So.. if we did go to War in any place and a couple of professionals as you call them got killed we never hear the end of it. but yet if some one in a Building Line went to Work and fell off a building or a Mother five died in a Car Crash. We go Ahh at lest it was'nt me..


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 56 ✭✭Captainship


    Cork24 wrote: »
    professionals.. if you were Conscript into the Army it is now you job. you job is to serve your Country in any shape or form. if it goes to work then you do your bit.
    QUOTE]

    I dont know what you mean by conscript.
    In Norway its 6-9 months compulsory duty from you are 18-44 years.
    This is also includes the reserves.After 35 years of age.They are there to protect the country.Most are transfered to the homeguard when finished their duty.
    Noone is sent to Afghanistan or Abroad.
    The professionals Telemarksbataljonen,Marinejegere MJK,Forsvarets spesialkommando FSK the special forces who are on contract and volunteered are in Afghanistan and abroad.NO Conscripts.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭private2bcadet


    our voice in europe has absolutely nothing to do with our military you nimrod!
    you really havnt a clue do you? you think the ira are just people with masks? you are the defenition of a walter mitty. i completely disagree with what the ira do and have done... but even i will admit... their professionalism, makes the taliban look like the bloody boyscouts! the brits are hammering the taliban! they admitted they couldnt beat the IRA!


    it takes a lot more 'balls' to stay out of a bloody military alliance than to just give in and join!


    pretty much everything your saying warrants the question 'what the hell is this guy even talking about'

    because you have no idea what your on about! you dont even know that ireland practically is a member of NATO. we're just not subject to article 5 of the treaty!

    little idiots like you really grind my gears,... but you know what really annoys me... all your friends, if you have any, probably think you know everything about the military world cos you seam to be very outspoken about it! so your probably tainting their opinions with your muck aswel! little do they know,, you are actually making things up,, and living by philosophies designed to make computer games sound cool!

    you have all these opinions,, and every single time i point out how flawed they are, you just switch to some other crap and start pretending you know about it!

    if your as un-irish to assume, they royal irish is not a part of the british army, and its the army of northern ireland, then you dont get to have opinions on ireland, or her foreign policy!

    quit while your ahead


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 56 ✭✭Captainship


    our voice in europe has absolutely nothing to do with our military you nimrod!
    you really havnt a clue do you? you think the ira are just people with masks? you are the defenition of a walter mitty. i completely disagree with what the ira do and have done... but even i will admit... their professionalism, makes the taliban look like the bloody boyscouts! the brits are hammering the taliban! they admitted they couldnt beat the IRA!


    it takes a lot more 'balls' to stay out of a bloody military alliance than to just give in and join!


    pretty much everything your saying warrants the question 'what the hell is this guy even talking about'

    because you have no idea what your on about! you dont even know that ireland practically is a member of NATO. we're just not subject to article 5 of the treaty!

    little idiots like you really grind my gears,... but you know what really annoys me... all your friends, if you have any, probably think you know everything about the military world cos you seam to be very outspoken about it! so your probably tainting their opinions with your muck aswel! little do they know,, you are actually making things up,, and living by philosophies designed to make computer games sound cool!

    you have all these opinions,, and every single time i point out how flawed they are, you just switch to some other crap and start pretending you know about it!

    if your as un-irish to assume, they royal irish is not a part of the british army, and its the army of northern ireland, then you dont get to have opinions on ireland, or her foreign policy!

    quit while your ahead

    Well saidicon10.gif


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭private2bcadet


    Well saidicon10.gif


    haha, thanks!


  • Registered Users Posts: 499 ✭✭MACHEAD


    I think that movie with 'Brice' in it was on TV recently, most likely he's just got carried away.........yippie kai aay mother****ers!


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭private2bcadet


    MACHEAD wrote: »
    I think that movie with 'Brice' in it was on TV recently, most likely he's just got carried away.........yippie kai aay mother****ers!

    haha


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 bouse23


    you always here in daily mail type newspapers if everyone did national service there would be no crime. i was in finland a few years ago a nuetral country with compulsury national service for males and people there used to say that guys came out of the army wild they all drank too much and got into fights all the time and that scrapping national service would reduce crime drunkeness etc


  • Registered Users Posts: 38 Kinza


    Cork24 wrote:
    Any Way you just wait and see.. Ireland being Over Run in a few years time!

    or maybe sooner then you think!! North Korea will Nuke South, America will Bomb the **** out of North Korea, China Russia will condemn America and South Korea for its actions and hell we have WW3 on our hands!

    Hell its only 16 more Months till Dec. 2012


    Just came across this thread today and was surprised to see that the op, who seemed to be shot down throughout this thread for his views, may have actually been on to something here all those months ago going by recent events in asia!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,663 ✭✭✭Cork24


    Seen, that the GDP of Ireland and the Loan Rate were getting off the IMF is going to hit around 1billion a year, Now with the size and Exports this country has, how are we going to pay this back?

    1. We will have to sell some of our Army base around the Country to Either US or NATO. Since US Army in Germany Contract is all most up, US were looking at Bosnia for their base. but since Ireland will need money to ease the pressure i think we could sell to the US Army, After all the US always wanted an Army base here.
    Our we could Sell Cobh Naval base back to the British Army.. since Churchhill wanted it back during WW2

    2. We could join NATO which in turn help our Finances in the Deference force

    3. Look we have around 30% of people on the Dole,, around 18% are fit enough to join the Army, Look 1. 18% off the Dole would ease our pockets, if this come in, the 18% will serve in the Army for the 4year bail out plan @ 8euros an hour, @ 30hrs a week 240 plus Taxes. they will be coming out around 200 a week same as their getting on the Dole but at lest they will be paying Taxes and off the medical Card.

    out of the 18%. 4% place in prison's, the others will be in Search & Rescue, etc.

    we could get people off the dole on min Wage onto jobs Cost Guards, Police Force, Fire, anything with State Jobs under a 4year.


  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭BuckJamesRogers


    cushtac wrote: »
    Most of Europe has either done away with conscription or is in the process of doing so.

    Austria still has it. You have the choice to do so many months of military service or so many months of a community based service instead.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,267 ✭✭✭concussion


    Austrian Green Party MP says conscription is
    "inappropriate and extremely expensive"
    while the Defence Minister calls it a success.

    http://www.austriantimes.at/news/General_News/2010-07-12/24950/Greens_want_conscription_referendum

    This may also be of some interest
    http://www.isn.ethz.ch/isn/Current-Affairs/Security-Watch/Detail/?lng=en&id=91858


  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭BuckJamesRogers


    concussion wrote: »
    Austrian Green Party MP says conscription is while the Defence Minister calls it a success.

    http://www.austriantimes.at/news/General_News/2010-07-12/24950/Greens_want_conscription_referendum

    This may also be of some interest
    http://www.isn.ethz.ch/isn/Current-Affairs/Security-Watch/Detail/?lng=en&id=91858

    Most of my mates there chose the community type service thing but 3 of them went for the military type service. I think (open to correction) it's nine months long...Austria is quite similar to Ireland (in terms of neutrality and attitude to military) IMO.

    Not sure the same would work here though


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 16,164 Mod ✭✭✭✭Manic Moran


    Most of my mates there chose the community type service thing but 3 of them went for the military type service. I think (open to correction) it's nine months long...Austria is quite similar to Ireland (in terms of neutrality and attitude to military) IMO.

    There are some minor differences.

    2nd-eurofighter-austria-2.jpg

    Leopard_2A4_main_battle_tank_Austria_austrian_army_640.jpg

    NTM


  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭BuckJamesRogers


    There are some minor differences.

    2nd-eurofighter-austria-2.jpg

    Leopard_2A4_main_battle_tank_Austria_austrian_army_640.jpg

    NTM

    Granted, still very similar to Ireland in terms of their definition of neutrality though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,772 ✭✭✭meathstevie


    Cork24 wrote: »
    do something different to the World join the Irish.
    or be a prawn in the British Army, at lest they make a difference. Number one evening tho their part of an British unit. their still their to serve the people of the North keep the peace between the two groups.

    What about the PSNI are they Prawns to the Queen? should a Catholic be allowed to join the PSNI with out the fair of the IRA attacking them? should a Catholic be allowed to join the RIR without the fair of being Attacked by the IRA or UDF?

    Many people from the South have join the RIR others join the french foreign legion

    With the Royal Irish Rangers they are territorial Army
    and Royal Irish Regiment are General Service within North Ireland.

    Polite request, could you refrain from mentioning the PSNI and the British Army in the same train of thought. They're fundamentally different organisations.

    For starters PSNI constables do not swear allegiance to any Queens or Kings. PSNI Constables upon finishing basic training swear an oath to fulfill their duty ( as laid down in the PSNI code of ethics which is a publicly available document if you wish to research it ) to the best of their ability in the service of the people of Northern Ireland, that's all people of Northern Ireland. That's the ones who believe they're British as well as the ones who believe they're Irish and everything in between.

    The PSNI does not fight or engage in combat with any enemies ( real or perceived ) of a state. The PSNI attempts to bring criminals to justice and above all attempts to protect the people of Northern Ireland from all sorts of danger. That ranges from trying to prevent violent crime taking place, assisting social workers in the search of missing vulnerable children in their care, providing police cover to the fire or ambulance service when they have to operate in areas tormented with anti social behaviour, giving first aid to accident victims awaiting the arrival of the ambulance service etc etc....


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,772 ✭✭✭meathstevie


    Cork24 wrote: »
    professionals.. if you were Conscript into the Army it is now you job. you job is to serve your Country in any shape or form. if it goes to work then you do your bit.

    Ireland are in Afghan.. for a country that had Men in almost Every War their was, we don't act like it. For a Country as Small as Ireland we need a bigger voice in Europe.. We just a ****ing Mouse In a Dogs World when it comes to Europe. We Voted No to the last Treaty.. Hell Europe was going to push on with out us. that's how little we are to them. We need Europe. we need to grow a bigger pair of Balls and Join NATO put more money into our Forces, Show the rest of Europe were Ready to more with you in keeping Euro Zone Safe and Free from anykind of Attack..

    We Cant even Stop a couple of guys running around with masks calling them self's the Real IRA.. so how are we meant to stop some Muslim who would love to kill Every one that makes fun of the Muslim World?

    Holland is just as Small as Ireland and Yet it seems to have more of a voice in Europe why as it all comes down to Power in which Power we dont have and people are saying we dont need a bigger Army Navy or Air.

    Nato was build to stop Russia now Russia are apart of it. What does it tell us? if were not in it we can not Ask for their help if we ever need it?

    So.. if we did go to War in any place and a couple of professionals as you call them got killed we never hear the end of it. but yet if some one in a Building Line went to Work and fell off a building or a Mother five died in a Car Crash. We go Ahh at lest it was'nt me..

    Eeh Holland and Belgium combined are half the size of Ireland but have a combined population of nearly 30 million people and are geographically only a kick in the arse away from where a major conventional conflict between NATO and the Warsaw Pact countries would have taken place : Germany.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 882 ✭✭✭LondonIrish90


    hahahaha

    i think everyone should just ignore this thread.. your man actually is only like 12 or something... go back to call of duty hahaha

    poccington couldnt have put it better!

    ALL of my mates who are in the british army, .. are based in england and scotland!

    and yea, the british do make a difference... they kill thousands upon thousands of civis in one country, and cause an even bigger war, all because a few of their american friends were killed in new york... its a difference all right...

    cop on

    And yet you still have "mates" in the British Army despite your misguided and actually rather disgusting descriptions of them? Do you bollocks. You never had any. A liar and a fantacist.

    I know the other poster in question deserves to be put in his place for the sheer amount of waffle he is coming out with, but you are not far behind him. You certainly aren't the bastion of intellectualism you think you are. I see this is a year old anyway, I somehow don't think made it to cadetship!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭laoch na mona


    no need to waste money on the army
    if equipment was made in ireland it would be worth expanding since there would be jobs created and we could start exporting military gear


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,663 ✭✭✭Cork24


    So who digged this post up from the grave ??


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,367 ✭✭✭Riddle101


    As a young man myself, I don't feel I should be forced to join up by anyone other then myself. Conscription is a very unpopular method of bringing people into the army and not everyone wants to be a soldier. There would be uproar if people tried to impose it here. Look at Vietnam or what happened in 1918 when they tried to impose it here at that time. They may be different times but the feeling is still the same, especially since we're not even in a war so there would be no proper reason or explanation to impose it.

    Also, I don't think the army would want anyone who was there because they were conscripted. They would want motivated people, people who are actually there because they want to be. They're the best type of people you want, because they make the best soldiers I think. That being said, it's just a theory and not based on fact so don't quote me on that last part.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,504 ✭✭✭tac foley


    'Prawns to the Queen'?

    Explain, please.

    tac


  • Registered Users Posts: 372 ✭✭jamesdiver


    I just read that too Tac, that made my day


  • Registered Users Posts: 22 thebigfella1


    Some crazy points on this.

    But I have to say it is an option for those in transition year in school who WANT to to do 9months militray service. It does not have to be Inf based.

    Anyone with an intrest in mechanics, medics, engineers etc. could gain valuable expierence as well as fitness and discipline.

    But it should not be forced on anyone.

    That "Cork" fella made one good point, if there are young lads on the dole who would have an intrest in serving they could be brought in at the same cost to the state minus training costs. why not???


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 638 ✭✭✭amurph0


    That "Cork" fella made one good point, if there are young lads on the dole who would have an interest in serving they could be brought in at the same cost to the state minus training costs. why not???

    Why should someone on the dole get preference over someone who's employed? There's plenty of people with jobs who've been trying for years to get into the army but can't because of the embargo.

    If going on the dole meant I could just get straight into the army then I'd quit my job tomorrow, and I bet a lot of other people would too.

    That kind of system wouldn't work. Jobs in the army shouldn't be just handed out to people on the dole, it should be open to people who really want it and also meet the requirements.

    Also this thread is more then 2 years old. Why was it resurrected?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 22 thebigfella1


    amurph0 wrote: »
    Why should someone on the dole get preference over someone who's employed? There's plenty of people with jobs who've been trying for years to get into the army but can't because of the embargo.

    If going on the dole meant I could just get straight into the army then I'd quit my job tomorrow, and I bet a lot of other people would too.

    That kind of system wouldn't work. Jobs in the army shouldn't be just handed out to people on the dole, it should be open to people who really want it and also meet the requirements.

    Also this thread is more then 2 years old. Why was it resurrected?


    I prob restarted it apologies, was just looking through a few of them.

    I'ld imagine if the scenarios that we discussed above were implented i.e. a form of voluntary service option, it would be open to all. To be honest I taught that went without saying.

    Also the army has recruited over 500 in the last 2 years, it was an open competetion, if you are not making it through this comp I think you should look at your approach. I mean this with no disrespect as your desire to serve is clear but there must be a block somewhere.

    Are you in the RDF??


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