Messy housemate - wrecking my head!!

doireann08

Hi Everyone

I am renting a room out to a guy P ( about 27/28). I own the house. P is generally a pretty good housemate. Pays bills on time, doesn't have mad parties etc etc.

P moved in last August. Another guy J was also in the house renting ( moved out in Feb to live with gf).

Anyway I am beginning to get annoyed with P. I am pretty easygoing, P never puts the bins out, does any hoovering etc etc. To be honest I am happy to do this myself!!!.

However I am not happy about P never cleaning the grill after he uses it. He leaves the lard build up on the grill so if I use it, I have to spend ages cleaning it first every time I want to use it. I have mentioned it to him to clean the grill after he uses it, but he never does!!

I also had the same issue with the main bathroom. I was always cleaning it. I have my own ensuite and P and J used to share the main bathroom. It was always spotless when J lived in the house. Since J has moved out, it is disgusting, hairs all over the bath. P is the only one using the main bathroom, If I have people over, they will use it or sometimes I will if I want a bath. Again something I mentioned to P.

I did say to him that I would use the bath from time to time and if people came over they would use the main bathroom. It has got to the stage that before I have anyone over, I have to give the main bathroom a good scrub!!! as I have been mortified before at the state he has left it in.

I know in the grand scheme of things, he is a good housemate and if the only thing I can complain about is his lack of cleaning, I am pretty lucky

I have mentioned it nicely a few times, but I am not his mother, nor am I a "clean freak".......... but this is beginning to annoy me.....

I think I am a pretty good landlord, his friends come up and stay a fair bit and they use the spare room. On one occassion I had the room made up, the mates used my sheets. P didn't even wash my sheets or make the bed after his mates used the spare room!!!.

I can't believe his lack of cop on. All of the above I have spoken to him about in a nice way.... no joy!! What next??

happymondays

doireann08 wrote: »

Hi Everyone

I am renting a room out to a guy P ( about 27/28). I own the house. P is generally a pretty good housemate. Pays bills on time, doesn't have mad parties etc etc.

P moved in last August. Another guy J was also in the house renting ( moved out in Feb to live with gf).

Anyway I am beginning to get annoyed with P. I am pretty easygoing, P never puts the bins out, does any hoovering etc etc. To be honest I am happy to do this myself!!!.

However I am not happy about P never cleaning the grill after he uses it. He leaves the lard build up on the grill so if I use it, I have to spend ages cleaning it first every time I want to use it. I have mentioned it to him to clean the grill after he uses it, but he never does!!

I also had the same issue with the main bathroom. I was always cleaning it. I have my own ensuite and P and J used to share the main bathroom. It was always spotless when J lived in the house. Since J has moved out, it is disgusting, hairs all over the bath. P is the only one using the main bathroom, If I have people over, they will use it or sometimes I will if I want a bath. Again something I mentioned to P.

I did say to him that I would use the bath from time to time and if people came over they would use the main bathroom. It has got to the stage that before I have anyone over, I have to give the main bathroom a good scrub!!! as I have been mortified before at the state he has left it in.

I know in the grand scheme of things, he is a good housemate and if the only thing I can complain about is his lack of cleaning, I am pretty lucky

I have mentioned it nicely a few times, but I am not his mother, nor am I a "clean freak".......... but this is beginning to annoy me.....

I think I am a pretty good landlord, his friends come up and stay a fair bit and they use the spare room. On one occassion I had the room made up, the mates used my sheets. P didn't even wash my sheets or make the bed after his mates used the spare room!!!.

I can't believe his lack of cop on. All of the above I have spoken to him about in a nice way.... no joy!! What next??

honest answer is your better off not share your house if you want it kept clean up to your standard.
its hard being a house owner becuase everything is bought with your own money and thus cared for. which is perfectly reasonable.
but people renting wont have the same amount of respect because it not thier house, they are only passing through.

only answer i can give is either look for someone else and hope they fit the bill or put up with it becuase i gaurentee it wont change by saying it to him.

everyone has a different standard of cleaniness, one thing ive learned from 10 years of house sharing is people never chnage no matter how many times you tell them something. today its the grill tomorrow it will be something else.

doireann08

agree with you happymondays, other than that he is fine... but am sick of cleaning up after him:)

StormWarrior

You sound a bit OCD - I lived with someone like you and it drove me nuts! The things you're describing don't sound that bad. The grill problem is easily solved by making a rule that people must put tin foil on it before using it. Then it will never need to be cleaned, even if this bloke never changes the tin foil, all you need to do is throw the old peice away and put a fresh one on when you want to use it.

I know hairs in the bath is a bit minging, but it's a small problem. I stayed in a £130-a-night hotel last week and there were even a few hairs in the shower there! You say you keep your bathroom spotless, maybe your standards are just too OCD for the average person to live up to? If a guest is coming just tell him to go and rinse his pubes away at once!

I personally would be annoyed at a tenant bring their friends over to stay regularly, but you don't have a problem with this only the sheets not being changed. Well just tell him if he doesn't change the sheets next time he can't have any more friends over. Honestly he sounds like a good tenant, you could have someone partying all night and trashing the house!

doireann08

Hi Storm Warrior

I don't think I am OCD at all!!! I am pretty normal and I have had no issues like this in any other houseshare.....

Besides he has now just told me could his two mates stay on Sat, he had told them they could stay before he even asked me!!

I don't think I am being unreasonable in expecting people to clean up after themselves.. it is part of any houseshare and I have been sharing houses for over 10 years.

HardyEustace

I don't think you're being unreasonable at all. You're not his Mammy.

However you're wasting time and energy getting annoyed while he is getting away with bloody murder.

1. can you get someone else in? There are lots of people out there who would love to live in a well cared for house, particularly one where there is a spare room for their friends
2. if you can, then I would have another chat with him and just explain that these issues are deal breakers for you

To be honest, it sounds like he's very lazy and doesn't take you seriously. You have to lay down the law and tell him to shape up or you'll give him notice.

However, if you're not prepared to do that and you've already chatted to him, there's sod all you can do.

sesna

You're basically trying to weigh up your cleaning standards against getting up to 10,000 euro a year tax-free from your tenant. Tough one.

doireann08

hardy eustace, he is very lazy.

sesna, you have it in a nutshell, i am weighing up the following options
1 - his lease is up the end of august, do i get rid of him and get another tenant ( it took me a while about 6 weeks to rent out room last time)
2 - do i just put up with it. and take the momey ( he pays E400 per month)... i have said it to him so many times.. i feel like now saying, no mates staying unless you clean

He asked me if it was ok for two of his friends to stay after the fact. To test him ( because on other occasions his mates have been already arrived and he has only informed me when they have been here) I said that my friends were staying this weekend.

He said his mates were coming up from Galway and " he wasn't going to fight" about who had the spare room. Hello I own the house, I think I have first dibs on spare room!!!
He said they could sleep in living room, they didn't need a bed. I felt like I was backed into a corner, that I would look extremely petty if I said no

I do feel like he is beginning to increasingly take the p*ss

HardyEustace

Check out daft and see what's available in the area.

The other thing I would put my foot firmly down on is having people staying in the sitting room. If it's a shared house (even with only two), the last thing you want is to be unable to use the sitting room because there's bodies staying there. Either say they stay in the person's room or the spare room - not the sitting room.

To be honest, once his lease is up, or a month before hand, give him his notice and get another tenant in. It's wrecking your head. I don't think he will change, if he does it's too little, too late.

It's you home and place of refuge, coming home all stressed and angry and frustrated will not be good for you long term. Seriously, can you really put up with another year of this? Because he doesn't sound like he'll change.

I would suspect before this, that not asking for the spare room on time, didn't really bother you. But now, the resentment has started to build, this and every other little thing will bother you.

I'd give him notice for the end of August and get someone else in. It's not going to have a happy ending otherwise.

doireann08

eustace

You are right, P leaving it until the last minute to ask me if his friends could stay didn't hugely bother me before. It happened twice I think. Since May he has had people stay over about 4/5 times.

I am normally laid back, but the cleaning is really bothering me now because I guess I do feel resentul. He hasn't hoovered once and I dread to think of what state his bedroom is in.

He left his bedroom door open one day. I pass by his room to go downstairs and I say that there was a dent in the wall ( plasterboard) about the half the size of a fist.

So in the lease agreement I had stated that if the tenant leaves, they must not use the deposit as last months rent and damages etc had to be paid for... When do you think I should tell him. His lease ends 1st september

FruitLover

I was considering the unfortunate awkwardness of the situation right up until I read the word 'landlord' in the original post.

Grow some balls and tell him that in your house, your rules will be obeyed.

doireann08

Fruitlover.. I guess I have been too easygoing in some respects. I have already spoken to him about my issues... He says he will do it and this is why I am wondering what to do next.
The money is handy. I am also going to speak to him and say that I don't want his two mates sleeping in the sitting room

athtrasna

As far as I know leases don't apply in the case of the tenant renting a room from an Owner Occupier...they are in fact licensees rather than tenants. Licensees have practically no rights re notice etc so if you've had enough, don't wait til September.

doireann08

athtrasna wrote: »

As far as I know leases don't apply in the case of the tenant renting a room from an Owner Occupier...they are in fact licensees rather than tenants. Licensees have practically no rights re notice etc so if you've had enough, don't wait til September.

Thanks, well i would have to give a min 4 weeks notice. P has signed a lease agreement... the only stipulation is a 4 week notice period

HardyEustace

doireann08 wrote: »

Thanks, well i would have to give a min 4 weeks notice. P has signed a lease agreement... the only stipulation is a 4 week notice period

well it depends, on the one hand, it might be easier to fill the room coming into September (the end of his lease agreement), on the other hand, I'd plump for giving him his notice now. Allow a week to repaint the room and fix it up (by the way, I'd ring around and get quotes on how much it would cost to fix the plaster board if there is a dent in it) and maybe give yourself a break of a week or two before you start advertising? (or even stipulate a date after when the house is empty).

I would definitely repaint the room and having it looking sparkling. Then when people come into the house outline what your expectations are with regard to housework and to people staying over.

athtrasna

doireann08 wrote: »

Thanks, well i would have to give a min 4 weeks notice. P has signed a lease agreement... the only stipulation is a 4 week notice period

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/sharing-accommodation-with-your-landlord

edanto

It sounds like you need to give him a warning, a final warning. He's ignoring what you've asked when it comes to cleaning standards of shared spaces and requests to use the spare room. He's only renting one room, the spare room isn't 'spare', it's yours. But you're really only getting p1ssed off about that because of the lack of cleaning, and you should acknowledge that so he understands.

It doesn't sound like he gets it, since you've mentioned the cleaning to him so many times. I'd suggest that you tell him that you've had enough, that unless he keeps the shared spaces clean over the next fortnight that you'll be asking him to leave. And he'll only have 4 weeks notice after that point.

It's likely that as soon as you give him his notice, he won't pay any more rent. So, while he's on his best behaviour in the next week, you might get him to pay for the wall damage, you can tell him that it'll have to come out of his deposit anyways, and best to get it fixed up now so that the house looks well. Good luck!

who the fug

StormWarrior wrote: »

You sound a bit OCD - I lived with someone like you and it drove me nuts! The things you're describing don't sound that bad. The grill problem is easily solved by making a rule that people must put tin foil on it before using it. Then it will never need to be cleaned, even if this bloke never changes the tin foil, all you need to do is throw the old peice away and put a fresh one on when you want to use it.

If it is OCD to expect a clean kitchen and bathroom, then I be ****ed.

Thin foil on the grill is a great should be mandatory, along with cook and wash as you go.

Rinsing a bath take 2 minutes after use

HardyEustace

edanto wrote: »

It sounds like you need to give him a warning, a final warning. He's ignoring what you've asked when it comes to cleaning standards of shared spaces and requests to use the spare room. He's only renting one room, the spare room isn't 'spare', it's yours. But you're really only getting p1ssed off about that because of the lack of cleaning, and you should acknowledge that so he understands.

I think at this stage the damage has been done and even if he started cleaning now, then that resentment is still there.

If you want to box clever, then I'd only give him notice after he's handed over August's rent so that you have the deposit to fall back on for overdue bills/damage.

conorhal

doireann08 wrote: »

hardy eustace, he is very lazy.

sesna, you have it in a nutshell, i am weighing up the following options
1 - his lease is up the end of august, do i get rid of him and get another tenant ( it took me a while about 6 weeks to rent out room last time)
2 - do i just put up with it. and take the momey ( he pays E400 per month)... i have said it to him so many times.. i feel like now saying, no mates staying unless you clean

He asked me if it was ok for two of his friends to stay after the fact. To test him ( because on other occasions his mates have been already arrived and he has only informed me when they have been here) I said that my friends were staying this weekend.

He said his mates were coming up from Galway and " he wasn't going to fight" about who had the spare room. Hello I own the house, I think I have first dibs on spare room!!!
He said they could sleep in living room, they didn't need a bed. I felt like I was backed into a corner, that I would look extremely petty if I said no

I do feel like he is beginning to increasingly take the p*ss

I'd get shot of him to be honest.

I had the same carry on with a flat mate, nice girl but would only do a bit of superficial cleaning like wiping down a counter top after using it, the oven would be caked in grease and smoke if you turned it on, she never once cleaned out the fridge when it got manky or put out a bin etc. I inevitably got a bit weary of shouldering the burden of the cleaning.
Now I'm far from a neat freak, and generally I'd not be bothered cleaning up somebody else’s mess, but since she wouldn't do it, the mess would inevitably get to the point that somebody had to sort it and of course I was the one that would inevitably 'blink first'.
I think the best thing to do in such situations is just to have the bloody argument and have it early, I'm really not one for confrontation though so you let it slide and slide until you just end up feeling resentful towards a person that probably doesn't even notice. So it's best to clear the air and have it out.
Or have her out and learn from the experience, then start fresh with a new flatmates with whom you outline your expectations up front with.

Some people seems to think that your being a bit OCD but I don't see it that way, it's about respecting the people you live with, and as far as I’m concerned, if somebody you share with that's a flatmate rather than a mate (whom I’ve lived with also and thus they get a bit more leeway) is happy to let you walk around behind them cleaning up their mess then they don't respect you, and why would you want to live with somebody that shows you no respect?

As for the ‘guests staying’ issue, I had the same one with the same girl, she took over the spare room for her clothes and was drying her washing in there and crashing guests, the landlord sorted it though. He came over to collect the rent, saw the situation, and explained to her that if she wanted to rent a second room in the house she could but it’s use was a privilege and it was not to be used as a closet and laundry that would leave the walls damp and moldy. When she persisted, he locked the room. Then she began crashing mates in the living room. I really didn’t care for that, as far as I’m concerned if she wanted to crash them in her room that was fine, but the living room is a common area in the house and I don’t care to wander in there to find people I don’t know sleeping on the floor, it means that I can’t even go in there on a Sunday morning in my PJ’s and drink a coffee and watch a bit of telly. It’s out of order and she was told to stop it.

syklops

can you get someone else in? There are lots of people out there who would love to live in a well cared for house, particularly one where there is a spare room for their friends

This is not 2005 anymore. There are not loads of people looking for nice well cared for house. Actually there are lots of well cared for houses looking for anyone at all to rent them.

Alot of the advice on this thread was along the lines of get rid of him, get someone else. Easier said then done now a days.

The OP was renting 2 rooms, is now only renting one of them. Did the OP decide to stop renting the second room, or is it a case that the OP could not get anyone else?

Hello I own the house, I think I have first dibs on spare room!!!

You sound like alot of fun to live with. When your watching TV together and he wants to watch one thing and you want to watch something else, do you say "er Hello I own the television so i get dibs on what we watch"?

And to be honest, I would say no, you dont have dibs on the front room just because you own the house. If you dont want him using it at all tell him so otherwise come up with a policy regarding 'booking' the room and informing the eachother of the dates. A ledger would work perfectly.

gazzer

What about when it comes to the end of the lease that you say to him that you want to do a rota for the housework. Do up a list of chores (leaving out the bins, cleaning the cooker, hoovering etc and tell him that the work has to shared equally. See what he says to that and if he kicks up about it you just tell him that he has to find somewhere else to live.

HardyEustace

syklops wrote: »

This is not 2005 anymore. There are not loads of people looking for nice well cared for house. Actually there are lots of well cared for houses looking for anyone at all to rent them.

I know it's not 2005 but just from listening to people who are renting
1. there's plenty of houses out there, yes but there seems to be a lack of reasonably priced, nicely turned out houses.
2. It's not just the house, the vast majority of people want to live with someone who also likes a clean house and will not shirk their duty when it comes to cleaning/ minding the house.

doireann08

syklops wrote: »

This is not 2005 anymore. There are not loads of people looking for nice well cared for house. Actually there are lots of well cared for houses looking for anyone at all to rent them.

Alot of the advice on this thread was along the lines of get rid of him, get someone else. Easier said then done now a days.

The OP was renting 2 rooms, is now only renting one of them. Did the OP decide to stop renting the second room, or is it a case that the OP could not get anyone else?



You sound like alot of fun to live with. When your watching TV together and he wants to watch one thing and you want to watch something else, do you say "er Hello I own the television so i get dibs on what we watch"?

And to be honest, I would say no, you dont have dibs on the front room just because you own the house. If you dont want him using it at all tell him so otherwise come up with a policy regarding 'booking' the room and informing the eachother of the dates. A ledger would work perfectly.

Sylops I am perfectly reasonable to live with. I don't have first dibs on the TV. We have no issues with who wants to watch what. If he is watching the worldcup and I come in to the sitting room, I certainly wouldn't ask him to change the channel

I rented the other room but I have deliberately kept it as a spare room so that my friends/family can stay the odd time they come over... He has had his friends stay over more often than me

I would get rid of him a lot quicker, but I am mindful of the fact that it is harder to rent rooms out. I only want to rent one out.... If I did decide to get rid of him I would wait till end of July as I want to esnure rent is paid.

The lack of cleaning and his " lack of listening" is the real issue, as I have said it so many times now that I don't know what other approach to take... How many times should you say to someone to just clean up after themselves.....
Also I am going away for 3 weeks at Christmas and I don't relish the idea of leaving him in my house on his own as I can only imagine the state it would be in before I came back

The real crux of my dilemna is, it is all very well to ask him to leave.... however it isn't that easy to rent rooms out anymore. I guess I either take the loss of extra money or put up with him...

If I got on with him ( I don't not get on with him, but talking to him is like dragging blood out of a stone!!!) it would be different

edanto

Maybe you could try and get someone else renting the spare room, so that at least you have some rent coming in and can take a stand with the problem child.

HardyEustace

To be honest, I was going to post something similar.

In all honest, how often do you have friends and family staying there?

I think that three in a house works far, far better as it kind of puts less pressure on everyone.

You can be choosier about who you get for the rooms as you should always have at least one other income coming in.

In most cases your housemates will be younger and are far more likely to have more mobile friends and thus get far more use out of the spare room.

stovelid

doireann08 wrote: »

He said his mates were coming up from Galway and " he wasn't going to fight" about who had the spare room. Hello I own the house, I think I have first dibs on spare room!!!

Actually you don't.

The house-owner thing shouldn't ever be enforced by you to your tenant. You should sort out the matter in the same way that two people renting the house would.

If I was a tenant with a home-owner, I'd be out of there the first sign of the owner pulling rank.

One of the things I've found about the Celtic Tiger is the large amount of people who rent out rooms in their houses through financial necessity but can't help acting like they don't rally want the tenants in the house.

vampire of kilmainham

doireann08 wrote: »

Hi Everyone

I am renting a room out to a guy P ( about 27/28). I own the house. P is generally a pretty good housemate. Pays bills on time, doesn't have mad parties etc etc.

P moved in last August. Another guy J was also in the house renting ( moved out in Feb to live with gf).

Anyway I am beginning to get annoyed with P. I am pretty easygoing, P never puts the bins out, does any hoovering etc etc. To be honest I am happy to do this myself!!!.

However I am not happy about P never cleaning the grill after he uses it. He leaves the lard build up on the grill so if I use it, I have to spend ages cleaning it first every time I want to use it. I have mentioned it to him to clean the grill after he uses it, but he never does!!

I also had the same issue with the main bathroom. I was always cleaning it. I have my own ensuite and P and J used to share the main bathroom. It was always spotless when J lived in the house. Since J has moved out, it is disgusting, hairs all over the bath. P is the only one using the main bathroom, If I have people over, they will use it or sometimes I will if I want a bath. Again something I mentioned to P.

I did say to him that I would use the bath from time to time and if people came over they would use the main bathroom. It has got to the stage that before I have anyone over, I have to give the main bathroom a good scrub!!! as I have been mortified before at the state he has left it in.

I know in the grand scheme of things, he is a good housemate and if the only thing I can complain about is his lack of cleaning, I am pretty lucky

I have mentioned it nicely a few times, but I am not his mother, nor am I a "clean freak".......... but this is beginning to annoy me.....

I think I am a pretty good landlord, his friends come up and stay a fair bit and they use the spare room. On one occassion I had the room made up, the mates used my sheets. P didn't even wash my sheets or make the bed after his mates used the spare room!!!.

I can't believe his lack of cop on. All of the above I have spoken to him about in a nice way.... no joy!! What next??

I have a simelar problem i own my house too i have a nephew living in one of the rooms he's 30 he rareley cleanes his room or tidies up after useing the shower and couldent care less when i mention it i dont mind about his room so much as iam not in it but we do have to use the same toilet an shower so i wish he would keep it clean at least:eek::eek::eek:

StormWarrior

doireann08 wrote: »

He asked me if it was ok for two of his friends to stay after the fact. To test him ( because on other occasions his mates have been already arrived and he has only informed me when they have been here) I said that my friends were staying this weekend.

He said his mates were coming up from Galway and " he wasn't going to fight" about who had the spare room. Hello I own the house, I think I have first dibs on spare room!!!
He said they could sleep in living room, they didn't need a bed. I felt like I was backed into a corner, that I would look extremely petty if I said no

I do feel like he is beginning to increasingly take the p*ss

I think this is much worse than the cleaning issue, I wouldn't tolerate this. Just because he rents a room from you does not give him any rights to have people over, especially without asking. In my first year of university I was a lodger in someone's house, and they told me at the start I wouldn't be allowed any friends over, and I thought it was fair enough. If he asked first and made sure it didn't inconvenience you it would be one thing, but what he is doing here is outrageous. Honestly, if I was you, as soon as he did the above I would have just thrown him out, your sanity is more important than a few euros! Anyway, you have seen the hole in his wall - destroying your property is an excellent reason to throw him out, and if you do give him notice, make sure you get the last moneth's rent in advance, if he's a day late throw him out, make sure he knows he won't be getting his deposit back or using it as the last month's rent. Did you ask him how the hole got there?

By the way, if you want to say no to something in your own house, say it. Who cares if he thinks it's petty, your home is not a doss house. If he wants to smash holes in walls and have his mates over all the time, let him buy his own house.

stovelid wrote: »

The house-owner thing shouldn't ever be enforced by you to your tenant. You should sort out the matter in the same way that two people renting the house would.

If I was a tenant with a home-owner, I'd be out of there the first sign of the owner pulling rank.

^I don't agree with this at all. OP, when you get your next tenant, decide what you will and won't tolerate from them, and write it into the contract!

doireann08

StormWarrior wrote: »

I think this is much worse than the cleaning issue, I wouldn't tolerate this. Just because he rents a room from you does not give him any rights to have people over, especially without asking. In my first year of university I was a lodger in someone's house, and they told me at the start I wouldn't be allowed any friends over, and I thought it was fair enough. If he asked first and made sure it didn't inconvenience you it would be one thing, but what he is doing here is outrageous. Honestly, if I was you, as soon as he did the above I would have just thrown him out, your sanity is more important than a few euros! Anyway, you have seen the hole in his wall - destroying your property is an excellent reason to throw him out, and if you do give him notice, make sure you get the last moneth's rent in advance, if he's a day late throw him out, make sure he knows he won't be getting his deposit back or using it as the last month's rent. Did you ask him how the hole got there?

By the way, if you want to say no to something in your own house, say it. Who cares if he thinks it's petty, your home is not a doss house. If he wants to smash holes in walls and have his mates over all the time, let him buy his own house.



Storm Warrior its the complete lack of respect that is the issue. His mates have now gone. P didn't even say thanks I appreciate you letting them stay as anyone with manners would do.

When one of his friends arrived, P wasn't even here..... My mother actually came to stay today and yesterday. She has just left. P has met my mother before, but he never even said hello to her or acknowledged her presence. Again beyond ignorant!!. So I have made the decision to kick him out.

I will wait until end of July to give him notice ( as I want Aug rent to be paid first). He is soooo stingy I know he will do his best to use deposit to pay last months rent ( I have it written into the lease he cannot do that)

Chinafoot

stovelid wrote: »

Actually you don't.

The house-owner thing shouldn't ever be enforced by you to your tenant. You should sort out the matter in the same way that two people renting the house would.

If I was a tenant with a home-owner, I'd be out of there the first sign of the owner pulling rank.

Eh, no. The tenant is paying €400 a month for his room and the use of the communal areas of the house like the kitchen, the sitting room and the garden. The spare room is not included in that money. The OP is paying the lions share of the mortgage, not the tenant, so they do in fact have "dibs" on the spare room. I don't see how anyone is "pulling rank". The OP pays for the rest of the house, there's no rank to be pulled.

Terri26

StormWarrior wrote: »

I think this is much worse than the cleaning issue, I wouldn't tolerate this. Just because he rents a room from you does not give him any rights to have people over, especially without asking. In my first year of university I was a lodger in someone's house, and they told me at the start I wouldn't be allowed any friends over, and I thought it was fair enough. If he asked first and made sure it didn't inconvenience you it would be one thing, but what he is doing here is outrageous. Honestly, if I was you, as soon as he did the above I would have just thrown him out, your sanity is more important than a few euros!


He has every right to have a friend over without asking! He is not living with his parents where he has to ask permission. You can't except someone to keep to their room when they are renting from you. he probably assumes it is like he is renting with you rather than from you. I lived for a year in a situation like this and never will again! Excepting to ask permission is a joke although I would mention it out of manners!! In future say these rules to potential tenants then all will be happy.

stovelid

StormWarrior wrote: »

^I don't agree with this at all.

Bullshit.

The ownership of the house shouldn't figure in the equation. A tenancy exists and as far as that goes, the tenant should be equal to the other tenant, even if the other tenant happens to own the house.

If the owners wants to enforce arbitrary rules based on their ownership of the house, the tenant should be informed of the situation up-front. Personally, I tended to avoid house-shares with a house owner because I found that the Celtic Tiger situation was often in effect: home-owner need help with mortgage but deep-down doesn't want to share home. Not saying this is necessarily the case with OP, obviously.

As for the cleaning up, the OP has every right to expect the tenant to clean up after themselves without having it in contract - it's basic manners.

mickoneill30

As the lease is due to be renewed how about bumping it up €50 a month and getting a cleaner in so they can do a huge clean once or twice a month.
It won't stop the niggly stuff like the grill but the bathroom problem would be sorted.

stovelid wrote: »

Bullshit.

The ownership of the house shouldn't figure in the equation. A tenancy exists and as far as that goes, the tenant should be equal to the other tenant, even if the other tenant happens to own the house.

I don't agree with that. If the OP rents out a second room he should pay half the rent to his first tenant?
Although I suppose if the tenant wants equal rights on the spare rooms he could pay more than €400 a month.

Edit: Ah I hadn't read the post about kicking him out. Now that I have, it sounds like it's the right thing to do.

stovelid

mickoneill30 wrote: »

I don't agree with that. If the OP rents out a second room he should pay half the rent to his first tenant?
Although I suppose if the tenant wants equal rights on the spare rooms he could pay more than €400 a month.

OP: was it clear from the start that you were just renting out certain areas in the house. Maybe I shouldn't jump to conclusions. It's just that I've shared 3-bed houses as one of two tenants before and I was never in a situation where I was renting specified areas of the house: it was a house share. The way it's described here is like some weird digs situation - or a guest house?

If he has accepted that from the start, I can see why you feel you have dibs on the room, but letting him then use the spare room just complicates things imo.

mickoneill30 wrote: »

As the lease is due to be renewed how about bumping it up €50 a month and getting a cleaner in so they can do a huge clean once or twice a month.

We did something like this before and it worked. Could be a plan. Also it's a discreet way of raising the issue of cleaning as you're saying that the house isn't clean enough and the choice is to share cleaning duties or pay.

StormWarrior

stovelid wrote: »

OP: was it clear from the start that you were just renting out certain areas in the house. Maybe I shouldn't jump to conclusions. It's just that I've shared 3-bed houses as one of two tenants before and I was never in a situation where I was renting specified areas of the house: it was a house share. The way it's described here is like some weird digs situation - or a guest house?

If he has accepted that from the start, I can see why you feel you have dibs on the room, but letting him then use the spare room just complicates things imo.

I don't see what's weird about it, anyone with half a brain cell would understand that they were renting a room, and getting use of the kitchen, bathroom & living room, not getting full run of the entire house. I agree that letting him use the spare room complicates things. With most people it would probably be ok to let them use it once in a while, but this tenant sounds like the kind of person who takes a mile if you give them an inch. For this reason he shouldn't get an inch more of the house than what he has actually paid for.

StormWarrior

doireann08 wrote: »

Storm Warrior its the complete lack of respect that is the issue. His mates have now gone. P didn't even say thanks I appreciate you letting them stay as anyone with manners would do.

When one of his friends arrived, P wasn't even here..... My mother actually came to stay today and yesterday. She has just left. P has met my mother before, but he never even said hello to her or acknowledged her presence. Again beyond ignorant!!. So I have made the decision to kick him out.

I agree about the lack of respect, that's what I meant when I was shocked about the way he expected you to put up with his friends there when you had other plans. He is treating your house like a youth hostel, good on you for getting rid of him. Do let us know how he takes the news about being let go and not getting his deposit back. By the sounds of him, you should be worried about what he'll do when he finds out. Don't let him have anyone else over for the duration of his stay, I've got a horrible feeling that when you tell him, he'll start making your life even more of a misery.

stovelid

StormWarrior wrote: »

I don't see what's weird about it, anyone with half a brain cell would understand .

I would have never taken it to be as as such, and I've shared plenty of houses. Unless told specifically otherwise, I assume that shouse sharing is house-sharing.

doireann08

stovelid wrote: »

Bullshit.

The ownership of the house shouldn't figure in the equation. A tenancy exists and as far as that goes, the tenant should be equal to the other tenant, even if the other tenant happens to own the house.

If the owners wants to enforce arbitrary rules based on their ownership of the house, the tenant should be informed of the situation up-front. Personally, I tended to avoid house-shares with a house owner because I found that the Celtic Tiger situation was often in effect: home-owner need help with mortgage but deep-down doesn't want to share home. Not saying this is necessarily the case with OP, obviously.

As for the cleaning up, the OP has every right to expect the tenant to clean up after themselves without having it in contract - it's basic manners.

Hi Stovelid. I have lived in several houseshares and if one of the other tenants wanted to have their friends stay over for the night ( i am not talking about dropping over for dinner and drinks!) . It is common courtesy to let the others know. In any other houseshare I have been in, it would be taking the p*ss if any housemate kept having their friends over in the spare room or the sitting room.

If you want to keep using the spare room, well then pay the additional rent to use it!!! I don't think P should " expect" to use the spare room when he feels like it because their is no -one in it at present. I did make it clear that I don't mind if friends stay over occasionally but that is it!!.

The other issue is that P is quite mean and ignorant. He was pretty rude to my mother. I feel like it is all one way traffic and that I have gone out of my way to be nice to him and would never get a thank you. He is lacking in any manners.

I have now locked the spare room... so he will not be using it any more.

lion_bar

Why not get a cleaner to come in for an hour or two a week to clean the cooker and the two bathrooms.

split the bill with P who you said is good to pay bills.

doireann08

StormWarrior wrote: »

I don't see what's weird about it, anyone with half a brain cell would understand that they were renting a room, and getting use of the kitchen, bathroom & living room, not getting full run of the entire house. I agree that letting him use the spare room complicates things. With most people it would probably be ok to let them use it once in a while, but this tenant sounds like the kind of person who takes a mile if you give them an inch. For this reason he shouldn't get an inch more of the house than what he has actually paid for.

StormWarrior, that is it in a nutshell. By the way I was also a tenant with a homeowner, so I have been at the other side of the coin too. I used the spare room occassionally, nowhere near as frequently as P.

I honestly don't understand how people think that just because there is a spare room in a house, they have the godgiven right to use it, just because they are renting one of the bedrooms. If he asks to have someone over again, I will say, thats fine, but we should split the rent for that room then ( how stingy is that!!).

Anyway re: getting rid of him, I have 2 possible ways I can do this.
1 - I am not renewing his lease, some one else will be moving in
2- I am increasing the rent by E50 per month, for cleaning etc... ( however if I tell him I was getting a cleaner in, he would make even more of a mess!!!)

HardyEustace

doireann08 wrote: »

Anyway re: getting rid of him, I have 2 possible ways I can do this.
1 - I am not renewing his lease, some one else will be moving in
2- I am increasing the rent by E50 per month, for cleaning etc... ( however if I tell him I was getting a cleaner in, he would make even more of a mess!!!)

Don't renew the lease but don't tell him until after you get August's rent.

I don't think he'll get any better. I don't think the situation will get any better.

I know you haven't mentioned it but I would seriously consider renting out the spare room for the reasons I listed in my previous mail.

I think that three in a house works far, far better as it kind of puts less pressure on everyone.

You can be choosier about who you get for the rooms as you should always have at least one other income coming in.

In most cases your housemates will be younger and are far more likely to have more mobile friends and thus get far more use out of the spare room.

As long as the "spare room" is empty, issues of the tenant using it more could and will arise. Also, to be honest, it's not something you can really tackle at the pre-moving in stage without risking sounding 1. rather selfish 2. rather mean.

stovelid

doireann08 wrote: »

Hi Stovelid. I have lived in several houseshares and if one of the other tenants wanted to have their friends stay over for the night ( i am not talking about dropping over for dinner and drinks!) . It is common courtesy to let the others know. In any other houseshare I have been in, it would be taking the p*ss if any housemate kept having their friends over in the spare room or the sitting room.

If you want to keep using the spare room, well then pay the additional rent to use it!!! I don't think P should " expect" to use the spare room when he feels like it because their is no -one in it at present. I did make it clear that I don't mind if friends stay over occasionally but that is it!!.

The other issue is that P is quite mean and ignorant. He was pretty rude to my mother. I feel like it is all one way traffic and that I have gone out of my way to be nice to him and would never get a thank you. He is lacking in any manners.

I have now locked the spare room... so he will not be using it any more.

I think you should just refuse to renew his lease. It sounds like it won't work out, especially if he has been rude to your mother. Which you don't appear to have mentioned until now, for some reason.

I think you should to make it absolutely clear to new tenants that:

You're offering a "digs" type tenancy where they are renting a defined space in Your House and not a house-share. When I was renting, I would have found this very helpful as to know which tenancies to avoid straight out of hand.

You expect either participation in a cleaning rota or a contribution towards a cleaner. Perhaps include the latter in an increased rent, as you say, which is a good idea.

StormWarrior

Just tell him that your living styles are not compatible because of the mess and the way he treats your house like a youth hostel, plus his rudeness to you and your mother. As soon as you have August's rent, tell him. Say that you're deducting the cost of repairing the hole in the wall from his deposit, and before giving him the rest of the deposit you will inspect his room, and if it's not in the standard he receved it in, he won't get anything back. If he plays up at all once you've told him, throw him out immediately. I'm sure it won't hurt him, sounds like he has plenty of friends he can crash with!

StormWarrior

stovelid wrote: »

I would have never taken it to be as as such, and I've shared plenty of houses. Unless told specifically otherwise, I assume that shouse sharing is house-sharing.

The OP said "I'm renting a room to a guy," I don't know how anyone would take that to mean they could use the whole house however they liked.

stovelid

StormWarrior wrote: »

and the way he treats your house like a youth hostel, !

The tenancy actually appears to be not unlike a youth hostel: renting a bedroom with access to strictly defined communal spaces.

It appears to be offered without requiring a youth hostel card though, which is a bonus.

StormWarrior

stovelid wrote: »

The tenancy actually appears to be not unlike a youth hostel: renting a bedroom with access to strictly defined communal spaces.

Not really, you don't tend to rent bedrooms in youth hostels, and I've never stayed in one with access to strictly defined spaces. The way he treats her house sounds like the hostels I stayed in when I was travelling around Europe in my younger days: loads of random people coming and going whenever they feel like it, crashing all over the place, wandering around anywhere they please and making a mess.

The tenancy sounds to me like he's renting a room, just for himself, he gets access to certain places in the house but now he is taking the p*ss and using the whole house, even areas that don't concern him and having loads of people there constantly.

doireann08

thanks everyone
my mother only came up on sat which is why i never mentioned it previously. P had met her once before
My mother and I were sitting in the kitchen having a coffee. Paul came in to kitchen never said hello to her and completely ignored her!! which was strange considering my mother had spoken to him last time she was up

Honestly I do find it strange that there is a debate as to what rooms a tenant has access to when renting a house??
I have rented for years and if there was a spare room, we all agreed in the beginning how it was used. how often friends could stay over in it etc etc.

When I previously rented and shared a house with the owner occupier. She did say to me that she didn't mind me having friends to stay occasionally, but not as a regular occurance. In this case I never viewed her spare room for me to use as a pleased simply because I paid rent. I don't get the comparision to a youth hostel. I have spoke to a few people about it and they all said his behaviour was unacceptable..

I am in my early 30's and my house is not a revolving door to have P's friends crash on the couch.

The problem is P doesn't respect that it is my home... and I feel like his "mother" having to clean up after him constantly.....to the point where I feel like I am nagging.... He doesn't know that I saw the hole in the wall, so I am going to have to find a way to bring that up now...

I have never had this issue with any other person I rented the two rooms out to.

HardyEustace

doireann08 wrote: »

The problem is P doesn't respect that it is my home... and I feel like his "mother" having to clean up after him constantly.....to the point where I feel like I am nagging.... He doesn't know that I saw the hole in the wall, so I am going to have to find a way to bring that up now...

To be honest, I wouldn't mention it till the final inspection of his room before he moves out.
1. you'll get his back up, relations seem strained between you and it could make it worse - you've another six weeks of sharing a house
2. he could try and fix it and make it even worse

It gives him time to invent excuses/reasons for it

doireann08

HardyEustace wrote: »

To be honest, I wouldn't mention it till the final inspection of his room before he moves out.
1. you'll get his back up, relations seem strained between you and it could make it worse - you've another six weeks of sharing a house
2. he could try and fix it and make it even worse

It gives him time to invent excuses/reasons for it

I agree with you. However in order to deduct some of the money from the deposit, I will need to have an idea how much it will cost to fix. I am guessing that the walls in his room will need to be repainted too.

HardyEustace

doireann08 wrote: »

I agree with you. However in order to deduct some of the money from the deposit, I will need to have an idea how much it will cost to fix. I am guessing that the walls in his room will need to be repainted too.

You can get a general quote from tradespeople. It's a fairly bog standard thing to fix I'm sure.

To be honest, I don't think you should charge him for re-painting. I think that comes under general wear and tear. Repainting is just a smart move on your part as you'll attract a more people to the room as it'll look nicer and it sets a precedence for the tenant that it's a nice house that should be looked after.