Protein Shake Sweeteners

columok

I eat say 90% paleo most of the time with the 10% being high fat dairy and the occasional cheat. One of my dailys is a 50g protein shake (two scoops.) its a flavoured isolate. The carb level is incredibly low so I'm only really worried about the sweeteners and not any added sugar!

My query is how bad would the insulin spike be from the sweeteners contained within? Would mixing coconut milk with the shakes be a bad idea as the saturated fat combined with the insulin spike could result in fat storage (or is this idiocy)? If I was to buy an unflavoured whey isolate of my protein does anybody have any good lowcarb lowsweetener ways of flavouring the protein without using a blender?

Lastly does anybody know if the addition of fat (coconut milk or olive oil) to the shake slows the uptake of the fast acting isolate? This would obviously be highly desirable for a during the day or breakfast shake!

rubadub

columok wrote: »

Lastly does anybody know if the addition of fat (coconut milk or olive oil) to the shake slows the uptake of the fast acting isolate?

I am pretty sure the fat does slow it down, I have read people saying it in the fitness forum, they avoid fatty foods as post workout meals, and some would use skim milk for shakes.

Khannie

columok wrote: »

One of my dailys is a 50g protein shake (two scoops.) its a flavoured isolate.

This is slightly off topic, but what weight are you?

columok wrote: »

Lastly does anybody know if the addition of fat (coconut milk or olive oil) to the shake slows the uptake of the fast acting isolate? This would obviously be highly desirable for a during the day or breakfast shake!

Wouldn't bother me in the slightest. Actually, if you're taking 50g (A LOT!!!!) then slowing down the rate of absorption might actually be a good thing. Personally (i.e. I have no evidence to back this up) I think people sweat over the speed at which the aminos from whey hit the blood stream way way way way too much. I think 90% of the battle is the fact that you're having some protein after training at all.

columok

Khannie wrote:

This is slightly off topic, but what weight are you?

89-90kg now. Was 106kg at christmas after a bad few months eating rubbish with an injured back. I crossfit 3 times a week a Crossfit Ireland which is fairly strength focussed. I try to get in over 200g protein a day. Breakfast from monday-friday is normally the aforementioned shake. Lunch is always a fish or meat salad (to the tune of 50g protein). Dinner regardless of after training or not is usually an epic consisting of huge amounts of protein and fat. Its beautiful

Khannie wrote:

Wouldn't bother me in the slightest. Actually, if you're taking 50g (A LOT!!!!) then slowing down the rate of absorption might actually be a good thing. Personally (i.e. I have no evidence to back this up) I think people sweat over the speed at which the aminos from whey hit the blood stream way way way way too much. I think 90% of the battle is the fact that you're having some protein after training at all.

I meant the slowing down of the protein absorbtion would be fantastico as it means I can take a big glug (50g) and know that it'll slowly absorb into my system. I only use protein for the convenience and cost. Can no longer cook eggs at work and it gets expensive to add another rake of fish/meat for breakfast! Protein shakes allow me to pour my cash towards epic dinners!!!

brianthebard

My pwo shake is usually a few scoops of isolate, milk, a banana, glutamine and some splenda. The milk will slow the absorption of some of the protein, but it will not have any detrimental effect. I'm usually hungry an hour afterwards which is to me the best sign that the protein has been absorbed. I think (but can't be sure) that the lack of carbs and sugars in your shake will in fact be as much or more of a barrier to protein absorption after your training. I realize you are following a paleo plan but if I were you I would look at scheduling some carb intake around your workout time.

Transform

columok wrote: »

I eat say 90% paleo most of the time with the 10% being high fat dairy and the occasional cheat. One of my dailys is a 50g protein shake (two scoops.) its a flavoured isolate. The carb level is incredibly low so I'm only really worried about the sweeteners and not any added sugar!

My query is how bad would the insulin spike be from the sweeteners contained within? Would mixing coconut milk with the shakes be a bad idea as the saturated fat combined with the insulin spike could result in fat storage (or is this idiocy)? If I was to buy an unflavoured whey isolate of my protein does anybody have any good lowcarb lowsweetener ways of flavouring the protein without using a blender?

Lastly does anybody know if the addition of fat (coconut milk or olive oil) to the shake slows the uptake of the fast acting isolate? This would obviously be highly desirable for a during the day or breakfast shake!

myprotein do a unflavoured one - tastes ok but would not buy a 10lb bag of it as it gets a bit boring after a while

El_Dangeroso

Good question OP. I didn't know the thing about the fat slowing down the protein absorption so that's a new one on me.

Re: Insulin spike, we don't have great data on this but the spike in all non-caloric sweeteners is definitely less than sugar. My sweetener of choice is erithritol or stevia. Both combined have the most realistic taste, if not slightly mint-y. Stevia creates less of a spike than aspartame, but don't you want a little extra insulin post workout to promote growth?

rubadub

Temple_Grandin wrote: »

on this but the spike in all non-caloric sweeteners is definitely less than sugar.

I read about this theory being turned completely on its head. Some say it could be Pavlovian conditioning, if this is true then it is very important what the subjects are used to eating. One theory is meant to be people are eating sugary stuff all the time and getting insulin spikes as normal, so when they get a sweet taste it spikes as the body is expecting sugar.

The reverse theory is that if people are drinking diet drinks all the time their body gets used to this and produces no insulin spikes, they lose the association between sweet things and sugar. So when they do actually eat sugar they might get less of a spike than they would if they had not drank diet drinks.

El_Dangeroso

rubadub wrote: »

I read about this theory being turned completely on its head. Some say it could be Pavlovian conditioning, if this is true then it is very important what the subjects are used to eating. One theory is meant to be people are eating sugary stuff all the time and getting insulin spikes as normal, so when they get a sweet taste it spikes as the body is expecting sugar.

The reverse theory is that if people are drinking diet drinks all the time their body gets used to this and produces no insulin spikes, they lose the association between sweet things and sugar. So when they do actually eat sugar they might get less of a spike than they would if they had not drank diet drinks.

That's a plausible theory, but aspartame produces more of an insulin spike than stevia, so there's definitely a physiological component along with a psychological one.

columok

Transform wrote:

myprotein do a unflavoured one - tastes ok but would not buy a 10lb bag of it as it gets a bit boring after a while

Thanks Dom will order a 1kg of it and worst case scenario can always use it to tone down the flavour of the flavoured stuff!!!

Temple Grandin wrote:

Re: Insulin spike, we don't have great data on this but the spike in all non-caloric sweeteners is definitely less than sugar. My sweetener of choice is erithritol or stevia. Both combined have the most realistic taste, if not slightly mint-y. Stevia creates less of a spike than aspartame, but don't you want a little extra insulin post workout to promote growth?

Where did you get your stevia? It would be really great to see rankings of typical insulin spikes for all of the different sweeteners!

As per the growth thing I only tend to eat whole foods after training mainly because for me protein shakes are always second best to a ridiculously large assortment of meat/fish/veggies/fats so after training I want to tuck in to some steak and eggs and give the chocolate beaker a miss!!!

I will try and include a decent glug of fats with all of my day shakes from now on to slow the absorbtion down. Again it would be great to have a good idea of protein to fats ratio for this!