Luas Cross City (Line BX/D) [now open]

strassenwo!f

Sorry, I should have written:

strassenwo!f wrote: »

For example, if there were a lot of demand for Bride's Glen - Connolly services, and such a service were available, then those passengers would be removed from negotiating the interchange at O'Connell/Abbey Street and that interchange would become more manageable for those who are looking for something else (easier to negotiate the platforms, the traffic lights, etc., because there would be fewer people jostling to make the change).

Very poor English in the earlier post. Sorry.

LeinsterDub

strassenwo!f wrote: »

I would like to say that this will happen in 5 years, though given the stately pace with which public transport infrastructure is developed in Ireland, I'd have to realistically give it 10 years. But at the outside.

This won't happen there is simply no need for it

LeinsterDub

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/luas-cross-city-to-return-famous-dublin-features-1.3005620

Heritage works beginning

strassenwo!f

LeinsterDub wrote: »

This won't happen there is simply no need for it

Interesting. Have you already seen the demand figures for a line which is due to open next December?

strassenwo!f

strassenwo!f wrote: »

I would like to say that this will happen in 5 years, though given the stately pace with which public transport infrastructure is developed in Ireland, I'd have to realistically give it 10 years. But at the outside.

I did indeed say 'stately' in that post. I meant, of course, 'glacial'. 'Given the glacial pace with which public transport infrastructure is developed in Ireland...

Living overseas, and despite access to the internet, my English seems to be going to pot. Not 'stately, 'glacial'.

MJohnston

negotiating the interchange at O'Connell/Abbey Street

This is a mad comment. If people can't "negotiate" crossing the road to the other platform, the world is in trouble.

I've travelled on the London underground, Cologne's Stadtbahn, NYC's subway, and Washington D.C.'s Metro. Each considered some of the best transport networks in the world. Every. Single. One. makes you walk a few metres to switch between lines, just like the Luas will.

Presenting this as a major issue with the Luas is entirely out of touch with reality.

LeinsterDub

strassenwo!f wrote: »

Interesting. Have you already seen the demand figures for a line which is due to open next December?

Nope nor do I need to. To repeat for what must be the 15th time it's less than a 2 minute walk

LeinsterDub

strassenwo!f wrote: »

I did indeed say 'stately' in that post. I meant, of course, 'glacial'. 'Given the glacial pace with which public transport infrastructure is developed in Ireland...

Living overseas, and despite access to the internet, my English seems to be going to pot. Not 'stately, 'glacial'.

Just use the edit function like the rest of us

strassenwo!f

MJohnston wrote: »

This is a mad comment. If people can't "negotiate" crossing the road to the other platform, the world is in trouble.

I've travelled on the London underground, Cologne's Stadtbahn, NYC's subway, and Washington D.C.'s Metro. Each considered some of the best transport networks in the world. Every. Single. One. makes you walk a few metres to switch between lines, just like the Luas will.

Presenting this as a major issue with the Luas is entirely out of touch with reality.

So why do many cities in Europe, or indeed most, including cities like Dresden whose transport in the inner city is almost entirely tram-based, retain this (a variety of routes through a central section) as part of of their tram systems?

They're not doing this because they're stupid. They've been running trams for a lot longer than Dublin has under its' current LUAS regime, with Dublin on a very steep learning curve with regard to public transport provision.

What Dublin is doing right now is right, putting the tram infrastruture in place. These tweaks that we are talking about at the moment, on this thread, can be righted easily enough. It would, of course, be better if it were all in the system from the beginning, but the link-up itself will be great for the city.

I really think it's going to be fantastic, creating a direct link between places like Broombridge, Broadstone and Grangegorman with St. Stephen's Green, for the first time in our living memory.

Once that is in place, I hope we can tweak later, if it turns out that tweaks could improve thngs.

LeinsterDub

strassenwo!f wrote: »

So why do many cities in Europe, or indeed most, including cities like Dresden whose transport in the inner city is almost entirely tram-based, retain this (a variety of routes through a central section) as part of of their tram systems?

13 lines v 2

LXFlyer

strassenwo!f wrote: »

As has been pointed out above, the connections aren't there at this stage to facilitate, for example, Bride's Glen - Connolly.

But one of the reasons many cities retain a variety of direct tram services through central sections is that it removes a lot of passengers from interchange choke points.

For example, if there's a lot of demand for Bride's Glen - Connolly services, then those passengers are removed from negotiating the interchange at O'Connell/Abbey Street and that interchange becomes more manageable for those who are looking for something else (easier to negotiate the platforms, the traffic lights, etc., because there are fewer people jostling to make the change).

The initial plan is not to have this arrangement in Dublin, but I'm confident that it will eventually come. For example, there can currently be no direct tram connection between Broombridge and Connolly, and this appears to depend on a building at the corner of Marlborough Street and Abbey street, currently a newsagent.

That building will eventually come down, perhaps as part of a complete redevelopment of the area in and around the Irish Life Centre, and of the Irish Life Centre itself. The passenger demand figures obviously aren't there at the moment, but a couple of years of operation should show this to be desirable.

I would like to say that this will happen in 5 years, though given the stately pace with which public transport infrastructure is developed in Ireland, I'd have to realistically give it 10 years. But at the outside.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that building on the corner of Marlborough Street and Lower Abbey Street that you want to demolish is a listed protected building, so it won't be going anywhere.

There will not be any operational connection at that junction, full stop. It is impossible to physically fit one in, given the space constraints.

Consequently, please just accept this reality and stop going off on wild fantasies - LUAS will operate as the Red Line and the Green Line, which makes it simple for users.

If people want to switch lines they can do so with a walk of 1-2 minutes maximum, and given LUAS operates a zonal fare structure they won't be penalised for making two separate tram journeys.

This nonsense of continually trying to find fantasy routes is pointless.

strassenwo!f

lxflyer wrote: »

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that building on the corner of Marlborough Street and Lower Abbey Street that you want to demolish is a listed protected building, so it won't be going anywhere.

There will not be any operational connection at that junction, full stop. It is impossible to physically fit one in, given the space constraints.

I have no reason to doubt your statement that it is listed.

But listed buildings can, on occasion, be removed. And correctly, if they are of no major architectural value and are in the way of desirable new developments.

Ten years, max.

marno21

MOD:

Can we keep discussion to updates and progress regarding the Luas Cross City scheme? There are no plans to run scheduled services between the Red and Green lines and until that changes it's a fruitless debate (and off topic for this thread).

Steve Allen

I see the taxis have egged back in to their usual spot at the bottom of Grafton St within minutes of the barriers coming down. Looks to be a loading area on the plans, though i think that's what it had been before the works started

mrsdewinter

Meanwhile, I see in the Dublin Inquirer that trams will be seen in front of the GPO from June when line testing starts. They also note that the opening date has been pushed back to early December.

fxotoole

mrsdewinter wrote: »

the opening date has been pushed back to early December.

what was it previously? I thought it was "late 2017"? In which case they are technically not pushing it back.

mrsdewinter

fxotoole wrote: »

what was it previously? I thought it was "late 2017"? In which case they are technically not pushing it back.

Just checked the story again: it reads, 'the first passenger services are now scheduled slightly later than originally planned, in early December'. I'd formed the impression in recent times that services could launch in November - though perhaps that was speculation.

LeinsterDub

http://www.dailyedge.ie/luas-cross-city-3-3263443-Mar2017/

Here are the most irritating things about the Luas works:

1. It has taken longer to build than the Empire State Building and the Eiffel Tower combined

It's starts off with this gem and gets worse

wakka12

LeinsterDub wrote: »

http://www.dailyedge.ie/luas-cross-city-3-3263443-Mar2017/



It's starts off with this gem and gets worse

The one about it becoming a landmark was funny to be fair haha

MJohnston

LeinsterDub wrote: »

http://www.dailyedge.ie/luas-cross-city-3-3263443-Mar2017/



It's starts off with this gem and gets worse

Sorry but using the Rosie Hackett bridge as a "starting point" for the Luas works is a massive stretch!

Stephen15

At least they were honest at the start saying that this will take 4 years and not giving a 2 year completion date and keep pushing forward and forward.

spacetweek

Abysmal article. Even as a fluff piece it's p**s poor.

4 places to cross O'Connell St? I doubt it, at this stage!

"marginally more convenient" :rolleyes:

Middle Man

...rattle out of the pram article IMO.

It should also be noted that every Christmas, works have to be suspended in the city centre - also, there are the St. Patrick's festivities as well as the 1916 commemorations that had to be taken on board. In my mind as the tracks are now laid, the worst is over and hopefully the extended Green Line service will greatly enhance to Luas system as a whole. We need to do more of this not only in Dublin, but in Cork, Limerick and Galway.

jamo2oo9

spacetweek wrote: »

Abysmal article. Even as a fluff piece it's p**s poor.

4 places to cross O'Connell St? I doubt it, at this stage!

"marginally more convenient" :rolleyes:

It was the case before Christmas. The only places you could cross were at the Quays junction, Abbey St junction, Henry St/Talbot St junction, Parnell St junction and a pedestrian crossing just beside the 1000 restaurant by the bus stops. Pretty much the whole central median was fenced off with the exception of those crossings list above.

cgcsb

LeinsterDub wrote: »

http://www.dailyedge.ie/luas-cross-city-3-3263443-Mar2017/



It's starts off with this gem and gets worse

no mention of the number of deaths and the amount of and severity of life ruining crippling disabilities acquired.

Sam Russell

Mod: Can we return to discussing BXD line. Pedestrians and Jays are off topic.

I have deleted the off topic posts.

Sam

Sam Russell

Mod: Any continuance of discussion of pedestrians in this thread will get a chance to take a long walk.

Sam

cormac616

Great to see Reimagining Phibsborough has been successful in their campaign to lower the wall at Broadstone. It looked awful and at least you can see the broadstone building now.

https://www.facebook.com/reimaginingphibsborough/posts/1423688777694344

LeinsterDub

http://m.independent.ie/business/small-business/we-cant-guarantee-customers-will-come-back-when-luas-works-are-finished-dublin-city-businesses-form-alliance-35603825.html

We were told in 2014 that the short term nature of the project would outweigh the negative impact. There's nothing short-term about three years

Aka how were we to know this 4 year plan would take 4 years?

MJohnston

LeinsterDub wrote: »

http://m.independent.ie/business/small-business/we-cant-guarantee-customers-will-come-back-when-luas-works-are-finished-dublin-city-businesses-form-alliance-35603825.html



Aka how were we to know this 4 year plan would take 4 years?

They have inaccurate memories too, because I believe it was late 2015 when the construction works began. It was all utilities and heritage works before that.