Opinions on my Experimental Selection for RWC 2011

Arrogance

I'd like some opinions on this selection for the World Cup. In my opinion whilst this may not be the best team individually we could field, it is the most likely team to compete.

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy
5.Ferris
6.Henry
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Trimble
12.D'arcy
13.O'Driscoll
14.Bowe
15.Murphy

Obviously theres some suprising selections here so let me explain.

First off the front 5. Having a huge front 5 is essential to competing up front and that would be quite possibly the biggest front 5 Ireland have ever fielded. It would also be the most mobile. All are great ball carriers and moving Ferris to second row ensures that we dont lose a lineout target (as Ferris is used as much as POC and DOC anyway) and allows us to field an extra flanker. Considering how important the break down is this is essential. Touhy is a huge unit that is more dynamic than Cullen, DOC and POC. I think hes a modern second row and is needed in today's game.

The backrow is once again possibly our biggest. All 3 are incredible ball carriers, have excellent link play, support well and most importantly, all 3 are excellent on the ground.

Every player in that 8 is not only incredibly strong and good at ball carrying but also extremely mobile. Whilst the loss of the likes of POC, DOC and Wallace and moving Ferris to second row might seem crazy when looking at the bigger picture it is for a greater good. In my opinion that is the best 8 we could field AS A UNIT.


Now onto the 9-10 combination. Boss is incredibly strong, a quick passer and a threat with the ball. Combine that with Sexton and you will constantly have the opposition thinking. The kicking game is gone, the running game is back. Sexton and Boss are key.

The only other position that needs explaining is Trimble over Earls. Personally I feel that Trimbles physicality is needed. Today's game is all about strike runners and being able to gain hard yards. Earls is a pacey finisher but thats it. He scored some run in tries but I wouldnt have any confidence him going for the corner opposed. Trimble has the ability to come inside and break through tackles on a consistent basis. Once again Earls is a better player but once again Trimble would be better for the team as a whole as what he brings is something Ireland lacks, physicality.

danthefan

That's a ridiculous team. No.

bleg

Absolutely shocking. Never.

JustinDee

Arrogance wrote: »

Having a huge front 5 is essential to competing up front

No, it isn't (see Wallabies for example) and for someone who purports to want an offloading game, Ferris in the locks is a complete waste as well given that there is absolutely nothing in his CV that will show he's ever able to play there or scrum in there.
Fla will be the first choice hooker. Hayes could well be reserve prop.
O'Leary and Reddan will be the halfbacks with Stringer and not Boss in reserve, I'd say.
You're writing O'Callaghan off despite his form following his return from injury this year. O'Connell will most definitely be in the team too.
Wally will also be in the team.
Not about to go into another Sexton v O'Gara debate. There are enough in this forum already.
Murphy could well be fullback too. Then again, Kearney could just well have a great next two games on this tour. Nice to have a choice of two excellent no.15s.
You've also forgotten Keith Earls.

Too reactionary a selection and the only way that team could ever take the field is if there were injuries at hooker, lock, defensive and openside flankers, halfback, wing and fullback.

Foxtrol

JustinDee wrote: »

You've also forgotten Keith Earls.

And Luke Fitzgerald

JustinDee

Foxtrol wrote: »

And Luke Fitzgerald

I've also forgotten Luke Fitz

funky penguin

And a bench.

thomond2006

funky penguin wrote: »

And a bench.

Kidney doesn't use it so there's no need to discuss replacements tbh.

Amazotheamazing

How about we scrap the concept of a first team and just pick form players for our provinces next year. If Donncha Ryan and Buckley force their way into the Munster squad, it would be nonsense to have Hayes and DOC (or POC) in the Irish first team. Same goes for O'Gara v. Sexton v. Keatley (can't bring myself to believe either NOC or Humph's offer anything). I sometimes wonder are the provincial coaches totally free to pick players as they please...

thomond2006

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I sometimes wonder are the provincial coaches totally free to pick players as they please...

Hayes and Buckley at Munster comes to mind.

On the flip side, Healy was benched in the HEC semi.

JustinDee

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I sometimes wonder are the provincial coaches totally free to pick players as they please...

Of course they are.

Blobby George

Arrogance wrote: »

1.Healy

I stopped reading here. The kid has made no progress since blasting on to the scene at croker. In fact he seems to be going backwards.

Amazotheamazing

JustinDee wrote: »

Of course they are.

Not so, Puc was told he'd never be picked ahead of Horan for a HEC game. He spoke about just having to accept it in his last interview with the Sunday Times. Can you envisage a situation where Munster would be let drop O'Gara for Warwick this side of the world cup?

Amazotheamazing

Blobby George wrote: »

I stopped reading here. The kid has made no progress since blasting on to the scene at croker. In fact he seems to be going backwards.

Hasn't helped that Hayes is playing his worst ever rugby and Healy has also had to work with numerous different hookers and second rows in his 8 or so caps. I agree he's not really progressing, but he's not being helped progress by the chaos (injuries) around him.

JustinDee

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Not so, Puc was told he'd never be picked ahead of Horan for a HEC game. He spoke about just having to accept it in his last interview with the Sunday Times

This quote of his means that Tony McGahan gets told who to pick, does it? Nothing to do with what the coach may or may have not thought of the fella's ability if indeed it was said in the first place?

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Can you envisage a situation where Munster would be let drop O'Gara for Warwick this side of the world cup?

Again, you're guessing here.
I for one wouldn't pick Warwick at 10 ahead of O'Gara.

Amazotheamazing

JustinDee wrote: »

This quote of his means that Tony McGahan gets told who to pick, does it? Nothing to do with what the coach may or may have not thought of the fella's ability if indeed it was said in the first place?


Again, you're guessing here.
I for one wouldn't pick Warwick at 10 ahead of O'Gara.

Justin, I appreciate you're closer to this stuff than most of us here, but there's no way every form player gets picked by the provinces.

I wouldn't pick Warwick either, he's got no control at outhalf, but I don't think we're even allowed have the option. I'll be shocked if Wian du Preez and Borlase play ahead of fit Irish players in the HEC next year, regardless of their form.

JustinDee

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Justin, I appreciate you're closer to this stuff than most of us here, but there's no way every form player gets picked by the provinces.

I wouldn't pick Warwick either, he's got no control at outhalf, but I don't think we're even allowed have the option. I'll be shocked if Wian du Preez and Borlase play ahead of fit Irish players in the HEC next year, regardless of their form.

Have Wright or Van Der Linde not ever started ahead of Healy? What about Contepomi ahead of an up and coming Sexton?
I think you overestimate the union's stance over the coaches in charge of its provinces. What is wanted is provincial wins and national team wins. No noses are cut to spite any faces.
And before the usual suspects all jump down my gullet, I'm not being big-headed or smart about this.

chris85

Ah come on you are kidding me.


1.Healy - fair enough, his scrummaging has very much improved.
2.Cronin - no way. hes a liability. Flan will be back in.
3.Buckley - Hitting some good form. good potential.
4.Touhy - Seriously? DOC
5.Ferris - you are joking. POC
6.Henry - Mcloughlin for me.
7.O'Brien - Wally.
8.Heaslip - absolutely.
9.Boss - Reddan. TOL just behind as sub
10.Sexton - Yes
11.Trimble - Possibly but not convinced at all yet. he has work to do to earn his place.
12.D'arcy - unsure of centre combination. Would like Earls paired with BOD for a game or two and see how they interact. Earls is a great player to have, a real utility back that can cover any of the back five.
13.O'Driscoll - no doubt
14.Bowe - yes
15.Murphy - possibly but will be a fight with Kearney, Kidney will pick on best form at the time.

profitius

OP I think new ideas are always a good thing. Thinking outside the box is what the greatest minds do.

I'd make a few changes (in bold).

Arrogance wrote: »

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy DOC
5.Ferris POC
6.Henry Ferris
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Trimble Luke Fitz
12.D'arcy BOD
13.O'Driscoll Earls
14.Bowe
15.Murphy

I've always liked Trimble but his weakness is his kicking. You could pick a team without POC in it. No matter what anyone says he's still one of the best locks in the world and easily Irelands best.

profitius

Lads, lets also remember that a year is a long time in sport. There could be a few new guys come through in the provinces and put their hand up for inclusion. Theres usually one or two every year.

Ciaran-Irl

I find myself thinking, "why the hell do I read these obviously stupid threads?"

Ferris & Tuohy at lock is about as likely as Fitzgerald &Earls at prop.

Jemo

Some odd selections there, but each to their own! Trimble is the man that has caught my attention most, I know his kicking isn't perfect, but I think he gained a lot worse reputation for it after that moment where him and Rob gifted a try. Much as Earls isn't a dire defender, these kind of reputations can be exaggerated. I don't see many Ulster games but what I have seen of him he has coped well with this apparent weakness and prefers to run it back in either case. In attack he certainly offers something Ireland could use, raw physicality and the ability to bounce through defenders and finish, his disallowed try today for instance was a fine piece of finishing and should have been awarded. he didn't necessarily drop the ball, it remained under his body as he slid and didn't move faster than his body. You can ground the ball with downward pressure and he had that so I don't see the problem although I'm sure other people will disagree. People have bandied about the idea of Luke moving to 15 but I don't see that happening, remaining on the wing or moving to 12 seem more likely to me. The problem is, that Earls, Luke, Trimble and Bowe are all excellent but there are only 2 starting spots and Bowe isn't going anywhere barring injury! Thus, despite my liking for D'arcy, I would like to a see a backline of this nature developed next year (assuming Luke recovers well from injury and regains top form)

9. Reddan 10.Sexton 11. Earls 12. Fitzgerald 13. O'Driscoll 14. Bowe 15. Kearney with Trimble, Wallace and O'Leary on the bench.

I'm sure many people will disagree with Fitz at 12 in particular with the usual notes to bad games in the past but I think in time he could grow into a class player there. He has the boot, speed, distribution, step and physicality to make it at inside centre. It's harsh on D'Arcy though who still makes the yards and is one of our best attackers but I think its time to shake it up a little and O'Driscoll is necessary for his playmaking ability.

irishbucsfan

Jemo wrote: »

I'm sure many people will disagree with Fitz at 12 in particular with the usual notes to bad games in the past but I think in time he could grow into a class player there. He has the boot, speed, distribution, step and physicality to make it at inside centre. It's harsh on D'Arcy though who still makes the yards and is one of our best attackers but I think its time to shake it up a little and O'Driscoll is necessary for his playmaking ability.

What is that based on?

He lacks that, and the experience of playing the position. Defending at 12 is entirely different to defending on the wing and he would need to be playing there regularly if he's going to be moved there for 2011. And that won't happen because not only is one of the best 12s in the world in the Leinster and Ireland team ahead of him there, but McFadden, one of the teams most promising centers is behind D'Arcy.

I think there's an 80%% chance we'll see D'Arcy at 12 in the WC, and a 19% chance we'll see P. Wallace there

Jemo

I don't mean distribution in the paddy Wallace sense of the word but rather more of a D'arcy style.,He can hit the line at speed and has a quick strong pass which can release those outside him. In either case Ian McGeechan, Michael Cheika and Bradley have all viewed him as having the necessary skills in the past so I am not alone in this view. Next year we are in for a shake up at Leinster with Schmidt coming in and he is likely to experiment somewhat. Luke will be coming back from a long term injury and will not be rested as much as the other internationals so he will be fitted in somewhere. In view to the 2015 world cup I would like to see him developed as a 12, much as D'Arcy was developed into that role. McFadden is being groomed for 13 and for me Earls is a better option on the wing, it's just a personal opinion, please don't make this into the usual Earls debate. If Fitz comes back from injury as good a player as he left then he needs to be accommodated into the Ireland backline and looking at the age profile I think 12 is his best longterm option. The backline I mentioned earlier has not only a lot of talent and size but real pace which is something we lack somewhat at current.

The Rooster

Dan Chewy definitely has the potential to replace Donncha O'Callaghan, easily the most over-rated player in the Irish set-up. Even Mick O'Driscoll outshines him when he plays alongside him, as he has done for Munster in the last couple of months.

Big Paulie hasn't had the best of years by his standards, but this enforced rest could do him the world of good.

tolosenc

Can't look much past: Healy, Flannery, Buckley, Cullen, O'Connell, Ferris, Wallace, Heaslip, Reddan, Sexton, Fitzgerald, Earls, O'Driscoll, Bowe, Kearney. Bench: Fogarty, Horan, O'Callaghan, Jennings, O'Leary/Stringer, O'Gara, Trimble/Wallace

danthefan

tolosenc wrote: »

Can't look much past: Healy, Flannery, Buckley, Cullen, O'Connell, Ferris, Wallace, Heaslip, Reddan, Sexton, Fitzgerald, Earls, O'Driscoll, Bowe, Kearney. Bench: Fogarty, Horan, O'Callaghan, Jennings, O'Leary/Stringer, O'Gara, Trimble/Wallace

Earls at 12? I can look way past that. Miles and miles past.

dmcc13

Arrogance wrote: »

I'd like some opinions on this selection for the World Cup. In my opinion whilst this may not be the best team individually we could field, it is the most likely team to compete.

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy
5.Ferris
6.Henry
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Trimble
12.D'arcy
13.O'Driscoll
14.Bowe
15.Murphy

Obviously theres some suprising selections here so let me explain.

First off the front 5. Having a huge front 5 is essential to competing up front and that would be quite possibly the biggest front 5 Ireland have ever fielded. It would also be the most mobile. All are great ball carriers and moving Ferris to second row ensures that we dont lose a lineout target (as Ferris is used as much as POC and DOC anyway) and allows us to field an extra flanker. Considering how important the break down is this is essential. Touhy is a huge unit that is more dynamic than Cullen, DOC and POC. I think hes a modern second row and is needed in today's game.

The backrow is once again possibly our biggest. All 3 are incredible ball carriers, have excellent link play, support well and most importantly, all 3 are excellent on the ground.

Every player in that 8 is not only incredibly strong and good at ball carrying but also extremely mobile. Whilst the loss of the likes of POC, DOC and Wallace and moving Ferris to second row might seem crazy when looking at the bigger picture it is for a greater good. In my opinion that is the best 8 we could field AS A UNIT.


Now onto the 9-10 combination. Boss is incredibly strong, a quick passer and a threat with the ball. Combine that with Sexton and you will constantly have the opposition thinking. The kicking game is gone, the running game is back. Sexton and Boss are key.

The only other position that needs explaining is Trimble over Earls. Personally I feel that Trimbles physicality is needed. Today's game is all about strike runners and being able to gain hard yards. Earls is a pacey finisher but thats it. He scored some run in tries but I wouldnt have any confidence him going for the corner opposed. Trimble has the ability to come inside and break through tackles on a consistent basis. Once again Earls is a better player but once again Trimble would be better for the team as a whole as what he brings is something Ireland lacks, physicality.

I like the front five, bit harsh on flannery maybe.i would have david wallace 7, he's just too good and altho kearney has been hit and miss recently he is class and will come through this to prove he is the best in the world. I think trimble is a good player getting better but fitzgerald will prove he is a different class when he is back....i dont think there would be any missing physicallity from him.

I really cant stand boss but i see why you picked him....reddan would be my choice but im really not sure on him either...i'd haveto see both more often to decide.

But good team and a pleasant surprise i nver thought of ferris at 5 but it makes sense

tolosenc

danthefan wrote: »

Earls at 12? I can look way past that. Miles and miles past.

I meant rather the team that would be chosen, rather than whatever the best option may be...

And Drico wearing 13 playing at 12.

Bugnug

Arrogance wrote: »

I'd like some opinions on this selection for the World Cup. In my opinion whilst this may not be the best team individually we could field, it is the most likely team to compete.

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy
5.Ferris
6.Henry
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Trimble
12.D'arcy
13.O'Driscoll
14.Bowe
15.Murphy

Obviously theres some suprising selections here so let me explain.

First off the front 5. Having a huge front 5 is essential to competing up front and that would be quite possibly the biggest front 5 Ireland have ever fielded. It would also be the most mobile. All are great ball carriers and moving Ferris to second row ensures that we dont lose a lineout target (as Ferris is used as much as POC and DOC anyway) and allows us to field an extra flanker. Considering how important the break down is this is essential. Touhy is a huge unit that is more dynamic than Cullen, DOC and POC. I think hes a modern second row and is needed in today's game.

The backrow is once again possibly our biggest. All 3 are incredible ball carriers, have excellent link play, support well and most importantly, all 3 are excellent on the ground.

Every player in that 8 is not only incredibly strong and good at ball carrying but also extremely mobile. Whilst the loss of the likes of POC, DOC and Wallace and moving Ferris to second row might seem crazy when looking at the bigger picture it is for a greater good. In my opinion that is the best 8 we could field AS A UNIT.


Now onto the 9-10 combination. Boss is incredibly strong, a quick passer and a threat with the ball. Combine that with Sexton and you will constantly have the opposition thinking. The kicking game is gone, the running game is back. Sexton and Boss are key.

The only other position that needs explaining is Trimble over Earls. Personally I feel that Trimbles physicality is needed. Today's game is all about strike runners and being able to gain hard yards. Earls is a pacey finisher but thats it. He scored some run in tries but I wouldnt have any confidence him going for the corner opposed. Trimble has the ability to come inside and break through tackles on a consistent basis. Once again Earls is a better player but once again Trimble would be better for the team as a whole as what he brings is something Ireland lacks, physicality.

Yea that looks good, lets try that. And when the crazy world cup is over maybe some of these guys can travel with the squad to the WC in NZ.

dmcc13

My team is based on class some are not in form or been injured for ages but based on their top form, and if the 2nd row experiment works!!, this would be my 15;

15. R.Kearney
14 T.Bowe
13. B. O'Driscoll
12. P.Wallace
11. L.Fitzgerald
10. J.Sexton
9. E. Reddan
8. J.Heaslip
7. D.Wallace
6. D.Leamy
5. S. Ferris
4. P O'Connell
3. T.Buckley
2. J.Flannery
1. C.Healy

Ciaran-Irl

dmcc13 wrote: »

My team is based on class some are not in form or been injured for ages but based on their top form, and if the 2nd row experiment works!!, this would be my 15;

15. R.Kearney
14 T.Bowe
13. B. O'Driscoll
12. P.Wallace
11. L.Fitzgerald
10. J.Sexton
9. E. Reddan
8. J.Heaslip
7. D.Wallace
6. D.Leamy
5. S. Ferris
4. P O'Connell
3. T.Buckley
2. J.Flannery
1. C.Healy

What is everyone's obsession with Ferris is the second row? That has zero chance of happening. Story this crazy talk!

Jemo

I don't understand the Ferris situation very well either, he has the potential to be Irelands greatest ever blindside mainly for his loose play, why would you put him in the second row where he would be so much less effective. There are similar mutterings about moving O'Brien to hooker, so one would guess that these ideas are based on the concept of having as many top class abrasive ball carriers on the field as possible. The way that rugby is going, I can see this becoming more and more common, it has already stopped being a game for all shapes and sizes, and moving flankers into all regions of the pack is another step towards this future. For Ferris to be pushed into the second row would have to mean a better 6 ousted him and for Ferris to prove he was a better option there than doc poc cullen and the other contenders. In either case, we have abrasive speedy second rows developing in Ryan and Tuohy. Let Ferris do his thing where he learned his trade, on the blindside flank. If Leamy wants in he will have to out perform his competition.

dmcc13

Ciaran-Irl wrote: »

What is everyone's obsession with Ferris is the second row? That has zero chance of happening. Story this crazy talk!

The reason i would give for moving ferris to the second row is because ireland lack a Thion, Thorn or Botha. A second row of real grunt, power and skill. Playing in the 2nd row does not hinder a players play around the park as is proven by the 3 named players. Obviously it would have to be experimented with first but it could be a winner, fabien pelous started of at 8 and moved to 2nd row and he wasn't too shabby.

sock puppet

dmcc13 wrote: »

The reason i would give for moving ferris to the second row is because ireland lack a Thion, Thorn or Botha. A second row of real grunt, power and skill. Playing in the 2nd row does not hinder a players play around the park as is proven by the 3 named players. Obviously it would have to be experimented with first but it could be a winner, fabien pelous started of at 8 and moved to 2nd row and he wasn't too shabby.

Maybe if he packs on some weight but is he not a little small for second row?

subfreq

Experimental with an eye on the WC next year I would say this.

It's so hard based on current form because I honestly can't chose a half back. TOL has every single physical attribute but doesn't have the operating system between the ears to get the most out of it. Boss I don't rate and Reddan I don't think is as good as TOL has shown he can be.

I am going TOL and Kearney begrudgingly as they are both rank out of form but the best the country has when they get it right.

With Flan, Buckley, Ferris, Kneeslip, Healy all in the same team Ireland would finally have a proper selection of ball carriers and the backs I think would cause any country a nightmare.

15 Kearney
14 Earls
13 BOD
12 Fitzgerald
11 Bowe
10 Sexton
9 TOL
8 Kneeslip
7 Jennings
6 Ferris
5 Buckley
4 O'Connell
3 Ross
2. Flannery
1 Healy

Madworld

subfreq wrote: »

Experimental with an eye on the WC next year I would say this.

It's so hard based on current form because I honestly can't chose a half back. TOL has every single physical attribute but doesn't have the operating system between the ears to get the most out of it. Boss I don't rate and Reddan I don't think is as good as TOL has shown he can be.

I am going TOL and Kearney begrudgingly as they are both rank out of form but the best the country has when they get it right.

With Flan, Buckley, Ferris, Kneeslip, Healy all in the same team Ireland would finally have a proper selection of ball carriers and the backs I think would cause any country a nightmare.

15 Kearney
14 Earls
13 BOD
12 Fitzgerald
11 Bowe
10 Sexton
9 TOL
8 Kneeslip
7 Jennings
6 Ferris
5 Buckley
4 O'Connell
3 Ross
2. Flannery
1 Healy

How would you lift a 21st second row??

JustinDee

dmcc13 wrote: »

The reason i would give for moving ferris to the second row is because ireland lack a Thion, Thorn or Botha
A second row of real grunt, power and skill. Playing in the 2nd row does not hinder a players play around the park as is proven by the 3 named players.

He is nothing like those players and is the first defensive blindside player who possesses the skillset of an openside also that Ireland have been able to select in the professional era.
He has grunt, power, skill and pace . . . which is why he is in the backrow and one of the best flankers around.
Scrummaging from lock is also an entirely different kettle of fish to being on the flank.

Fabien Pelous made his debut at lock, by the way. Not at eight.

boredatwork82

Not a bad team OP.

My front row would be the same. Someone said Cronin was a liability. That is a load of bull. The guy is the best hooker in the country. Dynamic, powerful and his throwing is grand. He lost his 2 main lineout options eaerly on Saturday, so please don't judge him on that.

Second row, I would go with DOC & Touhy( although I would like see more of him)

6 has to be Ferris - One of the best 6's in the world. Why would you waste that in the second row.
7. Sean O'Brien - his ability the break through the first up line of defence is vital. Going to ground is pointless, most of the best teams in the world offload, and keep the ball alive. Irish rugby is still too obsessed with the break down.

8. Heaslip - although his maturity and leadership have to be seriously questioned, like wtf was he thinking. If you gonna get a red card for hitting Richie MaCaw, make sure you do it right and he has to go off injured.

9. Stringer - the only real passer we have at 9.
10. Sexton - playing off stringers quick ball would let him attack defenses alot more.

Centres: Paddy Wallace, & BOD(or Darcy but not both of them - that partnership hasn't worked in years.)

Wings:Trimble and Bowe
Fullback: Geordan Murphy

We could spread the ball wide with Wallace and sexton in 10-12 and let the back 3 play in space before it gets closed down. They are all brilliant support players so quick ball out here and we could be sorted. the 3 of them would cause all sorts of damage playing off each other.

Otacon

Madworld wrote: »

How would you lift a 21st second row??

Bending at the knees?

Jemo

boredatwork82 wrote: »

9. Stringer - the only real passer we have at 9.
10. Sexton - playing off stringers quick ball would let him attack defenses alot more.

In my personal opinion, its' a myth that Stringers pass is so good it lets outhalfs attack the defence better, his pass is a small amount faster than the likes of Reddan but he lacks consistency in his passing at this point in his career unfortunately and would need a lot of gametime to get back to his former self. In most games he tries go too fast and ends up throwing a couple of wobblers along the ground. Playing stringer allows backrows to target the outhalf more as he is much more predictable. People see him come on late in a match and up the ante after TOL, this is no great feat, TOL is there to be physical, and we seen against nz that Reddan offers the same amount of pace with a better all round game and can hold the defence. Stringer shouldn't get picked except as cover for minor matches, and I'm glad to see Kidney has moved in this direction too.

Mr.Applepie

Madworld wrote: »

How would you lift a 21st second row??

I suppose you could have Hayes in at 3. Then we'd find out just how good a lifter he really is!

Mr.Applepie

1. Healy
2. O'Brien
3. Ross
4. Ferris
5. Mushy
6. BOD
7. Wallace
8. Heaslip
9. TOL
10. Fitzy
11. Carr
12. D'Arcy
13. Earls
14. Bowe
15. Conway

We wouldn't be able to kick, scrum or win a lineout but if we ever managed to get the ball we definitely be able to run it!

BoarHunter

to answer briefly i don't think you should go to a world cup with an experimental team

Mr.Applepie

Mr.Applepie wrote: »

1. Healy
2. O'Brien
3. Ross
4. Ferris
5. Mushy
6. BOD
7. Wallace
8. Heaslip
9. TOL
10. Fitzy
11. Conway
12. D'Arcy
13. Earls
14. Bowe
15. Conway

We wouldn't be able to kick, scrum or win a lineout but if we ever managed to get the ball we definitely be able to run it!

Conway on both wings??? :eek:

Mr.Applepie

Deleted User wrote: »

Conway on both wings??? :eek:

What can I say the lad has potential!

dmcc13

sock puppet wrote: »

Maybe if he packs on some weight but is he not a little small for second row?

He's the same height as DOC and pretty much the same weight, but is a lot more dynamic and powerful

dmcc13

JustinDee wrote: »

He is nothing like those players and is the first defensive blindside player who possesses the skillset of an openside also that Ireland have been able to select in the professional era.
He has grunt, power, skill and pace . . . which is why he is in the backrow and one of the best flankers around.
Scrummaging from lock is also an entirely different kettle of fish to being on the flank.

Fabien Pelous made his debut at lock, by the way. Not at eight.

Fabian pelous started his career at number 8(originally with dax i belive but could be wrong), and played there for toulouse, he made his debut at 2nd row alright in 95 but by 96 was pciked as the number 8, until he was injured, but still switched between 8 and 2nd row up until the turn of the century . All those traits you mention are exactly what thion,thorn and botha bring to the 2nd row and is what we miss. Thorn and botha in particular are extremely skillful,powerful and fast!! why can a second row not have these traits, as well as adding another player at 6 who has these traits also (i.e Leamy)?? True scrummaging would be a problem but nothing experience and good coaching cant fix

Arrogance

After today's game you'd wonder where Rudock could slot in, in a few years time. If Ferris moved to second row, which I reckon he could easily do, we could have Ferris, Ruddock, O'Brien and Heaslip all on the pitch which would be, incredible to have.

Arrogance

Long term experimental team (RWC2015)

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy
5.Ferris
6.Ruddock
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Earls
12.Fitzgerald
13.Bowe
14.Conway
15.Kearney

thehighground

Arrogance wrote: »

Long term experimental team (RWC2015)

1.Healy
2.Cronin
3.Buckley
4.Touhy
5.Ferris
6.Ruddock
7.O'Brien
8.Heaslip
9.Boss
10.Sexton
11.Earls
12.Fitzgerald
13.Bowe
14.Conway
15.Kearney

Both Buckley & Boss will be 35 then.