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Working in the Black Market

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  • 27-05-2010 3:34pm
    #1
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭


    I have a "friend" who recently was getting a few jobs done on his house by various tradesmen, many of whom were willing to drop their prices significantly to work for "cash-in-hand". By doing so, they are essentially working on the black market by not paying tax.

    What are your opinions on this;

    Have you ever paid someone to do a job cash-in-hand? Have you ever worked for cash-in-hand payments?

    Do you think that it is acceptable / unacceptable?

    The Black Market 223 votes

    I have paid someone to work for me for cash-in-hand
    0% 0 votes
    I have never paid someone to work for me for cash-in-hand
    20% 45 votes
    I have worked for cash-in-hand
    5% 12 votes
    I have never worked for cash-in-hand
    30% 68 votes
    I am OK with me / others working for cash-in-hand
    4% 10 votes
    I am not OK with people working for cash-in-hand
    29% 66 votes
    Atari Cashuar
    9% 22 votes


«13

Comments

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    #2
    Daemos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,645 ✭✭✭Daemos


    starbelgrade wrote: »
    Poll to follow shortly.
    You should really just put that in your sig so you don't have to keep saying it over and over and over and over...


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    #3
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    DaPoolRulz wrote: »
    You should really just put that in your sig so you don't have to keep saying it over and over and over and over...


    Maybe I should just stop posting altogether.


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    #4
    prinz
    Registered Users Posts: 14,598 ✭✭✭✭prinz


    starbelgrade wrote: »
    By doing so, they are essentially working on the black market by not paying tax.
    What are your opinions on this

    One of the main reasons Greece went down the tubes. Should not be encouraged. Anyone who operates on a black market basis forfeits the right to complain about the country.


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    #5
    ballsymchugh
    Registered Users Posts: 7,936 ✭✭✭ballsymchugh


    by paying cash in hand, you don't get a receipt, so how could you prove that if work went wrong that the tradesman is responsible for it? that's the only thing i'm wary of. if you ask for a receipt then it creates the paper trail but it's also your comeback if it goes tits up.


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    #6
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 23,979 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    starbelgrade wrote: »
    Maybe I should just stop posting altogether.

    We could have a poll on that:P


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    #7
    easyeason3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,104 ✭✭✭easyeason3


    No I don't see anything wrong with it.

    Probably a lot more people signing on & doing nixers than ever before.

    Can be the difference of a family eating so why would you begrudge anyone that?


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    #8
    Wazdakka
    Registered Users Posts: 4,467 ✭✭✭Wazdakka


    Yea I've paid Cash in hand to get a few jobs done before..

    You have to be careful though as the workers are rarely insured and if any accidents happen then it's probably you that's going to be held liable.

    The important thing is to agree on a price beforehand....
    and always wear a condom.


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    #9
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    ejmaztec wrote: »
    We could have a poll on that:P


    I'm not sure that I'd want to know the results on that one. :D


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    #10
    Bazzy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭Bazzy


    Cash in hand all the way man


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    #11
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    Bazzy wrote: »
    Cash in hand all the way man

    ~That's just funny :
    Cash in hand all the way man
    __________________
    Looking for a PAYE tax Refund?

    www.brownenvelope.ie


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    #12
    TheZohanS
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,583 ✭✭✭✭TheZohanS


    easyeason3 wrote: »
    No I don't see anything wrong with it.

    Probably a lot more people signing on & doing nixers than ever before.

    Can be the difference of a family eating so why would you begrudge anyone that?

    Then why don't we all draw the dole and do nixers? It would be like a magical utopian society.


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    #13
    Jay D
    Registered Users Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Jay D


    BORING...........


    this thread certainly makes me want to go asleep and even a poll, God!n Where's the - seriously, get a life option?


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    #14
    Eoin
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 21,238 CMod ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    I'm a bit of a hypocrite when it comes to this. I don't like tax cheats, as I pay my fair share (even on part time work that I do). But if I can get some work done on my house by a tradesman for a bit less than some of the exorbitant prices they have charged over the last few years, I'll turn a blind eye to it.


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    #15
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Jay D wrote: »
    BORING...........


    this thread certainly makes me want to go asleep and even a poll, God!n Where's the - seriously, get a life option?

    Then I suggest you start an alternative thread with a really engaging & interesting subject topic, with amazing poll options that will blow people's minds.

    If you can think of one.


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    #16
    easyeason3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,104 ✭✭✭easyeason3


    TheZohan wrote: »
    Then why don't we all draw the dole and do nixers? It would be like a magical utopian society.

    Well if someone is drawing the dole & making a weeks wage out of nixers then I have a problem with it.

    BUT, if someone is drawing the dole & gets random nixers here & there that would count as pocket change to some people then yeah why not?


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    #17
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 23,979 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    I assume that most of the nixers are cowboys, and it's easier to negotiate a decent price with someone who's above the radar, and can provide guarantees if anything goes wrong.


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    #18
    Morlar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    easyeason3 wrote: »
    Well if someone is drawing the dole & making a weeks wage out of nixers then I have a problem with it.

    BUT, if someone is drawing the dole & gets random nixers here & there that would count as pocket change to some people then yeah why not?

    Because they are cheating the system twice. They should not be on the dole if they can get a job and if they have a job they should pay tax like the rest of us. Also it's illegal.


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    #19
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    easyeason3 wrote: »
    No I don't see anything wrong with it.

    Probably a lot more people signing on & doing nixers than ever before.

    Can be the difference of a family eating so why would you begrudge anyone that?


    No it can't. You will not starve in this country. It could be the difference of getting your house repossesed, or your phone cut off, but not starvation.


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    #20
    ScumLord
    Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    ballsymchugh wrote: »
    by paying cash in hand, you don't get a receipt, so how could you prove that if work went wrong that the tradesman is responsible for it? that's the only thing i'm wary of. if you ask for a receipt then it creates the paper trail but it's also your comeback if it goes tits up.
    "Cash in hand" is just one of the other payment options out here in the wesht.


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    #21
    Cypher_sounds
    Registered Users Posts: 8,103 ✭✭✭Cypher_sounds


    Morlar wrote: »
    Because they are cheating the system twice. They should not be on the dole if they can get a job and if they have a job they should pay tax like the rest of us. Also it's illegal.

    Doing nixers is not a job its just 'helping out a friend or neighbour' not cheating nobody unless the neighbours hubby is out:pac:


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    #22
    Overature
    Registered Users Posts: 908 ✭✭✭Overature


    i wouldn't call it "black market", im sure the majority of people who were offered some small job where they would get away with not paying tax would take it.


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    #23
    Jaxxy
    Registered Users Posts: 4,297 ✭✭✭Jaxxy


    I've both paid someone cash-in-hand and been paid cash-in-hand, generally to and from people I am acquainted with. I'd rather pay someone I know to do up my bathroom, for example, than someone I don't. All of the women in my family get their hair done by my best friend too, since she's out of work and most of us can't afford to pay Peter Mark €120+ every month for a head of meche.

    I have no problem with it, but then again I obviously have loose morals. :P


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    #24
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 23,979 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    Cypher_sounds wrote: »
    Doing nixers is not a job its just 'helping out a friend or neighbour'

    They must have a sh1tload of friends and neighbours, many of them miles away.


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    #25
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    easyeason3 wrote: »
    Well if someone is drawing the dole & making a weeks wage out of nixers then I have a problem with it.

    BUT, if someone is drawing the dole & gets random nixers here & there that would count as pocket change to some people then yeah why not?

    I've a mate (not a mate in inverted commas this time, but a real one) who worked for over 15 years paying PRSI etc. He was made redundant 2 years ago & after a year was means tested. The means test for Social Welfare benefits is a bizzarre one that doesn't take into account the real income & expenditure of people - ie., it ignores tax hikes, health levies, mortgage payments etc - basically anything that affects peoples real life costs & spending.

    Anyhow, they calculated by their odd calculations, that as his wife earns 10cent over the allowed weekly limit, he gets no welfare whatsoever. He even offered to give them the 10cent a week (ie. €5.20 per year) so he could get some of payment, which they refused.

    So after 15 years paying PRSI & Tax, the system basically told him to go f*ck himself, for the sake of just over a fiver.

    He now does nixers & odd jobs, all for cash-in-hand and feels perfectly justified in doing so. I find it hard to argue with his viewpoint.


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    #26
    Lando Griffin
    Registered Users Posts: 2,952 ✭✭✭Lando Griffin


    In the height of the recession an engineer friend of mine was getting a house ready to hand over to some clients on a Friday evening, and had employed a legit painter to do some painting.
    During conservation with the painter, he complained about having not enough work to pay the bills and said it was tough for him to keep going.
    The engineer pointed out the few jobs to be done and left.
    When he returned, half the work was done, the wooden door covered in specks of paint and varnished over and the bucket of paint left in the middle of the floor.
    He called over the lad doing the snagging and asked where the painter had got to to which he replied “He left at 3 o clock cos he said he doesn’t work after 3 on a Friday”


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    #27
    easyeason3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,104 ✭✭✭easyeason3


    Morlar wrote: »
    Because they are cheating the system twice. They should not be on the dole if they can get a job and if they have a job they should pay tax like the rest of us. Also it's illegal.


    I'm talking about sporadic work so how are they cheating the tax system twice?
    Do you expect someone to sign off the live registar for the sake of a few hours work when it probably took them a few months to get welfare payments due to a backlog?


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    #28
    Cypher_sounds
    Registered Users Posts: 8,103 ✭✭✭Cypher_sounds


    ejmaztec wrote: »
    They must have a sh1tload of friends and neighbours, many of them miles away.

    Word of mouth is a powerful thing ;) hard to say no too lol


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    #29
    thetonynator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭thetonynator


    starbelgrade wrote: »

    He now does nixers & odd jobs, all for cash-in-hand and feels perfectly justified in doing so. I find it hard to argue with his viewpoint.


    Yes, but he's not drawing the dole. Therefore he is probably entitled to work odd jobs.


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    #30
    starbelgrade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,739 ✭✭✭✭starbelgrade


    Lando Griffin wrote: »
    In the height of the recession an engineer friend of mine was getting a house ready to hand over to some clients on a Friday evening, and had employed a legit painter to do some painting.
    During conservation with the painter, he complained about having not enough work to pay the bills and said it was tough for him to keep going.
    The engineer pointed out the few jobs to be done and left.
    When he returned, half the work was done, the wooden door covered in specks of paint and varnished over and the bucket of paint left in the middle of the floor.
    He called over the lad doing the snagging and asked where the painter had got to to which he replied “He left at 3 o clock cos he said he doesn’t work after 3 on a Friday”

    There was a hell of a lot of that sort of thing going on during the boom.


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    #31
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,969 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    eoin wrote: »
    I'm a bit of a hypocrite when it comes to this. I don't like tax cheats, as I pay my fair share (even on part time work that I do). But if I can get some work done on my house by a tradesman for a bit less than some of the exorbitant prices they have charged over the last few years, I'll turn a blind eye to it.

    Im like that. On the one hand I cant stand tax dodgers. On the other hand, your income is taxed, everything you buy has tax added on, If you have a car the registration is taxed, you have to pay for the roads via road tax, and if you ever decide to drive anywhere the fuel is tax. God help you if you drink because about 70% of what you spend is tax, and if you have any money left from all that, and put it in the bank, and get interest, you get charged tax on that too. So the other part of me says screw them. Little nixers here and there wont break the bank. However a company relying solely on off the books work is going too far.


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