Series 5, Episode 6 - "The Vampires of Venice"

Daemos

Well, what did we think of that?

It was alright I thought, but not fantastic. Your typical historical episode with alien-origin monsters that humans see as something else (The Shakespeare Code comes to mind).

Nice to see Rory sticking around for a bit, I like it when he has more than one companion at the same time.

Hot girls were a plus :P

Overall, 6/10 for me

Next episode looks good though

I liked it! Some good lines in there (

'Yours is bigger than mine.' 'Let's not get into that'

xD) Next week's looks mind bending, should be good!

Motley Crue

Not a particular strong episode in my opinion, there didn't really seem to be a point in having Amy's fiancé in it -

and just when you taught it would turn into something - we saw the spoiler for next week with her 5 years in the future and pregnant, yes, Doctor Who acknowledged sex!

Anyway, the episode this week was slightly disappointing because I wasn't particularly interested in it and after last week it was a plain "monster of the week" style story, like X-Files used to do, and unlike X-Files there was nothing that good about it.

Unfortunately it's the poorest story of the series so far and really let the series down, hopefully next week will be better

"Vampires?! Don't be absurd - they're fish from space!"

Motley Crue

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055905851

Another thread about this at the same time lol

But personally I didn't like the episode, and put in a little picture of a fish for everyone lol

K-9

Some very funny bits, the start with the wedding cake, "tired of running down corridors" line was brilliant and the chicken fight scene.

Amy looking better than ever and gorgeous vampires.

Some of the CGI stuff was dodgy.

Overall 6.5/10.

TheCapedCrusade

Decent plot, didn't follow the story as the pacing was awful.

Next weeks story looks to be good though.

sock puppet

I though it was a good episode. I really like Matt as the doctor.

Although what about the competely unresolved issue of

the man-eating fish living at the bottom of the canal?

anotherlostie

I thought it was OK - bit hard to follow last week really. Strong on the humour and I like Rory now - he's a bit gormless but will stand up for himself when he needs to. Good that the crack is really an arc now - unlike previous ones where it was just hinted at subtly until we got to the end of the series. Best thing about the episode though was the trailer for next week - it looks like a really old fashioned Doctor Who story, and I mean that in a good way.

Busi_Girl08

Rory - "And you kissed her back."
Doctor - "No...I kissed her lips"
:pac:

Overall, meh.

As said above, the pacing was pants, there were some good moments, and the whole "vampire" stance was pretty good, until it turned into some naff alien thing.
Why couldn't it have just been an alien that looks like a vampire? Not some stupid CGI nightmare? :mad:

Which bring me onto the next point; The CGI. It was ridiculous. The CGI water, the villain, the lightening. It was like watching some weird b-movie.

Overall, 6.5/10.
Good idea, badly executed.

Next week looks awesome though

Busi_Girl08

sock puppet wrote: »

I though it was a good episode. I really like Matt as the doctor.

Although what about the competely unresolved issue of

the man-eating fish living at the bottom of the canal?

I think it's implied that they are all going to die, maybe because they have nothing to feed on. And I assume the mother died when she jumped in, so their main guardian is gone too.Not long till they follow.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

It was the weakest of this series so far, but it was still a lot better than some of Tennant's outings... I think Matt Smith and Karen Gillan really make the show - its good to see a lot more character driven sideplots than what we've seen in previous years... Smith proving again tonight why he's a great Doctor with some fantastic lines - loved the scene with the mirror...

Gambler

Humour was good but over all it was a bit of a "meh" episode for me too.. Roll on next week..

ixoy

I quite liked it - it was good for a "monster-of-the-week" episode and I thought it was better than the Hasbro Dalek episode.

Rory was pretty decent and he didn't show himself up too much.

Some decent elements of humour too. And come on long-term fans: how could you not dig a photo ID of William Hartnell?

I think what's able to carry these episodes are the two leads. Matt Smith is still impressing me and I thought he did humour well here.

I've no idea about next week (nor do I want to) but I'm glad to hear you think it looks good!

sock puppet

Busi_Girl08 wrote: »

I think it's implied that they are all going to die, maybe because they have nothing to feed on. And I assume the mother died when she jumped in, so their main guardian is gone too.Not long till they follow.

Oh I know but they're still down there in the meantime. Suppose it's only dangerous if someone decides to go swimming:pac:.

Killer_banana

It was an okay episode, alright story, some dodgy effects but pretty decent. The character of Rory seems great, I'm going to enjoy him being in the TARDIS. The darker tone of this season was very apparent in this episode, I liked that.

I was disappointed with this episode because it's the one I've been looking forward to most (well bar last week's and the week before's). It featured a lot in the season's initial trailer and they released clips of it before the season even started so when the vampires turned out to be stupid fish people and certain pieces of the plot (such as not being able to go out in sunlight and then being out in the sunlight) didn't add up I was quite disappointed...then I saw the promo for next week's episode and I didn't care anymore.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

I quite liked it, my favourite of the season except for the angel eps. I'm always on the wrong end of public opinion on this forum

Raedwald

Felt that it was an ok episode, solid but spectacular. There is always an episode like this in every tv program, it has to be done and to make it interesting a key piece of info is put into it.

In relation to the CGI, looked very cheap i have to say could of been better. But i assume that this was an episode that was designated a cheap one budget wise.

Pittens

They spent all the money on a trip to Croatia.

BuffyBot

Above average Who-historical-aliens romp. Certainly worked better than spitfires in space...

Nice humour touches, and Matt Smith showing range I don't think many people expected of him. I liked Rory, and think it would be good to have him in the TARDIS a little more. Gillan just seems to keep delivering. All in all, not half bad as a standalone monster of the week episode.

BlitzKrieg

sock puppet wrote: »

Oh I know but they're still down there in the meantime. Suppose it's only dangerous if someone decides to go swimming:pac:.

they clearly evolved into:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDD9jGMlxNQ

On the episode it was a bit muddled but overall a romp through history that was a tad bit more serious then the shakespeare code and an ok episode.

muddled issues include the random

reflecting a make up case was it? to kill the son, but the sky had been blacked out etc? slightly confused me

better then the dalek episode but weaker then everything else this season.

Also is this season going a bit too similar to season 2? we've picked up the boyfriend fiance and he's now having a spat with the doctor over his girl

(and we know this season ends with cybermen again...)

we also had an episode with someone who knows the doctor better then the companion show up (river song - sarah jane).

Looking forward to next week though kinda like the idea of a dream lord.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

they clearly evolved into:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDD9jGMlxNQ

On the episode it was a bit muddled but overall a romp through history that was a tad bit more serious then the shakespeare code and an ok episode.

muddled issues include the random

reflecting a make up case was it? to kill the son, but the sky had been blacked out etc? slightly confused me

better then the dalek episode but weaker then everything else this season.

Also is this season going a bit too similar to season 2? we've picked up the boyfriend fiance and he's now having a spat with the doctor over his girl

(and we know this season ends with cybermen again...)

we also had an episode with someone who knows the doctor better then the companion show up (river song - sarah jane).

Looking forward to next week though kinda like the idea of a dream lord.

I didn't know... Nor did I want to... Spoiler tags would've been nice there...

Doctor DooM

As a fan of the odd hammer horror film I hugely enjoyed this (it was a clear homage to them). As with others I kinda lost a little interest when it turned out they were fish monsters. Seeing as in extended media the time lords fought a war with space vampires, it wouldn't have been too hard to just leave them as a species of vampires?

Still I really enjoyed it as it sent memories rushing back as it trbuted to another old British fantasy tradition but I can see why people who never dug that would think this one's weak.

ixoy wrote: »

I quite liked it - it was good for a "monster-of-the-week" episode and I thought it was better than the Hasbro Dalek episode.

Some decent elements of humour too. And come on long-term fans: how could you not dig a photo ID of William Hartnell?

As a transformers fan, you take that back about Hasbro!

(Aside no 1- remind me to tell you all about the time the 8th Doctor almost met the transformers.)

(Aside no 2- Yeah I lolled at Hartnell.)

doctorwhogirl

I wasn't hugely moved by the episode. But I did like the dialogue a lot. I felt more could have been made by Smith at the end of the female's comment about watching another race died, but then that may have harked back to much to Tennant's sometimes mournful doctor.

LOVED LOVED LOVED LOVED LOVED the library card. Best thing about it.

GSPfan

The absolute best part of the episode was the comment about the mother providing females for her sons. "Uhhhhhh. I mean I've been around a bit but thats just................. Uhhhhh".

GSPfan

Also the blonde Vampire girl that was featured a lot was an absolute BANG. Lets hope the trend of companions having previous roles in Doctor Who continues and she gets the next one.

K-9

GSPfan wrote: »

Also the blonde Vampire girl that was featured a lot was an absolute BANG. Lets hope the trend of companions having previous roles in Doctor Who continues and she gets the next one.

All of them were gorgeous, but yes, she was my favourite!

Just watched it again on BBC3 and nod to Doctor Doom, definitely a homage to Hammer Horrors. Should have spotted that, especially the cross sign.

The first 20/25 minutes was very good, the introduction of the fish ruined it and the references to DT and the timelords.

flazio

I thought most of the homages leant back to Toby Whithouse's own excellent Vampire show 'Being Human', Francessco was clearly a take on Herrick's right hand man Seth and the fight had hall marks of 'worlds gayest ninjas', as with the attempted cross diversion.
Like Being Human it was a good mix of humor and drama, (I was laughing all the way into the title sequence from the moment the Doctor popped his head out of the cake.)

GSPfan

I'm just gonna through this out there and I don't expect a positive response but is any one else getting used to the theme tune? I'm even starting to like it.

marwelie

I missed it on Saturday because I didnt realise it was on at 6pm. I also missed it on BBC3 tonight because I was at a family do. I cant watch it on the iPlayer so is there any other way to see this weeks episode again? Will it be repeated on BBC3?

The Recliner

marwelie wrote: »

I missed it on Saturday because I didnt realise it was on at 6pm. I also missed it on BBC3 tonight because I was at a family do. I cant watch it on the iPlayer so is there any other way to see this weeks episode again? Will it be repeated on BBC3?

It is repeated on Friday at 9pm

Didn't think this episode was great personally

I liked a lot of the little touches and there were some great lines and references but on the whole it just didn't sum up

This is the first episode of Doctor Who that I have forced the girlfriend to watch so it was disdappointing that it was a let down

I still have both Flesh and Stone eps on the ntl box so I will try and convince/trick/bribe her to watch them and hopefully she like it

jasonb

I actually enjoyed this one. Not so much the Fish Monsters From Space plot, but the fact that Matt Smith didn't spend the whole time running around and shouting, so we actually got a little more of his take on The Doctor.

I thought Rory was ok, a little too like Mickey as someone already pointed out. I also thought his comments to the Doctor ( about making people do dangerous things to impress him ) were good, but maybe a little too soon ( he's only met the Doctor twice ) and were harking back to 'Love & Monsters' by trying to show what it's like for the people left behind or after the Doctor has left.

But, like I said, it was good to see a slightly quieter Doctor ( in parts ) so we could get a sense of how he thinks / feels etc.

J.

phil1nj

I enjoyed this one. Thought the humour was handled very well (especially by Matt Smith). Not every episode can be a gold plated winner but there were parts of this one that made up for it. The library card was a nice touch as well.

With regard to the theme tune, anyone else think that it sounds a bit like the X-files near the end of the opening credits?

Also Starring LeVar Burton

GSPfan wrote: »

I'm just gonna through this out there and I don't expect a positive response but is any one else getting used to the theme tune? I'm even starting to like it.

I feel the same... Getting used to it now and starting to think its better than the previous one we had...

pixelburp

Just watched it this morning & yeah, the new theme tune has grown on me somewhat. Maybe I like watching it because it's the only decent special effect left in the show now Although the CGI fish-people weren't too bad, the Venice FX and CGI-storm that appeared near the end were B-movie bad. There really have been some ropey FX so far, but this episode takes the biscuit. Which is doubly annoying because what has been much bettter is the direction - there have been some lovely shots & scenes.

Otherwise, I thought the story was fairly blah & mediocre: "monster of the week" mixed into their obligatory Period episode, there wasn't anything to recommend or overly criticise (even if changing the Vampires to fish-people made no sense - Dr. Who has had vampires loads of times).

I did really love the banter between the three leads though - more Rory please, he's an adorable dope - I can actually see why Amy might marry him

The stag-night scene was genuinely funny, I can't believe I had reservations about Matt Smith: he may not have the gravitas for the heavy scenes, but he does the playful, awkward comedy to a tee. His mannerisms too are just priceless: "funny how you can say something in your head and it sounds fine" *awkward pose*.

Doctor DooM

pixelburp wrote: »

The stag-night scene was genuinely funny, I can't believe I had reservations about Matt Smith: he may not have the gravitas for the heavy scenes, but he does the playful, awkward comedy to a tee. His mannerisms too are just priceless: "funny how you can say something in your head and it sounds fine" *awkward pose*.

I so loved this bit. He was a bajillion miles away from Tennant right there in the best possible way.

Memnoch99

''Did you kiss her back? ''
''No I kissed her mouth''

Brilliant line. Only high point about this episode was the comedy in it, story and special effects were poor. Great exchanges between the Doctor and Rory throughout the episode.

The Recliner

The Recliner wrote: »

It is repeated on Friday at 9pm

Didn't think this episode was great personally

I liked a lot of the little touches and there were some great lines and references but on the whole it just didn't sum up

This is the first episode of Doctor Who that I have forced the girlfriend to watch so it was disdappointing that it was a let down

I still have both Flesh and Stone eps on the ntl box so I will try and convince/trick/bribe her to watch them and hopefully she like it

My boyfriend sat me down and made me watch the 1st ep of the season and now I'm hooked, so keep trying

BlitzKrieg

alright story, some dodgy effects but pretty decent.

its doctor who

the Venice FX and CGI-storm that appeared near the end were B-movie bad.

its doctor who!

There really have been some ropey FX so far, but this episode takes the biscuit.

its DOCTOR WHO

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WBIajuSEq3Y

ixoy

I think too many people have been spoilt by the US shows with their fancy schamncy HD large SFX budgets. As BlitzKreig said: It's Doctor Who. It's a show where the opening credits were done by zooming a camera in on plastic. Where the alien Alpha Centauri looked like a giant painted cardboard penis. Where the terrifying alien has his cushion re-adjusted by a stage hand before sitting down. Let's not bother focusing too much on the production values current weaknesses - it's a lot better than it used to be!

Daemos

Suprised the scene in City Of Death where Duggan rams the wall and the entire room shakes wasn't in that video

Also (a bit late I know) but in Flesh And Stone I could have sworn I saw the wall move when Matt Smith put his hand on it, anyone else see it?

Speedsie

Yep - saw the wobbly wall myself - was surprised no-one mentioned it!

pixelburp

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

its doctor who

its doctor who!

its DOCTOR WHO

Fair enough, but don't forget the old show was back in the day before HD television, CGI or even VHS Video Recorders, it was easier to miss those ropey SFX. Considering season 4 is broadcasting in HD, it seems a shame that the effects have to suffer.

Killer_banana

Yes we've been spoiled by Hollywood effects and yes Doctor Who has a history of dodgy effects but back then ropy effects were acceptable, nowadays people are going to expect more from effects even from a programme with a history of tinfoil monsters, it's just a fact. Also a lot of viewers may not be familiar with the original series so they won't know how much better the effects are.

I have a friend who's seen '80s Who as a child and tried to watch New Who. She couldn't because the quality of the effects just annoyed and distracted her too much. When the standard of effects is stopping the show gaining new fans surely you need to do some rethinking. And I know the story should be more important than effects but it simply isn't for some people, I know someone else who won't watch Heroes for the same reason and their effects are far better than Who's.

Harmsden

Lots to like in this episode, but possibilities squandered. Enjoyed scene between the Doctor and the vamp queen. Something that's missing a lot from New Who is the Doctor squaring off with a flesh and blood villain, as opposed to getting blokey with a piece of CG. The Lazarus Experiment's one of my fave New Who's precisely because, while the plot's derivative, that scene between Tennant and Gatiss in the church just pulsates. One of the greatest disappointments of New Who was waiting for Tenant's Doctor and Simm's Master to have a crackling scene together in Last of the Time Lords, and watching that potential get binned by turning Tennant into a cartoon. It's scenes like the one between Smith and the vamp queen that remind you it doesn't matter whether the FX are ropey or not as long as you have two actors who are just INTO it.

Didn't mind the revelation that the vamps were space fish. Actually, I'm disappointed they didn't explore that more. At times, you can see the bones of a much creepier, Lovecraftian episode, 'The Shadow Over Venice.' Oh well.

Couldn't care less about Amy's husband/baggage. All the Tylers, Stewarts and Nobles of the world could be exterminated tomorrow as far as I'm concerned. Boohoo! Relationships are confusing and difficult! That's why I watch Dr Who in the first place geniuses! Aaah. Let me take my mind off my woes with some deranged adventures through time and... oh. A couple having difficulties. Greeeeat.

Hollywood has a lot to answer for. They've boiled cinema down into a troth of colourful, videogame goop. Roll up, roll up! Eat your goop! I prefer less FX in Dr Who, but if your turned off fun storytelling by the FX not being up to a sufficient standard, have a feel and make sure you don't have holes in your skull. You may have been lobotomized.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

Had a second look at the episode and I have to disagree with all the naysayers here... It's better than the first 3 episodes of this series, which were brilliant... For a monster of the week story it really is fantastic and I didn't see a problem with the special effects - thats the problem with today's society, they want everything spoonfed to them - use some of your own imagination while watching the show and you won't be giving out about effects... Of all the nonsense I've ever heard, this SFX debate is up there with the most nonsensical of it...

BaconZombie

I really like the little details, like the fish Gargoyles...

CaptainNegative wrote: »

Had a second look at the episode and I have to disagree with all the naysayers here... It's better than the first 3 episodes of this series, which were brilliant... For a monster of the week story it really is fantastic and I didn't see a problem with the special effects - thats the problem with today's society, they want everything spoonfed to them - use some of your own imagination while watching the show and you won't be giving out about effects... Of all the nonsense I've ever heard, this SFX debate is up there with the most nonsensical of it...

Stark

CaptainNegative wrote: »

Had a second look at the episode and I have to disagree with all the naysayers here... It's better than the first 3 episodes of this series, which were brilliant...

It was better than "Victory of the Daleks" for definite. But while that I've watched "The Eleventh Hour" 4 times now and "The Beast Below" 3 times, I've pretty much forgotten the vampires episode already. The comedy moments were great, but the story just didn't hang together.

Pittens

Of all the nonsense I've ever heard, this SFX debate is up there with the most nonsensical of it...

My perfectly normal 30 inch television shows the SFX to be fine. Is it because I dont have HD?

Yeah the storm was a bit off, but so what. They had to do that bit in studio I am guessing. Frankly in future the directors should use less CGI and more close ups. Doctor is climbing something, camera zooms down to show potential fall, doctor is very wet. That would be old school and it would shut the naysayers up.

I dont even get the complaints about the SFX - I thought that the Atrexi(sp?) in Ep. 1 were really really good but people complained.

Is it my TV? Are complainers about SFX emphasising that they have a HD set?

Sleepy

Is it a generational thing?

I think the CG in Doctor Who is fine for a weekly serial. I'm 29 and grew up with awful SFX in almost everything - look back at Terminator 2: Judgement Day for example. It was heavily lauded for it's "brilliant" SFX at the time and it's nowhere near the standard of CG used in Doctor Who nowadays.

Have younger generations gotten so used to the seamless SFX/CGI of things like Saving Private Ryan / Sunshine etc that they can't enjoy television without it?

pixelburp

Yikes, a hot topic this.

Well for one, I'm 29 so as much as I'd like to think so, I'm not a young 'un chasing Avatar-standard SFX. I grew up with 80s Who, so in fairness I know exactly how bad SFX can get (I'm amazed at how the top 10 video didn't list any 80s "effects").

For two, Dr. Who is now one of the BBC's flagship shows and biggest money spinners. It's getting airtime on HD & is being pushed a lot State-Side (BBC America's most popular show, ever apparently), it just seems a shame then that the standard of SFX has dropped. I dunno, maybe they're recouping the money spent on the Specials during 2009.

For three, if they're trying to save money, I wish they did so by not spending it on new Dalek designs. We didn't need those

Doctor DooM

Sleepy wrote: »

Is it a generational thing?

I think the CG in Doctor Who is fine for a weekly serial. I'm 29 and grew up with awful SFX in almost everything - look back at Terminator 2: Judgement Day for example. It was heavily lauded for it's "brilliant" SFX at the time and it's nowhere near the standard of CG used in Doctor Who nowadays.

Have younger generations gotten so used to the seamless SFX/CGI of things like Saving Private Ryan / Sunshine etc that they can't enjoy television without it?

I'd like to credit our younger peers more than that

That said, be thankful you're ont babylon 5 fans if you think this CGI is bad