SGU 1x16 "Sabotage" **SPOILERS**

Kiith

Hmm, not sure what to think about that one. I enjoyed it, but they seemed to skip over quite a bit. Eli, Scott and Chloe getting back to Destiny was badly done. Just kind of happened. Will we see more of what happened to them? Was a slow episode, but decent overall.

And what happened Franklin?

Bah! Thread fail. Forgot to add a poll.

johnnysmack

Have to agree with you, it was stupid the way the got back on board. As for Franklin, he better not have ascended!

Also Starring LeVar Burton

I thought it worked well - thought it was pretty good not having another episode of them trying to get back, since we already knew last week the best way they could do that...

LoGiE

I thought this was a poor episode. Some bad dialog and more bloody backround music! Hey Math boy!....

somuj

I reckon he's in statis in some other part of the shape and the ship will call upon when needed.

For all we know the ship has beaming technology

P.S

was a rather dull episode till nearing the end

GarethWA

Not great after last weeks solid ep.
Said to myself "That's a little too convenient!" far too many times!
Earth-bound drama felt unnecessary as i do not feel Camille's character is developing at all, and we spent a lot of time watching absolutely nothing happen relative to anything on Destiny.:mad:
I wonder will it be a 'x amount of months later' job and we'll conveniently be in the next galaxy next ep. Not a lot to do in empty space...
Unless, of course, they were boarded...:D

Redisle

johnnysmack wrote: »

Have to agree with you, it was stupid the way the got back on board. As for Franklin, he better not have ascended!

Yeah, it was a bit ridiculous when they just appeared, they just totally erased that story line in the space of 2 minutes and nothing else was said!

Ascension was actually the first thing that crossed my mind when Franklin disappeared! Like maybe there had been Ancients on the ship at some stage and maybe they had ascended through the use of the chair, rather than Rush's idea that they previously ascended and didn't use the ship.

I wonder if Franklin was more ancient than human there, surely that thing would have done some strange things to his head, plus when he told them to get out he didn't exactly sound normal.
Like he must now posesses all the knowledge of the ship / possibly all the knowledge of the ancients.. Now just to find the bugger!

krpc

johnnysmack wrote: »

Have to agree with you, it was stupid the way the got back on board!

A ridiculous deus ex machina! :rolleyes:

ixoy

Most of the episode was pretty decent but the dreadful way in which Eli and the Gang were returned really put a dampener on it. To think we were praising them last week for not delivering a last-minute rescue! This is even worse because it happened off screen. Grrr.

Venom

Very badly written and weak episode imho. The return of the away team was a joke and a huge plot-hole to the last two weeks and there was way to much earth-side drama again. I felt the whole disabled scientist subplot was just added to be "edgy" rather than from a story point of view.

Conor108

They coulda fleshed out the away team return a bit yeah. But Chloe said "Didn't you guys figure outta way for us to dial in?" Maybe the aliens had something to do it and TPTB are keeping it intentionally vague for some upcoming story? I mean the aliens did make it to the planet Scott, Chloe and Eli dialled in from.

Loved the music in this episode! Actually I've liked all the music SGU has used so far (Alexi Murdoch, Rob Thomas etc.) except for Chloes dream sequence in the opening of 'Divided'.

Mr. Brody's still! We have a bar! On Destiny! This'll be great!

What annoyed me was the whole Lt. James being switched with the alien! Don't they usually need to put the stone on that blue glowing cube thing for a connection? Not a fan of Camille's Earth story either

GarethWA

Conor108 wrote: »

What annoyed me was the whole Lt. James being switched with the alien! Don't they usually need to put the stone on that blue glowing cube thing for a connection? Not a fan of Camille's Earth story either

I think they tried to explain the whole James/alien thing by saying something about how the device was knocked over and wasnt disconnected properly. My intelligence felt a little insulted at how they breezed over that.

P.S. thanks for the video, was wondering what song that was!:D

helimachoptor

But the time where James was switched with the alien and when she switched back it didnt she didnt seem to move from where she was.

BaconZombie

Just finished watching it and thought it was ok, was hoping the "battle" scene would of been better.
I agree the yeah were back bit at the start was a bit of a cop-out.

On the whole Franklin chair bit part, I think the first time he used it it re-wrote this brain like the Face-Grabber in SG1 did to Jack, but the 2nd time it needed to push this brain harder then it should be.

That's why it froze the room to drop his core temperature so he could fully sync with the ship but this completely burned his body out.....
So the chair is a "one use" item.. Possible theory where all the Ancients disappeared to...

Bajingo

I thought it was a good episode..apart from how Eli and co. got back aboard..but then I think it was the best way to get around it too without going too deus ex to be honest...wait..

Anyone else think of the basestar hybrids when Frankilin hopped in the chair?

Anita Blow

People need to make up their minds! Going into showing them getting back would've taken time out of the whole Sabotage storyline. I think they did ok in how they handled it. I mean really, would you rather water down the sabotage episode so they could show the 3 of them sitting on a planet for a 2 nights and then suddenly the address pops up or just let them come through the gate like the did and then spend a tiny bit of time describing what happened. I don't think it was crucial to see them waiting on that planet.

I enjoyed the music but this was the first time I felt they forced that music montage into the show. They really are overusing the whole soft rock montage I think

BaconZombie

I was thinking more along the lines of the pilot in Andromeda Farscape.

Bajingo wrote: »

I thought it was a good episode..apart from how Eli and co. got back aboard..but then I think it was the best way to get around it too without going too deus ex to be honest...wait..

Anyone else think of the basestar hybrids when Frankilin hopped in the chair?

GarethWA

Bajingo wrote: »

I thought it was a good episode..apart from how Eli and co. got back aboard..but then I think it was the best way to get around it too without going too deus ex to be honest...wait..

Anyone else think of the basestar hybrids when Frankilin hopped in the chair?

No, but now that you mention it...!

GarethWA

Anita Blow wrote: »

People need to make up their minds! Going into showing them getting back would've taken time out of the whole Sabotage storyline. I think they did ok in how they handled it. I mean really, would you rather water down the sabotage episode so they could show the 3 of them sitting on a planet for a 2 nights and then suddenly the address pops up or just let them come through the gate like the did and then spend a tiny bit of time describing what happened. I don't think it was crucial to see them waiting on that planet.

I agree, but i'd rather have seen some of that than the earthbound boring Camille story!

The Gnome

helimachoptor wrote: »

But the time where James was switched with the alien and when she switched back it didnt she didnt seem to move from where she was.

That's what I was thinking. I'm betting she didn't sabotage the ship after all, maybe she did connect with the aliens and report the location of Destiny. After all the aliens were following Eli & Co, they may have suspected Destiny was close and knew they could connect to the crew somehow but it's pure speculation of course, but I suspect there's a different saboteur with another agenda.

Do we know who attacked the Icarus base in the pilot? I wondered how whoever it was found the base. I'm thinking a mole among the base staff, a mole who is now sabotaging Destiny.

Probably totally off though and James not moving will be explained away.

Dr. Baltar

Have to agree that Eli & Co coming back was very poorly executed.
Although, I think there's more to it than that. Considering Eli didn't want to send Kino through the gate, I think that they're being controlled in some way by the Blue Aliens.

Overheal

I think Apophis is responsible for the sabotage

Kiith

Overheal wrote: »

I think Apophis is responsible for the sabotage

When in doubt, blame Apophis

_Kaiser_

Have to agree that this latest episode wasn't great - especially after the last few weeks.

Eli and co just appearing was a bit of a let down after all the build up about how and when they'd get back, but as Anita says above, seeing them sitting around till the address popped up wouldn't have really worked either. My guess is they just wrote themselves into a corner on this one and needed to tie the arc up quickly.

Even the whole thing with the aliens seemed a bit convenient. James just happens to connect with one of them, who figures out where Destiny is, sends/takes that information back, oh and has time to sabotage one of the FTL drives as well?
Then the alien goes home, a strike force is organised at a moments notice and just before they board the ship, Franklin - who's been comatose for weeks - just happens to wake up and save them in the nick of time!
I'm all for just going with the story occasionally, but this was just lazy writing.

As for the Camile story, boring and pointless and added nothing to the episode or the character.

Overall then a very poor follow-up to the recent good form imo.

DingChavez

What was wrong with how they returned?

At the end of the last ep they couldn't get back because the ship went to warp. When it was sabotaged it dropped out of warp...

The Gnome

Overheal wrote: »

I think Apophis is responsible for the sabotage

Ha ha! Excellent, I can picture Camille peeling off one of those latex face masks to reveal Aphopis. "Surprise Bitches!"

johnnysmack

DingChavez wrote: »

What was wrong with how they returned?

At the end of the last ep they couldn't get back because the ship went to warp. When it was sabotaged it dropped out of warp...

They were supposed to have gone out of range of the gate when they went to FTL.

Conor108

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Even the whole thing with the aliens seemed a bit convenient. James just happens to connect with one of them, who figures out where Destiny is, sends/takes that information back, oh and has time to sabotage one of the FTL drives as well?

I got the impression that the alien who took control of Lt. James ONLY found their location and that Destiny itself intentionally overloaded its weakest FTL module to increase overall FTL efficiency and make it accross the galactic void to recharge?

Dr. Perry says

From Gateworld.net's transcript:
PERRY: There was an overload - one that probably shouldn't have happened because the system is unbelievably robust, with more safeguards than I can count, but it happened. And - as with most overloads - it happened in the weakest link.

Tar.Aldarion

I think it's implied the alien sabotaged it too, not the best episode but as Amanda is so beautiful I will let that slide!

FreudianSlippers

Poor episode. The first half was god-awful and contained a frankly shark-jumping deus ex machina in bringing those stranded on the planet back to destiny.
Second half was better but only in comparison to the first half - realistically the second half was not good either.

Tar.Aldarion

The way they just appeared back did hurt my face all right. Did like the dinosaur

BaconZombie

Best shot of the Chair so far:

DingChavez

johnnysmack wrote: »

They were supposed to have gone out of range of the gate when they went to FTL.

They never said they were out of range. If they were Rush would have been more surprised that the gate activated. Instead he was very calm and knew it was them. They even redialled the planet. They definitely weren't out of range.

Overheal

DingChavez wrote: »

They never said they were out of range. If they were Rush would have been more surprised that the gate activated. Instead he was very calm and knew it was them. They even redialled the planet. They definitely weren't out of range.

That doesnt make sense though. Destiny's FTL allows it to receive incoming wormholes. This is already established. So why werent they able to get a lock?

don ramo

Overheal wrote: »

That doesnt make sense though. Destiny's FTL allows it to receive incoming wormholes. This is already established. So why werent they able to get a lock?

its a known fact you have to be stationary to recieve or dial a wormhole, stargate 101

solid ep, i thought anyway

Kiith

BaconZombie wrote: »

Best shot of the Chair so far:

Your looking at the chair?

stevenmu

Overheal wrote: »

That doesnt make sense though. Destiny's FTL allows it to receive incoming wormholes. This is already established. So why werent they able to get a lock?

Can it though? When they first got on board I thought the ship was not going FTL. IIRC when they first dialed the address it failed and I think it was implied that the first dial failed because the ship was at FTL and the second succeeded because it was not?

The Don

It was a decent episode but I felt the deux-ex way they brought back the guys was a little convenient. Not sure where the alien could have taken over Lt. James as after she came back she said that she couldn't do it so it was her at that stage. There might be something to the theory that someone else sabotaged the drives and informed the planets where abouts to the Lucian alliance.

More sides to Rush again in this episode. I doubt we'll get any real answer about what happened to Franklin in the next episode.

Did anyone else think that Camile was going to die in disabled doctor's body?

don ramo

stevenmu wrote: »

Can it though? When they first got on board I thought the ship was not going FTL. IIRC when they first dialed the address it failed and I think it was implied that the first dial failed because the ship was at FTL and the second succeeded because it was not?

if the ship is in FT, then theres is no point of origin, if theres no point of origin then the gate doesnt work, i think at one stage you had to be within range of a planet to get a point of origin, but later when they went into space the could get a point of origin by useing the stars, they had to find six surrounding stars,

thinking about it destiny must not have left the galaxy, because a gate address is done by useing six symbols represented by stars to find a gate thats around the center of those six stars intersecting, so no stars no gate address,

anyone smell a continuity error

Kiith

don ramo wrote: »

anyone smell a continuity error

A wizard did it. :rolleyes:

helimachoptor

they had left the galaxy, sure it was floating between them and was shown like this in the show!

Memnoch

What a rubbish episode. I just can't tolerate any more of this body swap nonsense anymore.

Firstly, I thought they couldn't use the stones, because the aliens had one closer to them and the use would swap them with the aliens who used the stone to sabotage Destiny already.

But quite apart from the glaring plotholes is this whole body swap sexcapade nonsense. I can't imagine that the people who volunteer for the swap, consent to having their bodies used to have sex with whoever the temporary inhabitant chooses. That's practically rape. It's idiotic, lazy and cheap story telling.

I've enjoyed the last few episodes, but this was just stupid.

FreudianSlippers

The Don wrote: »

Did anyone else think that Camile was going to die in disabled doctor's body?

Yeah, I kept thinking that the whole time!

DingChavez

don ramo wrote: »

if the ship is in FT, then theres is no point of origin, if theres no point of origin then the gate doesnt work, i think at one stage you had to be within range of a planet to get a point of origin, but later when they went into space the could get a point of origin by useing the stars, they had to find six surrounding stars,

thinking about it destiny must not have left the galaxy, because a gate address is done by useing six symbols represented by stars to find a gate thats around the center of those six stars intersecting, so no stars no gate address,

anyone smell a continuity error

The gate on destiny doesn't need to be near a planet, it just needs to be stopped and in range. They were outside the Galaxy but close enough for a connection.

don ramo

DingChavez wrote: »

The gate on destiny doesn't need to be near a planet, it just needs to be stopped and in range. They were outside the Galaxy but close enough for a connection.

you still need coordinates, and the cordinates are generated by using the stars, its like daniel explained with a cube, it has six sides, pick a point on each side(each point representing a star) and draw a line to the point on the opposite side of the cube, youll have 3 lines intersecting each other at one point, and that point is your destination, enter your point of origin, and bang you have a connection,

there are no stars between galaxies, so what are you suppose to use to get coordinates, space dust?

it a continuty error,

TheKells

The Don wrote: »

Did anyone else think that Camile was going to die in disabled doctor's body?

Well I was hoping she was, if that counts?!:D

Overheal

stevenmu wrote: »

Can it though? When they first got on board I thought the ship was not going FTL. IIRC when they first dialed the address it failed and I think it was implied that the first dial failed because the ship was at FTL and the second succeeded because it was not?

Youre right actually: They were not in FTL when they first arrived on Destiny.

The Gate Wiki states though that Destiny's FTL can receive wormholes. This might be confused information however.

The reason in Air that they only made it on the 2nd attempt was because of Eli discovering the Point of Origin was incorrect... (more below)

don ramo wrote: »

if the ship is in FT, then theres is no point of origin, if theres no point of origin then the gate doesnt work, i think at one stage you had to be within range of a planet to get a point of origin, but later when they went into space the could get a point of origin by useing the stars, they had to find six surrounding stars,

thinking about it destiny must not have left the galaxy, because a gate address is done by useing six symbols represented by stars to find a gate thats around the center of those six stars intersecting, so no stars no gate address,

anyone smell a continuity error

Thats how the gates appear to work. But then you have the McKay space bridge. But, thats neither here nor there.

The Destiny Gate Address is Unique. Its not a set of Co-ordinates: Its a Code (Air pt.1) thats why the point of origin for Icarus didn't lock. They only made it through during the attack because Eli convinced Rush to dial using Earth as the Point of Origin.

Its actually very likely the Ancients used Icarus itself (or planned to) to dial Destiny. Theres nothing on Earth with the power to dial it (presumably, Even Atlantis wouldn't be able for it) And the Stargate on Icarus was discovered already in a Dial-out-Only configuration (Air, pt.1) presumably rigged that way by the Ancients.

The point of using Earth's origin was symbolic of Destiny's origin. And to ensure virtually anyone with even advanced knowledge of the gates and access to Destiny's address would not be able to gain entry to the ship.

It doesnt matter *where* Destiny is. The gate network will search it out.

Memnoch wrote: »

Firstly, I thought they couldn't use the stones, because the aliens had one closer to them and the use would swap them with the aliens who used the stone to sabotage Destiny already.

That was how Boobs was used to sabotage the ship actually. They would not have used the stones if they didn't have to: Destiny was not going to make it across the void. They needed to bring an expert onboard or face dying slowly in cold space.

But quite apart from the glaring plotholes is this whole body swap sexcapade nonsense. I can't imagine that the people who volunteer for the swap, consent to having their bodies used to have sex with whoever the temporary inhabitant chooses. That's practically rape. It's idiotic, lazy and cheap story telling.

Thats Sci-Fi dude. It asks these questions.

Bajingo

Dr. Baltar wrote: »

Have to agree that Eli & Co coming back was very poorly executed.
Although, I think there's more to it than that. Considering Eli didn't want to send Kino through the gate, I think that they're being controlled in some way by the Blue Aliens.

I dont think so..is'nt it Eli's character to incessantly moan about everything :P..I could be wrong though...

Memnoch

Overheal wrote: »

Thats Sci-Fi dude. It asks these questions.

What questions? These aren't legitimate questions about the human condition. These are weak and transparent attempts at dramatization due to a lack of creative ideas and strength of character/story.

To imply that this is somehow the core of what sci-fi is about, is imo a deep insult to the searching questions that sci-fi has and does ask about humanity.

Overheal

Memnoch wrote: »

What questions? These aren't legitimate questions about the human condition. These are weak and transparent attempts at dramatization due to a lack of creative ideas and strength of character/story.

To imply that this is somehow the core of what sci-fi is about, is imo a deep insult to the searching questions that sci-fi has and does ask about humanity.

I think you've missed it then. Its a hard one to word. I think it has to do with our virtual lifestyle. And what will it come to? Long term relationships with webcams and remote controlled toys? What constitutes intimacy?

So theres that aspect of it. "Okay you're in another woman's body" or "Hey, thats my body you're screwing your wife with" If you were braindead, would it be alright to transplant a paraplegic into your body? Thats an old question.

Then theres mental/emotional chemistry vs. physical chemistry. Does Chloe have more in common with Eli than scott? Is she just with Scott because he's better physically? Did she only kiss Eli while he was in a more attractive body (of an airmen)? And was Eli's physical failings the only thing keeping those two from hitting it off?

Plenty to mull over when you think about it. But back to this: if you were braindead, would it be alright for someone else to be transplanted into your body? Is it still yours? Does it matter what happens to your body when you no longer posses it?

Memnoch

Overheal wrote: »

I think you've missed it then...

I think you're just seeing something where there's nothing. What you're not getting is that this has nothing to do with philosophical thought. They're just sticking people in other's people's bodies and sending them on their merry way, completely ignoring the fact that in that sort of situation there would obviously be rules that would have to be followed, consent that would have to be given.

But rather than trying to tackle the issues, they're jumping over them completely in order to create some false drama.