Who are you voting for and why ?

danman

dlofnep wrote: »

To be honest - What I'm not content with on these forums, and I've said this before - is that, when a thread is created to discuss who we are voting for - If a poster mentions Sinn Féin, they are often chastised. We should all be afforded an equal right to express our views on here, without being chastised. I'm well used to it now - so if I choose to post in such threads, I'm ready to spend a few pages defending my vote (not that I should have to in a democratic state), and clearing up the types of distortions that people have already posted in this thread. It's time-consuming.

With your belief on equal rights for all parties, what is your opinion of the abuse that FF posters get on this site?

Annasopra

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

Water costs have to paid anyway, so you either directly charge those who use water or place a blanket tax on the whole population. In terms of "fairness" the former easily wins the day; pay for what you use I say.

It's not "fair" at all - It's another form of regressive taxation

Put it this way John Gormley has said that 1 billion eur in revenue will be raised from water charges

Thats 1 billion euro take out of the general taxation system and then you charge per household - In effect this means that the poorer sections of society will be paying proportionately more of their household income on water then middle class households

I think these links explain Labours position very well

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/6247053

http://thelooneyleft.blogspot.com/2009/12/press-release-budget-10-labour.html

dlofnep

danman wrote: »

With your belief on equal rights for all parties, what is your opinion of the abuse that FF posters get on this site?

I think you'll find that I've been more than fair, as evident in this post: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=65519542&postcount=17

Fianna Fáil is the party I dislike the most, but I try not to chastise their followers too often. I believe that everyone should have the right to air their views without being belittled.

danman

Thanks for that.

I may not be pro any party, and I admit I don't have an affection for SF, but I do believe we should have proper political debates on this section of boards and leave the rants to after hours.

You've just gone up a notch in my personal poster rating.

dlofnep

Appreciated

Eliot Rosewater

Johnnymcg wrote: »

It's not "fair" at all - It's another form of regressive taxation

By the same token we should get rid of electricity charges, because that is a form of "regressive tax".

In reality, the council is providing a quantity based service. I believe that you should pay for what you get, and that those who use less water should not have to pay for by those who use more.

Annasopra

Eliot Rosewater wrote: »

By the same token we should get rid of electricity charges, because that is a form of "regressive tax".

In reality, the council is providing a quantity based service. I believe that you should pay for what you get, and that those who use less water should not have to pay for by those who use more.

So a family with 5 children should be penalised because the parents want to wash and feed the children?

Eliot Rosewater

Johnnymcg wrote: »

So a family with 5 children should be penalised because the parents want to wash and feed the children?

That's an interesting way of looking at things. Should I be "penalized" by my broadband company because I want to post on Boards.ie? But you've mentioned both food and water there; I assume you are against supermarkets "penalizing" families for wanting to feed themselves?


The point is this: the family are receiving a service from the council. It costs the council money to provide this service, and thus the family should pay the council for those costs incurred.

yoshytoshy

You can't put a value on clean water ,I think we're one of the last countries in europe to throw away the stuff.

It's in everybodies interest that we treat water responsibly and charge for it.

rcecil

Sinn Fein predicated the economic crisis years earlier and were called Loolas by Ahern. Now FF and their golden circle buddies have fleeced us for up to 70 bn euros and many people think voting FG is the alternative.

That's like Mussolini saying he would make the trains run on time or George Bush's kindler, gentler America that killed multitudes in the lust for oil and empire.

Sinn Fein was the only party to fight against the Lisbon Treaty. Now they are being proven right in their analysis. Where are all these jobs that the corporate parties promised?

If you seriously look at how SF has worked with the opposition in the 6 counties and has done a credible job then you should look deeper at SF policies and stands.

SF Elected officials are paid an industrial wage and the rest goes back into the movement. No perks.

Sinn Fein is respected by leaders like Nelson Mandela.

Gerry Adams was the only world leader to meet with Bush and speak in opposition to the invasion of Iraq.

SF is opposed to US troops landing at Shannon on their way to invade other small countries.

Sinn Fein actively supports a Palestinian state and the removal of the Cuban embargo

Sinn Fein is the only party that speaks against the misuse of Irish nattural resources ie Shell to Sea and fishing rights

The party actively supports workers rights and fights corporate dominance.

Ireland is worth the struggle. So do you vote for tweedledee? Tweedledum? Or try a new approach.

FTA69

Now FF and their golden circle buddies have fleeced us for up to 70 bn euros and many people think voting FG is the alternative.

When Fianna Fáil and their golden circle decided to recapitalise Bank of Ireland and AIB (worth €1.5bn at the time) with €7bn odd of tax payers' money in return for a 25% stake in them, Sinn Féin voted in favour of it. It was left to Gilmore to point out the fundamental injustice of such a move. Similarly in 2007 Sinn Féin did a complete u-turn on its economic policies and were desperately trying to get into coalition with the crowd you're deriding above.

Sinn Fein was the only party to fight against the Lisbon Treaty.

Is that so? I must have just been deluded regarding all the things I was doing at that time so. I'm not in Sinn Féin, but yet I distinctly remember flypasting at 4am and spending my evenings handing out leaflets for weeks.

Gerry Adams was the only world leader to meet with Bush and speak in opposition to the invasion of Iraq.

Adams a "world leader"? :rolleyes:

I also remember Ógra Shinn Féin protesting outside Stormont about Bush and then inside Adams and co swanning around the place with him. Gas.

Almost as gas as Martin McGuinness recently being pictured with his arms around the Israeli ambassador, clasping his hand while presenting him with a book. Yeah, Boycott Israel... :rolleyes:

Sinn Fein is the only party that speaks against the misuse of Irish nattural resources ie Shell to Sea and fishing rights

Really, when I was getting f*cked into a ditch after a site occupation in Rossport I didn't see anyone from Sinn Féin there at the time.

Listen, I don't want to come across as some bitter arsehole, I was in Sinn Féin for long enough myself. That having been said, much of what you've wrote above is simply nonsense.

danman

rcecil wrote: »

Gerry Adams was the only world leader to meet with Bush and speak in opposition to the invasion of Iraq.

when did Gerry Adams become a world leader?
What's he the leader of?

I thought the French amongst many others showed their colours toward the Iraq invasion.
A little bit of revisionist history going on there?

SeanW

Ideally, we need a government that will balance the books - with as little extra tax as possible - take on the totally inefficient mess that is the public service, respect civil liberties, and have some vision for economic recovery.

1. Fianna Fail ... need I say more.:mad:
2. Labour. Just voted in their AGM that its their policy to reverse the PS pay cuts, seemingly independent of any reform. Just reverse the cuts. They just lost my vote.
3. Greens. Propped up Fianna Fail. Killed most of the roads programme beyond what was already under construction. Clearly few if any new roads will go to construction if they get reelected. They also did what I considered impossible, i.e. make more crazy anti-nuclear policies (I considered it impossible since we already have a ban on nuclear energy generation) yet they scuppered two Uranium exploration projects that could have brought wealth, jobs and prestige to Co. Donegal, which is the poorest in Ireland. They imposed a whole load of new taxes and regulations that are going to hurt for a long time.
4. Sinn Fein/IRA. Some positives, but it will take a new generation of SF politicians/leadership before I can vote for them.
5. Socialist Party, SWP and miscellaneous far left headbangers ... no thanks

That leaves me with Fine Gael. I believe, at very least that Enda Kenny is an intelligent and honest person, so I couldn't care less about his supposed lack of charisma. I also think they have at least some idea what they're doing.

nacho libre

PomBear wrote: »

The party policy is to support abortions where there is a risk to the life or health of the mother, or where there is a foetal abnormality that means the foetus would be stillborn.

.

Thanks for answering my question. I'll likely be voting Labour come the next election so.

PomBear

nacho libre wrote: »

Thanks for answering my question. I'll likely be voting Labour come the next election so.

take note of the second part of my post, i'd recommend voting SF if that's your swaying factor tbh

rcecil

And what PARTY were you flypasting for? Sinn Fein was the only PARTY fighting Lisbon. Gerry Adams is a world leader according to the leaders I respect like Mandela. Adams "swanning" around with Bush? Again Adams was the only one to present him with a letter opposing invasions and US troops at Shannon. Shell to Sea? Congratulations for being at the Garda riot as were several SF staff. I will give you their names upon request. A solid delegation of us were at Castlerea recently with Pat O'Donnell and later the Mayo SF councillors went inside to meet with him. An Phoblacht is the only national paper covering their struggle.ONLY SF as a party have spoken out and worked in his behalf.
Further, tough decisions are made at a national Ard Fheis and fully debated. Lastly I think people on the left need to work in unison not spend time attacking each other. The enemy laughs at you.

danman

Enemy????

this is the sort of language that puts people off SF.
Do you not realise this?

RandomName2

rcecil wrote: »

And what PARTY were you flypasting for? Sinn Fein was the only PARTY fighting Lisbon.

Had they kept quiet maybe the no side would have got some more votes.

FTA69

rcecil wrote: »

And what PARTY were you flypasting for? Sinn Fein was the only PARTY fighting Lisbon.

More nonsense. I was out on behalf of Éirigi. The Socialist Party and the SWP and a few other PARTIES also opposed Lisbon.

Gerry Adams is a world leader according to the leaders I respect like Mandela.

He leads a dwindling centre-left political party in a small European country. He is not a world leader, much as you'd like him to be.

Adams "swanning" around with Bush? Again Adams was the only one to present him with a letter opposing invasions and US troops at Shannon.

So you don't find the notion of Adams hobnobbing with Bush inside Stormont while Ógra protested outside a slight bit contradictory. Almost as contradictory as Adams and McGuinness getting pally with an Israeli ambassador while simultaneously participating in Boycott Israel campaigns.

Shell to Sea? Congratulations for being at the Garda riot as were several SF staff. I will give you their names upon request. A solid delegation of us were at Castlerea recently with Pat O'Donnell and later the Mayo SF councillors went inside to meet with him.

I never said nobody in Sinn Féin participated in that particular campaign, when I was in SF I was also out picketing Shell stations. My only concern is your bald assertion that it was solely Sinn Féin who were driving that campaign when it wasn't then and it certainly isn't now.

ONLY SF as a party have spoken out and worked in his behalf.

More spoof.

Further, tough decisions are made at a national Ard Fheis and fully debated.

They are in their arse, they're made by Gerry Adams and his clique. There was f*ck all consultation in 2007 when Sinn Féin cynically kangaroo-hopped into the centre aching to get into coalition with Fianna Fáil, in fact that disaster led to them actually losing a TD when Adams was crowing about 10-12.

Lastly I think people on the left need to work in unison not spend time attacking each other.

Ha, so he says after the litany of "Sinn Féin are the ONLY..."

The enemy laughs at you.

I'd say there's people (and not just the "enemy") laughing at you if you honestly buy into the nonsense you've just wrote above.