Anybody buy property in Kranevo, Bulgaria?

dermatrov

I am a concerned (some may stupid) person who purchased a property a few years ago when times were good in Bulgaria.

Bought from a developer called Best Of Bulgaria, http://www.best-of-bulgaria-property.com/ lovely development in Kranevo, which is nearly finished now, but the builder is in trouble, due to so many UK buyers being unable to complete due to sterling/euro situation and banks stopping mortgages.

No sign of deeds coming etc.

Worried.

Anyone had similar situation?

dermatrov

If so PM me and I will share my experiences first :mad:

dermatrov

If so, please join this forum so we can build a community, gain strength, and have a voice.

dudara

Moved to Accomodation & Property

dudara

Victor

It is important to get independent legal advice. Do not use a solicitor that is recommended by any developer.

35plus

dermatrov wrote: »

If so, please join this forum so we can build a community, gain strength, and have a voice.

Hi, I have also stupidly purchased an apartment at Kranevo Paradise Gardens, have you had any joy with Best of Bulgaria, I sent them an email recently and have had no response. Do you kow of anyone else who has dealt with them? Do you have any updates as to where they are with the project?

Please get in touch, I would like to hear how you are getting on.

Thanks

dermatrov

Hi


Just sent you a PM



Dermatrov

35plus wrote: »

Hi, I have also stupidly purchased an apartment at Kranevo Paradise Gardens, have you had any joy with Best of Bulgaria, I sent them an email recently and have had no response. Do you kow of anyone else who has dealt with them? Do you have any updates as to where they are with the project?

Please get in touch, I would like to hear how you are getting on.

Thanks

the_syco

Do a search in here for titles with "Bulgaria" in them here, and you'll find a few threads. One thread talks about how a group went together to get money back...

dmc96328

dermatrov wrote: »

I am a concerned (some may stupid) person who purchased a property a few years ago when times were good in Bulgaria.

Bought from a developer called Best Of Bulgaria, http://www.best-of-bulgaria-property.com/ lovely development in Kranevo, which is nearly finished now, but the builder is in trouble, due to so many UK buyers being unable to complete due to sterling/euro situation and banks stopping mortgages.

No sign of deeds coming etc.

Worried.

Anyone had similar situation?

Hi
we have been waiting years for this project to complete. any help advice would be appreciated.

moro25

Glad to find some fellow purchasers of this development. I bought back in 2005 and like you guys are long awaiting delivery I even have a mortgage on the place!. I have actually been to the development and stood inside the apartment I purchased so it is all nearly finished. These guys have been hit by a combination of bad luck, misjudgement and greed! The usual!
I have tried lawyers etc but there is nothing that can be done and I am pretty sure this company is slowly retiring back to Cyprus and just keeping things ticking along with a shell in Bulgaria because now they don't communicate at all.
Also emailed Best of Cyprus.
Weird thing is, that I think they should have approach us investors if what they needed was 500,000 euros they may be able to sell us some apartments in return for completion of the project but I don't see them considering all options!
Can you guys get in touch with me so we can look at all the avenues that may be available?
Thanks
Sacha

moro25

I also think we need to reach out. There must be lots more people so I have set up a group in facebook so we begin to get real faces and people together
http://www.facebook.com/groups/265367176810560/
please join
Thanks
Sacha

moro25

Additionally, I looked at their membership that they used to put at the bottom of their emails and like certain property related associations etc...all false - I heard back from the bodies in the UK and associations. So they were asked to remove those accreditations as it were.
I don't know what will happen with the development. There are many shells in Bulgaria at different stages. Ideally, we should take matters into our own hands but we need to go through the process.
So let's get going on some sort of an action plan or at least explore the options, get to know each other a little and see if there is anything that could be done.
Sacha

redbullx11

Hi fellow bestofbulgria sufferers! , I also bought an apartment in kranevo paradise gargensI , we had paid 50% , but 3 years ago decided to cancel and request a refund. based on the fact that their lates plans were different to what we originally paid for ,they agreed ,but its been 3 long painful years , while they have always been in communication ,its generally been the same 'economic downturn' waffle , but as of late none of them are replying , i hav considered the legal route

moro25

I tried the legal route on getting money back for the furniture I paid for as they were going to deliver at that time. Of course, I didn't get the money back for that. I wish you luck with the legal route but I am beginning to think they have gone bust and of course there is nothing or not much that I think can be done at that point!
To me one of the obvious things that seems to have been overlkooked here and suggested to Andreas Kasioulius is that they approach the original investors and sell the remaining project to us with a guarantee it would finish the project. They seem to need about 500,000 euros to finish the project and put it into operation. They have over the past year apparently been neogotiating with a group of investors but that has obviously fallen through.
If you ask me whether for a share I would put up another 10,000 euros with another 49 investors to complete the project as long as it was guaranteed I would agree. Does anyone believe this is feasible/negotiable?
Sacha

Mattyr95

Hi guys. I've been looking for a forum conversation on Kranevo Paradise Gardens for some time now. Glad to have finally found one.

Ours is a similar story. My brother and I purchased an apartment back in 2005 and opted to pay in instalments. We agreed to the annexes to the contract when the completion date was postponed and continued to transfer our instalments as required. In summer 2007 I asked a question via our agent regarding the final 10% instalment. I assumed that this would not be payable, the developers having imposed a 10% penalty on themselves for late completion (as per the annexes to the contract). Their reply was that the full discount would not be given for some obscure reason which I now forget. We obviously queried this but were then told that if we didn't like it Best of Bulgaria would be happy to cancel our purchase and give us a full refund plus the 10% in way of the penalty. Both we and our agent were gobsmacked (the dispute had been over a sum of a mere 700 euros) but saw it as an opportunity to release ourselves from what was becoming an increasingly problematic arrangement. We signed a cancellation contract and were told that our refund would be transferred in one month. This never happened.
I have spent the last 4 years chasing up Best of Bulgaria. Firstly through the British director, Alex Beeston and later through Haris Menalow, once Alex was mysteriously “no longer involved in the workings of the company”, (Haris’s words). They continually quoted excuses that I am sure you are all familiar with, that repayments to their lender took priority over cancelation refunds and that we would receive our money when and if the company found its way out of trouble. I then found via their website that our apartment had been resold for a sum 3 times that of our initial investment and due refund. I now believe that they purposely coerced us into cancelling to enable them to resell the apartment to generate further capital. I don’t believe they ever had any intention of refunding us within time frame they initially specified.
Whilst on holiday in Cyprus last Christmas, I phoned Haris Menalow and requested a meeting. He obliged and met for a coffee in Limassol. He was extremely apologetic about the whole affair and appeared to be on the level (why would he bother meeting me for a coffee if he were not). He reassured me that they had a Russian investor literally days away from signing a deal that would ensure the completion of the project, delivery of all apartments and payment of all refunds. I left the meeting with a level of renewed confidence in the situation.
I continued to communicate with Haris over the coming months (via text message as he had stopped replying to emails some months earlier), and he continued to assure me that the deal was still going ahead and that the investors were still carrying out due diligence. Around May Haris stopped replying to my text messages. I tried phoning and emailing both the Cyprus and Bulgaria offices but to no avail.
With this, we decided to finally seek legal assistance, (we had neglected to seek this previously due to the cost involved but had recently come into some money that would allow us to finance it). We instructed a Bulgarian solicitor who has just this week got back to us with his preliminary report. The long and short of it is that the company, Golden Bulgarian Developers Ltd (they formed a different company for each of their developments) has been insolvent since May. It appears that the administrators have not yet been called in but it is just a matter of time. The bank will obviously be the preferred creditor and our solicitor feels that the chances of us getting back our investment are slim. The cost involved in pursuing it is not cheap and could effectively be throwing good money after bad. We are still undecided as whether to pursue the matter.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. However, I would be keen to see what we can achieve as a team, (I know where the Best of Cyprus office is in Limassol:)) I have joined the aforementioned Facebook group and would encourage others to do likewise. It's possible that if we all club together that the Bulgarian courts will have to take us seriously as a preferred creditor!? Just a thought. I will run it by our solicitor. Please feel free to PM with any questions.

Matt

moro25

Mattyr95 wrote: »

Hi guys. I've been looking for a forum conversation on Kranevo Paradise Gardens for some time now. Glad to have finally found one.

Ours is a similar story. My brother and I purchased an apartment back in 2005 and opted to pay in instalments. We agreed to the annexes to the contract when the completion date was postponed and continued to transfer our instalments as required. In summer 2007 I asked a question via our agent regarding the final 10% instalment. I assumed that this would not be payable, the developers having imposed a 10% penalty on themselves for late completion (as per the annexes to the contract). Their reply was that the full discount would not be given for some obscure reason which I now forget. We obviously queried this but were then told that if we didn't like it Best of Bulgaria would be happy to cancel our purchase and give us a full refund plus the 10% in way of the penalty. Both we and our agent were gobsmacked (the dispute had been over a sum of a mere 700 euros) but saw it as an opportunity to release ourselves from what was becoming an increasingly problematic arrangement. We signed a cancellation contract and were told that our refund would be transferred in one month. This never happened.
I have spent the last 4 years chasing up Best of Bulgaria. Firstly through the British director, Alex Beeston and later through Haris Menalow, once Alex was mysteriously “no longer involved in the workings of the company”, (Haris’s words). They continually quoted excuses that I am sure you are all familiar with, that repayments to their lender took priority over cancelation refunds and that we would receive our money when and if the company found its way out of trouble. I then found via their website that our apartment had been resold for a sum 3 times that of our initial investment and due refund. I now believe that they purposely coerced us into cancelling to enable them to resell the apartment to generate further capital. I don’t believe they ever had any intention of refunding us within time frame they initially specified.
Whilst on holiday in Cyprus last Christmas, I phoned Haris Menalow and requested a meeting. He obliged and met for a coffee in Limassol. He was extremely apologetic about the whole affair and appeared to be on the level (why would he bother meeting me for a coffee if he were not). He reassured me that they had a Russian investor literally days away from signing a deal that would ensure the completion of the project, delivery of all apartments and payment of all refunds. I left the meeting with a level of renewed confidence in the situation.
I continued to communicate with Haris over the coming months (via text message as he had stopped replying to emails some months earlier), and he continued to assure me that the deal was still going ahead and that the investors were still carrying out due diligence. Around May Haris stopped replying to my text messages. I tried phoning and emailing both the Cyprus and Bulgaria offices but to no avail.
With this, we decided to finally seek legal assistance, (we had neglected to seek this previously due to the cost involved but had recently come into some money that would allow us to finance it). We instructed a Bulgarian solicitor who has just this week got back to us with his preliminary report. The long and short of it is that the company, Golden Bulgarian Developers Ltd (they formed a different company for each of their developments) has been insolvent since May. It appears that the administrators have not yet been called in but it is just a matter of time. The bank will obviously be the preferred creditor and our solicitor feels that the chances of us getting back our investment are slim. The cost involved in pursuing it is not cheap and could effectively be throwing good money after bad. We are still undecided as whether to pursue the matter.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. However, I would be keen to see what we can achieve as a team, (I know where the Best of Cyprus office is in Limassol:)) I have joined the aforementioned Facebook group and would encourage others to do likewise. It's possible that if we all club together that the Bulgarian courts will have to take us seriously as a preferred creditor!? Just a thought. I will run it by our solicitor. Please feel free to PM with any questions.

Matt

Matt thanks for your post. Obviously this is very bad news but not unexpected. I really don't know what the potential outcomes are in these situations not just for yourself but for others like myself that still own apartments there. I think the bank will take ownership of everything that wasn't sold ??and is owned by the company ?? It may improve the chances of this being finished in a way ! Can anyone shed light ?
Thanks
sacha

Victor

moro25 wrote: »

I tried the legal route on getting money back for the furniture I paid for as they were going to deliver at that time. Of course, I didn't get the money back for that. I wish you luck with the legal route but I am beginning to think they have gone bust and of course there is nothing or not much that I think can be done at that point!
To me one of the obvious things that seems to have been overlkooked here and suggested to Andreas Kasioulius is that they approach the original investors and sell the remaining project to us with a guarantee it would finish the project. They seem to need about 500,000 euros to finish the project and put it into operation. They have over the past year apparently been neogotiating with a group of investors but that has obviously fallen through.
If you ask me whether for a share I would put up another 10,000 euros with another 49 investors to complete the project as long as it was guaranteed I would agree. Does anyone believe this is feasible/negotiable?
Sacha

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

Tigger

Victor wrote: »

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

i think you'll find it's :
"There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again."

GWB

redbullx11

I am currently woking with a solicitor , they have issued legal notice to them via notary , but there is no one at bestofbulgarias office. If they do not reply the next step will be to take them to court Im nervous of this route ,as you say it couldbe throwing good money after bad. As individuals maybe we have no voice and cannot get anywhere , but a suggestion ,as a larger group if we come together ,maybe using one solicitor with one solid route , one disadvantage going alone is the legal costs are big , if we as a group go through the courts in one action against BOB , the legal cost would be small . what do you think

Mattyr95

redbullx11 wrote: »

I am currently woking with a solicitor , they have issued legal notice to them via notary , but there is no one at bestofbulgarias office. If they do not reply the next step will be to take them to court Im nervous of this route ,as you say it couldbe throwing good money after bad. As individuals maybe we have no voice and cannot get anywhere , but a suggestion ,as a larger group if we come together ,maybe using one solicitor with one solid route , one disadvantage going alone is the legal costs are big , if we as a group go through the courts in one action against BOB , the legal cost would be small . what do you think

I think it's definitely worth asking the question. I'll PM you with my thoughts. Anybody else interested in this proposal?

yayrab1930

I'm in the same boat. Actually passed by the development yesterday. It's still one of the biggest and (imho) nicest in the area. I would consider the suggestion of paying say 10,000 more to see the project through to completion. I brought this up with Andreas last summer, but he dismissed the idea. I assumed that this because his relations with his customers were not good enough to get say 50 to increase their investments. Now Andreas appears to be in Cyprus, and the young woman left apologetically handling the affairs in Varna has not replied to us since about 10/8/11.
I guess like many of us, I bought via a ltd company. I have been putting considerable effort to keep the Ltd in order - assuming that the administrator should not be able to touch the assets of a solvent company. But we have had problems getting all of our original paperwork from BoBG. Our new accountant has been getting very frustrated because Apologetta does not know much about accounting, and the original accountant now works elsewhere (although she did meet us mid July with most of the paperwork prepared). We are still requesting the missing paperwork from Apologetta, but as I said, she has stopped replying.
For me it would be advantageous to join any joint legal actions, so please keep me informed.
Ian

yayrab1930

p.s. When I saw Apologetta at the BoBG offices in mid-July, she mentioned that the mortgage for the offices had not been paid for months, and that that it is only a matter of time before the bank takes ownership and evicts them/her. The security guard downstairs was extremely unfriendly, which led me to believe that he knew something of the offices debt situation. Apologetta did say that Andreas was still contactable via the BoBG and BoCyp mailboxes.

Mattyr95

Spoke to our solicitor. He says that joint action is a non-starter as we all have separate contracts & interests (some people are owners with deeds, some investors and others creditors like myself). I think at this point we're just going to write this off and put it behind us

annie oakley

I recently employed a firm of solicitors in Dublin, who work with a firm of solictors in Bulgaria, and asked them to carry out a due diligence legal report on Golden Bulgarian Developers and my company. The report basically backs up what you are all saying. KMB best of Bulgaria have had insolvency proceedings brought against them by foreign investors in Balchik. The court has imposed a ban over te operation of this company. They are the sole owners of Golden Bulgarian Delvelopers. Their office is the same as GBD and are being searched by the police, and headquarters are closed.The financial status of Golden Bulgarian Developers is very poor and likely to likely to result in it's insolvency.

I now have to provide the solicitor with receipts of monies paid to determine if legally I can be a creditor. Aparently nowhere in the legal documents does it say that the developer must finish the development!

I will let you all know what the outcome of my investigation is. I would certainly be interested in "clubbing together" with other investors as I think there is strength in numbers! And I am sure that some of you feel like me, I really do not want to throw more money at this and have nothing to show at the end. The due diligence report wasn't cheap, but it led me to contact other investors so glad I did it now (just wish I had done it when investing!)

Mattyr95

Just as a matter of interest, does anybody know of or happen to be in contact with any other investors who have not yet commented on this thread or signed up to the Facebook page?

dermatrov

Hi. Yes I am in touch with some other buyers now.

I have just joined the FB group (requested), I have concrete news. I will not post it on this thread, as I do not want to compromise the outcome, however, what I know will impact everybody on this thread. I will update all on the locked FB group, once I have been accepted or by PM. I will then set up an email distribution thread.

Regards

Dermatrov

dix21

I too purchased an Apartment at Kranevo in 2006.

I went into estate agent in London to purchase an apartment in France but was sold apartment in Bulgaria.

The Purchase price for apartment £70k plus £6.9k furniture plus 10k for legal fees

I Have spent all available cash on this project and I have lost enough.

Any suggestions what I do next???

moro25

Hi was it at Paradise Gardens 1? If so please join this site:
http://www.facebook.com/sserfaty25?ref=tn_tnmn#!/groups/265367176810560/

there are more of us there too. I am admin so request to join.
Cheers
Sacha

moro25

By the way which apartment did you buy? Section and number?

dermatrov

Hi all

For anybody who bought one of these apartments, or any investment via "Best of Bulgaria" - please register your interest immediately on www.incisecapital.com as a syndicate is being formed and court proceedings are happening currently.

Thanks

Dermatrov

Victor

As always, be wary of scams that target people who are already the victims of scams, e.g. offering to get your money back in exchange for an upfront amount of money.

ramenor

Hi Victor

Whilst I fully endorse your recommendation for caution in general, I'm responding because I'm one of the founders of the site referred to in Dermatrov's post (immediately before yours).

We are owned by 108 investors who advanced loans to the group of companies responsible for the development in question and who, after a 3 year legal battle, have taken control of the group. We are now in the process of restoring, to the extent possible, each of the affected projects and would urge anyone who has purchased through Best of Bulgaria to get in touch. We will however be making contact with every purchaser we can identify as we work our way through each project.

Our status can be verified via Companies House in the UK and the Bulgarian Commercial Register, as well as via our lawyers in Bulgaria. We would be happy to supply the appropriate information to any genuine interested party. Send me a PM or visit our site at www.InciseCapital.com.