Gangland 7 arrests this am

munstergirl

News from limerick leader, someone else will have to post link.
Gardai were busy at work this am,
Hope they lock them all up and throw away the key!

Itsdacraic

I was going through the city early this morning and noticed a lot of Garda activity alright.

They have one these "shows of force" every few months. I wonder if there'll be full page photos of the raids in one of the Sunday red tops?

Rarely does anything stick, hopefully this time will be different.

h3000

munstergirl wrote: »

News from limerick leader, someone else will have to post link.

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/Nine-men-arrested-during-gangland.6249231.jp

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0423/limerick.html

Mc Love

They will be all released I'd say this afternoon

the drifter

yip on the way into work i passed 3 aru units 2 paddy wagons 1 mini bus a k9 unit ( i tink) and 4 squad cars all togehter....and thought to myself.....someones getting an ass whooping this morning :P

Reaganomical

Seven of those detained are being questioned under the new gangland legislation introduced last year. They can be held for up to a week if necessary

From the rte.ie report. They might not be getting out quite as quickly as they expected.

flutered

this will be a test of the new legislation. it will be a case of schit or get off the pot, i wonder will we have a news release from him with the dandruff shoulders.

Itsdacraic

If it was any of the big boys brought in we'd have heard about it by now. Probably just the usual slew of low ranking lackies.

munstergirl

I think its amazying 130 gardai for 8 arrests...
Time will tell, if it was a publicity stunt hopefully not!

PARKHEAD67

munstergirl wrote: »

I think its amazying 130 gardai for 8 arrests...
Time will tell, if it was a publicity stunt hopefully not!

Hopefully with that amount of guards its the big boys theyre after. Its great to see em gettin tough with these f**Ks at last. Was a drug raid in a house up the road from me a couple of days ago. 4 or 5 drugs squad involved.1 man led away.Not in Limerick BTW.

concussion

Usually the posts are along the lines of "the guards do nothing", now it's "too many of them are arresting people"

PARKHEAD67

concussion wrote: »

Usually the posts are along the lines of "the guards do nothing", now it's "too many of them are arresting people"

Your right. But the more guards in these areas where crime is rife the better I think. And when theres that amount of guards involved it sends out a serious message. People have had enough of these scumbags.

Henry Ford III

Not sure who got arrested yet, but I hear the cops are absolutely intent on closing down the gangs this time - and will do whatever is necessary to do so.

Furthermore I understand the Gardai have a high ranking gangbanger who has turned evidence.

We'll see what develops.....

MissHoneyBun

concussion wrote: »

Usually the posts are along the lines of "the guards do nothing", now it's "too many of them are arresting people"

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?! The thugs must be laughing! If they used their resources correctly, they'd be making eight arrests per day not once in a blue moon and the scum would have been off the streets by now. I don't see why they should be applauded for this, it's called doing their job. Which is what everyone in gainful employment is expected to do.

Kristopherus

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?! The thugs must be laughing! If they used their resources correctly, they'd be making eight arrests per day not once in a blue moon and the scum would have been off the streets by now. I don't see why they should be applauded for this, it's called doing their job. Which is what everyone in gainful employment is expected to do.

Boy , you havent a clue how the Gardai work in those situations.

MissHoneyBun

Kristopherus wrote: »

Boy , you havent a clue how the Gardai work in those situations.

Unfortunately I know all too well about the inner workings of the Gardai Kristopherus so I wouldn't go making mindless assumptions if I were you

Kristopherus

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Unfortunately I know all too well about the inner workings of the Gardai Kristopherus so I wouldn't go making mindless assumptions if I were you

From inside the counter or outside?

dh0661

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?! The thugs must be laughing! If they used their resources correctly, they'd be making eight arrests per day not once in a blue moon and the scum would have been off the streets by now. I don't see why they should be applauded for this, it's called doing their job. Which is what everyone in gainful employment is expected to do.

you must be the ex minister for defence.

MissHoneyBun

Kristopherus wrote: »

From inside the counter or outside?

Politely, that is none of your business. But please don't some assume ignorance on the basis that someone has a different opinion to you.

pinkfloyd34

munstergirl wrote: »

I think its amazying 130 gardai for 8 arrests...
Time will tell, if it was a publicity stunt hopefully not!

id say they need that amount of guards ro carry out the searches, these fellas dont hide anything in their houses but may have their drugs/weapons hid around the area so the guards are probably searching waste land in areas near these fellas houses so in that respect 130 may even be too small, there not there to carry out the actual arrest.

Amazotheamazing

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?! The thugs must be laughing! If they used their resources correctly, they'd be making eight arrests per day not once in a blue moon and the scum would have been off the streets by now. I don't see why they should be applauded for this, it's called doing their job. Which is what everyone in gainful employment is expected to do.

Em, do you realise how long it would take to search each house/area without large numbers of Gardai? It takes incredibly long to get into the position where you can make arrests if you want the charges to stick in these scenarios, that's why they can't arrest 8 every day.

daveharnett

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?!

Have you ever seen a strong unarmed man really struggling with police? It can easily take four to restrain him without risking serious injury to either party (and I've seen teams of four struggle too). Police forces everywhere have found that overwhelming numbers make raids much safer, both for police and suspects.

So how many people would you send to knock down a door containing an unknown number of people linked to organised crime and known to carry arms?

That's ignoring all of the manpower needed outside of the raiding teams - surveillance, searching the premises, collecting evidence, taking statements, all that jazz.

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

If they used their resources correctly, they'd be making eight arrests per day not once in a blue moon and the scum would have been off the streets by now.

If they made eight arrests per day, the gangs could quit crime and live off their harassment claims. You need evidence to arrest people, which is thin on the ground when witnesses are being shot.

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

I don't see why they should be applauded for this, it's called doing their job. Which is what everyone in gainful employment is expected to do.

My employer doesn't expect me to storm the houses of armed criminals, or get shot at while patrolling. Just to illustrate, here's what they found when they came knocking a while back.

ligind

This has all the appearance of a pr excercise.

I think we all understand that to make cases stick against the main players requires careful policework and you can only make arrests when you have gathered the evidence.

The problem I have is that while this is going on lots of the junior scum bags are running around causing problems virtually unimpeded so by the time the guards make the big time arrests there is another generation ready to step in and take over.

Henry Ford III

ligind wrote: »

This has all the appearance of a pr excercise.

I think we all understand that to make cases stick against the main players requires careful policework and you can only make arrests when you have gathered the evidence.

The problem I have is that while this is going on lots of the junior scum bags are running around causing problems virtually unimpeded so by the time the guards make the big time arrests there is another generation ready to step in and take over.

I agree with your 3rd paragraph, but this is no PR exercise.

The cops have got a new line of evidence - someone very much on the inside has turned I'm hearing.

Stab*City

Henry Ford III wrote: »

The cops have got a new line of evidence - someone very much on the inside has turned I'm hearing.

That would be interesting if it turns out to be true.. A twist this story has yet to produce..

Stab*City

i live directly across the road from one of the houses raided yesterday morning..

Kess73

Stab*City wrote: »

i live directly across the road from one of the houses raided yesterday morning..

So you live in one of Dooradoyle/Ballinacurra Gardens/Ballinacurra Road/Hyde Road/Lenihan Avenue/Weston then.:)

concussion

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Way to twist things there. I reckon people are more concerned with why they are sending 130 people to arrest 8. Sixteen guards to every one arrest?!

8 people in several different buildings, each in the company of an unknown number of people. As has been said, you need a restrain those eventually arrested as well as anyone else obstructing you and in addition you need search teams, command and control, possibly a cordon (well, several cordons) and a reserve to move to any trouble spots. Maybe they should have sent a car to each address and politely asked them to put some cuffs on?

Henry Ford III

Stab*City wrote: »

That would be interesting if it turns out to be true.. A twist this story has yet to produce..

It's true ok. Confirmed. The name of the individual was in the papers recently too.

Stab*City

Henry Ford III wrote: »

It's true ok. Confirmed. The name of the individual was in the papers recently too.

Link?

MissHoneyBun

Information and evidence is gathered mainly prior to arrests. It's what prompts the arrest to take place. Evidence gathered during an arrest would be mainly supplementary. An arrest is just the formal procedure of taking somebody in for questioning on suspicion of them being in breach of legislation. Often when a lot of the hard work has already been completed.

Daveharnett, statements would be taken at the station, not at the scene and are often taken on a one-to-one basis with occassionally two Gardai present. Evidence is also thin on the ground because the Gardai won't exhaust all their means of looking for it. Convictions can be made on the basis of circumstantial evidence too you know, which often has more impact than the anecdotal evidence supplied by witnesses. Gardai do expect to make raids and be shot at, it's the nature of their job which they are made fully aware of before they choose to pursue this type of career. Gangs don't exist in this town solely for financial gain Dave nor would they voluntarily 'quit crime' to live on claims if there were 8 arrests made per day. They should be forced to quit crime by being systematically arrested and imprisoned for consistently breaking the law.

Concussion, arrests made during raids are usually best executed when done discreetly and without pomp or ceremony attached to cordons. The merits of stealth in these situations are widely acclaimed.

As another poster has already mentioned, deploying large amounts of Garda resources to focus on singular incidences allows further crime to go unnoticed and paves the way for the next generation while all the Gardai are busy pursuing a handful of perpetrators. An exercise in futility basically and a largely uneffective means of tackling widespread crime.

Henry Ford III

Stab*City wrote: »

Link?

No link. Not mentioned in the press, yet.

concussion

I did say possibly cordons. I have no idea of the requirements of this specific operation. Show me something that proves that they needed less Gardaí than were involved but took them anyway and I'll stand beside you and say they wasted taxpayers resources. Otherwise I'll have to disagree with you view that too many were used.

Edit - daveharnett never said they would take statements at the scene. He said Gardaí would be needed to take statements.

smokie2008

Henry Ford III wrote: »

No link. Not mentioned in the press, yet.

You said his name was mentioned in the press recently, so post that link???

MissHoneyBun

concussion wrote: »

Show me something that proves that they needed less Gardaí than were involved but took them anyway and I'll stand beside you and say they wasted taxpayers resources. Otherwise I'll have to disagree with you view that too many were used.

I could equally request that you show me something that proves your opinion too. None of us here are privy to the specifics of this case so requesting proof is largely irrelevant. The basis of this conversation is speculatory for all of us.

johno2

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

None of us here are privy to the specifics of this case so requesting proof is largely irrelevant. The basis of this conversation is speculatory for all of us.

Translation: I'm making all this up so the rest of you must be doing that too.

johno

MissHoneyBun

johno2 wrote: »

Translation: I'm making all this up so the rest of you must be doing that too.

johno

Do you have anything to substantiate that accusation Johno or are you just contibuting groundless assumptions?

concussion

That's grand. There are three options that I can see so:

1 - You know that too many were used but won't tell us any more. If so, you are indirectly revealing operational information. Tut tut.

2 - You forgot to put "in my opinion" in front of everything you posted.

3 - You don't know what you're talking about.

Amazotheamazing

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Information and evidence is gathered mainly prior to arrests. It's what prompts the arrest to take place. Evidence gathered during an arrest would be mainly supplementary. An arrest is just the formal procedure of taking somebody in for questioning on suspicion of them being in breach of legislation. Often when a lot of the hard work has already been completed.

Daveharnett, statements would be taken at the station, not at the scene and are often taken on a one-to-one basis with occassionally two Gardai present. Evidence is also thin on the ground because the Gardai won't exhaust all their means of looking for it. Convictions can be made on the basis of circumstantial evidence too you know, which often has more impact than the anecdotal evidence supplied by witnesses. Gardai do expect to make raids and be shot at, it's the nature of their job which they are made fully aware of before they choose to pursue this type of career. Gangs don't exist in this town solely for financial gain Dave nor would they voluntarily 'quit crime' to live on claims if there were 8 arrests made per day. They should be forced to quit crime by being systematically arrested and imprisoned for consistently breaking the law.

How many people do you think are needed to search a house and arrest a person?

The point of these arrests is they are being charged with really serious stuff, offences against the state, it's not comparable to picking someone up for littering or whatever you want 8 people arrested for every day.

MissHoneyBun

concussion wrote: »

That's grand. There are three options that I can see so:

1 - You know that too many were used but won't tell us any more. If so, you are indirectly revealing operational information. Tut tut.

2 - You forgot to put "in my opinion" in front of everything you posted.

3 - You don't know what you're talking about.

I have made it clear what I'm talking about and don't see the need to assert my judgements to fit your requirements. Again, I could equally make those same three assumptions relevant to your posts.

Amazotheamazing

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

I have made it clear what I'm talking about and don't see the need to assert my judgements to fit your requirements. Again, I could equally make those same three assumptions relevant to your posts.

No you haven't, how many Gardai do you think should have been used?

Btw, do you think the same Gardai who arrested the guys left them unattended in the squad car while they had a quick look around the houses or something? Maybe the Gardai called a taxi to run the arrested back to Henry street while they checked the back yard etc? Sure, could they have hired a few polish lads to check the attic, half the price and twice as fast you know...

J K

concussion wrote: »

T
....
1 - ...... If so, you are indirectly revealing operational information....

She sounds like a solicitor actually. An angry solicitor. Wonder why the chip
on the shoulder, hardly analogous with success.

concussion

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

I have made it clear what I'm talking about and don't see the need to assert my judgements to fit your requirements. Again, I could equally make those same three assumptions relevant to your posts.

What you have done is asserted that you know what you are talking about and that there was no need for that amount of Gardaí. Yet you haven't given us any reason to believe what you say.

Myself, I know very little about Garda operations but I do know that if you're going to raid a house you need a lot of bodies to get in there, more to stop them running away and an element to control all that. I would be very surprised if they did that without a backup unit standing by to assist and, given the nature of the arrests, an armed unit also. Put those numbers together and you could easily reach 16 per house, if not more.

You say they definately didn't need that many so prove it. Myself, and others, have shown how you may need that amount.

Amazotheamazing

J K wrote: »

She sounds like a solicitor actually. An angry solicitor. Wonder why the chip
on the shoulder, hardly analogous with success.

Thought she was the angry primary school student teacher in Mary I? Anyhow, good to know the next generation will be well versed in Garda procedure as well as the usual primary school subjects.

MissHoneyBun

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

No you haven't, how many Gardai do you think should have been used?

Btw, do you think the same Gardai who arrested the guys left them unattended in the squad car while they had a quick look around the houses or something? Maybe the Gardai called a taxi to run the arrested back to Henry street while they checked the back yard etc? Sure, could they have hired a few polish lads to check the attic, half the price and twice as fast you know...

I'm sure you know what they say about sarcasm so I'm not sure why you're resorting to it. Also, where in my posts did I suggest any of that nonsense about taxis etc?! Just to clarify, 130 Gardai for 8 arrests is too many. That clear enough for you?

MissHoneyBun

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Thought she was the angry primary school student teacher in Mary I? Anyhow, good to know the next generation will be well versed in Garda procedure as well as the usual primary school subjects.

Getting personal now? Charming way to make a debate. Actually I'm not sure why I'm bothering here when the foundations of your posts revolve around rhetoric, sarcasm and personal abuse which constitutes little or no intelligence regarding the issue.

daveharnett

MissHoneyBun wrote: »

Just to clarify, 130 Gardai for 8 arrests is too many. That clear enough for you?

That much is clear. You have been asked a number of times how many Gardai you would task to an operation where 8 houses connected to armed gangs are raided. Care to answer?

MissHoneyBun

daveharnett wrote: »

That much is clear. You have been asked a number of times how many Gardai you would task to an operation where 8 houses connected to armed gangs are raided. Care to answer?

Can you provide the case history that would allow anyone to posit a concrete answer? If not, see post # 35.

Aidric

I'm surprised people are still engaging with this poster. Classic troll behaviour. Throw a statement out there and then steadfastly refuse to back it up.

MissHoneyBun

Aidric wrote: »

I'm surprised people are still engaging with this poster. Classic troll behaviour. Throw a statement out there and then steadfastly refuse to back it up.

Check out post #31 there Aidric before ya jump in with the old irrational statements. Anything more to contribute than that yourself no? Cos if not, you aren't really in a position to comment on people throwing statements out now are you? Classic troll behaviour indeed.

Stab*City

4 to 6 gurads involved in the dooradoyle raid.. FACT

2 guards approached the house on foot.. Started hitting the door "LET US IN, LET US IN" one took off running around back of house while the other gained entrance.. The runner returned with a gearbag and entered house. Door was locked and every window in house opened. Paddywagon arrived guard beat down door while detectives inside.. guard proceeded to kick in door while house was already occupied by gaurds..

end of eyewitness account.

So that leaves 126-124 useless guards to do the rest of the 7 "raids/arrests"