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Power restriction for new drivers?

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135

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    #62
    P.C.
    Registered Users Posts: 2,782 ✭✭✭P.C.


    bbk wrote: »
    How can someone who only drives a car have any credible opinion on what legislation is in place for bikers? Aside of course of the legislation that can effect car drivers in some way, I think bikes have to have lights on as an example.

    I say that because, he hasn't given any opinion on what legislation should be in place with bikers with regards to bikers nor did he intend to. I dont see why you are getting yourself in a twist about it.

    So -

    Do you agree with restriction imposed on first time biker riders?

    Go back and read the first post, then come back and answer that.


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    #63
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    challengemaster wrote: »
    The government? Really? Don't you think they already have enough say in things? The people who couldn't handle a pair of tits if they were put infront of their noses? Take a look at the roads you drive on every day. Now, re-think putting the govt. in charge of things... ;)

    hmm....lawnmower has 13hp, can't really kill yourself though, damn thing has a fail-safe seat :pac:

    Go drive out in front of a truck and report back :D


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    #64
    hobochris
    Registered Users Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭hobochris


    KamiKazi wrote: »
    Go drive out in front of a truck and report back :D

    does the truck have to be moving?:D


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    #65
    challengemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 16,931 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    KamiKazi wrote: »
    Go drive out in front of a truck and report back :D

    but..it's in the shed... :(


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    #66
    bmw535d
    Registered Users Posts: 1,160 ✭✭✭bmw535d


    im insured in a 2.8 shogun with 123bhp and only paying 1000 on my dads policy so its cheaper than you think,,i have a learner permit to


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    #67
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Jeez lads, never let the topic get in the way of a good argument :rolleyes:


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    #68
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users Posts: 13,981 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    bmw535d wrote: »
    im insured in a 2.8 shogun with 123bhp and only paying 1000 on my dads policy so its cheaper than you think,,i have a learner permit to

    Are you trying to troll?


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    #69
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    Problem with motorcycles is there is no protection. Every crash the driver ( and passenger ) is ejected. The damage done is when the kinetic energy of the ejected person is absorbed in hitting stationary objects.
    The faster you go the more your kinetic energy and the more damage done.

    Seat belts save lives not by preventing you from hitting the windscreen but by preventing you from being ejected from the vehicle.

    Motorcyles ( or donorcycles as we call them) unfortunatly are proportionally more dangerous.

    If my son turning 17 had the choice of a 50 cc scooter or a 250bhp car, I know which one he would be safer in.


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    #70
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Problem with motorcycles is there is no protection. Every crash the driver ( and passenger ) is ejected. The damage done is when the kinetic energy of the ejected person is absorbed in hitting stationary objects.
    The faster you go the more your kinetic energy and the more damage done.

    Seat belts save lives not by preventing you from hitting the windscreen but by preventing you from being ejected from the vehicle.

    Motorcyles ( or donorcycles as we call them) unfortunatly are proportionally more dangerous.

    If my son turning 17 had the choice of a 50 cc scooter or a 250bhp car, I know which one he would be safer in.

    Attack the post not the poster eh?

    OK, this post is moronic.


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    #71
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    Sorry I have seen several motor cyclists left paralysed from hitting telegraph poles at high speeds.
    I also used to ride motor cycles ( and still own one but the insurance is too expensive).
    Motor cycles are more dangerous, often it is not the motorcyclists fault but more often than not in a MVA car vs motorcycle the speed the motorcyclist is ejected and the deceleration ( hitting a stationary object) often determines the outcome.

    Calling my previous post moronic is more a reflection of yourself.


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    #72
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    You think I'm not aware of the dangers of being on a bike? :rolleyes:

    I would regard a 17 year old unexperienced being in control of a 250bhp car a lot more dangerous than a 50cc moped.


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    #73
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Problem with motorcycles is there is no protection. Every crash the driver ( and passenger ) is ejected. The damage done is when the kinetic energy of the ejected person is absorbed in hitting stationary objects.
    The faster you go the more your kinetic energy and the more damage done.

    Seat belts save lives not by preventing you from hitting the windscreen but by preventing you from being ejected from the vehicle.

    Motorcyles ( or donorcycles as we call them) unfortunatly are proportionally more dangerous.

    If my son turning 17 had the choice of a 50 cc scooter or a 250bhp car, I know which one he would be safer in.

    What has any of that (badly informed) information got to do with restricting learners?


    Putting a 17yr old behind the wheel of a 250bhp car wouldn't do very much for anyone's safety (particularly other road users), suggesting such a thing is simply trolling for an argument or indicative of your level of intelligence, not very high.

    As an aside, I have know many more that lost their lives in cars than on bikes and I'm a biker.


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    #74
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    No I would not.
    Statistically the chances of a death or serious injury I am afraid would be with the scooter rider.

    There were 2 motorcyclist killed on the roads last weekend.

    Probably were far more MVAs involving cars but the chances of having a fatal outcome on a motorcyle are greater.
    They represent less than 2% of vehicles but account for 12% of road fatalities.


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    #75
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    bladespin wrote: »


    As an aside, I have know many more that lost their lives in cars than on bikes and I'm a biker.

    Yes that is true more people die in car accidents but motorcycles are more dangerous.

    Which part of my post is badly informed?
    I only go by statistics and the crippled motorcyclists I treat.


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    #76
    Cuddlesworth
    Registered Users Posts: 13,981 ✭✭✭✭Cuddlesworth


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    No I would not.
    Statistically the chances of a death or serious injury I am afraid would be with the scooter rider.

    There were 2 motorcyclist killed on the roads last weekend.

    Probably were far more MVAs involving cars but the chances of having a fatal outcome on a motorcyle are greater.
    They represent less than 2% of vehicles but account for 12% of road fatalities.

    Compulsorily wearing of full safety gear plus VAT free prices for all safety gear(like all other industry) and CBT before getting on a bike would drop that figure right down.


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    #77
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Yes that is true more people die in car accidents but motorcycles are more dangerous.

    You seem convinced on that, but, as already asked, what has that got to do with restricting learner or newly qualified car drivers???

    BTW I've been riding motorcycles since I was 5 and have yet to be attacked by one, how can you describe them as dangerous? They're just machines.


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    #78
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Yes that is true more people die in car accidents but motorcycles are more dangerous.

    Everything is relative.

    Relatively speaking, a newbie on a 50cc moped is a lot safer than a guy who's just passed his theory test getting behind the wheel of a 250bhp car.


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    #79
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    KamiKazi wrote: »
    Everything is relative.

    Relatively speaking, a newbie on a 50cc moped is a lot safer than a guy who's just passed his theory test getting behind the wheel of a 250bhp car.

    Having had to tell the parents of a "Newbie" that their son did not make it, I would question your assertion.


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    #80
    peasant
    Registered Users Posts: 17,819 ✭✭✭✭peasant


    bladespin wrote: »
    Putting a 17yr old behind the wheel of a 250bhp car wouldn't do very much for anyone's safety (particularly other road users),

    Safe driving is not about horse power but about brain power.

    While having more horses at your command might increase the temptation to drive like an eejit, being an eejit isn't in any way diminished by driving a slow sh!tbox.

    In other words, a young driver with cop-on will drive safely no matter what car (s)he's in, a totally reckless driver will possibly kill someone while driving a Micra


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    #81
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Having had to tell the parents of a "Newbie" that their son did not make it, I would question your assertion.

    So you'd agree with me that it's ridiculous to have such stringent power restrictions for bikes and none for cars?


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    #82
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    Having had to tell the parents of a "Newbie" that their son did not make it, I would question your assertion.

    Very sad indeed, the term's noob btw.
    Also, I'm just a little bit shocked at a doctor using the term 'donorcycles'

    Any who, back to the topic at hand;

    I take it then you are infavour of restricting new drivers on safety grounds then???


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    #83
    Anan1
    Registered Users Posts: 22,818 ✭✭✭✭Anan1


    KamiKazi wrote: »
    Attack the post not the poster eh?

    OK, this post is moronic.
    If that's the best you can muster by way of constructive argument then best not post at all.


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    #84
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    bladespin wrote: »
    Very sad indeed, the term's noob btw.
    Also, I'm just a little bit shocked at a doctor using the term 'donorcycles'

    Any who, back to the topic at hand;

    I take it then you are infavour of restricting new drivers on safety grounds then???

    Sorry the term was used when I worked in Australia, they tend to be a bit more "efferevescent" in language use , mind you "drinkdrive bloody idiot " was pretty good.
    I would like to see the evidence that power restrictions on motorbikes actually saves lives.
    Australia practically every 17 year old has a 3.7 lit holden with community based car insurance . But speeding was nearly impossible with big fines that hurt.
    Perhaps better enforcement would save more lives - it seems to have been very effective so far.


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    #85
    Idleater
    Registered Users Posts: 6,236 ✭✭✭Idleater


    Traumadoc wrote: »
    I would like to see the evidence that power restrictions on motorbikes actually saves lives.

    I think this is the exact question that remains unanswered.


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    #86
    alo1587
    Registered Users Posts: 460 ✭✭alo1587


    Power of a car doesnt kill,speed of a car does.You can still get a 1 Litre ****box up to (and over) 100 mph...


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    #87
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    Anan1 wrote: »
    If that's the best you can muster by way of constructive argument then best not post at all.

    It was a pretty silly answer to the question don't you think?

    Q: Should new drivers cars be restricted?

    A: Motorbikes are scary.

    :rolleyes:


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    #88
    KamiKazi
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,201 ✭✭✭KamiKazi


    bladespin wrote: »
    It was a pretty silly answer to the question don't you think?

    Q: Should new drivers cars be restricted?

    A: Motorbikes are scary.

    :rolleyes:

    You can't be talking to nice respectable car drivers like that, it's all the big bad bikers fault anyway.

    /sarcasm


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    #89
    peterdaly
    Registered Users Posts: 37 ✭peterdaly


    A new learner driver has to have a driver that has a 2 year full driving license in the car to be able to drive. You can still kill someone at 30mph.


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    #90
    bladespin
    Registered Users Posts: 7,335 ✭✭✭bladespin


    peterdaly wrote: »
    A new learner driver has to have a driver that has a 2 year full driving license in the car to be able to drive. You can still kill someone at 30mph.


    That's true but the discussion is about those who have passed their test, should they be restricted as motorcyclists are?


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    #91
    Traumadoc
    Registered Users Posts: 2,523 ✭✭✭Traumadoc


    KamiKazi wrote: »
    You can't be talking to nice respectable car drivers like that, it's all the big bad bikers fault anyway.

    /sarcasm

    As I said I own a motorcycle as well, I never said it was the "big bad bikers" fault. In most cases it is not. Just motorcyclists are more likely to die or be badly injured.


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