Vaginismus

Orla K

I'm wondering are people aware of what vaginismus is. Myself, I only heard about it a year or two ago. I was aware of the what it was and why I had it(only mild) but never thought it had a name.

So a simple question to people, have you heard of it before?

I was going to put in a better explanation of it but the better one was so long because it really does vary so much.

Vaginismus, sometimes anglicized vaginism is the German name for a condition which affects a woman's ability to engage in any form of vaginal penetration, including sexual intercourse, insertion of tampons, and the penetration involved in gynecological examinations. This is the result of a conditioned reflex of the pubococcygeus muscle, which is sometimes referred to as the "PC muscle". The reflex causes the muscles in the vagina to tense suddenly, which makes any kind of vaginal penetration—including sexual intercourse—painful or impossible.
A vaginismic woman does not consciously control the spasm. The vaginismic reflex can be compared to the response of the eye shutting when an object comes towards it. The severity of vaginismus and the pain during penetration, including sexual penetration, varies from woman to woman.

spurious

I've heard of it.

shellyboo

Yup, I've heard about it before.

Ickle Magoo

Yep, think I read about it in an agony aunt section of a mag at the dentists...

SeekUp

I'd heard of that happening, but I didn't know that's what it was called.

alwaysadub

Yeah i've heard of it before.
I know of someone who had a mild case of it.
If i remember right,it can be over come sometimes.
But it's a pretty awful thing to have.

Morgase

Yeah I know of it, because I have it

It is horrible to feel not in control of your own body.

Dudess

A good analogy is to think of it as the female equivalent of erectile dysfunction. It must be horribly frustrating to want to have sex with someone but to be unable to. It is considered to have psychological factors also

ERR!

never heard of it before :O

Orla K

Dudess wrote: »

A good analogy is to think of it as the female equivalent of erectile dysfunction. It must be horribly frustrating to want to have sex with someone but to be unable to. It is considered to have psychological factors also

I'd say it's mainly psychological, while there may be(not always) a physical reason why it started it's made worse by the fear of the pain.

Beffy

Never heard of this before. I'm quite surprised I haven't.

lemon_sherbert

I'd heard of this from an episode of Private Practice

Miss Lockhart

I have it too. I have persevered and managed to have full intercourse occasionally but it is very difficult and still quite painful.

As you can imagine inserting tampons and gynaecological exams are out of the question, as sex is only just manageable when totally aroused which is obviously not the case for these other situations.

I don't buy the mostly psychological theory in the sense that I had no fears or hangups about my body when I was younger and having this condition came as quite a surprise for me when I first tried to insert tampons etc and thought there was something very wrong with me.

I agree though that there is probably a psychological aspect to it now, for me, with the fear of the inevitable pain.

Orla K

Miss Lockhart wrote: »

I have it too. I have persevered and managed to have full intercourse occasionally but it is very difficult and still quite painful.

As you can imagine inserting tampons and gynaecological exams are out of the question, as sex is only just manageable when totally aroused which is obviously not the case for these other situations.

I don't buy the mostly psychological theory in the sense that I had no fears or hangups about my body when I was younger and having this condition came as quite a surprise for me when I first tried to insert tampons etc and thought there was something very wrong with me.

I agree though that there is probably a psychological aspect to it now, for me, with the fear of the inevitable pain.

It's not really about fears or hangups about the body although with some people I'm sure it can be. Only some people start with a physical cause, some people might startgetting it after years of having sex with no physical cause and then some people get it after childbirth (which could be physical or psychological, I have no idea)

I just have to say that there is nothing very wrong with you, it's normal out of the twelve people that posted here three of them have some form of it. And it is treatable just look up Dilator or treatments on the internet(if you don't know already)

Just don't get too bogged down about it, it'll only make it worse

ck3960

hi, yeah i've come across in a few times. its so distressing to see. must be so hard not to be able to control your own body. i've looked after some women in labour (i'm a midwife) with this. so as you can imagine it can be difficult for women who suffer with it when they're having babies.

altho i must add that if we know someone has vaginismus, we do take steps to try and make things easier for them. its not that uncommon i dont think, and women who have it need empathy and understanding.

jildwy

Hi all,

Lots of objective information on www.womenshealthcinic.ie, www.vaginismus.com and www.wikipedia.org

msdk

Hi,

I've heard of it, in fact I suffer from it. I'm in my 30s and have never managed to have sex, I've tried a few times but it never worked out and it's been years since I last tried. Needless to say I'm single, I think the fear of not being able to have sex has something to do with that. Anyway, I've found other posts online and I'm wondering does anyone have any recommendations of treatments? I've tried my GP but she's baffled and the Well Woman centre didn't really work out very well for me. Any help at all or even just a nudge in the right direction would be greatly received.

I'm new to this whole posting thing so I'm not even sure if this thread is still being read by people.

Kimia

Hi Msdk,

Sorry to hear that. I think it's very unfair of your doctor to just leave it at 'she's baffled'. She should refer you to someone else or at least keep trying to help you. Have you tried going to another GP?

Das Kitty

msdk wrote: »

Hi,

I've heard of it, in fact I suffer from it. I'm in my 30s and have never managed to have sex, I've tried a few times but it never worked out and it's been years since I last tried. Needless to say I'm single, I think the fear of not being able to have sex has something to do with that. Anyway, I've found other posts online and I'm wondering does anyone have any recommendations of treatments? I've tried my GP but she's baffled and the Well Woman centre didn't really work out very well for me. Any help at all or even just a nudge in the right direction would be greatly received.

I'm new to this whole posting thing so I'm not even sure if this thread is still being read by people.

I visited Dr. Martine Millet Johnston in the Kilkenny Clinic with a problem that isn't entirely unrelated to yours and I found her professional and compassionate. She solved my problem after years of pain and misdiagnosis. She is qualified both as a Gynaecologist and a Psychotherapist.

You have to be referred by your GP.

Please don't accept that this is just "how it is going to be." If you couldn't use your foot you'd keep trying to get to the bottom of the problem, but a lot of women just accept the problems with their vaginas.

It's clearly negatively affecting your life and you deserve love, happiness and joyful sex in your life.

babyfratelli_x

SeekUp wrote: »

I'd heard of that happening, but I didn't know that's what it was called.

Yup, same as this.

msdk

Thanks very much I'll try both of those, my GP did refer me to a woman in the Clanwilliam Institute but she told me my problem was caused by the fact that I was single and didn't seem to realise that part of the reason I'm single is because of this and part of this problem is of course caused by that, it's a catch 22.
I have found that people I've tried to get to help me have been more used to working with couples instead of a single woman and all got me to a certain point and then gave up so it's a hard situation from that end.
Plus as I'm sure you all know it's hard to get excited about a possible solution only to have it not work out.

I'll give them both a try though.

jildwy

Hi all,

See these two sites for more information

www.vaginismus.com
www.womenshealthclinic.ie/vaginismus/html

LegacyUser

Yep I suffered from it till age 20, couldn't even use mini tampons, it was like trying to gt a tampon into a brick wall.

What happened for me was that I totally resigned myself to never being able to have sex, just chalked it down as one of those things like getting married or buying a house or whatever that most people do but some people never do. And a month or two after I'd decided I was never going to have sex and that that was fine, I was masturbating and my finger just slipped in accidentally, and from there I was able to use tampons, and with the next boyfriend I had I was able to have sex (had tried with other guys before and it was just not going to happen, didn't even hurt really, they just might as well have been trying to get it into my ear).

I'm still quite tight down there and if I'm not having regular sex it gets to the point where I need to do gymnastics to get a mini tampon in, and it hurts for a sec every time me and my (well-endowed) boyfriend have sex (this wasn't a problem with more average fellas!), but I just tell myself that it will go in and it'll be fine, and then it is.

I consider myself very lucky to have resolved it at a relatively young age, and at the same time I don't regret that I had it.. it stopped me having very ill-advised sex with some very unsuitable young men in my teens!

Morgase

msdk wrote: »

Thanks very much I'll try both of those, my GP did refer me to a woman in the Clanwilliam Institute but she told me my problem was caused by the fact that I was single and didn't seem to realise that part of the reason I'm single is because of this and part of this problem is of course caused by that, it's a catch 22.
I have found that people I've tried to get to help me have been more used to working with couples instead of a single woman and all got me to a certain point and then gave up so it's a hard situation from that end.
Plus as I'm sure you all know it's hard to get excited about a possible solution only to have it not work out.

I'll give them both a try though.

I have no idea what your being single would have to do with anything. Is it because they try to counsel both of you at the same time or something? (Genuine question by the way, as I have been treated for this problem and my relationship status was irrelevant.)

Anyway I had my treatment at the Well Woman clinic on Pembroke Road, Dublin 4 You do need to be referred by a GP afaik.

Dr Eimer Philbin-Bowman is a Psychiatrist who sees clients for a wide range of issues, including anxiety and depression, psycho-sexual problems, vaginismus and eating disorders.

It took me a long time to overcome it but you should know that even if it does take a long time, the success rate is very very high. If you persevere with treatment, you will be well.

LegacyUser

Finally....this is exactly what I've been experiencing!! I'm 21, and have never had any problems up until about 4 months ago. Then it started hurting when my bf first enters me. Went to my doctor, and she did a full sti test which came back clear and I've been baffled ever since!

Looking at those websites, it seems I have the very mild form of it, whereby it hurts initially but after a minute or so the pain goes away completely. I was saying to my boyfriend that it felt as though it was something to do with the muscles down there being too tight! I'm so happy that I've finally found a possible answer to my problem Straight back to the doctor now to ask her about it!!!

LegacyUser

Morgase wrote: »

I have no idea what your being single would have to do with anything. Is it because they try to counsel both of you at the same time or something? (Genuine question by the way, as I have been treated for this problem and my relationship status was irrelevant.)

Back in the day when we were having trouble with it, both myself and my wife attended treatment. The 'homework' involved us both. I suspect it would take more inventiveness to do it single.

Treatment was a matter of individual and mutual sexual and non sexual stimulation.

It took me a long time to overcome it but you should know that even if it does take a long time, the success rate is very very high. If you persevere with treatment, you will be well.

We went to Caroline Harrison of the HARI unit at the Rotunda Hospital in Dublin. She told us about the high success rate too. I think it took us 3 to 4 months to get it sorted.

msdk wrote:

Needless to say I'm single, I think the fear of not being able to have sex has something to do with that.

Of course, it's perfectly possible so have a full and satisfying sex life (both m and f) without vaginal sex but I suspect it's very hard to approach a possible relationship with this looming in the back of your head...

LegacyUser

http://howibeatvaginismus.blogspot.com/

LegacyUser

I would advise anyone who has vaginismus to seek treatment early and don't "just live with it".

I developed vaginismus after a difficult sexual experience (not going into details). And being the embarrassed individual I was, I ignored it, hoping it would go away.

My fiance (later my husband) & I tried therapy but it didn't work as we weren't the open-talking types so we just lived with it....

We eventually separated (amicably) and I have not been out with anyone since - I'm afraid to, because I know I can't have sex.

I last had full intercourse over 25 years ago.

So ladies, don't ignore the problem.

msdk

I don't really understand what being single has to do with it either to be honest and just guessed that it was because it's easier to treat as a couple or if you have somebody you can talk to it about at the same time as trying to rectify the situation.
I tried the Well Woman on Pembroke Rd and really didn't find it great, went to see Dr Philbin Bowman and she gave me dilators etc but again the single thing became an issue when we reached a point where the next step was to try and actually have intercourse.
As one of the earlier posts said it is hard to go into anything with the fear hanging over you that it might not work out, plus a few less than understanding men have passed comment on it not working out so I really am terrified of trying again although I would of course love to get it sorted.
The thing is I can use tampons and it's ok when I'm on my own it's just with somebody else that it kicks in so I really am baffled.

I have just kind put it down to one of those things that I'll never be able to do, although covering it up in social situations is getting harder and harder, especially with long term friends who know that there's no history there.

Horrible situation

lisa085

I have it as well, the only advice I can give is not to get too bogged down into it, www.vaginismus.com sell dialators, de best kind dat can be sterilized if needed. www.vaginismus-awareness-network.org is an excellent information site. I went to shanakiel hospital cork, Dr.Cann she was fantastic out of all the doctors and gyno's id been to (approx 10)
Look at it in a positive way that my vaginia wont penetrate just any body!!!

ElleEm

I had a friend with it years ago. I had never heard of it,and could see the pain in her eyes everytime she spoke of it. She and her longterm boyfriend tried everything to fix it,and went down the counselling route too. It was so upsetting that they were putting it down to psychological issues when all she wanted was to be intimate with her boyfriend. It took yrs,but she got sorted in the end and now has a little baby!

LegacyUser

I'm terrified I suffer from this. I've had a sexual experience but it hurt almost to the point of crying (I was drunk though) but apart from that I'm quite nervous. It's almost as if I have always known it will hurt. I've tried penetrating myself but it just doesn't happen. Half of me still hopes I'm just doing it wrong.

LegacyUser

Hey just wanted to give a view from the opposite partner who has experience in coming across this. I was in a 10 year relationship with my ex who suffered from vaginismus, she was a virgin when we first met and remained a virgin when we split up. A truly complex and misunderstood issue to see somebody you love go through (and go through with). In my ex's case the pain it brought was enough to turn her off the very thought of even attempting sex, so after many years of trying and failing we just kind of slotted into the "thats just the way it is" process.
But my ex was absolutely reluctant to get help or go to therapy over the issue, and i would feel like a bastard anytime i wanted to bring it up, because i didnt want to voluntarily hurt her by attempting it again, and i also didnt want to knock her already frail confidence at the same time. Not to be self involved or anything but it had a deep effect on my own sexual confidence, so much so that i still havent had sex with anyone else since we split up in 2009.
Meanwhile i got the shock of my life in the summer when i found out she had a baby with her current boyfriend (i havent spoken to her since we split up and she moved to a different part of the country) but i'm absolutely delighted for her yet at the same time it affected my own confidence because now i've been left asking myself the dreaded question "was it my fault?".

My advice to anyone suffering would be to get the very best help there is available for it as soon as possible and most importantly dont allow your perceived shame of the condition allow it to get in the way. My ex's story is absolute proof that it can indeed be overcome, but bizarrely i have no real information on how she went about it!

seenitall

erawneila wrote: »

Meanwhile i got the shock of my life in the summer when i found out she had a baby with her current boyfriend (i havent spoken to her since we split up and she moved to a different part of the country) but i'm absolutely delighted for her yet at the same time it affected my own confidence because now i've been left asking myself the dreaded question "was it my fault?".

My advice to anyone suffering would be to get the very best help there is available for it as soon as possible and most importantly dont allow your perceived shame of the condition allow it to get in the way. My ex's story is absolute proof that it can indeed be overcome, but bizarrely i have no real information on how she went about it!

There are other ways to conceive other than the usual, you know. Think medical intervention.

Unless you know otherwise for certain, I wouldn't be jumping to too many conclusions about your ex's current sex life. It could be either way.

I feel for you and I think you should maybe see someone (some counselling?) to get you out of this sexual rut you are in at the moment. It seems your mind is stuck in the "no sex - ever" mode when there is no need for that any longer.

Das Kitty

seenitall wrote: »

There are other ways to conceive other than the usual, you know. Think medical intervention.

Unless you know otherwise for certain, I wouldn't be jumping to too many conclusions about your ex's current sex life. It could be either way.

I feel for you and I think you should maybe see someone (some counselling?) to get you out of this sexual rut you are in at the moment. It seems your mind is stuck in the "no sex - ever" mode when there is no need for that any longer.

In fairness most ways of conceiving would be ruled out by vaginismus, the most likely explanation is that she's overcome the problem.

erawneila, I really feel for you, a good counsellor could work wonders. Terrible that it's still affecting you.

seenitall

Das Kitty wrote: »

In fairness most ways of conceiving would be ruled out by vaginismus,

Yes, most, which is why I mentioned MEDICAL INTERVENTION, which would get around vaginismus with no problem as regards fertilisation, under localised anaesthetic for example (think in the direction of IVF); and no, I don't think that the most likely explanation is that she overcame the problem at all, given that she steadfastly refused to work on it for 10 years of a presumably loving relationship.

LegacyUser

Das Kitty wrote: »

In fairness most ways of conceiving would be ruled out by vaginismus, the most likely explanation is that she's overcome the problem.

We managed it. Sperm can swim all the way in from the outside.

harrythehat

Yeah I've heard of it. I don't think it's psychological, huge sympathy for anyone who has it!

msdk

If you don't think it's pyschological what do you think it is? As a suffered myself I'm very interested to see what thoughts you have on it

dearg lady

I'm glad to see this thread, this is such a 'swept under the carpet' issue, very few people seem to have heard about it, or at least, it's rarely talked about.

I suffered from it for years and I suppose it still affects me in some ways. I dealt with it on my own, I didn't attend counselling for the issues. I had mostly got over the issues that originally caused it, but unfortunately it doesn't necessarily go away when issues are resolved as it becomes a vicious circle. When it hurts once, you expect it to hurt next time etc etc.

Even when I got over it enough to have sex it was painful at first, and then uncomfortable, and then with every new partner it was difficult at the start and then settles down. With my current partner the sex was pain free the first time which was very exciting for me! I still sometimes find it uncomfortable initially, so we take it slow at the start til I relax more. On the plus side, I'm super tight so my man loves that!

Just wanted to share my story for anyone who's suffering. It's a good idea to first rule out any physical issues, so go see a GP, and then if not, you can work on the psychological issues. As crude as it sounds you will basically need to 'stretch' yourself. It can be extremely disheartening, but I would encourage everyone to keep on trying! To get over it feels amazing.

ck3960 wrote: »

hi, yeah i've come across in a few times. its so distressing to see. must be so hard not to be able to control your own body. i've looked after some women in labour (i'm a midwife) with this. so as you can imagine it can be difficult for women who suffer with it when they're having babies.

altho i must add that if we know someone has vaginismus, we do take steps to try and make things easier for them. its not that uncommon i dont think, and women who have it need empathy and understanding.

I know you posted this ages ago, but perhaps you or someone else could give me bit more detail on this. Can it cause problems in delivery, even for someone who's 'over it'? If I become pregnant should I mention it at the hospital? It does worry me slightly.

skmck

Im so glad I came across this thread as this is exactly my situation. I have finally built up the courage to seek help - would anyone have any recommendations for places to go in Dublin for help?

skmck

skmck wrote: »

Im so glad I came across this thread as this is exactly my situation. I have finally built up the courage to seek help - would anyone have any recommendations for places to go in Dublin for help?

Hi skmck

Unfortunately names of doctors and clinics aren't allowed to be posted on thread, however if someone has a recommendation they can drop you a pm instead

This is quite an old thread and we would normally would move your post to our women's health thread to ensure you get the best responses, but as this is a very specific issue, I will leave this open for you. If you would prefer to post in the women's health thread, you can find it here.

Best of luck

whoopsadaisydoodles

Morgase

PM sent to skmck with recommendations