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2010 NBA Playoffs

  • 17-04-2010 7:58pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭


    NBAplayoffs.png

    Bring them on:D


«134

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    Cleveland is so ridiculously talented. The only weakness I can think of is their pick and roll defense. They have everything else covered


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 830 ✭✭✭Judomad


    celtics letting me down big time :( when Tony Allen is our best player it shows just how bad we're doing :(


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    No real surprises so far, celtics v heats could be interesting after the G
    arnett incident, got to love the playoffs ! Garnett was out of order though from what I remember in my drunken state


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41 lkasprzak


    1:1 in Jazz-Nuggets series :D:D:D:D:D
    WOOOOOT :P


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    lkasprzak wrote: »
    1:1 in Jazz-Nuggets series :D:D:D:D:D
    WOOOOOT :P

    Count yourself lucky though. I don't think I've seen a more overly officiated game in my eight years of watching basketball. That call at the very end when the Refs said that Melo fouled Miles even though it was quite clear he stepped out of bounds was utter garbage. And I'm not a Nuggets fan.

    Although having said that if the Jazz win the series then Jerry Sloan deserves most of the credit. I don't think there are many coaches in the league who could have won without his starting center, starting small forward and play with a lineup that includes multiple second round picks and "never heard of him before" guys. Just an awesome coaching job.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 453 ✭✭Da GOAT


    Boston won again, so sweet. Dunno how they beat the heat by near 30 points without Garnett. Great that Davis got 23 points too, I think Sheed is just complete crap now. Seems to not give a crap, lazy and out of shape. Dunno why he is allowed shoot 3 pointers. Gonna see the game in full tonight anyway.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,949 ✭✭✭A Primal Nut


    Hey, never really post on here coz I have enough forums to be posting on!! Haha. Anyway went to my first NBA Game yesterday - Lakers vs Oklahoma in the Staples Centre. Was great. Best part was some guy from Compton made the half court shot and won 235k.

    All the papers were talking beforehand about how Kobe was being over-confident in spite of his broken finger and that it would likely cost them but he responded in style with 39 points and shot well. Kevin Durant was amazing as well.

    Also, cheerleaders are even hotter in real life! Although some of the girls in the crowd aren't bad either. :D

    I'll have pictures and videos later. Unfortunately I didn't record a video of the half court shot but I took some pictures of the guy celebrating.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    Delighted the Bulls got the win tonight, Cavs looked like a team that know they will win the series, just a matter of when, Bulls did make hard work of it towards the end when the Cavs started making those threes. Rose was very good once he got going, Hinrich is shooting the ball really well and Noah is just so active. LeBron had some fantastic plays both on the defensive and offensive end.

    Oklahoma really look like a team that could be around for a long time, so impressed by such a young team that don't play like a young team. Durant, Westbrook, Green, Harden to mention a few are all quality players that will only get better.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    The Lakers didn't even show up tonight. It's starting to remind me a little of the Houston series in that sense. Whats interesting to note is that the the Thunder are now running their offense through Westbrook instead of Durant. They've realized that they can do whatever they want to Fisher. Game 5 should be interesting.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭cobijones


    Are the next games on ESPN, cant see any games in the listings?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    cobijones wrote: »
    Are the next games on ESPN, cant see any games in the listings?

    They had been showing a good few games but it's a bit weird alright, I just checked and don't see any upcoming games? I had series link on Sky set up and had Lakers/Thunder last night but nothing on the list for after that. Have NBA Fastbreak and NBA action alright, I'll keep on eye out.

    I'd be surprised if Lebron & Co. don't respond tonight with an emphatic win in Chi town!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    jimmay wrote: »
    I'd be surprised if Lebron & Co. don't respond tonight with an emphatic win in Chi town!

    Hehe :D

    Cavs 121 Bulls 98

    and you know who...

    Lebron James tripple double: 37 points 12 boards 11 assists


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,887 ✭✭✭WHIP IT!


    jimmay wrote: »
    Hehe :D

    Cavs 121 Bulls 98

    and you know who...

    Lebron James tripple double: 37 points 12 boards 11 assists

    How about Oklahoma spanking the Lakers right now?? Crowd are awesome!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    jimmay wrote: »
    Hehe :D

    Cavs 121 Bulls 98

    and you know who...

    Lebron James tripple double: 37 points 12 boards 11 assists

    Was always on the cards to be fair, that man is unstoppable when he gets going.

    Wondering now what reaction the Lakers will have after getting their asses kicked by the Thunder. They just have so much quality that they are almost too big to fail, said it before but I think they lack chemistry, kind of opposite team characteristics of the Thunder.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    I'm at the point where I feel sorry for the Mavericks. I can't even hate on them anymore, I just feel sorry for them. They have one of the best owners in basketball and nothing they do to try and compete is working. In the past season they have gotten Shawn Marrion, Caron Butler and Brendan Haywood all for practically nothing, and yet they can't beat a Spurs team in the first round that's clearly past it's prime. It's just sad


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    Sea Devils wrote: »
    I'm at the point where I feel sorry for the Mavericks. I can't even hate on them anymore, I just feel sorry for them. They have one of the best owners in basketball and nothing they do to try and compete is working. In the past season they have gotten Shawn Marrion, Caron Butler and Brendan Haywood all for practically nothing, and yet they can't beat a Spurs team in the first round that's clearly past it's prime. It's just sad

    The Spurs might be past it's prime but it is still a deadly outfit, I honestly thought it would be a toss up between these two teams, thought Dallas would sneak it due to home court. Spurs will always be dangerous with Ginobili playing the way he is, also Parker and Duncan obviously, Hill and Blair are coming into their own now as well.

    Dallas seem to rely on Dirk too much, if he isn't shooting around 30 + points then they seem to struggle. Just looking at Dallas roster there and it is quite old. They don't utilize Marion enough in my opinion. If they some how pull through this then they would be hard to beat due to the matchup problems they would cause, cant see it happening though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 453 ✭✭Da GOAT


    watching Dirk lately, he looks sluggish when moving. Something about the Mavs just doesnt look right. Butler seems the most active type of player, Marion im not convinced he should have the ball more, his shot mechanics are just god awful.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53 ✭✭Eddie-B


    this has been the best first round in YEARS! sept for the bobcats but they just matched up horribly to the magic so was always going to be a wash out!

    What i dont get is the mavs. I mean in a game where tim duncan and tony parker go for 14 points between them and ginobli shoots 4-16 they should be destroying them! the mavs are 4 deep while the spurs are only 2 deep! its mind boggling!

    Heat should be gone tonight unless wade picks the entire miami team up and carries them again!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    cobijones wrote: »
    Are the next games on ESPN, cant see any games in the listings?

    I just sent a query to ESPN so I'll let you know what I hear.

    I did just notice on Paddypower they have live betting and according to them the Cavs/Bulls and Lakers/Thunder games are on ESPN tonight.

    Not on ESPN's site however could just be a listing blunder so fingers crossed.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    Nice...Cavs game 1am Thunder (note Thunder and not Lakers :D) game to follow at 3:30am on ESPN.

    Saweeet can't really see how Lebron can top last games performance so I'll go for an "average" night for him 25-30 points in a tighter win for the Cavs than Game 4.

    OKC/LAL hmmm not gonna call this one but I'd love Durant to blow Kobe out of the water and if the OKC get through this round Durant will be going to the next level of superstardom!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53 ✭✭Eddie-B


    after durant making kobe look a bit old in the last few moments of 2 games i think the thunder will push the lakers at home, lebron to go triple double again and grow an even bigger head!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    Looking forward to Lakers v Thunder, will be very interesting to see how the Lakers approach this game especially Kobe, there was definitely something up with him the last night and heard after that he was acting out to prove a point and piss Jackson off. I am not one bit surpried with that ego he has, read an article here that I pretty much agree with

    http://www.cbssports.com/columns/story/13308059/kobe-throws-away-game-4-and-jackson-lets-him-do-it

    Still think Thunder have it all to do because of how stacked the Lakers are, would be great to see Durant go off on one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21 sillyturd


    Lakers are a serious price to win it outright. I backed them before last nights game at 4/1 and i might even have more on them again. They will be steady enough until the finals and then they will explode. Hoping the Celtics or Magic can get rid of the Cavs though cause i'd be more confident of Lakers beating either of them than Cavs. Had a small bet on the Dallas at 60/1 before they pulled it back to 3-2. Think they might still be Dangerous.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53 ✭✭Eddie-B


    man i hope for u that the mavs win it so pints are on u! when i heard the okur was out i bet against the jazz and of course deron williams plays insane just to spite me! hope jennings keeps it up tonight would love for him to sort out that shooting percentage!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    sillyturd wrote: »
    Lakers are a serious price to win it outright. I backed them before last nights game at 4/1 and i might even have more on them again. They will be steady enough until the finals and then they will explode. Hoping the Celtics or Magic can get rid of the Cavs though cause i'd be more confident of Lakers beating either of them than Cavs.

    Hehe I was thinking the same for the Cavs, hoping the Lakers will get picked off before making the finals giving it to Lebrilliant & co :P

    Gotta admit though a Lebron/Kobe final is long overdue and would be epic.
    The media circus and coverage and attention it would get would be immense and seriously exciting!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    I had to laugh at Cuban when he pointed his finger at the refs after his team lost. How original. Every time a team loses, it's the ref's fault. :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,887 ✭✭✭WHIP IT!


    Any game on ESPN this evening?

    EDIT: Scratch that, Spurs-Mav on @ 1.0am http://www.livesportontv.com/basketball


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    WHIP IT! wrote: »
    Any game on ESPN this evening?

    EDIT: Scratch that, Spurs-Mav on @ 1.0am http://www.livesportontv.com/basketball

    That game was last night...the Spurs won the series 4-2
    That is 1am Fri as in late Thurs night! ;)

    There is a good game on tonight at half 2 with the Lakers/Thunder game although I think I'll just catch the highlights on that one.

    Tomorrow (Sat night) should be nice, can't wait...Cavs - Celts, 1am live ESPN sweet! And also during ads/half time the Mayweather - Mosley fight is on Sky Sports 1 free coverage starting at 2am (prob 4am start)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,723 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Epic game between the Thunder and the Lakers but I'm so gutted for the Thunder.
    They were behind most of the game and a few times the Lakers threatened to get away but the Thunder kept grinding it out, even with Durant having an off night from the floor, I don't know his final figures but he was 3/19 early in the 4th quarter. The got the lead late in the 4th and got up by 4 with under a minute left but Kobe sinks a contested 3 pointer to make it 1 and then the Lakers get a stop wtih 12 secs remaining, they go up the floor and Kobe shoots from outside with what looks like the last shot, he misses but Gasol grabs a contested rebound and gets the basket with .5 left on the clock. Durant then hits the rim with the last shot.

    Feel so gutted for the Thunder and their fans but an awesome game. Westbrook was just fantastic tonight. Kobe was back to his brilliant best, the Lakers got huge performances from everybody bar Bynum and that just shows how well the Thunder played. Possibly the best playoff game that finished in regular time that I've ever had the pleasure to watch, not including Celtics' games of course.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    Yeah Thunder deserved a game 7, last night was harsh...that horrible neanderthal creep Gasol just pipping it was rough but hopefully the Thunder will respond and continue growing next season. Great to see a team out of nothing make such an impact. Feckin Sky plus cut off the last 5 minutes of this game for me (even though I had the extra maximum 10 min added to end of recording :mad:) Hafta remember to record following show next time!

    Will be interesting to see how Lebron responds tonight considering all the speculation about his elbow. I think he'll come out with a strong possible heroic performance :p

    Interesting article here

    How much of a concern is James' injured right elbow? You can look at it two ways. One: It's a huge concern, because he's the best player in the series and his outside shooting is extra important against the Celtics, who will make it tough for him to get to the basket. Two: It was bothering him against the Bulls, and he still shot 57 percent, while averaging 31.8 points, 9.2 rebounds and 8.2 assists. So how bad can it be?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    Bah Humbug, damn Lakers, can't really take it away from them though, love him or hate him Gasol is out of this world, he gives the Lakes so much extra when on the floor.

    As for LeBron, I am sure he will be fine :rolleyes: unless he plays poorly then it will obviously be his elbow.
    Celtics can definitely trouble them but LeBron and Jamison will be difficult to match up against.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,887 ✭✭✭WHIP IT!


    Just saw highlights from Lakers-Thunder now. Sweet Jesus lads, last damn second & u don't box out?? This is the Playoffs FFS!

    Rebounding + Defence = Rings


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    Cavs were there for the taking yesterday, they were very lethargic for most of the game, LeBron got his points but Williams made the difference at the right times.
    If Pierce and Allen didn't miss so many open shots then it would of been very close at the end.

    Just watched Lakers v Jazz, decent game, Utah played very well and put it up to the Lakers. Pau Gasol has another brilliant game, stole the show for me, if Lakers go on to win the Championship this year, he will be the reason behind it for me.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,723 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Cavs were there for the taking yesterday, they were very lethargic for most of the game, LeBron got his points but Williams made the difference at the right times.
    If Pierce and Allen didn't miss so many open shots then it would of been very close at the end.

    Just watched Lakers v Jazz, decent game, Utah played very well and put it up to the Lakers. Pau Gasol has another brilliant game, stole the show for me, if Lakers go on to win the Championship this year, he will be the reason behind it for me.
    I agree that Gasol is a great player but its not because of him, its just a ridic lineup. Like Boston have four really great players in KG, Pierce, Rondo and Ray Allen but it doesn't compare the Lakers with Kobe, Gasol, Odom, Artest, Bynum and Fisher. Thats a top 6 players but then you have the depth that makes it so scary with Brown, Walton, Farmar and the currently injured Sasha Vujacic who would all be starters on most teams.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I agree that Gasol is a great player but its not because of him, its just a ridic lineup. Like Boston have four really great players in KG, Pierce, Rondo and Ray Allen but it doesn't compare the Lakers with Kobe, Gasol, Odom, Artest, Bynum and Fisher. Thats a top 6 players but then you have the depth that makes it so scary with Brown, Walton, Farmar and the currently injured Sasha Vujacic who would all be starters on most teams.

    Well I was exaggerating a small bit, they obviously have a great lineup but I honestly feel that bar Kobe, Gasol is the backbone of the team, such a well rounded consistent and intelligent player. I would have to slightly disagree with the depth, I like Brown a lot and Farmer, they are decent players, hate the other players but taking my personal views aside, I still think they are just decent and not great players.

    If Lakers win it all, Gasol for MVP of the finals :D


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,723 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Yeah Celtics, thats what I'm talkin' about. Woohoo, we have taken one in Cleveland, great defense and great shooting.

    Of course LeBron's arm was a big topic tonight, he was just extremely well guarded by Ray Allen. Fantastic Boston performance.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    eagle eye wrote: »
    Yeah Celtics, thats what I'm talkin' about. Woohoo, we have taken one in Cleveland, great defense and great shooting.

    Of course LeBron's arm was a big topic tonight, he was just extremely well guarded by Ray Allen. Fantastic Boston performance.

    Wasn't able to watch the entire game but it was just great team play by the Celtics and good coaching. Allen did a great job defending Allen but they rotated it well and everyone did an extremely solid job.

    Should be a great series, LeBron will always be such a huge threat (even with his hurt elbow :rolleyes:) Celtics looked focused, hope they continue the intensity into their home games.

    Spurs v Suns will be another good series, will be interesting tactically, J Rich gives the Suns that little something extra for me, how the Warriors traded him just baffles me !


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    That was a very interesting night of basketball. I don't think I've ever seen this version of the Cavs not play hard before. They were totally flat. LeBron was really passive too, which was weird. Even though the C's have dominated about 6 of the 8 quarters so far, I still think the Cavs win without much of a problem. Hope I'm wrong.

    As for the Spurs/Suns, that's setting up to be a great series. The difference between this Suns team and past ones is that they can actually defend halfway decently in the half court. And there's a pretty significant athleticism advantage in Phoenix's favor. Game 2 is huge.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭Carcharodon


    I knew Atlanta would struggle but lack of effort by slome players has been shocking, sad to see.

    Utah were unlucky tonight, game could of went either way, Utah just didn't get that final roll, very good game, they will feel disappointed but you can't really take too much away from the Lakers, they came up with the answers when challenged.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    Gonna be very interesting to see what's gonna happen in the Cavs/Celts match-up. Setting up very nicely now down to a best of 3 series. All the other series are 3-0. Can see this going the distance, possibly down to the last minute just like 2 years ago in the Eastern Conf Semis/Finals


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    Is it just me or has these playoffs have little intrigue so far?. I mean sure there have been a few decent games here and there but there's been three sweeps in the second round and only one 7 game series overall. From an entertainment standpoint I thought the Spurs and Suns would be a lot better.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,723 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Sea Devils wrote: »
    Is it just me or has these playoffs have little intrigue so far?. I mean sure there have been a few decent games here and there but there's been three sweeps in the second round and only one 7 game series overall. From an entertainment standpoint I thought the Spurs and Suns would be a lot better.
    I felt last year that the Spurs had gotten old and that trend has continued. I think they are done unless they come up with another star big man like they did all those years ago when they signed Duncan which put sparked Derek Anderson back into top gear.

    I do agree that the semi's have been very poor with the exception of the Celtics/Cavs matchup. I really think a lot of teams have taken a step backwards.

    The Suns are improving and will be a force now for a couple of years if they can hang on to their younger players.
    The Celtics are looking old with Pierce banged up and on the slide by the looks of things, Ray Allen is on a downward curve too, KG has too many injury problems but they still have enough class to put it up to anybody and are unstoppable when all these guys hit form on the same night.
    There are 3 major forces in the NBA right now and they are the Lakers, Cavs and Magic.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 39,723 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Boomshakalaka!!!
    Its clear that when Paul Pierce steps up the team is much, much better. I really loved watching that tonight, the second quarter 15 to zip run I think it was just set the whole thing up. Super D and no mention of LeBron's arm.

    This team can go out in a whimper in two games or could go all the way and win it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 453 ✭✭Da GOAT


    I HEART BOSTON


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    Yeah, it's great to see Boston getting numbers from all their players. At the start of the playoffs I really doubted that they could give CLE (or ORL) a tough series, very glad that Allen/KG/Pierce are still able to do it in style, helped massively by Rondo.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Sea Devils


    Game 6 is a career defining game for LeBron. I'm extremely curious to see how he reacts, because I don't think he's ever faced adversity that's anywhere close to this. He's been praised and gushed over since he was a sophomore in HS. How will he react to the criticism? Does he have the mental toughness and stones to pull his team together?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    ...SHOCKING...
    :eek::eek::eek:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 534 ✭✭✭jimmay


    Sea Devils wrote: »
    Game 6 is a career defining game for LeBron. I'm extremely curious to see how he reacts, because I don't think he's ever faced adversity that's anywhere close to this. He's been praised and gushed over since he was a sophomore in HS. How will he react to the criticism? Does he have the mental toughness and stones to pull his team together?

    Totally agree

    Don't think he'd want his last game in Cleveland like that.

    Lebron to go off for 50 next game ha I dunno Boston looked unstoppable!

    edit. just watching NBA fastbreak: The basketball world is stunned


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,337 ✭✭✭moneyman


    eagle eye wrote: »
    I agree that Gasol is a great player but its not because of him, its just a ridic lineup. Like Boston have four really great players in KG, Pierce, Rondo and Ray Allen but it doesn't compare the Lakers with Kobe, Gasol, Odom, Artest, Bynum and Fisher. Thats a top 6 players but then you have the depth that makes it so scary with Brown, Walton, Farmar and the currently injured Sasha Vujacic who would all be starters on most teams.


    You have got to be kidding me :eek:

    What teams would Brown, Walton, Farmar or Vujacic start on? I'm guessing none. Brown is a decent rotation player, nothing more. Farmar sucks and is one of their most frustrating players - go onto a Lakers message board and see how they feel about him. Vujacic? The guy is hated by all. He wouldn't start on one team in the league, although none of the other guys would either.

    BTW, Fisher isn't a top player. He is a solid, saavy veteran who get's by on a reliable jumper and experience. He is not a top PG in the league and never has been. At his peak he was a very good roleplayer. Now, he is getting eaten alive by every PG he comes up against. He is a liability on defense and if it weren't for the guys that surround him he wouldn't even be starting. He's lucky he's got such a good team around him to cover up his weaknesses.



    On another note, what's up with LeBron? Possibly moved on to Chicago or NY mentally already? Just.... well, strange. Rondo is a beast. He's the Celtics most important player at this point. His performance in game 4 was ridiculous.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,806 ✭✭✭Lafortezza


    moneyman wrote: »
    On another note, what's up with LeBron? Possibly moved on to Chicago or NY mentally already? Just.... well, strange. Rondo is a beast. He's the Celtics most important player at this point. His performance in game 4 was ridiculous.
    Agree about Rondo, most important player for BOS so far these playoffs.
    As for LeBron, he might just be feeling the pressure or is pissed off with being the only Cavs guy who seems to give a sh1t. He could be angry that no other Cavalier has stepped up to regularly drop 25+ points and give him some help.

    Honestly I'm not sure how this Cavs roster can improve over the next couple of years to win rings. They are way over the salaries limit and this current bunch of players doesn't look good enough to consistently beat LA and ORL for the next 3/4 years.


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