STOP use of Dangerous Chairshots, Protect safety of wrestlers . TNA + WWE spoilers

DM_7

So WWE have banned the use of unprotected chair shots. For this they deserve serious credit.

http://www.pwinsider.com/article/45988/wwe-bans-chair-shots-to-the-head.html?p=1

But they still persist with PPV's dedicated to dangerous matches. Hopefully we see matches like this years MITB where the dangerous spots are more controlled than previous MITB. But do WWE really need to be having Sheamus weild a steel pipe or have Bret Hart nail a dozen chair shots on Vince?

In the ROH locker room they have welcomed the move in for the most part would like to see it replicated. But they could go a little further.
http://www.pwinsider.com/article/46444/roh-champion-tyler-black-talks-about-roh-banning-a-move-bryan-danielson-attending-wrestlemania-and-more.html?p=1

Tyler Black:

AC: Let me ask you another WWE question that relates to Ring of Honor. Recently WWE banned chair shots to the head. As part of their wellness policy now, I guess they could suspend guys for hitting each other on the head with steel chairs. And you’ve seen them move away from that – now mostly doing the chair shots across the back, like they used to do years ago. And that’s one place I’ve heard Ring of Honor criticized – that when you go in that direction of the hardcore stuff it could be pretty violent and dangerous. I’ve seen some of the chair shots and some of the bumps that guys take. Would you like to see a similar philosophy in Ring of Honor, and maybe all of wrestling, where guys are a little more careful with stuff like that?

TB: Yeah, and you know what, we actually, as a locker room, discussed this. And if you’ll notice, on the next set of TV tapings, there’s not much in the way of head shots. I can’t say there’s none, because sometimes Necro (Butcher) is pretty unpredictable. But we pretty much decided as a consensus that we don’t want to do that either, and that’s a great thing. I’m glad that WWE has decided to back to their roots with that sort of thing, because it’s really not safe and it’s causing guys’ careers to be short, and that’s not good for anybody. That’s not good for business, and that’s not good for families and friends in general. Hopefully, that becomes more of a trend and safety in the business becomes more of a trend, because I know over the last decade some of that caution has been thrown to the wind a little bit, as far as head drops and chair shots and guys taking care of each other. So hopefully we can get back to that and we can have longer, healthier careers.

TNA have a long way to go to suggest they have any concern for their employees. They seem to use blood and have ladder matches just because they can.

One man who has noticed this is Lance Storm who says he is not watching TNA anymore.

http://www.stormwrestling.com/040610.html

The straw that broke the camels back for me was the unprotected chair shot to the head of Rob Terry by Homicide. Yes they have done chair shots to the head before, and they bothered me then too, but this one was different; this unprotected chair shot to the head came just 2 days after Chris Kanyon’s suicide death and I just couldn’t stomach it. I know there will be defenders out there that will want to argue that Chris Kanyon’s depression that led to his suicide has not been determined to as a result of concussions he suffered due to chair shots to the head, but that is just a cop out, in my opinion.

What a horrific tribute this was to the death of Chris Kanyon. How the people in charge of TNA can be either this insensitive or this oblivious is beyond me. Now I’m not saying that this one instance has sealed the fate of young Rob Terry or that TNA has sentenced him to death, but there are many roads one can travel on in life and we all know where this particular road leads. Rob Terry and TNA together have very willingly chosen a very dangerous road to go down, and it is a journey I refuse to witness or support.

When is this industry and the people in it going to wake up and learn from the death toll this business has experienced? Thankfully WWE is taking steps forward with their wellness policy and the banning of chair shots to the head, but TNA seems content to seek short term, shock value ratings and ignore the horrific long term writing on the wall. This may be a decision the company and the talent made willingly together, but it is one I am not willing to tolerate any longer. I have lost too many friends, and we should all know better by now.

In a week where another wrestler has passed away I am also sickened by persistant use of stupid weapon use, the use of needless blood loss in wrestling and the lack of a wellness policy in ALL promotions.

Its time for the people running the industry to get tough and protect the talent they hire.

What do you think, like lance should we turn away from wrestling shows that show little regard for the short, medium and long term safety of wrestlers? This would push Feds away from moments that put wrestlers at risk.

Sorry if this overlaps with the Angle thread.

waltersobchak

I think the majority of fans have outgrown the "Hardcore" element in Pro Wrestling to be perfectly honest as it something that was edgy in the 90s but is passe now .. With everything thats happened over the last 10 years and the amount of wrestling deaths as well as the link to concussions and brain damage and Chris Benoit, WWE are doing the smart thing by distancing themselves from it. TNA embracing it show's they're stupidity and that they really are behind the fu*king times

D2D

Absolutly, the safety of wrestlers in Paramount these days.

There was no need what-so-ever for the unprotected chair shot Rob Terry received on iMPACT! as it served absolutely no purpose, well imo, it didn't. The debate about the unprotected chair shots arose in January when Jeff hit Homicide with the unprotected chair shot. Just an observation but that's twice in TNA in 2010 that the unprotected chair shots have involved Homicide. TNA is fast becoming WCW/ECW and I really don't think the current direction TNA are taking isn't gonna end well.

The reasons WWE are doing the gimmick theme event's such as Hell in a Cell or TLC is because there the matches that draw the casual wrestling fans attention and genuinely attract the big numbers. WWE PG is excellent imo. I really don't care about the no blood rule and I think it's as good as it's ever been.

The lack of a wellness policy is pretty clear in TNA's terms. Genuine question but when was the last time it was acknowledged by TNA themselves that they suspended some-one for failing a wellness policy?? What the WWE have done with the wellness policy is great for the business. Also isn't taking drugs illegal?? If so then why aren't they (apart from Jeff Hardy) being brought up about it in front of Police/a court of Law??

To do what TNA did on Monday night was ridiculous in this day and age ESPECIALLY when Chris Kanyon passed away at the week-end.

glenjamin

I gotta disagree DM. I agree that TNA is going a bit overboard with chair shots and blood especially when it's just for a TV taping. But blood and chair shots have been around for years. I think as long as it's not done too often there shouldn't be a problem. I'd save it for the big occasions such as PPVs. When I think of Austin vs Bret at Mania 13 I don't the ending would be the same in that match if it wasn't for the blood. I think blood plays a big part in telling a story in PW if it's used right. You can get away with a chair shot to the front of a head as you can use your arms to protect yourself and also give off the same effect in selling it.

rossie1977

glenjamin wrote: »

I gotta disagree DM. I agree that TNA is going a bit overboard with chair shots and blood especially when it's just for a TV taping. But blood and chair shots have been around for years. I think as long as it's not done too often there shouldn't be a problem. I'd save it for the big occasions such as PPVs. When I think of Austin vs Bret at Mania 13 I don't the ending would be the same in that match if it wasn't for the blood. I think blood plays a big part in telling a story in PW if it's used right. You can get away with a chair shot to the front of a head as you can use your arms to protect yourself and also give off the same effect in selling it.

there is no place for unprotected chairshots like the one rob terry received monday night which is the point of this thread

blading and its pros and cons are a separate discussion, but while we are talking about it, the wwe have proved blading completely pointless given the amount of legit cuts their wrestlers have received since they brought in the blading ban

chopperbyrne

glenjamin wrote: »

I gotta disagree DM. I agree that TNA is going a bit overboard with chair shots and blood especially when it's just for a TV taping. But blood and chair shots have been around for years. I think as long as it's not done too often there shouldn't be a problem. I'd save it for the big occasions such as PPVs. When I think of Austin vs Bret at Mania 13 I don't the ending would be the same in that match if it wasn't for the blood. I think blood plays a big part in telling a story in PW if it's used right. You can get away with a chair shot to the front of a head as you can use your arms to protect yourself and also give off the same effect in selling it.

The whole point of this is that they aren't protecting themselves and some companies are letting their employees do this without repercussion.

D2D

glenjamin wrote: »

I gotta disagree DM. I agree that TNA is going a bit overboard with chair shots and blood especially when it's just for a TV taping. But blood and chair shots have been around for years. I think as long as it's not done too often there shouldn't be a problem. I'd save it for the big occasions such as PPVs. When I think of Austin vs Bret at Mania 13 I don't the ending would be the same in that match if it wasn't for the blood. I think blood plays a big part in telling a story in PW if it's used right. You can get away with a chair shot to the front of a head as you can use your arms to protect yourself and also give off the same effect in selling it.

While I agree with some aspects, I disagree on the chair shots

With all the talk about wrestler's death and severe concussions received due to excessive chair shots, there has to be some sort of limit. A chair-shot here and there might be fine for the new breed of wrestlers but for veterns like Flair and Angle, they all will add up. Unprotected chair shots is just stupid.

DM_7

glenjamin wrote: »

I agree that TNA is going a bit overboard with chair shots and blood especially when it's just for a TV taping.

A bit overboard? Its a big problem.

glenjamin wrote: »

But blood and chair shots have been around for years. I think as long as it's not done too often there shouldn't be a problem.

But thats my point, it is done too often and in a dangerous way.

glenjamin wrote: »

When I think of Austin vs Bret at Mania 13 I don't the ending would be the same in that match if it wasn't for the blood. I think blood plays a big part in telling a story in PW if it's used right.

Yes, use of blood is not the end of the world in an isolated occurance. But what I am talking about is needless use, use on a weekly tv show for shock value.

glenjamin wrote: »

You can get away with a chair shot to the front of a head as you can use your arms to protect yourself and also give off the same effect in selling it.

Thats true you can get away with it. But thats not regarded as dangerous chairshots like the thread title. We are talking about unprotected chairshots to the head. A chair shot to the arm is no big deal once used the odd time. A chairshot to the head, unprotected can cause serious long term damage.

But thanks for the counter view, makes these threads interesting!

waltersobchak

Chairshots are one thing... Unprotected shots are another.. And TNA embracing them shows a distinct lack of care for their talent

D2D

waltersobchak wrote: »

Chairshots are one thing... Unprotected shots are another.. And TNA embracing them shows a distinct lack of care for their talent

Yeah, twice in 2010, TNA have done unprotected chair shots and with their current roster having a load of veterans on it, someone will end up seriously hurt

DM_7

waltersobchak wrote: »

Chairshots are one thing... Unprotected shots are another.. And TNA embracing them shows a distinct lack of care for their talent

To be clear, this is exactly what I am talking about.

As rossie said blading is really a discussion for another thread, I should probably have left it out of this thread. But since I didn't I don't see the point of the amount of blading TNA use.

Storm also talked about reasons Terry is getting a push. It seems to be his look more than his ability, how do many guys get that sort of look. Steroids. Just like head injuries, steriods lead to bad things and needs to be fully stamped out.

glenjamin

DM-ICE wrote: »

Yes, use of blood is not the end of the world in an isolated occurance. But what I am talking about is needless use, use on a weekly tv show for shock value.

Thats true you can get away with it. But thats not regarded as dangerous chairshots like the thread title. We are talking about unprotected chairshots to the head. A chair shot to the arm is no big deal once used the odd time. A chairshot to the head, unprotected can cause serious long term damage.

I said that as long as rarely done it's ok (blood).

I am in full agreement that what TNA is doing is wrong. (I haven't seen the chairshot as mentioned but an unprotected chairshot is an unprotected chairshot). A protected chairshot to the head can have the same effect imo.

I don't wish to derail the thread by talking about blood but I did see Flair a few weeks and the amount of blood he lost was extremely dangerous. What pissed me off even more was it was a TV taping. TNA are fast becoming the new ECW and to prove it there's rumour of them starting a new faction with just members of the old ECW.

Only a matter of time before someone gets cripled or dies in a TNA ring.

waltersobchak

glenjamin wrote: »

I said that as long as rarely done it's ok (blood).

I am in full agreement that what TNA is doing is wrong. (I haven't seen the chairshot as mentioned but an unprotected chairshot is an unprotected chairshot). A protected chairshot to the head can have the same effect imo.

I don't wish to derail the thread by talking about blood but I did see Flair a few weeks and the amount of blood he lost was extremely dangerous. What pissed me off even more was it was a TV taping. TNA are fast becoming the new ECW and to prove it there's rumour of them starting a new faction with just members of the old ECW.

Only a matter of time before someone gets cripled or dies in a TNA ring.

TNA are nothing like ECW, ECW was a direct reaction to wrestling's lack of realism at the time and where a total reaction to Generation X.. And a by product of fan's wanting something real.. The envelope was pushed back then, nowadays fans have literally seen it all so TNA copying ECW comes across pathetic

D2D

glenjamin wrote: »

I said that as long as rarely done it's ok (blood).

I am in full agreement that what TNA is doing is wrong. (I haven't seen the chairshot as mentioned but an unprotected chairshot is an unprotected chairshot). A protected chairshot to the head can have the same effect imo.

I don't wish to derail the thread by talking about blood but I did see Flair a few weeks and the amount of blood he lost was extremely dangerous. What pissed me off even more was it was a TV taping. TNA are fast becoming the new ECW and to prove it there's rumour of them starting a new faction with just members of the old ECW.

Only a matter of time before someone gets cripled or dies in a TNA ring.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2a3BbbNhaY

Chair shot at 8.57

DM_7

glenjamin wrote: »

I said that as long as rarely done it's ok (blood).

I am in full agreement that what TNA is doing is wrong. (I haven't seen the chairshot as mentioned but an unprotected chairshot is an unprotected chairshot). A protected chairshot to the head can have the same effect imo.

I don't wish to derail the thread by talking about blood but I did see Flair a few weeks and the amount of blood he lost was extremely dangerous. What pissed me off even more was it was a TV taping. TNA are fast becoming the new ECW and to prove it there's rumour of them starting a new faction with just members of the old ECW.

Only a matter of time before someone gets cripled or dies in a TNA ring.

On flair, its not that long since WWE had him lose a heap of blood too at the hands of jericho. Flair gives everything he can, like Angle (Other thread) he will persist with things he shouldn't do. If a fed can't find a way of using Flair without having him spill so much blood they shouldn't book him at all.

Black talks about guys protecting each other above, that suggests to me the wrestlers themselves are coming up with many of these dangerous moments. It really is time for the people in charge of the promotions to step in and stamp this stuff out.

DM_7

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

Chair shot at 8.57

I think the fact OJ appeared straight away and took the focus away from what the stupid chair shot was supposed to "achieve", getting terry over as a monster, made the unforgivable even worse.

glenjamin

waltersobchak wrote: »

TNA are nothing like ECW, ECW was a direct reaction to wrestling's lack of realism at the time and where a total reaction to Generation X.. And a by product of fan's wanting something real.. The envelope was pushed back then, nowadays fans have literally seen it all so TNA copying ECW comes across pathetic

I think what they're trying to do is put a real factor back in wrestling for those that want it and aren't satisfied with what the WWE is offering. But my post about TNA becoming the new ECW was more in reference to the dangerous stips, spots and weapons use. It seems like they're trying to make TNA as extreme as possible just to beat WWE in the ratings without even regarding the health and safety of their performers.

flahavaj

The issue shouldn't be left in the hands of the wrestlers. The likes of Foley, Flair and Angle have shown repetedly, that left to their own devices, wrestlers WILL be as irresponsoble as they possibly can with their own health.

Worse still look at it from the point of view of a guy like Rob Terry: You're working in company that already top heavy with way too many wrestlers. Established guys who've been there for years such as Christopher Daniels are getting fired. Here you are a rookie in the industry actually being given some TV time to get over. Bear in mind TV time is at an absolute premium in TNA, most people get about 30 seconds per show. Given the chance to do something shocking or unique in order to get over and make a name for yourself, of course a guy like Terry is going to be all on for taking a chairshot to the head. Wouldn't be surprised if he volunteered to do it.

The point is you can't leave tuff like this up to wrestlers. Wrestlers are generally idiots when it comes to their safety. It needs strong management right from the very top of the company and strict responsoble guidelnes that outright ban the practice. Anything else is just not good enough.

D2D

flahavaj wrote: »

The issue shouldn't be left in the hands of the wrestlers. The likes of Foley, Flair and Angle have shown repetedly, that left to their own devices, wrestlers WILL be as irresponsoble as they possibly can with their own health.

Worse still look at it from the point of view of a guy like Rob Terry: You're working in company that already top heavy with way too many wrestlers. Established guys who've been there for years such as Christopher Daniels are getting fired. Here you are a rookie in the industry actually being given some TV time to get over. Bear in mind TV time is at an absolute premium in TNA, most people get about 30 seconds per show. Given the chance to do something shocking or unique in order to get over and make a name for yourself, of course a guy like Terry is going to be all on for taking a chairshot to the head. Wouldn't be surprised if he volunteered to do it.

The point is you can't leave tuff like this up to wrestlers. Wrestlers are generally idiots when it comes to their safety. It needs strong management right from the very top of the company and strict responsoble guidelnes that outright ban the practice. Anything else is just not good enough.

Bang on flah +1

Wrestlers will stop at nothing to a) get themselves over/coverage or b) go all out to entertain everyone. Often is the case (a), serious injuries follow due to said wrestler being reckless and irresponsible in any attempt to get him/her self over

waltersobchak

glenjamin wrote: »

I think what they're trying to do is put a real factor back in wrestling for those that want it and aren't satisfied with what the WWE is offering. But my post about TNA becoming the new ECW was more in reference to the dangerous stips, spots and weapons use. It seems like they're trying to make TNA as extreme as possible just to beat WWE in the ratings without even regarding the health and safety of their performers.

But there not putting the real factor back into wrestling, there putting clusterfu*k angles on tv mixed with sh*tty booking..

DM_7

Well said Flah,

Even Homicide proabably thought he was doing Terry a favour!

flahavaj

DM-ICE wrote: »

Well said Flah,

Even Homicide proabably thought he was doing Terry a favour!

You can be sure he did, he probably gave him some painkillers from his personal stash for the headache and congratulated him on "taking it like a man."

glenjamin

waltersobchak wrote: »

But there not putting the real factor back into wrestling, there putting clusterfu*k angles on tv mixed with sh*tty booking..

Send your complaints to Eric Bischoff, TNA Wrestling, PO 474823, USA.

waltersobchak

Already done:pac:
http://www.facebook.com/Russo?v=wall

D2D

glenjamin wrote: »

Send your complaints to Eric Bischoff, TNA Wrestling, PO 474823, USA.

or facebook:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Eric-Bischoff-Controversy/310203093797

We actually should campaign against this

DM_7

Dare_2_defy wrote: »

We actually should campaign against this

How would we do it?

D2D

DM-ICE wrote: »

How would we do it?

FAIL on my part for suggesting it, my bad

glenjamin

DM-ICE wrote: »

How would we do it?

I will tell 2 friends and they will tell 2 friends....

geeky

flahavaj wrote: »

You can be sure he did, he probably gave him some painkillers from his personal stash for the headache and congratulated him on "taking it like a man."

Well, Homi did take one himself for Matt Hardy's first appearance on TNA. That chair shot (any unprotected chair shot to the head) is absolutely ridiculous, leaving aside debate about the pros or cons of today's TNA.

I've commented anyway on Eric B's fanpage. We'll see how long it lasts.

flahavaj

geeky wrote: »

Well, Homi did take one himself for Matt Hardy's first appearance on TNA. That chair shot (any unprotected chair shot to the head) is absolutely ridiculous, leaving aside debate about the pros or cons of today's TNA.

I've commented anyway on Eric B's fanpage. We'll see how long it lasts.

Two wrongs don't maka a right. As I said earlier its not the wrestlers who are to blame, its the management that allows it to happen, or even encourages it.

Cactus Colm

flahavaj wrote: »

The issue shouldn't be left in the hands of the wrestlers. The likes of Foley, Flair and Angle have shown repetedly, that left to their own devices, wrestlers WILL be as irresponsoble as they possibly can with their own health.

And lets face it, those three have had incredibly successful careers.

I'm no fan of hardcore matches or garbage wrestling. But it wasn't long ago that quite a number of people on here were complaining about the PG-ification of wwe. Now Rob Terry taking that unprotected chair shot was a silly thing to do, but it's nothing in comparision to Angle wrestling with a broken neck, or Foley fighting in a death match with barb wire ring ropes, and C4 boards. Most superstars have taken (or given) unprotected chairshots to the head, or done much much worse. To the list of "Foley, Flair, and Angle" HBK, Taker, Kane, Randy Orton, Brock Lesnar, Mark Henry, John Cena, Big SHow, Rey Mysterio, Shane McMahon, and Vince McMahon, etc, etc.

Hell ... Rob Terry's chairshot didn't even look that bad.