Terrible customer service

Tragedy

I've never really had any dealings with AGS, have a couple of friends in it(but haven't had any encounters with them in their official capacity), and any checkpoint I've passed through, they have been unfailingly polite and nice.

However last night, I had a run in with the most obnoxious rude and snide person I've had to deal with it in a very long time.

Are AGS trained in how to interact with members of the public? Are there guidelines and/or procedures? Was I just unlucky to meet one in a bad mood?



Driving from Stillorgan to Knocklyon late last night via the M50. Just as the Dundrum traffic merges the mway was down to 1 lane(as per usual at night on the M50). Three cars a little in front, one behind. Kept to 100 for the length of the roadworks(about 3.5 miles).

Didn't close on the queue of traffic in front of me and just kept a regular speed for the duration. As the roadworks ended the car behind me turns on sirens and pulls me over.

Two guards get out of the unmarked Mondeo, both circle around the car before the driver comes to my window.

"license"(not hello, please, or can I see your license.)

Then moves to the front of the car and stays there for about 5mins.
Returns to the window and says something like "A fine will be out to you in the post" and goes to move off without saying anything else.

What the hell? No attempt to tell me what happened, what I did wrong, why I was pulled. Driver education? Nah. Courtesy? Nah.

I was a bit shocked as I thought he was just writing a producer(insurance disc had fallen off the windscreen so I had it on the centre console and showed it to him when giving him my license) so replied with "For what?"

"We were behind you on the Leopardstown Roundabout and caught you doing 140 going down the slip."

I replied with "What was the speed limit there? As far as I know it's the same as the motorway. I know I wasn't doing 140 as I had cruise control on as soon as I got up to motorway speed"(that was about 106km/h according to the satnav btw, and that was locked in to cruise control which is fly by wire and not electronic)

"I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute that. At first we thought the car was stolen and that was some of the most dangerous driving I've ever seen through the roadworks"

"There were 3 cars in front of me for the whole length of the roadworks and I never caught up with them, how could it have been some of the most dangerous driving you've ever seen? There were no temporary speed limit signs up anywhere."

"As I said, I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute it."

That was the limit of his conversation(other than a snide smile when I said we both knew I couldn't take it to court was his word is taken as law). If he had have been polite, courteous and said "You were going a bit fast down the slip and I didn't like the way you were driving in the roadworks, because of that I'm issuing you an FCPS for speeding. Be more careful in the future, good night" or something along those lines - I would have thought it harsh and bad luck, but I wouldn't think twice about it after.

But this, leaves a terribly sour taste in my mouth and I finally understand why people tar AGS with the same brush(not that I do mind, but I understand it).
No one likes being made to feel powerless, especially not by a condescending power tripper who simply doesn't like them just because.
Customer service is the biggest part of AGS in my opinion.

PS: Does anyone know when I find out what FCPS I'm actually issued with? He didn't actually say what or how many points. He didnt actually say an FCPS full stop, all he mentioned was a fine.

MagicSean

Tragedy wrote: »

I've never really had any dealings with AGS, have a couple of friends in it(but haven't had any encounters with them in their official capacity), and any checkpoint I've passed through, they have been unfailingly polite and nice.

However last night, I had a run in with the most obnoxious rude and snide person I've had to deal with it in a very long time.

Are AGS trained in how to interact with members of the public? Are there guidelines and/or procedures? Was I just unlucky to meet one in a bad mood?



Driving from Stillorgan to Knocklyon late last night via the M50. Just as the Dundrum traffic merges the mway was down to 1 lane(as per usual at night on the M50). Three cars a little in front, one behind. Kept to 100 for the length of the roadworks(about 3.5 miles).

Didn't close on the queue of traffic in front of me and just kept a regular speed for the duration. As the roadworks ended the car behind me turns on sirens and pulls me over.

Two guards get out of the unmarked Mondeo, both circle around the car before the driver comes to my window.

"license"(not hello, please, or can I see your license.)

Then moves to the front of the car and stays there for about 5mins.
Returns to the window and says something like "A fine will be out to you in the post" and goes to move off without saying anything else.

What the hell? No attempt to tell me what happened, what I did wrong, why I was pulled. Driver education? Nah. Courtesy? Nah.

I was a bit shocked as I thought he was just writing a producer(insurance disc had fallen off the windscreen so I had it on the centre console and showed it to him when giving him my license) so replied with "For what?"

"We were behind you on the Leopardstown Roundabout and caught you doing 140 going down the slip."

I replied with "What was the speed limit there? As far as I know it's the same as the motorway. I know I wasn't doing 140 as I had cruise control on as soon as I got up to motorway speed"(that was about 106km/h according to the satnav btw, and that was locked in to cruise control which is fly by wire and not electronic)

"I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute that. At first we thought the car was stolen and that was some of the most dangerous driving I've ever seen through the roadworks"

"There were 3 cars in front of me for the whole length of the roadworks and I never caught up with them, how could it have been some of the most dangerous driving you've ever seen? There were no temporary speed limit signs up anywhere."

"As I said, I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute it."

That was the limit of his conversation(other than a snide smile when I said we both knew I couldn't take it to court was his word is taken as law). If he had have been polite, courteous and said "You were going a bit fast down the slip and I didn't like the way you were driving in the roadworks, because of that I'm issuing you an FCPS for speeding. Be more careful in the future, good night" or something along those lines - I would have thought it harsh and bad luck, but I wouldn't think twice about it after.

But this, leaves a terribly sour taste in my mouth and I finally understand why people tar AGS with the same brush(not that I do mind, but I understand it).
No one likes being made to feel powerless, especially not by a condescending power tripper who simply doesn't like them just because.
Customer service is the biggest part of AGS in my opinion.

PS: Does anyone know when I find out what FCPS I'm actually issued with? He didn't actually say what or how many points. He didnt actually say an FCPS full stop, all he mentioned was a fine.

You'll get the fine in the post with the stated speed. If I were you I'd fight it.

Irish_polizei

Do you ever get the feeling that people never tell the full story on here ?? :pac:

AlekSmart

Driving from Stillorgan to Knocklyon late last night via the M50. Just as the Dundrum traffic merges the mway was down to 1 lane(as per usual at night on the M50). Three cars a little in front, one behind. Kept to 100 for the length of the roadworks(about 3.5 miles).

I`m pondering the 100KMH on the single lane issue here although I do not the mention of NO temporary speed restriction signs..

Tragedy,I really do feel it is a tragedy,but your post is the latest in rather a long line concerning the "customer" facing element of the Gardai`s duties.

Sadly unless this issue starts to engage the creative minds of AGS Senior Management then I reckon you`ve been shaken-down and will just have to live with it.

It`s highly likely that the AGS members posting here will have the relevant Unit ID`d in a flash but it`s also highly likely that this thread will not travel much further without seeing a Lock and Chain wrapped tightly around it.

da__flash

:cool:

AlekSmart

AlekSmart wrote: »

Tragedy,I really do feel it is a tragedy,but your post is the latest in rather a long line concerning the "customer" facing element of the Gardai`s duties.

Sadly unless this issue starts to engage the creative minds of AGS Senior Management then I reckon you`ve been shaken-down and will just have to live with it.

For some reason you don't get as many saying how well they were dealt with. But, what are you going to do.

AlekSmart

For some reason you don't get as many saying how well they were dealt with. But, what are you going to do.

Very true, foreign and to an extent that holds for ALL public facing staff of whatever hue.

However my own perception is that AGS senior management really do need to decide what form of Police Force they are managing (Although I readily concede that presently its a disgruntled one)

DublinWriter

I'm sure the Garda Ombudsman has a 'Failing to say Have a nice day' sub-category under the general 'Discourtesy' classification and she's dying to hear from you right now.

Honestly OP, do get stopped by an American or British policeman someday if you want to know all about rudeness.

King Ludvig

Tragedy wrote: »

...so replied with "For what?"

"We were behind you on the Leopardstown Roundabout and caught you doing 140 going down the slip."...

(presuming what you've said is the whole story)

Your speed would have had to have been recorded from a fixed position for the Gardaí to give you a FCPS so I douth you'll get a fine for that. If you did I'd fight it in court.

On the other hand the offence could be careless driving although Im pretty sure that goes straight to court. Could be a fine for not displaying insurance disc maybe?

TBH i dont think you'll see anything in the post.

deadwood

AlekSmart wrote: »

It`s highly likely that the AGS members posting here will have the relevant Unit ID`d in a flash but it`s also highly likely that this thread will not travel much further without seeing a Lock and Chain wrapped tightly around it.

You'll find most members posting here, and in the real world, would consider courtesy to the public a given.
It costs nothing to be civil and makes the day go a lot faster. It might sound silly, but more often then not, I'm left with a "thanks guard" when i've finished with a driver/offender. (hand gestures made behind my back notwithstanding).

The guard should have told the driver clearly what he was being stopped for. Being vague and leaving people to "stew" isn't on. (It only encourages them to go on boards.)

If they're being "done", as you kids say, then tell them. If they're not, then tell them that too.

Having said all that, Aleksmart, you're probably right. There's not much else to discuss here, is there? Motors or AH might flog it a bit more though.

Leo Demidov

Maybe the Garda Ombudsman should look at implementing a mandatory receipt system similar to the taxi industry.:rolleyes:

(The more I think of it, I might be on to something. If a guard is compelled to identify himself clearly by issuing a receipt to all customers, it may lead to better customer service. Then again, basic economic principles don't apply and a reputation for poor customer service will hardly affect business.- Back to the drawing board!)

What about "RateYourGarda.ie", devise a bonus scheme based on the number of gold stars one gets in a quarter?

Theres always one bad apple, good for nothing only making cheap cider.

Odysseus

foreign wrote: »

For some reason you don't get as many saying how well they were dealt with. But, what are you going to do.

Too be fair, I do remember seeing a few stating that here over the years, a search would show how many, but they do arise often enough. However, it's like anything else, the bad experiences always stick in peoples minds.

Traumadoc

I have to say I generally have had very good experiences with guards, very polite and professional. However the very few bad ones do sour my memories more than the vast majority of good ones.

I suppose it is like any large organisation you have a few rude ones that give the whole organisation a bad rep. be it nurses, doctors or whatever.

pa990

anytime i experience "Terrible customer service" i usually demand a refund, or i never go back there again.

soden12

DublinWriter wrote: »

I'm sure the Garda Ombudsman has a 'Failing to say Have a nice day' sub-category under the general 'Discourtesy' classification and she's dying to hear from you right now.

Honestly OP, do get stopped by an American or British policeman someday if you want to know all about rudeness.

The OP isn't in the UK or the US - he's writing about the Irish force and their beahviour which is usually expected to be different.

MagicSean

King Ludvig wrote: »

(presuming what you've said is the whole story)

Your speed would have had to have been recorded from a fixed position for the Gardaí to give you a FCPS so I douth you'll get a fine for that. If you did I'd fight it in court.

On the other hand the offence could be careless driving although Im pretty sure that goes straight to court. Could be a fine for not displaying insurance disc maybe?

TBH i dont think you'll see anything in the post.

I think there is a fine for an offence of Section 51a for careless driving. And I think the Gardaí can use their "follow speed" as evidence that he was speeding as a contributory factor. Never seen it done myself.

Leo Demidov

k_mac wrote: »

I think there is a fine for an offence of Section 51a for careless driving. And I think the Gardaí can use their "follow speed" as evidence that he was speeding as a contributory factor. Never seen it done myself.

I've wondered about the whole "follow speed" thing, how often is the speedometer on a Garda calibrated. I know that its a reasonably accurate means of determining someones speed, but how well would it stand up in court. Speedometers generally tend not to be 100% accurate and seem to overstate the speed.

(I know that a pursuing Garda doing 150kph would indicate excessive speed by the suspect, I'm just wondering how reliable is this sort of evidence.)

kravmaga

Tragedy wrote: »

I've never really had any dealings with AGS, have a couple of friends in it(but haven't had any encounters with them in their official capacity), and any checkpoint I've passed through, they have been unfailingly polite and nice.

However last night, I had a run in with the most obnoxious rude and snide person I've had to deal with it in a very long time.

Are AGS trained in how to interact with members of the public? Are there guidelines and/or procedures? Was I just unlucky to meet one in a bad mood?



Driving from Stillorgan to Knocklyon late last night via the M50. Just as the Dundrum traffic merges the mway was down to 1 lane(as per usual at night on the M50). Three cars a little in front, one behind. Kept to 100 for the length of the roadworks(about 3.5 miles).

Didn't close on the queue of traffic in front of me and just kept a regular speed for the duration. As the roadworks ended the car behind me turns on sirens and pulls me over.

Two guards get out of the unmarked Mondeo, both circle around the car before the driver comes to my window.

"license"(not hello, please, or can I see your license.)

Then moves to the front of the car and stays there for about 5mins.
Returns to the window and says something like "A fine will be out to you in the post" and goes to move off without saying anything else.

What the hell? No attempt to tell me what happened, what I did wrong, why I was pulled. Driver education? Nah. Courtesy? Nah.

I was a bit shocked as I thought he was just writing a producer(insurance disc had fallen off the windscreen so I had it on the centre console and showed it to him when giving him my license) so replied with "For what?"

"We were behind you on the Leopardstown Roundabout and caught you doing 140 going down the slip."

I replied with "What was the speed limit there? As far as I know it's the same as the motorway. I know I wasn't doing 140 as I had cruise control on as soon as I got up to motorway speed"(that was about 106km/h according to the satnav btw, and that was locked in to cruise control which is fly by wire and not electronic)

"I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute that. At first we thought the car was stolen and that was some of the most dangerous driving I've ever seen through the roadworks"

"There were 3 cars in front of me for the whole length of the roadworks and I never caught up with them, how could it have been some of the most dangerous driving you've ever seen? There were no temporary speed limit signs up anywhere."

"As I said, I'll be happy to see you in court if you want to dispute it."

That was the limit of his conversation(other than a snide smile when I said we both knew I couldn't take it to court was his word is taken as law). If he had have been polite, courteous and said "You were going a bit fast down the slip and I didn't like the way you were driving in the roadworks, because of that I'm issuing you an FCPS for speeding. Be more careful in the future, good night" or something along those lines - I would have thought it harsh and bad luck, but I wouldn't think twice about it after.

But this, leaves a terribly sour taste in my mouth and I finally understand why people tar AGS with the same brush(not that I do mind, but I understand it).
No one likes being made to feel powerless, especially not by a condescending power tripper who simply doesn't like them just because.
Customer service is the biggest part of AGS in my opinion.

PS: Does anyone know when I find out what FCPS I'm actually issued with? He didn't actually say what or how many points. He didnt actually say an FCPS full stop, all he mentioned was a fine.

I f you were doing 100 in the roadworks zone then you were 40 over the limit as its 60kmph in the roadworks zone.

However if there was no signage then I would appeal to the Officers Inspector or Superintendent.

Were they atatched to Dublin Castle Traffic division or local?

Once they asked for your driving licence then you will get 2 points and €80 fine.........they need the licence details to enter into the Pulse system.

King Ludvig

k_mac wrote: »

I think there is a fine for an offence of Section 51a for careless driving. And I think the Gardaí can use their "follow speed" as evidence that he was speeding as a contributory factor. Never seen it done myself.

Not sure its enough for a conviction in court though. I know it states the speed must be taken from a fixed position in one of the road traffic acts hence if an ANPR camera clocks you speeding while driving behind you, that wouldnt be admissable for a conviction for speeding (could be used, as you said, as a contributory factor for careless/dangerous driving charge though). I could be wrong though, maybe this has been changed since.

blueeyedboy wrote: »

I f you were doing 100 in the roadworks zone then you were 40 over the limit as its 60kmph in the roadworks zone.

However if there was no signage then I would appeal to the Officers Inspector or Superintendent.

Were they atatched to Dublin Castle Traffic division or local?

Once they asked for your driving licence then you will get 2 points and €80 fine.........they need the licence details to enter into the Pulse system.

Road works speed signs arent inforcable though are they? Never introduced by statutory instrument and all that...

Hooch

King Ludvig wrote: »

Not sure its enough for a conviction in court though. I know it states the speed must be taken from a fixed position in one of the road traffic acts hence if an ANPR camera clocks you speeding while driving behind you, that wouldnt be admissable for a conviction for speeding (could be used, as you said, as a contributory factor for careless/dangerous driving charge though). I could be wrong though, maybe this has been changed since

Once the vehicle is calibrated it is admissable as evidence.

wexfjord

wexfjord wrote: »

I've wondered about the whole "follow speed" thing, how often is the speedometer on a Garda calibrated.

I'm due in for calibration on Monday.

Leo Demidov

foreign wrote: »

I'm due in for calibration on Monday.

I was just checkin if you F*****S were paying attention!
...............................(FineOfficers^^^)

-Corkie-

I got stopped at a checkpopint a few months back and was asked to give a sample of breath which i did no bother. I dont drink btw but when the result showed clear he looked stunned and said oh its clear!! I said i am not suprised as i dont drink. He said ah we will catch the fellas like you yet.... I said fellas like who, at that he threw the plastic thing you blow on back in to my car. I took it back up and threw it out on the road at him and took off. I wouldnt mind im in my 30s dress well and have a new car which i would say ticked him off. He was with the traffic corps actually who are noted to be like this. I have a lot of normal guards as friends who are all very sound but what sort of a power trip are these fellas on.
I told a few ags members about it and they laughed and said he probabaly would have treated them the same:eek:

Irish_polizei

SARASON wrote: »

I got stopped at a checkpopint a few months back and was asked to give a sample of breath which i did no bother. I dont drink btw but when the result showed clear he looked stunned and said oh its clear!! I said i am not suprised as i dont drink. He said ah we will catch the fellas like you yet....

Thanks for sharing your story, that was terrific!:)

-Corkie-

That just proves my point, sarcasism and rolling eyes is so antagonistic.

Irish_polizei

SARASON wrote: »

That just proves my point, sarcasism and rolling eyes is so antagonistic.

What exactly proves your point?

guil

blueeyedboy wrote: »

Once they asked for your driving licence then you will get 2 points and €80 fine.........they need the licence details to enter into the Pulse system.

by that logic i would have being banned a long time ago

alexlyons

deadwood wrote: »

If they're being "done", as you kids say, then tell them. If they're not, then tell them that too.

A bit derogatory, no? That could possible be what some people are talking about in terms of guards thinking they're better than most...

King Ludvig wrote: »

Road works speed signs arent inforcable though are they? Never introduced by statutory instrument and all that...

I've heard that a number of times from a few guards and others, along with a thing about it on the radio...

Hooch

alexlyons wrote: »

A bit derogatory, no? That could possible be what some people are talking about in terms of guards thinking they're better than most...

No its not, its because hes an olde fart and were all 50 yrs or so younger......dw is know here for his humor.

alexlyons wrote: »

I've heard that a number of times from a few guards and others, along with a thing about it on the radio...

County council must pass a Bye-Law to allow the traffic regulations.....not a statuatory instrument. Most bye-laws are passed these days where as they werent 10 years ago.

-Corkie-

Irish_polizei wrote: »

What exactly proves your point?

I seen the other side of the coin today. I collected a new car for my wife(07) in dublin today which was out of tax since the end of feb. I went uo the slip road on the m8 for mallow and their is the tc with a checkpoint!! I came up to the garda and he looked at the car and laughed and said i bet your after buying it!! I said i am and offered him a receipt which he replied by saying you look honest, go on.... So a lot of nice guys out there.

Traumadoc

I was talking one day to the local supers daughter, who is a nurse, who had just been stopped by one of the traffic corp and recieved a tough time. She was visably shaken by the whole experience.

I have to say I have only met two rude policemen, in over 25 years of driving, and met far more polite and professional guards. Unfortunatly the polite ones pass without comment but you remember the traumatic experiences. This is the same for all experiences with authority, be it medical , policing or whatever.

bravestar

Traumadoc wrote: »

I was talking one day to the local supers daughter, who is a nurse, who had just been stopped by one of the traffic corp and recieved a tough time. She was visably shaken by the whole experience.

What's wrong with that? It is possible to be polite, professional and put the fear of god into people. I don't think they are mutually exclusive.

Terrontress

I've been looking at those Welsh traffic police on BBC1 and they always seem to be friendly and efficient but nobody gets away with anything. Maybe that is just because the cameras are there.

There was a guy the other night who failed to stop. Once they caught up with him they were friendly, had a good laugh, dropped him home and had a chat with his wife. He lost his license for 12 months over it although he stayed in the speed limit the whole time.

On Traffic Blues, there was a man in Donegal did the same. They caught up with him and then let him go after him telling lie after lie.

The Welsh lads are definitely courteous but would put the fear of God into you.

Shield

bravestar wrote: »

It is possible to be polite, professional and put the fear of god into people.

Agreed, but only when necessary. There's no need to put the fear of god into someone just because you can and you know how to. Everything is relative to the situation you find yourself in.

bravestar

psni wrote: »

Agreed, but only when necessary. There's no need to put the fear of god into someone just because you can and you know how to. Everything is relative to the situation you find yourself in.

Agreed 100%

parsi

Terrontress wrote: »

I've been looking at those Welsh traffic police on BBC1 and they always seem to be friendly and efficient but nobody gets away with anything. Maybe that is just because the cameras are there.

There was a guy the other night who failed to stop. Once they caught up with him they were friendly, had a good laugh, dropped him home and had a chat with his wife. He lost his license for 12 months over it although he stayed in the speed limit the whole time.

On Traffic Blues, there was a man in Donegal did the same. They caught up with him and then let him go after him telling lie after lie.

The Welsh lads are definitely courteous but would put the fear of God into you.

I saw that episode and I was quite struck by their behaviour. They were like brilliantly trained interrogators who found out everything they needed to know with the minimum of effort.

Whether it's just clever editing but they did seem to be more friendly/personable than their English colleagues and they seemed to use less jargon when talking to Dai Public.

Preset No.3

DublinWriter wrote: »

do get stopped by an American or British policeman someday if you want to know all about rudeness.

In all the years that I have been driving for both business and pleasure in Northern Ireland and England, I have found nothing but polite about courteous replies from police when stopped at checkpoints. The same goes for US cops, both services have been very professional!!

I have a number of friends that are members, and even tonight at a traffic corps checkpoint for random breath testing the guys very very polite even when I was semi-giving out that they were always out on a tuesday/wednesday night but when it came to the weekend, they always seemed to end up helping ordinary members with calls. Cutbacks and all that.

HOWEVER, there are and I have come across some real pricks! Badge power and all that! No concept of customer service, just treat you like a criminal from the outset and how dare you speak back to them!!

A US cop may spray, taser, or shoot you, but he will be nice till it comes to the part where he isnt nice! Thats one basic thing, training!

Lock away mods, if you have to. I however remain a loyal fan of this forum and a loyal friend to many members.