so what breed is your mongrel

PaulB91

well, i have a 5 year old lab/boxer (we think) and a 5 year old GSD (we think) and two pups from the GSD whom we thought maybe Newfies, but not so sure as some people said recently they looked like flat-coated retrievers (who i believe decended from Newfies) so i just sent of for DNA testing kits (£60 each) for two, the lab/boxer and one pup (from that we should have a good idea of mom and the other pup obviously) am i mad or has anyone else here had there "mongrel" dna tested?

Sid_Justice

I'd be skeptical if these things work

Noopti

I enquired about the DNA test thing before, but was told it was only suitable for North American dogs....

Where did you get yours?

PaulB91

not sure if i can mention the site - mods? i found them through a pet supermarket website

they cover the following breeds from what i can gather -
Afghan Hound, Airedale Terrier, Akita, American Eskimo Dog, Australian Sheep Dog, Basenji, Basset Hound, Beagle, Belgian Tervuren, Bernese Mountain Dog, Bichon Frise, Border Collie, Borzoi, Boston Terrier, Boxer, Brittany Spaniel, Bull Terrier, Bulldog, Chihuahua, Chinese Shar-Pei, Chow Chow, Cocker Spaniel, Dachshund, Dalmatian, Doberman Pinscher, English Setter, English Springer Spaniel, German Shepherd Dog, German Shorthaired Pointer, Golden Retriever, Great Dane, Great Pyrenees, Greyhound, Irish Setter, Italian Greyhound, Keeshond, Labrador Retriever, Lhasa Apso, Maltese, Mastiff, Miniature Pinscher, Newfoundland, Norwegian Elkhound, Papillon, Parson Russell Terrier, Pekingese, Pembroke Welsh Corgi, Pomeranian, Poodle, Pug, Rhodesian Ridgeback, Rottweiler, Saint Bernard, Saluki, Schnauzer.

Sid_Justice

do you take a sample and then post it back?

PaulB91

from what i gather it's a swab (from the mouth i assume) and then post it back to them, 21 days later they tell you your dog is decended from kings ;o)

Sid_Justice

Yeah I think I found the site. To be honest I'd be surprised how accurate it can be. Sure let us know anyway.

PaulB91

Sid_Justice wrote: »

Yeah I think I found the site. To be honest I'd be surprised how accurate it can be. Sure let us know anyway.

well i'll be sending two back - so we'll see if they can work it out - should be pretty good though, i mean people are locked away on the basis of DNA

FYI I was looking into a human DNA testing as well - see where i come from back in the distant past

crotalus667

PaulB91 wrote: »

(£60 each)

seems wayyyy to cheap

PaulB91

you think i should send them more money

peasant

I'm not entirely firm on the exact figures, but I remember reading somewhere that there is a bout a 1% genetic difference between wolf and dogs, all dogs that is.

So, if this test isn't going to tell you that you have a wolf, it is going to discard 99% of the supplied genetic material and sift through the remaining 1% to divine it into 60-odd breeds.
In other words, one sixtieth of 1% of the supplied material is going to tell you who's the daddy (and mammy) of your dogs?

And all that for 60 Euro?
Yeah right ...

Magenta

I read a review of those tests in a dog magazine. If I recall correctly, they tested a dog whose parentage they knew, and the results were way off.

morganafay

That's really interesting, I love trying to guess what cross breeds are

I wouldn't bother spending the money though. I would be kinda interested to find out what my cat is, we found him in a carpark but he looks just like a persian but with a prettier face I'd bet he's half persian, but maybe just a mongrel long haired cat!

roxiesmammy

Magenta wrote: »

I read a review of those tests in a dog magazine. If I recall correctly, they tested a dog whose parentage they knew, and the results were way off.

yeah read this article as well. If i was you i would save your money. Is there any reason you need to know the breed, maybe health reasons. If not i would be inclined to just enjoy your guys. Why line the pockets of something which i can tell is just guess work.

mymo

We had a hansom mutt as kids, kind of shaggy, medium size, beige colour with kind of a mane of hair round the neck. We always thought he had a bit of retriever in him, but joking one day in the pub, my grandad(dog at his feet) said he was an austrian pigeon hound:D
Word got around and people used to stop to see the dog, one guy even swore his uncle had one too.:rolleyes:
Anyone else got made up names for their mutts?

Esroh

I have always been fond of the Connemara Hound myself. A cross between a Sheepdog(of any kind) and a retrieving breed. That way you can go shooting on the hills and bring in the sheep at the same time:D.It is most often seen with lovely Long black coat but with white spot on chest or foot

PaulB91

roxiesmammy wrote: »

yeah read this article as well. If i was you i would save your money. Is there any reason you need to know the breed, maybe health reasons. If not i would be inclined to just enjoy your guys. Why line the pockets of something which i can tell is just guess work.

out of interest and in regards later health issues, for instance, if we find they are Flat Coated Retrievers they could suffer from cancer and die before they are 10 - in that case i would like to know so i can keep an eye out for any signs

Get a better understanding of your dog’s behaviour, potential health risks and personality.

PaulB91

peasant wrote: »

I'm not entirely firm on the exact figures, but I remember reading somewhere that there is a bout a 1% genetic difference between wolf and dogs, all dogs that is.

So, if this test isn't going to tell you that you have a wolf, it is going to discard 99% of the supplied genetic material and sift through the remaining 1% to divine it into 60-odd breeds.
In other words, one sixtieth of 1% of the supplied material is going to tell you who's the daddy (and mammy) of your dogs?

And all that for 60 Euro?
Yeah right ...

not sure your views on DNA but from what i have sourced the markers for breeds have been identified, therefore they simply look for those markers in the sample i send

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_dna_breed_identification#Genetics

Dog breeds can now be analyzed through genetics. Genetic markers (microsatellite markers and single-nucleotide polymorphisms) have been analyzed and a representative sample of 85 breeds were placed into four clusters, each cluster having shared ancestors. Cluster 1 is thought to be the oldest, including African and Asian dogs. Cluster 2 is mastiff type dogs; cluster 3 is herding dogs, and cluster 4 modern hunting type dogs (mostly developed in Europe in the 1800s.)[24]

Note: Relationships uncovered through genetics may not match "official" breed histories. The following breed lists are based on genetic research, not traditional beliefs about dog breeds.

Cluster 1 (Thought to be older lineages):[24] Afghan Hound, Akita Inu,[25] Alaskan Malamute, Basenji, Chow Chow, Irish Wolfhound, Lhasa Apso, Pekingese, Saluki, Samoyed, Shar Pei, Shiba Inu, Shih Tzu, Siberian Husky, Tibetan Terrier.

Cluster 2 (Mastiff-type):[24] Bernese Mountain Dog, Boxer, Bulldog, Bullmastiff, French Bulldog, German Shepherd Dog,Cierny Sery, Greater Swiss Mountain Dog, Labrador Retriever, Mastiff, Miniature Bull Terrier, Newfoundland, Pomeranian, Presa Canario, Rottweiler.

Cluster 3 (Herding):[24] Belgian Sheepdog, Belgian Tervuren, Borzoi, Collie, Greyhound, Pug, St. Bernard, Shetland Sheepdog.

Cluster 4 (Modern/hunting dogs):[24] Airedale Terrier, American Cocker Spaniel, American Hairless Terrier, American Water Spaniel, Australian Shepherd, Australian Terrier, Basset Hound, Beagle, Bedlington Terrier, Bichon Frise, Bloodhound, Border Collie, Cairn Terrier, Cavalier King Charles Spaniel, Chesapeake Bay Retriever, Chihuahua, Clumber Spaniel, Dachshund, Doberman Pinscher, English Cocker Spaniel, Flat Coated Retriever, German Shorthaired Pointer, Giant Schnauzer, Golden Retriever, Great Dane, Ibizan Hound, Irish Setter, Irish Terrier, Italian Greyhound, Keeshond, Kerry Blue Terrier, Komondor, Kuvasz, Manchester Terrier, Miniature Schnauzer, Norwegian Elkhound, Old English Sheepdog, Pharaoh Hound, Pointer, Portuguese Water Dog, Pit Bull Terrier, Rhodesian Ridgeback, Schipperke, Soft Coated Wheaten Terrier, Standard Poodle, Standard Schnauzer, Welsh Springer Spaniel, West Highland White Terrier, Whippet.

Whispered

mymo wrote: »

We had a hansom mutt as kids, kind of shaggy, medium size, beige colour with kind of a mane of hair round the neck. We always thought he had a bit of retriever in him, but joking one day in the pub, my grandad(dog at his feet) said he was an austrian pigeon hound:D
Word got around and people used to stop to see the dog, one guy even swore his uncle had one too.:rolleyes:
Anyone else got made up names for their mutts?

an Austrian Pigeon Hound Brilliant.

I met a woman who told me her dog was a "bitza". I think she believed it was a breed. She didn't seem to be joking.

My own dog is a staffador.

PaulB91

i think i have a Boxador, German Shepherd and two NewSheps, but that could change to a Staffador, German Shepherd and two FlatSheps - we'll have to wait and see

CreedonsDogDayc

We had a collie mix when we were kids. When I was about 5 I taught my younger sister (3) to tell people when asked that our dog was "a rare breed of wire haired boarder collie".

Trying to find a pic of her but none on this laptop!

PaulB91

peasant wrote: »

I'm not entirely firm on the exact figures, but I remember reading somewhere that there is a bout a 1% genetic difference between wolf and dogs, all dogs that is.

So, if this test isn't going to tell you that you have a wolf, it is going to discard 99% of the supplied genetic material and sift through the remaining 1% to divine it into 60-odd breeds.
In other words, one sixtieth of 1% of the supplied material is going to tell you who's the daddy (and mammy) of your dogs?

And all that for 60 Euro?
Yeah right ...

hmm seems dog dna testing come a long way in last few days

However, scientists used DNA profiling to prove that samples collected during the investigation were a billion times more likely to come from two specific dogs than any other animals

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/8559319.stm

kildara

PaulB91 wrote: »

hmm seems dog dna testing come a long way in last few days



http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/8559319.stm

Is that article not suggesting that they can trace the blood/saliva/hair back to an individual known dog, rather than a particular breed of dog?
ie, they know what dog to take samples from to prove that the dog in question inflicted the damage (in this case the dog belonging to the person who was ultimately found guilty of the murder).

Sid_Justice

1% genetic difference between wolf and dogs,

The 'genetic distance' between Chimpanzees and Humans is only believed to be around 2%. Apparently the genetic distance between humans and Bananas using the same metrics is 40% but that's neither here nor there.

However, scientists used DNA profiling to prove that samples collected during the investigation were a billion times more likely to come from two specific dogs than any other animals

The critical thing in that investigation is that they DNA profiled individuals and proved that the DNA was MUCH more likely to belong to either of those two rather than another individual. This was nothing to do with species or breeds or anything like that.

General ignorance on this subject is quite high.

PaulB91

http://www.squidoo.com/dog_dna_testing

Just like humans, dogs have genes and the genetic composition of the dog is important to some of their owners. Usually a dog DNA test starts at $40 which is conducted by the American Kennel Club themselves. The kennel club keeps a record of over 100,000 dogs and also certifies dogs every year as pure breeds.

OK if the American Kennel club can do it for $40 why do people think it's so far fetched - is it because it's new and un heared of here therefore must be wrong?

http://www.akc.org/dna/

The AKC has built the world's largest database of canine DNA profiles for parentage verification and genetic identity purposes.

AKC Parentage Profile

For AKC registered dogs born on/after January 1, 2000, dog owners may purchase a handsome profile displaying the registration information and genotypes for the dog and its AKC registered sire and dam. All three dogs must be AKC DNA Profiled to purchase this profile.

Example Dog DNA Results

Your dog's DNA results come to you in the form of a Certificate of DNA Breed Analysis as shown here. As you can see, these results are reported in one, two or three categories.

• Primary
• Secondary
• 'In the Mix'

It is important to remember that most mystery mutts will not have breeds listed in every category. As a matter of fact most mixed breeds will have nothing reported in the "Primary" category unless one of its parents is a purebred.

Certificate of DNA Breed Analysis Interpretation
Results are based on more than 100 identifiable breeds and are presented in three possible categories: Primary, Secondary and In the Mix”. Every dog's DNA composition is unique and breeds may not appear in all of the describe categories.


Primary – This category is intended to help owners recognise when their pet's DNA contains a majority of a specific breed. If your dog has a strong match to one of our over 100 breeds, then it is categorised as primary. Most mixed breed dogs will not usually have a breed in this category unless they have a pure-bred parent.


Secondary – This category reports breeds that might be easily recognisable within your dog. While these breeds may or may not have a strong influence on your pet, each breed listed makes up less than the majority of your dog's DNA.


In the Mix – This final category identifies breeds that have the least amount of influence on your pet's composition. They still appear, at low and measurable amounts, in your pet's DNA. If your pet's results only identify breeds in this category, it is possible your pet is composed of so many breeds only small influences from each breed can be detected.

toadfly

Ozzie is (we think) and JRT & Yorkie. has the JR face but with Yorkie colours.

PaulB91

TillyGirl wrote: »

Ozzie is (we think) and JRT & Yorkie. has the JR face but with Yorkie colours.

a Jackie then ;o)

Whispered

A Jackie sounds like a happy friendly litte dog
A york-russel sounds classier though. :cool:
A jackshire sounds like a cheeky chappy

CreedonsDogDayc

i guess there's only one way we'll know if the kit works or not!!! Be sure to report back when you get the results, and if the results tell you that your dogs a banana we'll know it doesnt work

PaulB91

well we are pretty sure what the promanent breed is in both the ones i'm testing, and if they come back telling me they are dachshund x poodle i'll be getting my money back was paid through paypal

olaola

We've a Fox Hound/Lab cross. A Lab-hound? A Fox-rador? Fox-lab-ound?!

PaulB91

olaola wrote: »

We've a Fox Hound/Lab cross. A Lab-hound? A Fox-rador? Fox-lab-ound?!

how about a "Foxador"

Sid_Justice

What's the point anyway?

As a previous poster said, certain breeds are more prone to certain diseases than others due to the inbreeding but I still think any vet should be able to diagnose disease/condition without the breed giving the big hint.

Furthermore, if your mongrel is a genuine mongrel and not a cross between 2 pure breeds than I dont think it would be of any relevance.

I mean doing it out of curiosity/interest fair enough but it seems like a (expensive) waste of time to me.

PaulB91

Sid_Justice wrote: »

What's the point anyway?

i did it out of interest as people are always asking what breed my dogs are, and then make their own mind up, so if it turns out i can see it's a Zebra cross with a Bear

Sid_Justice wrote: »

As a previous poster said, certain breeds are more prone to certain diseases than others due to the inbreeding but I still think any vet should be able to diagnose disease/condition without the breed giving the big hint.

ah yes, but if my pups have "Flat Coated Retrieve" in them there is a higher chance of cancer, and dying young if it's not spotted, so if i know they are i can keep an eye out for the symptons or signs, as the saying goes, for warned s for armed

Sid_Justice wrote: »

Furthermore, if your mongrel is a genuine mongrel and not a cross between 2 pure breeds than I dont think it would be of any relevance.

just because a dog is a mongrel does not mean it can't have genetic diseases passed down through the genes

Sid_Justice wrote: »

I mean doing it out of curiosity/interest fair enough but it seems like a (expensive) waste of time to me.

i'm sorry if you feel i wasted your time, and i will of course refund any money you sent to me for this - oh wait - it's my own money

Tootle

helena.ryan wrote: »

A Jackie sounds like a happy friendly litte dog
A york-russel sounds classier though. :cool:
A jackshire sounds like a cheeky chappy

It could be a Yorkussell....I think thats what I have. He is the tinest little puppy:D

lrushe

My Mam and Dad have a King Charles x JRT, he's the weirdest looking little dog, he literally looks like someone stuck a black and tan King Charles head on a Jack Russell's body, plus he has one ear that sticks up and the other flops down.
So I guess he could be a King Russell or a Jack Charles???

CreedonsDogDayc

lrushe wrote: »

My Mam and Dad have a King Charles x JRT, he's the weirdest looking little dog, he literally looks like someone stuck a black and tan King Charles head on a Jack Russell's body, plus he has one ear that sticks up and the other flops down.
So I guess he could be a King Russell or a Jack Charles???

ah he sounds gorgeous! any picks of him? Class names too, go with King Russell, more regal!!

lrushe

CreedonsDogDayc wrote: »

ah he sounds gorgeous! any picks of him? Class names too, go with King Russell, more regal!!

I had one somewhere, can't put my hand on it now. His name is Jack so I guess his name could be 'Jack Charles' and his breed a 'King Russell', makes him sound v.noble
He spent the first 9 months of his life locked in a tiny back garden with no one paying him any attention, now he wakes up to breakfast with my parents and then does a boarder check of their land, talk about going from rags to riches :pac:

CreedonsDogDayc

lrushe wrote: »

I had one somewhere, can't put my hand on it now. His name is Jack so I guess his name could be 'Jack Charles' and his breed a 'King Russell', makes him sound v.noble
He spent the first 9 months of his life locked in a tiny back garden with no one paying him any attention, now he wakes up to breakfast with my parents and then does a boarder check of their land, talk about going from rags to riches :pac:

Ah, sounds like a movie!! "The Adventures of Jack Charles...King of Russellland"

If you do find the pic, please post, we need it for the cover of the DVD box!

lrushe

CreedonsDogDayc wrote: »

Ah, sounds like a movie!! "The Adventures of Jack Charles...King of Russellland"

If you do find the pic, please post, we need it for the cover of the DVD box!

Brilliant!!! His 'love interest' could be their other dog, a JRT called Jill. Jack and Jill, seriously you couldn't make it up

PaulB91

well they have recieved the first swab - mentioned a few sceptics out there and they said

There are quite a few people out there who are sceptical about the testing as they don’t really understand that there has been a lot of scientific research gone into producing these tests a good link to give them is www.biopetvetlab.com This is our parent company where all the research and testing is done, it has a lot of scientific info on there about how the test was founded and the other research into Canine genetics that BioPet are doing at the moment.

PaulB91

We have got the results back on the DNA Tyson (picture attaced) is a Boxador
Level 1: Boxer
Level 3: Labrador Retriever

and Bully is German Springerese (i'll come back with a picture of him)
Level 2: German Shepherd Dog
Level 3: English Springer Spaniel
Level 5: Pekingese :eek:

In processing, breeds are detected as ranges rather than absolute values. These are then listed on your certificate as Levels which are defined as follows:
Level 1: over 75% of the DNA found in your dog is from the breed listed
Level 2: each breed listed represents between 37–74% of your dog’s DNA
Level 3: each breed listed represents between 20– 36% of your dog’s DNA
Level 4: each breed listed represents between 10–19% of your dog’s DNA
Level 5: each breed listed represents less than 10% of your dog’s DNA

kildara

Do you agree?

andreac

Thats interesting alright.
Just wondering did you give any info with the blood test or was it just the blood sample itself?

PaulB91

ye - we always thought Tyson was a Lab/boxer and Bully's mom is pretty much German Shep, rescue dog though so can never be 100% the missing piece was bully's dad, originally we thought Newfie (even people with Newfie's thought they where pure bred) then as they grew (and not that big) i thought maybe Flat Coated Retriever, but the Springer makes sense - the pekingnese makes it interesting

PaulB91

andreac wrote: »

Thats interesting alright.
Just wondering did you give any info with the blood test or was it just the blood sample itself?

no info other than name and age (DOB) never mentioned what we thought they might be no pictures of them until now for their certs (was told the breeds before pictures sent)

toadfly

Thats interesting Paul, wouldnt mind getting that done for Ozzie, although we are pretty sure hes a York Russel!

How much was it again? Did you have to take a blood sample or get the vet to do it?

PaulB91

TillyGirl wrote: »

Thats interesting Paul, wouldnt mind getting that done for Ozzie, although we are pretty sure hes a York Russel!

How much was it again? Did you have to take a blood sample or get the vet to do it?

twas 60 sterling (each) and it's just two swabs of the inside of the mouth - pretty simple, just get the swabs (sent to you) and rub them on the inside of the dogs cheek

perri winkles

We have two terrier mixes

One is is a cairn x, not sure what he could be crossed with, maybe a bit of scottie in him?

011.jpg


The other fella is a borer terrier/corgi ? or so we've been told!
0102.jpg

PaulB91

perri winkles wrote: »

We have two terrier mixes

One is is a cairn x, not sure what he could be crossed with, maybe a bit of scottie in him?

011.jpg


The other fella is a borer terrier/corgi ? or so we've been told!
0102.jpg

i'd say they are pretty spot on, i only glanced at your post before opening the pictures, and saw the second one and immediately thought corgi, zoomed in and thought looks like a border terrier as well, then read your post in full

perri winkles

Everybody who we talk to always says thats what chester is! (border/corgi) He's got the border terrier attitude anyway thats for sure! :P

Henry is a little harder to figure, just a mix of all things good