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Pick your Argentina team for South Africa.

  • 15-03-2010 9:52am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭


    Touching on this in the Rooney v Messi thread.

    I think most people agree that something's not right as they have a large pool of extremely talented footballers that should have qualified far easier than they did. So what was the problem? Why can these players not reproduce close to their club form.

    I would stick with the 4-3-3 with something like this:

    Andújar
    Zanetti-Demichelis/Samuel-G.Milito-Insua
    Masherano----Banega

    Veron/Aimar
    Messi
    Tevez/Aguero
    Higuain/D.Milito/Lisandro

    Could also have Lavezzi and Di Maria ready to slot in from the bench on either wing. Even Saviola is worth a look, doing very well with Benfica.


«13

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭thorbarry


    Ush1 wrote: »
    So what was the problem? Why can these players not reproduce close to their club form.

    When Argentina where playing the qualifying games for the WC, they selected more players than any other team, I think over 100 different players. I think its tough to add constancy to your game when you are constantly selecting new players. But, saying that, I read somewhere that when Maradona was a player, the coaches did the same thing. They would select alot of players from a large range of players, barley qualify for the word cup, then pick the best out of all the players, and do good in the WC. I think Maradona is just doing things like they did in the old days


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,558 ✭✭✭✭dreamers75


    Ush1 wrote: »
    ........


    Diego?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    thorbarry wrote: »
    When Argentina where playing the qualifying games for the WC, they selected more players than any other team, I think over 100 different players. I think its tough to add constancy to your game when you are constantly selecting new players. But, saying that, I read somewhere that when Maradona was a player, the coaches did the same thing. They would select alot of players from a large range of players, barley qualify for the word cup, then pick the best out of all the players, and do good in the WC. I think Maradona is just doing things like they did in the old days

    Totally agree. But they reckon Maradona has a hidden agenda to prove to the rest of the world that the Argentine league is as strong as Europe which is why he picked so many domestic based players. Strangely when they got hammered by Bolivia at altitude, I think it was Peru who played Bolivia after and purposely picked all Peruvian based players as they would be able to deal with the altitude better and they beat Bolivia easily.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    dreamers75 wrote: »
    Diego?

    :confused:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,558 ✭✭✭✭dreamers75


    Ush1 wrote: »
    :confused:

    Diego used 70 players in 11 games, wasnt sure if he was on here looking for tips :P


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    dreamers75 wrote: »
    Diego used 70 players in 11 games, wasnt sure if he was on here looking for tips :P

    Haha, wouldn't be suprised!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,592 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    Their attack is probably the best in the world, and the midfield isn't far behind.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,283 ✭✭✭Glico Man


    You do know Banega plays as a winger right?


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,741 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    DM, and I don't mean Mascherano.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    aaronh007 wrote: »
    You do know Banega plays as a winger right?

    Erm, no he doesn't. What game has he ever played right wing? Hernandez plays right for Los Che.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,555 ✭✭✭Gillington


    I think that Argentina have the weakest GK of all the bigger nations and this could be their downfall


  • Posts: 8,647 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What about Cambiasso?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,283 ✭✭✭Smegball


    I think Argentina will get knocked out early enough actually. Who is more likely to start? Aguero or Milito? The attacking players they have is quite amazing really, embarrassment of riches to say the least. The equivalent to Spains midfield.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,836 ✭✭✭Vokes


    Here was the lineup against Germany recently:

    22 Sergio Romero
    13 Walter Samuel
    2 Martin Gaston Demichelis
    14 Javier Mascherano
    6 Gabriel Heinze
    15 Nicolás Otamendi
    8 Juan Sebastian Veron
    7 Ángel Di María
    17 Jonás Gutiérrez
    9 Gonzalo Higuaín
    10 Lionel Messi


    I'd probably go with that but replace Gutierrez with one of Tevez / Aguero playing as a number 10, and shunt Messi to his preferred right-wing forward position.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,814 ✭✭✭✭JPA


    The fact Veron is in the team consistently means they will not do well in SA IMO.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,836 ✭✭✭Vokes


    They don't really have a player of that ilk, unless they get Riquelme back in, do they?

    Is Banega that kind of player?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,814 ✭✭✭✭JPA


    Vokes wrote: »
    They don't really have a player of that ilk, unless they get Riquelme back in, do they?

    Is Banega that kind of player?


    It's just the Argentinian need to have a playmaker in there when they do not have players of a high enough quality to fill that role at top class international level.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    What about Cambiasso?

    In for who? He has been a bit underwhelming this year also.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Vokes wrote: »
    They don't really have a player of that ilk, unless they get Riquelme back in, do they?

    Is Banega that kind of player?

    Riquelme will never play under Maradona.
    Banega is more a mixture, combative and good passing. Fantastic player for me and has to be in the starting line up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭Jayob10


    Argentina are gunna win the world cup. Its written in the stars. Maradonna is a one man soap opera.

    Heres the team I would pick


    Romero

    Zanetti
    Garay
    Samuel
    Ansaldi

    Mascherano
    Banega
    Cambiasso

    Messi
    Higuain
    Tevez/Aguero/Lavezzi (depending on form)

    Higuain will be a crucial player for them though, very important he stays fit.

    Argentina to win it out!!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Jayob10 wrote: »
    Argentina are gunna win the world cup. Its written in the stars. Maradonna is a one man soap opera.

    Heres the team I would pick


    Romero

    Zanetti
    Garay
    Samuel
    Ansaldi

    Mascherano
    Banega
    Cambiasso

    Messi
    Higuain
    Tevez/Aguero/Lavezzi (depending on form)

    Higuain will be a crucial player for them though, very important he stays fit.

    Argentina to win it out!!

    So you'd push Banega foward? It makes sense, he's been smashing this season with great supply to the attackers at Valencia.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭Bukman13


    Vokes wrote: »
    Here was the lineup against Germany recently:

    22 Sergio Romero
    13 Walter Samuel
    2 Martin Gaston Demichelis
    14 Javier Mascherano
    6 Gabriel Heinze
    15 Nicolás Otamendi
    8 Juan Sebastian Veron
    7 Ángel Di María
    17 Jonás Gutiérrez
    9 Gonzalo Higuaín
    10 Lionel Messi


    I'd probably go with that but replace Gutierrez with one of Tevez / Aguero playing as a number 10, and shunt Messi to his preferred right-wing forward position.

    In most of the World Cup games I've seen Argentina play, Maradona has played a 3-5-2 formation.

    Otamendi is a defender but has played on the right wing.

    He plays 2 holding midfielders.

    Maradona has said that the first 3 names on his team sheet are: Messi, Mascherano, and Gutierrez :eek:.

    Higuain and Messi will probably play up front.

    Leaving, Aguero, Tevez, Milito, Lisandro on the bench or out of the squad.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭Jayob10


    Ush1 wrote: »
    So you'd push Banega foward? It makes sense, he's been smashing this season with great supply to the attackers at Valencia.

    The thing about the midfield above is that all 3 can sit, and 2 out of the 3 (excluding Mascherano) can push on. I think Argentina will need to rely on keeping it tight at the back and being competitive in the midfield and the midfield 3 there will do that.
    I'm sacrificing a Veron/Aimar for a player such as Cambiasso.

    Banega is creative but hes a diminutive player, can stick his foot in too. And Tevez will work back too leaving at front 2 of Higuain and Messi at times.

    For some reason, I think Rafa Benitez would be a great manager for Argentina :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Jayob10 wrote: »
    The thing about the midfield above is that all 3 can sit, and 2 out of the 3 (excluding Mascherano) can push on. I think Argentina will need to rely on keeping it tight at the back and being competitive in the midfield and the midfield 3 there will do that.
    I'm sacrificing a Veron/Aimar for a player such as Cambiasso.

    Banega is creative but hes a diminutive player, can stick his foot in too. And Tevez will work back too leaving at front 2 of Higuain and Messi at times.

    For some reason, I think Rafa Benitez would be a great manager for Argentina :D

    Well I think any manager worth his salt should be able to get a good thing going with those players.

    The potential of their foward lines is just mind blowing, if they could get them all playing and geling together...*shudder*


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,946 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Messi doesnt really cut it at international level compared to Barca, dont get me wrong still a great player but just doesnt bring his barca form with him


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Headshot wrote: »
    Messi doesnt really cut it at international level compared to Barca, dont get me wrong still a great player but just doesnt bring his barca form with him

    Name a single Argentina player who has brought their club form?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,814 ✭✭✭✭JPA


    Headshot wrote: »
    Messi doesnt really cut it at international level compared to Barca, dont get me wrong still a great player but just doesnt bring his barca form with him


    Wrong choice of words there, doesn't cut it is wrong. The team doesn't make the best use of his talents is the problem.
    However he was a star at the Copa America in 2007 and this upcoming WC is his first chance to star at a WC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,946 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Ush1 wrote: »
    Name a single Argentina player who has brought their club form?

    doesnt matter, im talking about Messi not anyother player, he never brings his club form to the International stage in recent times, maybe its to do with all the pressure on him but for a WC class player you'd expect better


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Headshot wrote: »
    doesnt matter, im talking about Messi not anyother player, he never brings his club form to the International stage, maybe its to do with all the pressure on him but for a WC class player you'd expect better

    Well he's played out of position for one thing.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,946 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Ush1 wrote: »
    Well he's played out of position for one thing.

    he's played out of position for barca sometimes and does a fabulous job too


    at one stage

    argentina had a line up of

    tevez
    kun
    messi

    now that's his position but yet still doesnt show up


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Headshot wrote: »
    he's played out of position for barca sometimes and does a fabulous job too


    at one stage

    argentina had a line up of

    tevez
    kun
    messi

    now that's his position but yet still doesnt show up

    Fairly vague there to be honest, what game was that?
    I've seen him play well for Argentina many times but doesn't get the quality supply as with Barca. As was stated, Maradona plays 2 holding midfielders and Argentina rarely dominate possession as a result. There is clear reasons why he is more effective with Barca.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,946 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Ush1 wrote: »
    Fairly vague there to be honest, what game was that?
    I've seen him play well for Argentina many times but doesn't get the quality supply as with Barca. As was stated, Maradona plays 2 holding midfielders and Argentina rarely dominate possession as a result. There is clear reasons why he is more effective with Barca.

    im talking about the times before Maradona

    Alfio Basile was the manager


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Headshot wrote: »
    im talking about the times before Maradona

    Alfio Basile was the manager

    He played very well in the Copa under Basile in which they got to the final?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,219 ✭✭✭✭Pro. F


    Headshot wrote: »
    Messi doesnt really cut it at international level compared to Barca, dont get me wrong still a great player but just doesnt bring his barca form with him
    Headshot wrote: »
    doesnt matter, im talking about Messi not anyother player, he never brings his club form to the International stage in recent times, maybe its to do with all the pressure on him but for a WC class player you'd expect better

    It's silly to question Messi's ability or temperament in this situation. Diego is clearly a shìte coach, if they have any success it will be inspite of his influence. All the Argentinian players' form suffers when they play for their country these days and you're on here questioning whether Messi can handle the pressure? Me thinks you have an agenda.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,377 ✭✭✭Warper


    I would like to see Higuain as the main striker with Di Maria and Messi on the wings. I think Di Maria is a star in the making and those 3 up front would be terrifying.

    I would have Mascherano, Veron and Cambiasso in the middle.

    Dont know too much their defense but Heinze is an accident waiting to happen and they should try for someone else there. I still dont know how Guiterrez is getting on the team.


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  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 35,741 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    Lucho Gonzalez could be worth a punt for the midfield/playmaker role.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,919 ✭✭✭✭Xavi6


    Needs more Mad Zab


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 967 ✭✭✭Jigga


    Bukman13 wrote: »
    Maradona has said that the first 3 names on his team sheet are: Messi, Mascherano, and Gutierrez :eek:.
    Please tell me that is not true! On paper they have the most explosive forward line in the World Cup in my opinion. I'd love to see Argentina win the World Cup as with Maradonna manager it would be a good fcuk you to Fifa and Blatter who despise him but if a Championship player is one of the first names on the team sheet than I'm afraid its not gonna happen!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,280 ✭✭✭Bukman13


    Jigga wrote: »
    Please tell me that is not true! On paper they have the most explosive forward line in the World Cup in my opinion. I'd love to see Argentina win the World Cup as with Maradonna manager it would be a good fcuk you to Fifa and Blatter who despise him but if a Championship player is one of the first names on the team sheet than I'm afraid its not gonna happen!

    Yea, from what i've read he rates him very highly. Maradona said he has no problem with the fact he is playing in the championship and that he will defo be in the Squad for the WC.

    First 3 names on the team sheet!!! - Link: http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2009/sep/04/diego-maradona-argentina-world-cup


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 723 ✭✭✭Ian_K


    Can somebody please tell me how Jonas Gutierrez has even been let near players of Messi's class??


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,046 ✭✭✭eZe^



    Romero

    --Zanetti
    Garay
    Samuel
    Heinze-


    Cambiasso
    Mascherano

    Banega

    Messi
    Higuain
    Di Maria


    That team is good enough to win a WC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,571 ✭✭✭✭Frisbee


    eZe^ wrote: »

    Romero

    --Zanetti
    Garay
    Samuel
    Heinze-


    Cambiasso
    Mascherano

    Banega

    Messi
    Higuain
    Di Maria


    That team is good enough to win a WC.


    Is Banega suited to playing that more advanced role of the midfield three?
    Does he not usually play slightly deeper for Valencia?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,563 ✭✭✭kinaldo


    Jonás Gutiérrez is class, and works his socks off. Far too good for the Championship.

    Isn't it remarkable, and a damning indictment of Diego, that Higuaín wasn't picked for Argentina until their penultimate qualifier, and is now their first choice with 4 caps and 2 goals to his name?

    The problem is clearly Maradona himself. Riquelme should be in the team but has said that as long as Diego is in charge, he won't be coming back - "We don't share the same codes of ethics. While he is the coach of the national team, we can't work together."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,046 ✭✭✭eZe^


    Frisbee wrote: »
    Is Banega suited to playing that more advanced role of the midfield three?
    Does he not usually play slightly deeper for Valencia?

    He was primarily bought as a DMF, but this season he has proven that he is a much more all around player, he's quite capable of playing as a creative midfielder imo, he's like........ em............ Deco maybe? Strong, aggressive, complete midfielder.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,571 ✭✭✭✭Frisbee


    When you look at that as well it would have to be considered close to the best front three in the competition.

    Who else could rival them? Spain? France? That's probably about it.

    Unfortunately as long as Diego is in charge I can't see them winning it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,046 ✭✭✭eZe^


    Their front three potentially has ridiculous depth iswell;


    Higuain
    Milito
    Messi
    Di Maria
    Tevez
    Aguero
    Datolo
    Perotti (SO underrated)
    Guitierrez
    Lavezzi
    Zarate
    Lisandro Lopez
    Maxi Rodriguez
    Pablo Aimar

    It's no wonder Maradona used so many bloody players in the qualifiers, there's too many to choose from.



    Also, another thing I just realised about their midfield trio, if you want a more attacking threat you could easily go with;


    Banega
    Mascherano
    Lucho Gonzales


    Argentina have RIDICULOUS strength and depth in attack. Spain are their only rivals who have potentially forwards in;


    Villa
    Torres
    Llorente
    Guiza
    Negredo
    Navas
    Mata
    Silva
    Pedro
    Iniesta
    Pablo Hernandes
    Santi Cazorla
    Diego Capel
    Riera


    This world cup is going to kick soooo much ass!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    eZe^ wrote: »
    Their front three potentially has ridiculous depth iswell;


    Higuain
    Milito
    Messi
    Di Maria
    Tevez
    Aguero
    Datolo
    Perotti (SO underrated)
    Guitierrez
    Lavezzi
    Zarate
    Lisandro Lopez
    Maxi Rodriguez
    Pablo Aimar

    It's no wonder Maradona used so many bloody players in the qualifiers, there's too many to choose from.



    Also, another thing I just realised about their midfield trio, if you want a more attacking threat you could easily go with;


    Banega
    Mascherano
    Lucho Gonzales


    Argentina have RIDICULOUS strength and depth in attack. Spain are their only rivals who have potentially forwards in;


    Villa
    Torres
    Llorente
    Guiza
    Negredo
    Navas
    Mata
    Silva
    Pedro
    Iniesta
    Pablo Hernandes
    Santi Cazorla
    Diego Capel
    Riera


    This world cup is going to kick soooo much ass!

    Good call on Perotti! He's so quick and skillful.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,959 ✭✭✭✭CSF



    Andújar
    Zanetti---Samuel----G.Milito---Insua
    Mascherano
    Maxi
    Di Maria
    Aguero

    Messi
    Higuain

    Very attacking of course, but you get the impression that any Argentina team that wasn't would be wasting a serious amount of match changing talent.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,928 ✭✭✭✭Panthro


    .....and Franco Di Santo


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,482 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    Cesar Delgado hasn't been doing his chances any harm this season either.


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