Whats next, a permit to surf?

YouWantWhat

Hi all,

I'm not sure if you aware or not but Cork County Council are proposing to introduce new bye-laws "http://www.corkcoco.ie/co/pdf/187275461.pdf" which govern the beaches in County Cork, no doubt other counties will follow. Below is an extract from the bye-laws :

"Prohibited Acts: Surf Boards, Kite Boards and Sail Boards
No person shall wind-surf on sail boards or kite-surf on kite boards or surf on a surf board in close proximity to bathers".

I don't know what you think, but this country is going beyond a joke. I think its time we stood up and made our voices heard, rather than being dictated to by what seems to be becoming a dictatorship. Does anybody else feel the way I do, or do you think I should just sit down and shut up and take everything thats thrown at us?

So much for the freedom of the open seas!
:eek::o:mad:

kodute

YouWantWhat wrote: »

Hi all,

I'm not sure if you aware or not but Cork County Council are proposing to introduce new bye-laws "http://www.corkcoco.ie/co/pdf/187275461.pdf" which govern the beaches in County Cork, no doubt other counties will follow. Below is an extract from the bye-laws :

"Prohibited Acts: Surf Boards, Kite Boards and Sail Boards
No person shall wind-surf on sail boards or kite-surf on kite boards or surf on a surf board in close proximity to bathers".


So much for the freedom of the open seas!
:eek::o:mad:

Well that bit makes sense don't ya think? Who wants to ding their board on a swimmer?

GarryJ

YouWantWhat wrote: »

"Prohibited Acts: Surf Boards, Kite Boards and Sail Boards
No person shall wind-surf on sail boards or kite-surf on kite boards or surf on a surf board in close proximity to bathers".

So just take up kayak surfing or waveboarding or ...
Alternatively take your pet great white shark for a swim before heading for a surf instead. Should clear the area of bathers fairly lively.

And besides bathers tend not to like even moderately sized waves, so what exactly is the problem?

spaceHopper

Problem is there is no surf club in Cork the nearest one is Kerry or Waterford
(Limerick one is gone)

loctite

Could see this causing a problem alright.....

There should be areas reserved for bathers though, hopefully the co. Councils would consult with surfers when deciding on what beaches or sections of beach should be "zoned".

I fear the same could happen to a very small local beach. It has been getting more and more popular over the last few summers with bathers and it is a class little break when everywhere else is blown out.

YouWantWhat

Glad to see there's one or two of you that can see some sense rather than making smart ass comments. Lets face it, if there are a bunch of surfers in the water, all you have to do to clear them is jump into the water along side them and start swimming away - guess who will be breaking the law?

c-note

Well i've seen sfa bathers in irish waters,
and when they do go out they ususally only wade in waste high.

this bye law is probably to satisfy some busy-body, who had a board pass within 10ft of them and saw their life flash before their eyes.

even if the law passes i dont see who is going to enforce it.
its just a silly way of ensuring water users have some respect for eachother, which 99.9% of us do already.

anyway if your busted for it just say you were sufing on a windsurf board not a surfboard and the wording will ensure you're off scott free.

cornbb

I don't think it's a big deal. The conditions that make for good surfing, windsurfing and bathing are almost mutually exclusive

spaceHopper

cornbb wrote: »

I don't think it's a big deal. The conditions that make for good surfing, windsurfing and bathing are almost mutually exclusive

In France and Spain they put up flags where between them it's for swimmers...

I've been surfing in Lahich where swimmers have swam out where surfers are sure they'll keep an eye on me...

Also never mind the surfing - Kerry used to be a great spot to camp now because of litter and bade behiveour (some by surfers) you can't no tents camper vans .... Cork is heading the same way.

What we should be looking for is separate zones for swimmers and surfer policed by the beach life guards a lot of whom surf and know what they are doing.

If they want to ban free camping then they should provide Airs and Municipal camp sites

Still think of it, rock up to a beach with a crowded line up - go for a quick dip they all have to get out, get changed - then you get suited and grab your board instant wave feast !

paudie

Lads who the hell is going to enforce it?

Probably only lifeguards, which is July and August, when there is usually zero waves anyway.

They have zones in Lahinch and it works fine.

youngblood

Think its time for the SUPer's to avail of this loophole-ha ha
Def think there should be zones though-Dont think we'll have to worry about Surf Patrol breakin up the party

Mickeroo

most beaches these days have an area for swimmers and an area for water craft (including surfers,kayakers etc) marked out by flags, at least they do in mayo anyway! besides bathers won't be a problem for 9 out of the 12 months of the year anyway.

OldIrishWulf

I disagree with the ban,but last summer I went for a swim in garretstown and nearly got run over by some muppets with kite boards.They were in shallow water crossing the beach at high speed.Flat'ish sea and I didn't feel atall safe.If one of the b'tards (new to this forum dont know the language etiquete)had fallen off and was drowning I might have held him under.I've got the same disregard for jetsking monkeys.

I dont want to offend anyone here on my 2nd or 3rd post,fugg it.

spaceHopper

OldIrishWulf wrote: »

I disagree with the ban,but last summer I went for a swim in garretstown and nearly got run over by some muppets with kite boards.They were in shallow water crossing the beach at high speed.Flat'ish sea and I didn't feel atall safe.If one of the b'tards (new to this forum dont know the language etiquete)had fallen off and was drowning I might have held him under.I've got the same disregard for jetsking monkeys.

I dont want to offend anyone here on my 2nd or 3rd post,fugg it.

We aren't opposing a ban just saying that they should use the same system used on most european beaches.

Would you have a problem with a section of the beach that is flagged off just for swimmers, where that wouldn't be allowed to happen to you again?

tedshredsonfire

+1 on the jetskis of course there are some responsible drivers but mostly are assholes who insist on speeding around the ahrbour or near to it so we can all see how great they are. If you have a bouy on your spot for diving to warn boat users that divers down they often use it to do circles around. Its damm scary when you can hear the bugger above you and are afraid to surface cos you dont know where he will be. even harder if your holding your breath.

loctite

tedshredsonfire wrote: »

+1 on the jetskis of course there are some responsible drivers but mostly are assholes who insist on speeding around the ahrbour or near to it so we can all see how great they are. If you have a bouy on your spot for diving to warn boat users that divers down they often use it to do circles around. Its damm scary when you can hear the bugger above you and are afraid to surface cos you dont know where he will be. even harder if your holding your breath.

+1 on the diving, It became such a problem in one area where we used to teach diving that one of the instructors used to bring a plastic bag with him whilst diving. As soon as the jet skis passed overhead he'd let a little squirt of air into it and 9/10, it'd get sucked into the ski........ Priceless (although very expensive for the ski driver.....)

Sorry for off topic post:)

tedshredsonfire

Class must remember that one if on scuba.

CRenegade

Its crazy that there bringing in these new laws and if it starts in one County Council it can only spread to others.

Last month Failte Ireland launched their new 4 million advertising campaign focusing on holidaying at home and has the slogan 'The Fun Starts Here', apparently they will be using surfing as one of the major activities in the adverts to attract people to holidays here...http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0223/1224265037484.html

If they start bringing in these laws the fun will STOP here!

Im not from the Cork area but whoever is they should lobby the local Councillors... they will be the ones making the new law. At least if they altered it somewhat to not be so restrictive would be better.

_______________________________________________________________

http://www.surfaroundireland.com

quentingargan

The only option to make a submission on these bye-laws was in writing to the Co Council office in Schull. We've set up a site here where you can post comments on these bye-laws. The site will email you a request to confirm the submission, and it will then be printed and delivered to the Co. Council office in Schull before the deadline.

So if you have comments on these bye-laws, please make a submisison, either on the site or in writing by post. Cheers, Q

CRenegade

Cheers Quentingargan, Ive submitted my submission at that link.

Hopefully other County Councils wont follow suit.

I dont think it will be enforceable but if someone was hit by a surfer by accident at one of these locations and the swimmer gets injured, even if it was not the fault of the surfer, they will be in the wrong and would be liable for compensation or expenses to cover injuries, etc.

__________________________________________________________

http://www.surfaroundireland.com

loctite

Surfboards/Sailboards/Kiteboards/Canoes/Kayaks

1. No person shall wind surf on sailboards or kite surf on kiteboards or surf on a surfboard or use a canoe or kayak in close proximity to swimmers.
2. The Council may designate areas of the beach that will be clearly defined and to which the use of surf/kite/sail boards, canoes and kayaks is restricted.
3. No person shall offer tuition in surfing or any other water sport/activity from the beach or in the sea unless done in accordance with the standards issued from time to time by the Irish Water Safety and/or other body recognised to issue such standards by Clare County Council and unless done in accordance with the conditions of a license.

Taken from Clare Co.Council website. Clare beach bye laws commencement 2008. Law is already in existence in other jurisdictions.

I have yet to see a designated area for surfing in Clare though.....

Does this mean if boogers paddle out, all us surfers have to leave the line up??

http://www.clarecoco.ie/Accessible_HTML/waste_water_environment/Beach_Bye_laws/Clare_Beach_Bye_Laws.html

Bakharwaldog

These laws are just to keep swimmers and others safe. As lifeguards have no real authority any surfers or kayakers, regardless of skill, could jus be pricks and surf right on top of where people are swimming. If the lifeguard asked them to move they could just ignore them. The law is just to back up the lifeguards so if necessary,and they pose a real risk to others safety, they can inform the gardai or whovever.


Theres loads of laws for the beaches in mayo, all dogs must be kept under control which is rarely enforced unless the dog is takin the piss and attacking people or just generally pissing them off

quentingargan

c_k_m wrote: »

These laws are just to keep swimmers and others safe. As lifeguards have no real authority any surfers or kayakers, regardless of skill, could jus be pricks and surf right on top of where people are swimming. If the lifeguard asked them to move they could just ignore them. The law is just to back up the lifeguards so if necessary,and they pose a real risk to others safety, they can inform the gardai or whovever.

Theres loads of laws for the beaches in mayo, all dogs must be kept under control which is rarely enforced unless the dog is takin the piss and attacking people or just generally pissing them off

The bye-laws as proposed don't stop people kayaking or surfing - they just demand a license for people teaching kayaking and surfing (who just might also be teaching them to be considerate to bathers, observe a bit of health & safety etc....)

eiresurfer

YouWantWhat wrote: »

Hi all,

I'm not sure if you aware or not but Cork County Council are proposing to introduce new bye-laws "http://www.corkcoco.ie/co/pdf/187275461.pdf" which govern the beaches in County Cork, no doubt other counties will follow. Below is an extract from the bye-laws :

"Prohibited Acts: Surf Boards, Kite Boards and Sail Boards
No person shall wind-surf on sail boards or kite-surf on kite boards or surf on a surf board in close proximity to bathers".

I don't know what you think, but this country is going beyond a joke. I think its time we stood up and made our voices heard, rather than being dictated to by what seems to be becoming a dictatorship. Does anybody else feel the way I do, or do you think I should just sit down and shut up and take everything thats thrown at us?

So much for the freedom of the open seas!
:eek::o:mad:

A little bit of an over-reaction from YouWantWhat. What this law is really about is preventing nasty incidents whereby a beginner (or even an experienced surfer) with a heavy board has a collision with a swimmer. This is very easy to happen in places where you have lots of beginners surfing in places where you have lots of bathers.

In all lifeguard-patrolled beaches in Clare, you now have sections where only swimmers are allowed. This is absolutely the correct thing to do, and is no different from most surfing beaches around the world.

loctite

eiresurfer wrote: »

In all lifeguard-patrolled beaches in Clare, you now have sections where only swimmers are allowed. This is absolutely the correct thing to do, and is no different from most surfing beaches around the world.

How are the areas sectioned off out of curiosity???

eiresurfer

The lifeguards put down two yellow flags in the sand, and a sign that says swimmers only between the flags (or to that effect). If a surfer starts surfing between the flags, a lifeguard will kindly ask you to move outside the bathing area. Fairly standard stuff. And remember, there have been incidents around the world of swimmers being knocked unconscious by surfboards.

loctite

eiresurfer wrote: »

The lifeguards put down two yellow flags in the sand, and a sign that says swimmers only between the flags (or to that effect). If a surfer starts surfing between the flags, a lifeguard will kindly ask you to move outside the bathing area. Fairly standard stuff. And remember, there have been incidents around the world of swimmers being knocked unconscious by surfboards.

I can safely say that this doesn't happen at every beach in Clare.
Although it should. There is one particular beach which has a small but class right peak on it, which gets very busy with bathers during the summer in Clare. and last summer, with a crowded peak of around 15 surfers, there were people and children swimming in front of the peak.

At this particular beach there is ample space on the other side of it for bathers.

I brought it to the attention of the lifeguard on duty and they did nothing.

My fear is an accident will happen, someone will get hurt, there will be a knee jerk reaction from the council and the beach will become closed to surfers which would be a disaster, as 99 time out of a 100 it is the surfers who use this beach more than the bathers......

Panda

cnote2 wrote: »

they ususally only wade in waste high.

Dude, that **** is nasty, go find yourself a clean beach.

This kind of crap does piss me off though.
Just another law to illustrate the death of common sense.

eiresurfer

loctite wrote: »

I can safely say that this doesn't happen at every beach in Clare.
Although it should. There is one particular beach which has a small but class right peak on it, which gets very busy with bathers during the summer in Clare. and last summer, with a crowded peak of around 15 surfers, there were people and children swimming in front of the peak.

At this particular beach there is ample space on the other side of it for bathers.

I brought it to the attention of the lifeguard on duty and they did nothing.

My fear is an accident will happen, someone will get hurt, there will be a knee jerk reaction from the council and the beach will become closed to surfers which would be a disaster, as 99 time out of a 100 it is the surfers who use this beach more than the bathers......

Fair enough I stand corrected. However, I do know they do this at both Spanish Point and Lahinch beaches.

As for that beach you mentioned (I think I know the one you refer to), the lifeguards should have moved the people over to a safe section.

Just another law to illustrate the death of common sense.

I disagree - common sense is about preventing a 6-year-old kid getting whacked by a kook on a bic, which is what this law is about.

Panda

eiresurfer wrote: »

I disagree - common sense is about preventing a 6-year-old kid getting whacked by a kook on a bic, which is what this law is about.

To me common sense would mean surfing a reasonable distance away from any swimmers.

Marcaiocht_Tonn

I disagree - common sense is about preventing a 6-year-old kid getting whacked by a kook on a bic, which is what this law is about.

Can I just ask, what is this constant p1ss-taking of Bics? Sure it's not a performance board, but its a godsend for people learning the sport, and a perfectly capable board for competent surfers too. This is not a personal stab at the person quoted above, more an attitude that I sense right across the forum. Someone else used the words "Man up you pussy, your bic will keep you afloat" in a seperate thread. You'd swear some surfers were born as experts and didn't need to go through the beginner transition. I grow weary of this attitude.

conno16

in my experience ur transitionary period from complete novice to intermediate is extended by the use of BICs
no one should buy one
fair enough to rent one out for the first 3 / 4 runs but after that you are wasting your time with the chunks of plastic
your technique will improve drastically once you ditch it and move over to a decent board, one that can actually be guided with a wave as opposed to one that simply catches a ripp

Marcaiocht_Tonn

There's no doubt that a better board, e.g. fibreglass, is more responsive, better built and will allow someone to progress more quickly. However, I have no problem guiding a Bic on a wave (and I am by no means a skilled surfer), and it's a very handy board for learners due to its durability and cheap cost. I had a beautiful custom fiberglass board out in Hawaii, but had to sell it. I recently moved back to Ireland and needed to find a cheap board to keep me going, as I was out of pocket. Picked up a 7'10" Bic Minimal plus bag for 150 euro. I disagree with the statement "never buy a Bic", for many people it'll be the reasonable purchase given budgets etc (especially in these times!).

Also, still not an excuse to take the p1ss out of people man. I do several other watersports besides surfing, it is still the only one that consistently throws up this weirdly snobby attitude towards beginners. Again, not poking at anyone in particular here, but this attitude is most definitely out there. I wonder where it comes from...

loctite

Panda wrote: »

To me common sense would mean surfing a reasonable distance away from any swimmers.

or swimming a reasonable distance away from surfers......:D

kodute

Marcaiocht_Tonn wrote: »

I do several other watersports besides surfing...

Ugh a kayaker too I suppose! :pac:

Marcaiocht_Tonn

Even worse - a windsurfer!

tedshredsonfire

marcaiocht i know of one surfer who is skilled and deliberately surfs a bic so as to take the piss out of the piss takers so to speak. Bics are like the skodas of many decades ago. I still have one learnt ish on it but learnt a lot more when I got the loan of a longboard. My daughter uses it now in the summer. The reason imho its taken the piss out of so much is it symbolises the east coast weekend warrior who comes west and drops in on all the other surfers, doesn't give a **** about the litter he leaves etc. Thats a bad sterotype but unfortunatly true in a small number of cases.
As for cecil mor pass no heed of him. I have seen him surf a few times and all he has is an ex rental foamie so he has no business taking the piss outa bics.

spaceHopper

Marcaiocht_Tonn wrote: »

Also, still not an excuse to take the p1ss out of people man. I do several other watersports besides surfing, it is still the only one that consistently throws up this weirdly snobby attitude towards beginners....

That's because of two things

1 some people don't know the difference between a kook and a beginner - a beginner is learning to surf, a kook thinks they've learned it all but haven't.

2 What I call "spoon feeders" people who can't be arsed to learn for them selves and instead ask the same questions that have been asked before and expect that they should be spoon feed.

I've no problem with somebody saying I've tried to read the charts and am alway getting it wrong what should I be doing - instead you see people asking will it be good in xyz this weekend I don't know how to read charts...

These are my pet hate as they make all beginners look bad and typically come from Dublin so make all Dublin surfers look bad.

PS for the answer to most of your forecasting questions google LUD's FAQ

Marcaiocht_Tonn

SpaceHopper: PS for the answer to most of your forecasting questions google LUD's FAQ

Apologies, I may have picked this up wrong, but if this is aimed at me - I haven't at any point asked about forecasting...??

@tedshredsonfire, spacehopper: I understand what you're saying about "weekend warriors" dropping in, spoonfeeders etc - you won't hear me arguing in favour of people who ignore the etiquette. But there are always going to be beginners who make mistakes, and more tolerance is needed.

Anyway I appear to have inadvertently hijacked this thread with my ranting about attitudes etc, my bad!

tedshredsonfire

Marcaiocht its a valid point but spacehopper is correct, i think most established surfers are tolerant and helpful to beginners and do differentiate between a beginner and a kook. Kook to me is just slang for asshole and they are in every sport/community etc.

Overature

dude the number 1 rule in surfing is that it is your responsability to get out of the way of people on surf boards

Marcaiocht_Tonn

Fair enough lads, I see what you're saying about the difference between a beginner and a kook. I'm sure the latter does p1ss people off understandably...