Discuss Surfing forum policy changes here

cornbb

Right, here goes nothing...

First, a little history lesson. A number of years ago, someone here posted a link to an infamous Google map which pinpointed many breaks around Ireland. In a related incident, another member mentioned in passing a little-known spot in Kerry. Some people were unhappy with the naming of spots, pointing out that it went against the convention followed by most online surfing websites. In both cases, a lot of tempers were lost, threats of violence were made against the aforementioned member and a former moderator of the forum, the admins of the site stepped in and it was decided that people could name spots if they wanted.

As the dust has long settled, some members have said they feel that it's time to revisit this policy, i.e. to remove the link to the map and to prohibit the naming of lesser-known breaks. One of the arguments for this is that it would bring the policies of the forum into line with the rules of other websites, and maybe in the long term to attract more members to the site. I am of the belief that the users of a forum should have the steer the direction it goes in. So this thread is here to facilitate that debate.

A few things:
- The admins of the site (not the mods of this forum) will have the final say on whether things change. If you want to convince them that things should be done one way or the other, you will only be able to do so by making your point in a civilised and rational way. Good manners will go a long way.
- I'm attaching a poll to this. The poll is only there to give a rough idea of what people want - the contents of the thread will be what matters. It is a public poll - if you are registering just with the intention of voting in the poll don't bother because your vote will be removed and your account will probably be banned.
- If you register an account here just to chip in your 2c, that probably won't go down very well.
- Anyone losing their temper will be banned from the forum. Anyone threatening or implying violence will be reported to the admins, who may take further action.

(I don't want to seem heavy handed, but anyone who remembers the last "debate" we had on this will understand why I have zero patience for any insanity this time round).

So, here we go. To anyone who is new to surfing, or who wasn't around when this first kicked off, I would recommend listening to the points made by the more experienced guys around here before making your mind up.

donga_perkins

No, leave things the way they are now.

Why is this being re-hashed? Has someone seen the error of their ways?
Are boardsies afraid that they have zero credibility in the surf community, and are now starting to wonder why the big boys aren't coming in here to play?

I voted for the maps to be taken down and for the surfing forum to adopt the policies of every other surfing forum I know of, in Ireland and abroad.

But honestly, why is this being dug up again? Why not let sleeping dogs lie? This forum will never have any sort of credibility amongst serious surfers, nothings going to change that now.

kippy

Okay,
I am by no means an experienced Surfer however I am fully aware of the history of this issue.
I honestly don't mind either way however if the policy of this board is changed to reflect other surfing sites out there I would be slightly dissappointed.
Mainly for these reasons:
This board has enough surfers to help the n00bs (like myself) get started with plenty helpful posters and moderators.
Why try attract more surfers to the forum? If the only reason they arent here is the map, let them be I say. How much more helpful can they be than those already here?
The map itself isnt that good and most of the spots on it are well known. At the end of the day, the surfer has to decide whether he wants to stick to the well known and generally safer spots or spend time sounding out other spots. Its up to themselves.
If the rule were put in place not to name spots, it would be pretty difficult to have a rational conversation about surfing. There are a good few people on this board who appear to respect this unwritten rule anyway.....
I dont believe boards should bend to the wants of a very small minority (based on what I have read and seen, there werent that many old school surfers posting here anyway before the issues, just a few people actually had problems with the rules.)
The spirit of boards is very much different from many other sites out there. As well as being a discussion forum, its also a place where many people come for help on various different issues, surfing being one. I would HATE for some other forum, such as computers and tech to introduce a similiar rule - ie ban the posting of troubleshooting tips in case it does some guy out of work.

Anyway, thems my thoughts, I dont mind either way, I know enough spots that I am happy with at this stage and know enough friends who surf regularily who have no issues in divulging any lesser known spots if needs be.

Someday I may be a serious surfer, I hope to be......and this board will have more credibility than many.
Kippy

cornbb

donga_perkins wrote: »

Why is this being re-hashed? Has someone seen the error of their ways?
Are boardsies afraid that they have zero credibility in the surf community, and are now starting to wonder why the big boys aren't coming in here to play?

I voted for the maps to be taken down and for the surfing forum to adopt the policies of every other surfing forum I know of, in Ireland and abroad.

But honestly, why is this being dug up again? Why not let sleeping dogs lie? This forum will never have any sort of credibility amongst serious surfers, nothings going to change that now.

If you want to see things changed, then tell us why. If you really don't care, and if you don't think this forum will ever be any good, then don't bother posting again. I'm only interesting in seeing constructive posts in this thread.

cornbb

kippy, thanks for sharing your thoughts.

If the rule were put in place not to name spots, it would be pretty difficult to have a rational conversation about surfing. There are a good few people on this board who appear to respect this unwritten rule anyway

The one thing I would say is that 99% of the locations discussed here are already well known, and that if a rule change is made, the naming of well-known spots (e.g. spots mentioned in MagicSeaweed or the Stormrider guides) would not be banned. So not much would actually change in that regard.

OldGuysRule

No, leave things the way they are now.

What has been said above is generally reasonable, however one of the difficulties I do see is that many of us who contributed to the original discussions were banned for merely being 'surfer scum' by the admin. Just because of the side of the argument we found ourselves on.

These bans should be lifted by the admins now

There is a very knowledgeable online surfer community and as the traffic on other forums shows, are very willing to help and discuss surfing issues, especially technical. It is unfortunate that this forum lost that goodwill and I reckon it will take some time for it to come back.

This current debate can only help that. This forum, if it is to be of any real help to learners, improvers, intermediates or whatever, needs to follow where others have been successful.

The key issue here is the not just the controversial map (which was developed, stickied and updated by certain people for all the wrong reasons) but the concept of highlighting sensitive surf spots. As previously discussed, these are sensitive for several reasons, issues with access / landowners, spots that are dangerous, spots that cannot handle a crowd at the peak, environmentally sensitive spots etc. A rule of thumb that is generally accepted is the Stormriders guide; if it is in that, it can be discussed.

A forum can be a community, but all communities need their rules and customs. In this case, the admin need to listen to the mods who are now listening and engaging with those who know what they are talking about.

I do not mean to come across as preachy or as though I speak for all of those previously banned, but there were TWO nasty sides to what happened previously and it is too much to expect everyone to forgive and forget.

kippy

cornbb wrote: »

kippy, thanks for sharing your thoughts.



The one thing I would say is that 99% of the locations discussed here are already well known, and that if a rule change is made, the naming of well-known spots (e.g. spots mentioned in MagicSeaweed or the Stormrider guides) would not be banned. So not much would actually change in that regard.

Thats fair enough. In that case a rule change wouldn't actually change that much then.....
But again. Why pander to the needs of a few?

I voted no by the way, even if it doesnt make that much difference to me, I would prefer to see things remain as they are.

spaceHopper

No, leave things the way they are now.

kippy wrote: »

Okay,
If the rule were put in place not to name spots, it would be pretty difficult to have a rational conversation about surfing. There are a good few people on this board who appear to respect this unwritten rule anyway.....
Kippy

There is nothing to stop you saying for example “I’ll be on North Donegal at a wedding and don’t know any breaks – any help please PM me?” that’s the accepted way of doing it.


And it's only the lesser know spots.

kodute

No, leave things the way they are now.

OldGuysRule wrote: »

it is too much to expect everyone to forgive and forget.

Thats exactly what should happen. Nobody is saying invite everyone back for a love-in with their favourite admin, just forget what happened and move on. This is about policy changes for the benefit of this forum for the future.

kippy wrote: »

Thats fair enough. In that case a rule change wouldn't actually change that much then.....
But again. Why pander to the needs of a few?
I voted no by the way, even if it doesnt make that much difference to me, I would prefer to see things remain as they are.

They are not a few, they are the majority of surfers. They don't post here because of this reason. If you don't understand how this can irritate other surfers then ask them, read other forums, find out why nobody names these (very few) sensitive spots. Then try to understand why its a bad idea to keep them up.

OldGuysRule

No, leave things the way they are now.

It is better to refer to sensitive spots rather than secret. Secret sounds selfish and is giving the wrong impression to those who do not know what they are talking about. Sensitive is more appropriate, see my previous posting above.

fade2che

I can see the merits of both sides and would almost vote yes to enlarge the community and make this forum better however, fundamentally free speech regarding the locations of Irelands natural resources is not something that should be band, irrespective of what other forums do or don't do.
Free access to the location of breaks is something I regard as a positive trait of boards.ie and that is why I voted no.

Can anybody really say that boards policy has resulted in ruining your local break?
IMHO the community standards of other forums don't necessarily need to apply here. We have a unique surfing landscape (in that the harsh weather culls the numbers naturally, unlike other warmer climates) surely we can have a unique set of online community rules.

kippy

kodute wrote: »

Thats exactly what should happen. Nobody is saying invite everyone back for a love-in with their favourite admin, just forget what happened and move on. This is about policy changes for the benefit of this forum for the future.



They are not a few, they are the majority of surfers. They don't post here because of this reason. If you don't understand how this can irritate other surfers then ask them, read other forums, find out why nobody names these (very few) sensitive spots. Then try to understand why its a bad idea to keep them up.

I completely understand why a some surfers dont like naming spots publicilly. I've lived by the sea almost all my life.
To be honest, I am not sure how using PM's would make this okay either......surely word is going to get out either way either via PM's and word of mouth or on a public forum.
The majority of surfers I know, and I know a few of varying levels dont post on any forum, those that do dont seem to mind either way.

Anyway, sorry, this isnt relevent for the discussion.
Kippy

frag420

Firstly I agree that referring to these spots as secret spots sounds somewhat selfish and childish. Sensitive is a much better way of referring to these spots. I believe these spots are kept under wraps for good reasons such as environmental impact, trespass etc. I dont believe that they should be broadcast to the greater surfing community. I do however believe the maps should remain as a reference but left as they are with no more additions to them.

From experience when I have been to lesser known spots or sensitive spots I have noticed that they are beyond my surfing experience and thus are only used by the few that know how to surf these waves and so I have refrained from surfing there. Having loads of people ascending on these spots can sometimes lead to injury, aggression amongst surfers as some surfers do not have the experience to surf at these spots ( like me ) . As i have mentioned in one of my previous threads RE surfing I believe people should know their limits when it comes to surfing in Ireland and surf accordingly.

I have taken the time to read the original thread from 2008. I think that as a forum/community there is room for everyone and I think that all should be forgiven.

Anyways thats my two cents. I have three cents left. Il keep that for another thread,

frAg

kodute

No, leave things the way they are now.

frag420 wrote: »

Firstly I agree that referring to these spots as secret spots sounds somewhat selfish and childish. Sensitive is a much better way of referring to these spots. I believe these spots are kept under wraps for good reasons such as environmental impact, trespass etc. I dont believe that they should be broadcast to the greater surfing community. I do however believe the maps should remain as a reference but left as they are with no more additions to them.

From experience when I have been to lesser known spots or sensitive spots I have noticed that they are beyond my surfing experience and thus are only used by the few that know how to surf these waves and so I have refrained from surfing there. Having loads of people ascending on these spots can sometimes lead to injury, aggression amongst surfers as some surfers do not have the experience to surf at these spots ( like me ) . As i have mentioned in one of my previous threads RE surfing I believe people should know their limits when it comes to surfing in Ireland and surf accordingly.

I have taken the time to read the original thread from 2008. I think that as a forum/community there is room for everyone and I think that all should be forgiven.

Anyways thats my two cents. I have three cents left. Il keep that for another thread,

frAg

I think your being naive if you think that everything will be forgiven and forgotten and we can still keep the maps up. We can put the past behind us and move on if the maps are taken down. They are the constant reminder to some people of what happened.

The maps will remain on google. Nothing will change there. In fact if you seach "map surfing ireland" its on the first page.
Tin foil hats be assuaged: Freedom of information is not at risk. Just a policy change in line with every other forum.

rodento

No, leave things the way they are now.

I hate to say it but Old Guy Rules is right

loctite

No, leave things the way they are now.

Voted Yes.

I think it should be removed.
I don't believe that spots should be kept secret, but just because you know where some wave is, doesn't mean you should surf it. All to many times been out on waves where beginners would do better to go somewhere else. They'll injure themselves and/or other surfers.......

youngblood

If the majority of old surfing contributors have left to go on to other forums is there really any point in trying to change forum policy to attract them back?


Surely there are enough newer members to give info and advice?!?

If they deem Boards.ie not worthy enough of a forum to contribute on, then their mind is pretty much made up.

Surely Boards should be focussed on attracting those who wish to give advice and guidance?

(The idea of secret spots does seem a little elitist-secrets are there to keep people in the know and keep others out, which doesnt do much for improving the positive attitude to/of surfers)

Just my 2 cents

PeakOutput

No, leave things the way they are now.

i was absolutely in favour of putting up the map when the first debate was around and i had no idea about surfing i was all about the freedom of speech and you cant have these grumpy old surfers keeping the kids away from the sea

in reality thats not what it is about at all and to think it has anything to do with free speech is simply a misunderstanding of the issue


the problem with the result of keeping the map up is that the old experience pyramid on boards is very bottom heavy as far as i can see. and this is because experienced surfers understand why this unwritten rule is there and agree with it. do you not think it is wise to listen to the experienced peoples opinions? an opinion that is after all a majority opinion among surfers?

because of this bottom heavy pyramid once surfers get some experience under their belt they find they have to go to other forums to learn more adn get more experienced advice somewhere else.this is not good for the users of boards or the owners of boards as their goal is to keep as many people here for as long as they can

the reasons for the rule are varied but there are two main ones overcrowding and safety

breaks get overcrowded quickly when they are working and this ruins it for everyone and breeds localism which is nasty and unwelcome. crowds of experienced surfers find ways to get on and treat eachother with respect(generally) when it comes to dropping in on eachother etc but when you throw a bunch of novices into these crowds who dont know any better or should know better but dont care tempers flare quickly

the safety one is obvious and i dont think needs further explaining

the one other sport i know of were naming / 'burning' spots will get you almost immedietely ostricised from the community(way way faster than you will in surfing) is base jumping. i am lucky enough to have some very experienced jumpers as friends who will bring me with them but whenever they are bringing me somewhere i havnt been before they make it clear that while i can come i dont have 'bring other people there' rights because i have no idea what im doing basically.

this isnt because they dont want anyone else to have fun its because they dont want anyone dieing while doing something stupid at their spot and the inevitable attention this will bring upon them and probably cause the spot to get shut down.

this is the same as surfing the experienced surfers dont want to ruin anyone funs just the same as they dont want you to ruin their fun. its a pretty close community when you properly get into it i have found(i have somewhat been unnaturally thrown in the middle being completely unable to surf but hang out with alot of them due to college) and there are very few barriers in place. as you get better and better and more and more into it you will quickly find yourself getting more and more texts and emails asking you do you want to come here and there and another place you never knew existed because they know you have the ability and they know you love it and your not going to do some stupid noob move that puts yourself or them or the spot at risk

dmg10

No, leave things the way they are now.

As one of the ones who was originally banned (although quickly reinstated by protest of innocence!) I have to admit, I quit posting on this forum due to the bad attitude and complete disregard by the mods for the generally accepted surfing 'ethos'. As someone who obviously (like us all) came from being a beginner (and yes, when I started out I couldn't understand this whole sensitive spot phenomona), I was gradually introduced to different slightly more demanding breaks by my more experienced surf buddies as I improved. I was encouraged out there by my friends, warned of the potential rips, rocks etc etc, and as much as possible now will always try new quieter spots with people who I know have good experience of those places already.

For me, finding those quieter breaks (my friends laugh at me with all the OS maps in my car but if they look closely they'll notice they're all of coastlines...) is a bonus to my enjoyment of surfing. I've come through the stages of surfing the more crowded breaks to going and discovering those less known breaks, learning the do's and don't of them (and from time to time scaring myself silly) and sharing the waves with only a few out. It's bliss. And everyone should have to go through it :-) It's part of the development of your surfing and how it becomes part of your life, not just a weekend thing. I've seen people paddling out to breaks they've no business being out on just because they were told it's good and has 'great waves'. But where are those advisers when that surfer gets into trouble cause they're in over their head.

So yes, I agree spots shouldn't be spoonfed, there's enough info in the books for the major breaks and sensitive spots are there to be found, you just have to do a bit of searching yourself for them. Some forums do go overboard in terms of monitoring the whole spot naming and some people definitely overreact a lot but there is a good balance that can be achieved.

xxyyzz

No, leave things the way they are now.

youngblood wrote: »

If the majority of old surfing contributors have left to go on to other forums is there really any point in trying to change forum policy to attract them back?


Surely there are enough newer members to give info and advice?!?

If they deem Boards.ie not worthy enough of a forum to contribute on, then their mind is pretty much made up.

Surely Boards should be focussed on attracting those who wish to give advice and guidance?

(The idea of secret spots does seem a little elitist-secrets are there to keep people in the know and keep others out, which doesnt do much for improving the positive attitude to/of surfers)

Just my 2 cents

What people don't seem to realise is that this issue is bigger than boards' surfing community such as it is. The no naming convention is accepted by surfers the world over and what's pissing off the surfing community is that boards has taken it upon itself to tell surfers what best for them. To add insult to injury the map was put together by 2 boards members who never surfed in their lives.

There are plenty of new members here who are more than willing to give advice but you will find that the vast majority are relatively new to surfing. More experienced surfers will not offer advice because they fundamentally disagree with the spot naming policy on this forum. Forums such as longboardireland and irishsurfer have members who have been surfing for years and are more than willing to give advice but they will never name sensitive spots online.

Have a read of this to see what happens when sensitive spots can't handle a crowd. It may sound extreme but I know formerly quiet spots in my area that are turning into this.

gumbynation

No, leave things the way they are now.

voted yes to remove link to map as its in the best interests of the wider surfing community.
kudos to the mods for opening back up to the debate.

NickDrake

No, leave things the way they are now.

Here is my opinion. They should never have gone up and should be removed.

Basically it was a typical Boards thing. There are some amount of idiots on here that haven't a clue and try to force there crap ideas on others. and generally I have found the mods back them up. Must be a fellow tech nerd stuff.

What happened here is a example of mods backing fools and those of us who complained, were ignored.

Some new surfers with their bics came on here and thought they new about surfing. Ye were idiots and that new mod that was appointed came up with some crap nerdy boards reason for putting up the maps. Some crap about everyone having a say or some rubbish. Listen you were wrong and you should no longer be a mod.

Its amazing what the term mod can do for a fella. Turns him into a power hungry fella via the internet. But here it went another step. It really messed stuff up.

Right thats my rant over.

c - 13

NickDrake wrote: »

Here is my opinion. They should never have gone up and should be removed.

Basically it was a typical Boards thing. There are some amount of idiots on here that haven't a clue and try to force there crap ideas on others. and generally I have found the mods back them up. Must be a fellow tech nerd stuff.

What happened here is a example of mods backing fools and those of us who complained, were ignored.

Some new surfers with their bics came on here and thought they new about surfing. Ye were idiots and that new mod that was appointed came up with some crap nerdy boards reason for putting up the maps. Some crap about everyone having a say or some rubbish. Listen you were wrong and you should no longer be a mod.

Its amazing what the term mod can do for a fella. Turns him into a power hungry fella via the internet. But here it went another step. It really messed stuff up.

Right thats my rant over.

If you have an issue with the boards moderation take it to feedback or the help desk. This thread is about the maps.

spaceHopper

No, leave things the way they are now.

NickDrake wrote: »

Here is my opinion. They should never have gone up and should be removed.

Right thats my rant over.

If this desends into a slagging match then you'll be handing them a good reason why all surfers are stuck up d***s - yes a lot of the posters here are clueless beginners - sorry but it's true but we all had to start somewhere

C-13 I would never take anything to do with surfing to the feed back last time they didn't give it a fair hearing and were wrong. People who knew nothing about surfing imposed their own agenda

TheBigLebowski

Where is this "wider surf community" that people are talking about? The only other forum I know is irishsurfer.com and that's practically dead...

c - 13

spaceHopper wrote: »

C-13 I would never take anything to do with surfing to the feed back last time they didn't give it a fair hearing and were wrong. People who knew nothing about surfing imposed their own agenda

Moderation of a forum issues will always be looked at by an admin, if its posted on the helpdesk then only admin should be able to reply to you so there can be no outside interference.

If theres an is issue its in the users best interest to raise them, despite popular belief the forums are here for the users, the moderators are just volunteers who help out with the day to day operation.

Tristram

I'm happy with this forum as it it. If I need more I can go elsewhere. I think the admins came down on the right side of this a long time back.

paudie

No, leave things the way they are now.

The link should definitely be removed, there's a good few posts already giving reasons why. xxyyzz, dmg, PeakOutput, Old Goat plus others

I'm definitely not someone how follows traditions just because they are traditions, but the not naming spots tradition has good logic behind them, mainly safety for everyone.

Some people seem to think it's selfish surfers keeping stuff to themselves but that's not what it 's about. I know it may seem a bit snobbish about being shown the waves when you are ready, but this works. More experienced surfers can point out to the new surfer any important information like access issues or safety issues in the water.

I didn't take part in the original "discussion" but read the threads and it did seem like the map was kept in place just to spite the surfers who opposed to it being there. Yes I know there was threats made as well.

I'd definitely support the Stormriders/Magicseaweed tradition, i.e. only publicly talking about spots that are listed there. But it would need the mods help to quickly edit posts where sensitive spots have been named.

Just a quick reply to the person who said PMing is the same as naming publicly. I don't agree with this, if I were to pm you with a sensitive spot I'd be sure to tell you all the info you needed to know and trust you that if you were bringing someone else you'd provide them with the same info. Sure all spots gradually enter the wider community's knowledge but by that time the idea is, hopefully, that any info, i.e. access or safety issues, is public knowledge as well.

xxyyzz

No, leave things the way they are now.

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

Where is this "wider surf community" that people are talking about? The only other forum I know is irishsurfer.com and that's practically dead...

Longboardireland

tedshredsonfire

No, leave things the way they are now.

voted yes to remove the map for the same reasons listed above. I think sensitive spots is a better term.
access can be a big issue. farmer john passes no heed to a couple of guys at the weekend passing through his field minding what they do. add 20 plus surfers breaking fences etc and then he tells all to piss off threatening tresspass etc.

On the other sports situation I am involved in freediving and spearfishing and on the forum a well known poster give out a spot for bass and scallops. The unwritten rule ( and there are written legal rules too) is take what you will eat for the dinner basicly. The guy who requested the info took a whole lot more and now naming of spots for fishing/hunting is only by pm and only when you know the person or someone vouches for them not being a complete tool.

Other spots just cant handle the parking of 5-10 cars and vans and pisses off not the local surfers but the locals that live there if it makes their drive home a hassle.

Kudos for having the debate at least.

fade2che

NickDrake wrote: »

Here is my opinion. They should never have gone up and should be removed.

Basically it was a typical Boards thing. There are some amount of idiots on here that haven't a clue and try to force there crap ideas on others. and generally I have found the mods back them up. Must be a fellow tech nerd stuff.

What happened here is a example of mods backing fools and those of us who complained, were ignored.

Some new surfers with their bics came on here and thought they new about surfing. Ye were idiots and that new mod that was appointed came up with some crap nerdy boards reason for putting up the maps. Some crap about everyone having a say or some rubbish. Listen you were wrong and you should no longer be a mod.

Its amazing what the term mod can do for a fella. Turns him into a power hungry fella via the internet. But here it went another step. It really messed stuff up.

Right thats my rant over.

At least you admit your ranting I suppose. Can you also see your post is slightly abusive? Saying there are some amount of idiots on boards with crap ideas that they try to force on others? Mods are tech nerds because of decisions they make? New surfers with bics?
Seriously, is there anyone else you would like to take a dig at?
Your attitude gives surfing a bad name, this pretentious stance against newcomers, which reeks of snobbery does nothing for you or surfing culture.
Its also a cheap shot at mods given the topic and history of the boards.ie surfer community.

xxyyzz

No, leave things the way they are now.

Can ye just keep this on topic lads please? Progress is finally being made. We know there were idiots on both sides of the original debacle but this is not what's being debated here.

tedshredsonfire

No, leave things the way they are now.

some very talented surfers use bics and a lot of the time its just to piss off other surfers who expect them to be ****e.

NickDrake

No, leave things the way they are now.

paudie wrote: »

I didn't take part in the original "discussion" but read the threads and it did seem like the map was kept in place just to spite the surfers who opposed to it being there. Yes I know there was threats made as well.

Ya exactly. The mods are the problem here not the surfers. People did go to the help desk and surprise surpise nothing happened. SO don't fob me off with that.

YOu raised the issue again and therefore you are leaving yourself open to the consequences. (i.e the crit on here) Take it down and then do the honourable thing and resign as Mod to the Surfers Forum.

I am sure I will have support for that.

NickDrake

No, leave things the way they are now.

fade2che wrote: »

At least you admit your ranting I suppose. Can you also see your post is slightly abusive? Saying there are some amount of idiots on boards with crap ideas that they try to force on others? Mods are tech nerds because of decisions they make? New surfers with bics?
Seriously, is there anyone else you would like to take a dig at?
Your attitude gives surfing a bad name, this pretentious stance against newcomers, which reeks of snobbery does nothing for you or surfing culture.
Its also a cheap shot at mods given the topic and history of the boards.ie surfer community.

I have nothing against newcomers in general, it is against newcomers that used this forum to make that map available. Its not snobbery, its just being sensible.

I have nothing against people using bics but its the guys on here who wanted the map up that gave bics a bad name.

c - 13

NickDrake wrote: »

Ya exactly. The mods are the problem here not the surfers. People did go to the help desk and surprise surpise nothing happened. SO don't fob me off with that.

YOu raised the issue again and therefore you are leaving yourself open to the consequences. (i.e the crit on here) Take it down and then do the honourable thing and resign as Mod to the Surfers Forum.

I am sure I will have support for that.

What the hell are you on about, both myself and cornbb both surf but thats neither here nor there, you are dragging the whole thread off topic, one more time and you will be banned until the issue is resolved.

NickDrake

No, leave things the way they are now.

Ok I will no longer post on this issue but can I just ask one question to clear things up please?

What mod was responsible for putting up the maps??

c - 13

NickDrake wrote: »

What mod was responsible for putting up the maps??

I'm not sure who created and posted the actual maps originally but the decision to keep them on boards was made by the Admins on the back of the whole blow up in the forum at the time.

Chiarrai

No, leave things the way they are now.

<name removed>

That person did NOT create the map or post it here

NickDrake

No, leave things the way they are now.

c - 13 wrote: »

I'm not sure who created and posted the actual maps originally but the decision to keep them on boards was made by the Admins on the back of the whole blow up in the forum at the time.

Thanks. (my last post on the issue)

xxyyzz

No, leave things the way they are now.

Calm lads, calm Let's stay on topic here. We are discussing the merits of taking down the map. The forum mods are being quite reasonable about this.

jkl

No, leave things the way they are now.

Perhaps a less specific map.

The current map shows many breaks, beginners like the map, it helps give us an idea of where to go. The more advanced breaks on it aren't that clearly marked. And like all beginners i looked at it and got ideas above my station. Kind of like an access all areas pass.

I'd like to see a beginner friendly map, with the main Irish breaks clearly shown on it, the idea of every break for all levels seems too much to me.

The map as it is does not seem like a sensible idea to me and i'd support removing it.

tedshredsonfire

No, leave things the way they are now.

I think most beginners know where to go or are told in the surf shop or whereever theya are renting gear and are told strandhill, lahinch etc. The issue imho is with intermediates who are bored with the same places and want to try somewhere else.

jkl

No, leave things the way they are now.

Surely an intermediate should be able to read whats going on in the water, and take personal responsibility for their own actions?

That said i still think the map should be removed.

spaceHopper

No, leave things the way they are now.

jkl wrote: »

Perhaps a less specific map.

The current map shows many breaks, beginners like the map, it helps give us an idea of where to go. The more advanced breaks on it aren't that clearly marked. And like all beginners i looked at it and got ideas above my station. Kind of like an access all areas pass.

I'd like to see a beginner friendly map, with the main Irish breaks clearly shown on it, the idea of every break for all levels seems too much to me.

The map as it is does not seem like a sensible idea to me and i'd support removing it.

If you are looking for information on breaks then there's load else where on line magicseaweed, wannasurf beachwizard - this started out of what there is no community spirit here - the reason is because of what happened over one guy who is no longer around who posted a map to alleged secret spots -it was bait which we swallowed hook line and sinker - as things are the current map is very poor quality but what it stands for goes against what most experience surfers believe and we'd like to see it taken down.

As for the current mods here maybe I'm wrong but I don't see C-13 around much so to say anything - I've no axe to grind
CornBB has so far taken a light touch and has kept thing on tipic, yes he was part of the pro maps thing before but seams willing to listen as does C-13 so regardless of the outcome of this debate I can' see why either of them should resign.

I personally want to see the map taken down - going on the attack won't help - if you are on one side or the other fine but play the ball and not the man ( or lady)

xxyyzz

No, leave things the way they are now.

spaceHopper wrote: »

as things are the current map is very poor quality

There are spots on the map that definitely should not be there. The locations are correct but the descriptions are bull****.

Most surfers would agree that this is an acceptable list of spots.

OldGuysRule

No, leave things the way they are now.

When is the decision being made? Since the poll has been up, the majority have voted to take the map down. There have been over 800 views, over 45 replies, 30 votes.

fade2che

The thread is only open a day so it might be a good idea to leave it open at least a week in order to let members who log in less frequently a chance to contribute?

TheBigLebowski

Personally, I don't agree with censorship of this kind and don't think it should be tolerated here so I voted to leave as is.

Also, a good few of those voting for change are brand new members who only joined boards when this discussion started back up. There is a possibility the vote could be swayed by multiple accounts.

I wouldn't be in any hurry to change as a lot of the surfers here might be in hibernation until the weather improves and might not visit the board regularly this time of year.

kodute

No, leave things the way they are now.

TheBigLebowski wrote: »

Personally, I don't agree with censorship of this kind and don't think it should be tolerated here so I voted to leave as is.

Also, a good few of those voting for change are brand new members who only joined boards when this discussion started back up. There is a possibility the vote could be swayed by multiple accounts.

I wouldn't be in any hurry to change as a lot of the surfers here might be in hibernation until the weather improves and might not visit the board regularly this time of year.

Its up to the mods to close this and take it further whenever they deem appropriate.

As for the new accounts, read the first post again. The votes do not count as much as the content of the thread. So new regs and admins can vote as much as they want its the debate that will win the day.

spaceHopper

No, leave things the way they are now.

kodute wrote: »

Its up to the mods to close this and take it further whenever they deem appropriate.

As for the new accounts, read the first post again. The votes do not count as much as the content of the thread. So new regs and admins can vote as much as they want its the debate that will win the day.

Problem is that the loons will eventually get wind of this and it could desend into a slaging match - this is the kind of thing you are either for or against - IMO most who start out as for move to against with experience.