Spare a thought for Barry

recedite

P. Breathnach wrote: »

So you move seamlessly from wondering if he shops in NI to condemning him for doing it? Do you wonder why people in the public service feel put upon?

True, just because Barry's supporter and apparently fellow PS worker spends his wages in the North, it does not mean Barry does.
I'm sorry Barry.
Unless you and waster81 are the same person. Then I'm not.

SkepticOne

That was a huge PR disaster for the unions wasn't it when the roads to the North were blocked on the day of the strike. It didn't help either when some trade union official in Donegal later tried to organise buses for public sector workers to shop over the border.

btard

Bash Barry and his ilk all you like. The bottom line is you get what you pay for in this world. As you are all about to find out very soon.

talla10

johnnyrotten wrote: »

Barry has to pay for the mess and greed

but the greed was all in the private sector bankers, builders etc. i am so sick of people thinking public servants have it handy top wage pension etc. Anybody could have entered the public service but chose not to in public service i have always known i would never be rich, be my own boss, have social working hours, recieve annual summer and christmas bonus's, that i would be on a pay scale that takes 18 years to reach the top of that scale. but i expected after 30 years of loyal service to recieve a pension to which i believe i would be entitled for my sacrifice's and service to the public sector!!i don't have the luxury of getting a better paid job in a better company or even starting my own company or working abroad. the bankers, builders etc caused this mess abd public sector are paying the brunt of it!!!and i hate public v private arguements things are bad all over but for some to say they hope public servants are cut again i say leave off we have paid more than our share and done far more than our 'patriotic duty'!!!!!!!!!!!

SkepticOne

btard wrote: »

Bash Barry and his ilk all you like. The bottom line is you get what you pay for in this world. As you are all about to find out very soon.

More shopping trips to the North?

ei.sdraob

talla10 wrote: »

but the greed was all in the private sector bankers, builders etc. i am so sick of people thinking public servants have it handy top wage pension etc. Anybody could have entered the public service but chose not to in public service i have always known i would never be rich, be my own boss, have social working hours, recieve annual summer and christmas bonus's, that i would be on a pay scale that takes 18 years to reach the top of that scale. but i expected after 30 years of loyal service to recieve a pension to which i believe i would be entitled for my sacrifice's and service to the public sector!!i don't have the luxury of getting a better paid job in a better company or even starting my own company or working abroad. the bankers, builders etc caused this mess abd public sector are paying the brunt of it!!!and i hate public v private arguements things are bad all over but for some to say they hope public servants are cut again i say leave off we have paid more than our share and done far more than our 'patriotic duty'!!!!!!!!!!!

the builders or bankers put a gun to Barry's head and made him sign that contract?

btard wrote: »

Bash Barry and his ilk all you like. The bottom line is you get what you pay for in this world.

thats the problem aint it? were not getting the service we pay for, and striking surely doesnt help

btard wrote: »

As you are all about to find out very soon.

yes we are keeping note of Greece, are you?

changes

Its a complete joke of a government that would let public sector wages get way higher than the country can handle in a downturn/resession.

Barry was pilloried for not stress testing his mortgage and being left in financial difficulty as a result.

This government should done the same.

How many other western european governments have you seen cutting the public sector 3 times in 18 months and still leave open the threat of more.

I look at some of the councillors in my town and think if this is the quality of people who end up running the country then is it any wonder we are is such a state.

SkepticOne

talla10 wrote: »

don't have the luxury of getting a better paid job in a better company or even starting my own company or working abroad. the bankers, builders etc caused this mess abd public sector are paying the brunt of it!!

So when it comes to redundancies due to lack of funds you will be happy because you are now free to work abroad or start your own company? You will now have that luxury.

theg81der

Talla10 I`m pretty sure its the public sector you said you were in not the mafia...your welcome to leave and brave the real world with the rest of us, actually I`m sure they`d be quite glad if you left.
Also never, ever heard of summer bonuses must have been the other companies where the corridors were lined with gold......follow the follow the follow the yellow brick road.....what other kinds of rubbish has been embelished about the private sector.

btard

SkepticOne wrote: »

More shopping trips to the North?

Nah. The fiasco of the one day strikes are over. What's going on now is slow burning but essentially much more effective. You may mock or sneer all you like but we are fighting for you lot in the private sector just as much as ourselves. If they beat us they will crucify you lot even more. That's the whole point of this divide and conquer strategy.

ei.sdraob

btard wrote: »

You may mock or sneer all you like but we are fighting for you lot in the private sector just as much as ourselves

do you actually believe the stuff your typing?

btard

ei.sdraob wrote: »

do you actually believe the stuff your typing?

Fervently.

SkepticOne

btard wrote: »

Nah. The fiasco of the one day strikes are over. What's going on now is slow burning but essentially much more effective.

Few will notice and those that do will just assume that this is the way the public sector normally work.

Count Dooku

btard wrote: »

Nah. The fiasco of the one day strikes are over. What's going on now is slow burning but essentially much more effective.

Do you mean more justification for next round of cuts?

btard wrote: »

That's the whole point of this divide and conquer strategy.

It would be more difficult to divide without demands from public sector to screw private sector in order to keep salaries in PS untouched

WalterMitty

ei.sdraob wrote: »

do you actually believe the stuff your typing?

That s the prob EI, these guys in public sector really beleive that they are hard done by, they dont seem to relaise that its largely a zero sum game, that keeping wages high in public sector means more hardship for rest of society/economy through higher taxes and/or less services. They think there some massive amount of money there to pay them and fail to connect the dots and see where that money comes from and that its not the big bad government cutting their pay and conditions it is the wider Irish public through these elected representatives in the dail. Every party accepted the need to cut drastically but the likes of the labour party with their fantasy economics led the public sector to beleive that there was enough fat cats out there to tax to pay the bills. Claiming that the publice sector industrial action is for the benefit of the private sector workers too is horsemanure, the private sector suffers if the public doesnt , its that simple as the net cost of the public sector is paid for by the private sector.

mossfort

i didnt think it possible for the public service to go any slower than they were doing. for example people waiting 8 months for their jobseekers allowance to be paid after losing their jobs.
county council planning officials strolling off home from work at 2.30 in the day.
teachers leaving work early and getting paid for it.
and as far as the builders were concerned i think they increased employment in the public service through the revenue commissioners , county councils, fas etc.

btard

SkepticOne wrote: »

Few will notice and those that do will just assume that this is the way the public sector normally work.

You are missing the point. We don't care what you think or assume anymore. Don't make the same mistake the government are making. We have no where else to go. Losing this fight is not an option for us. Few have noticed so far because we are still in phase 1 and are basically just withdrawing goodwill. Our leaders are doing their best to sell us out before phase 2 and the real ****storm hits. If Cowan and Lenihan were not such arrogant incompetants they would have facilitated the sell out by now. Instead they are listening to the hawks who want us crushed completely. I must admit they are doing a good job to date. They've slashed our pay twice in 9 months with virtual impunity so far. A growing number of the rank and file are screaming for an escalation to phase 3 (the so called nuclear option) . The hawks advising Cowan want an escalation to phase 3 asap too. Hence the recent comments about suspending workers on a work to rule. They know from the recent air controllers dispute that this would mean a national all out strike. I fear this is where we are headed. Maybe it's for the best. It's bound to get very nasty but at least it will be sorted one way or the other. I'm not sure we can win with all the forces of the state and media ranged against us. Even our own so called leaders come to that. If we don't I'll just have to emigrate as my job won't be worth having anymore. I'd have no wish to live in a new Taiwan anyway. Only time will tell

SkepticOne

Nuclear option? Bring it on!

Smiegal

waster81 wrote: »

Yeah thats right its only public sector that go up north to shop.

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and the over priced private sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

The sooner all those over priced private companys go belly up the better. Only a matter of time thank God. I of course feel sorry for the employees but that's life...

Count Dooku

Smiegal wrote: »

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and the over priced private sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

The sooner all those over priced private companys go belly up the better. Only a matter of time thank God. I of course feel sorry for the employees but that's life...

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and through VAT to the overpaid public sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

The sooner state will be not able to service debt and foreign investors will stop buying Irish bonds the better. Only a matter of time thank God. We need to save our children from paying this huge debt. I of course feel sorry for the people on welfare benefits but that's life..
:rolleyes:

Head The Wall

btard wrote: »

You may mock or sneer all you like but we are fighting for you lot in the private sector just as much as ourselves. If they beat us they will crucify you lot even more.

You really havn't got a clue, ye are deluded if you think you are fighting for us. I am willing to accept as are many more the inconvenience that you are going to bring with your work at normal pace action. The smile that is going to be on my face when ye get what is coming to ye will be worth it, As someone said after the CPSU strike a while ago "So what if they go on strike, instead of waiting 13 weeks for my dole to be processed, it'll just now be 13 weeks and 1 day"

SkepticOne wrote: »

Few will notice and those that do will just assume that this is the way the public sector normally work.

True that's the general assumptiom and it's true that nothing gets done efficiently in the PS except for Motor tax and revenue. People having to wait weeks to collect Jobseekers benefit, waiting lists in hospitals etc. It goes on and on......

btard wrote: »

You are missing the point. We don't care what you think or assume anymore.

The hawks advising Cowan want an escalation to phase 3 asap too. Hence the recent comments about suspending workers on a work to rule.

Maybe it's for the best. It's bound to get very nasty but at least it will be sorted one way or the other. I'm not sure we can win with all the forces of the state and media ranged against us. Even our own so called leaders come to that. If we don't I'll just have to emigrate as my job won't be worth having anymore. I'd have no wish to live in a new Taiwan anyway. Only time will tell

You have to care what we assume, the PS is only a small percentage of the voting workforce. Unless Labour get into Govt on their own ye are going to get your medicine. People are sick of the PS attitude and are going to use ther votes aginst labour. The PS is in a Lose Lose situation, so bring on the suspensions and then the all out strike.

There's more than the state and media against you, most of the workforce are also. Book your flights now btard

Smiegal wrote: »

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and the over priced private sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

The sooner all those over priced private companys go belly up the better. Only a matter of time thank God. I of course feel sorry for the employees but that's life...

More denial, private sector are the ones that have been dropping prices recently. Are you telling me that public sector service costs did not go up in Ireland the last few years. They are the ones that havn't dropped their prices

Government in effect is a company. It is overpriced, overstadded inefficient and running a huge loss.

theg81der

I had some sympathy for the public sector till I was in a friends house that overlooks the Government buildings here, the back of 3 to be precise. Couldn`t believe in all the offices I could see in all three buildings, maybe 200 offices, I could not see one person at 3 o`clock in the day in their office. All the bloody lights were on too.

Now even if you reasonably say that they work their own hours and some came in at 7 o`clock, some work from home, some at meeting surely I should have been able to see one person?

If permanency and complete job security worked as a motivator for employees every company would be offering it.

Just to add in fairness even if we drop our costs significantly we will never be able to compete on a competitive footing with countries like India, china etc so we will always have to compete on another footing and driving wages down might not be the way to go so.

Head The Wall

This guy posted this on here last night and has now disappeared of the system totally. Anyway I'll tell you what I make of this

I don't want the government to use the money they are putting into NAMA to pay off every loan and mortgage in the country. It may be a runner if everybody in the country had a mortgage but thats not the case. People who have a mortgage get a free house while everyone else before and after have to pay for theirs. Real smart

Basra wrote:

banking system
Hey! What y'all make of this?

http://www.secretwarsinter.com/Irish-Banking-Fraud.htm

The money stolen from us, and being used by our government through NAMA and the bailouts would have paid off every loan and mortgage in the country. This in turn would actually have given the banks back their Money right?

Question has to be. Why was this not done?

Well, because this way, through NAMA and the bailouts, the banks get YOUR property when they reclaim it. AND, they also get YOUR money through the bailouts . It's a win/ win for them and a lose/ lose for you.
Recessions are no accident! They are orchestrated. Financial bubbles are created by "Fractional Reserve Banking" whereby banks are allowed to loan out money they do not have.
Fractional reserve banking means that the bank is only required to hold, on hand, the small fraction of money (5%) that is needed to cover daily activity. The rest they can loan out at huge rates. So only a fraction of deposits is likely to be drawn upon and / or cashed. This is a PYRAMID scheme dependent on good faith. I thought pyramid schemes were supposed to be illegal ??
Moneys deposited in accounts go into a reserve upon which credit can be issued. In the US credit can be issued to seven times the reserve, in international banks twenty times the reserve can be issued as credit.
An example: If you were to go to a bank and ask for a loan of say, 20,000. The bank can simply create that money as a figure on your ATM, cheque or whatever, out of "THIN AIR", NOTHING, ZIP. lets say you put your house up as collateral for this loan. What has the bank put up? Now the bank is making money from you as interest on the loan right? You might say fine, sur isn't that how banks make money? Well what if you can't pay back the loan? You lose your car to the bank right? Now the bank has a lot of your money, at interest, AND your car "ALL FROM ABSOLUTELY NOTHING" !! This in my view is legalised fraud. Who on earth gave banks this power? It is important to understand this concept in order to understand the larger picture.
This system of banking all creates a false economy. All it takes, once the bubble of debt is big enough , is to create a scare in the economy and start calling in loans.. Bubble bursts, and because there is no real money (debt free) out there to pay back the false money (loans from banks, etc.) we end up in a recession. If the decision was made at the time to simply stop the issuing of credit and allow enough time for the debts to be paid off well then the 'soft landing' our so called leaders talked about, could have happened.


Well that's not what happened is it? NO! To suit their agenda they had to call in loans, crash and burn the economy. The banks and corporations close to the conspiracy get bailouts from their political puppets, use this to buy out their competition, buy up real assets (Both of which have now significantly lowered in price) and give huge bonuses to their good little workers (forget what you have seen and move on ! ).

You can see it happening right in front of you every day right?

The loosening of banking regulations by the E.U. back in the 70's allowed this bubble to be created. Same across the world. Now it's time to sit back and watch the banking elite consolidate power, merge banks, merge corporations and roll out their new monetary Order. The agenda is monopoly. More power and money in less hands. The powers that be know exactly what they are doing. They rarely make mistakes.

You have to ask yourself, do you want the perpetrators of this crime to further their agenda and gain more power from it? Don't be fooled when they come out acting like the saviours telling you their new system will never let this happen again. That's what the people were told after the last depression. They'll promise us restrictions, regulations and anything else to keep us calm until time comes round for their next power grab.

They are criminals and if they have struck once they will strike again. Their new banking system will allow them to fleece YOUR CHILDREN a lot easier.

Anyone that believes it would be any different under Fine Gale or any other party for that matter is gravely mistaken. Doesn't take much to buy out enough 'key' people, and all it takes is one dodgy deal to hang over his/her head to keep them quiet. Remember all the secret meetings around the time that NAMA was being set up? A lot of good TD's at the time showed concern. Why the secret meetings? Well if any one of those good TD's were to see banking officials give orders to the government, there would have been a revolution the following morning.

So what can we do about this injustice I hear you ask? Well what do they do in other countries? They Revolt and demand that such crimes be reversed. Demand a sound monetary system and bloody well get it. I'm not suggesting we march on leinster house with guns and pick axes. I am calling for exposure of this blatant scam, peaceful protest with placards, demanding voices and an absolute persistence, so that people get a fair deal. Not like in this case, when the ugly reality of the oligarchy came true for magella and her family. http://audioserver.todayfm.com/audio/majellaemail.mp3
How can we fix the banking problem? The public must demand that money not be created and issued as loans from private banks. It must be something that is openly and publicly controllable, issuable, accountable, and interest-free.

But what if we do get our own sound currency and break away from the European system? Will they turn their backs on us? I say let them. We have some of the richest land in the world for farming. We have oil off the west coast being stolen from us by shell. A well educated workforce. Not to mention the fact that we are surrounded by water and fish. Anyone really going to try and tell me we can't sustain ourselves?

It's high time this fraud was exposed, and, as it is too late for the government to pay off our debt's, is it now time for us to demand that they be cancelled? Seems that would be the only fair thing to do right?

Because we are tied to the Euro you might think it would be difficult to demand a new, sound monetary system. Well England, as part of the EU still have the pound right? Why can't we demand our Punt back and end 'Fractional reserve Banking' in Ireland for good? Whatever way we move forward it has to be without Fractional reserve, "and" central banking because central banking working under the same system is a mere tool, which allows the Government to pull the strings of banks under it and vice versa.

So stop playing the blame game out there. Let's end the war between the public and private sector. This war only serves to shift the blame from the true culprits. We are playing right into the hands of these criminals when we fight each other. Fact is that nobody should be taking cuts. The only issue here should be the exposure of the criminal fraud outlined in this article, and the insane banking system itself that allows this kind of criminality to occur.

I have been fortunate enough to keep myself out of debt as have many others but I will not sit idle while my family and friends worry their way trough, possibly, the rest of their lives. Especially when these B******S knew all along, and for years, that this was coming down the line.


To research more on "Fractional Reserve Banking" Watch these documentaries on google video

Money as Debt : http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2550156453790090544&ei=yCZkS9GDFInt-Qaj2ui0CA&q=money+as+debt

Money Masters : http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936&ei=fCdkS8_eGJW2-AalobG1CA&q=money+masters&view=3#

theg81der

+1 to the above, even thou it was interesting reading.

I chose to be prudent - stuck with my small house and paid off my morgage no way I`m paying for other people like the ones who were scoffing at me for not driving a fancy car or buying a bigger house a few years ago they can sing for it.

How is it that post disappeared?

ei.sdraob

Smiegal wrote: »

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and the over priced private sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

The sooner all those over priced private companys go belly up the better. Only a matter of time thank God. I of course feel sorry for the employees but that's life...

btard wrote: »

A growing number of the rank and file are screaming for an escalation to phase 3 (the so called nuclear option)

yes please

go ahead both of yee and yeer unions

use the "nuclear" option



i thought the problem with the ps was them living in a protective bubble detached from reality, but now i see its closer to being in an asylum

madness

thebman

Smiegal wrote: »

I'd sooner pay HM government my euro then the Corrupt Cowen and co and the over priced private sector here. Just wish I lived closer to the boarder.

Upward only rent reviews, great idea that. Wonder why Irish private sector can't compete.

Of course the government will outlaw it sometime this year when they get around to it.

FlashGordon1969

MaceFace wrote: »

Very true, but most have the threat hanging over them, and that is very significant.

Most dont have that threat either. I know a few public sector workers let go who were on contracts.

gurramok

theg81der wrote: »

I had some sympathy for the public sector till I was in a friends house that overlooks the Government buildings here, the back of 3 to be precise. Couldn`t believe in all the offices I could see in all three buildings, maybe 200 offices, I could not see one person at 3 o`clock in the day in their office. All the bloody lights were on too.

Now even if you reasonably say that they work their own hours and some came in at 7 o`clock, some work from home, some at meeting surely I should have been able to see one person?

They were all at a union meeting (just like the air traffic controllers were with Impact )

btard

Head The Wall wrote: »

You really havn't got a clue, ye are deluded if you think you are fighting for us. I am willing to accept as are many more the inconvenience that you are going to bring with your work at normal pace action. The smile that is going to be on my face when ye get what is coming to ye will be worth it, As someone said after the CPSU strike a while ago "So what if they go on strike, instead of waiting 13 weeks for my dole to be processed, it'll just now be 13 weeks and 1 day"

True that's the general assumptiom and it's true that nothing gets done efficiently in the PS except for Motor tax and revenue. People having to wait weeks to collect Jobseekers benefit, waiting lists in hospitals etc. It goes on and on......

You have to care what we assume, the PS is only a small percentage of the voting workforce. Unless Labour get into Govt on their own ye are going to get your medicine. People are sick of the PS attitude and are going to use ther votes aginst labour. The PS is in a Lose Lose situation, so bring on the suspensions and then the all out strike.

There's more than the state and media against you, most of the workforce are also. Book your flights now btard

You and other in this thread seem to have no idea how the public sector works, what it does for you, or how your life would change if we are forced to withdraw our labour. Waiting a few weeks for your dole money and longer waiting lists will be the least of your problems. Be careful what you wish for, you may get it.

FlashGordon1969

I recently tried to get a bank account address changed . Had written a letter oif complaint stating various problems I had with the bank. A guy rang and swore blind it would be all sorted. It wasn't -was forced to make two more calls for what should have been a simple thing. Im just showing one example of the inefficiencies in Private sector.