When RTE goes digital in 2011 . . .

LordSutch

How will I receive RTE/TV3 when they go Digital in 2011 or 2012 ???

Currently I have a dish & FTA box for all other stations, (plus a Loft aerial plugged into the RF socket for RTE/TV3), but when the Three Rock analogue signal goes off air in a year or two, what will people like me do to receive RTE? Get a second FTA box for the Irish stations? or what

Liam Byrne

Camelot wrote: »

How will I receive RTE/TV3 when they go Digital in 2011 or 2012 ???

Currently I have a dish & FTA box for all other stations, (plus a Loft aerial plugged into the RF socket for RTE/TV3), but when the Three Rock analogue signal goes off air in a year or two, what will people like me do to receive RTE? Get a second FTA box for the Irish stations? or what

Unfortunately it will require the terrestrial equivalent of a satellite box, and probably one per TV.

Not sure how this works with a distributor, but it'll probably need a box per TV

LordSutch

Another box plugged into another socket, with yet another set of cables > Its going to be so bloody complicated ....... :mad:

Minstrel27

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Not sure how this works with a distributor, but it'll probably need a box per TV

Unless the tv has a built in MPEG4 tuner it will need a STB

Liam Byrne

Minstrel27 wrote: »

Unless the tv has a built in MPEG4 tuner it will need a STB

Either way we'll be forking out more cash - new box or new TV - in order to receive what we currently have.

If life were fair, the Government would forego the TV licence for that year to allow people to pay for the equipment related to their decision.

Minstrel27

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Either way we'll be forking out more cash - new box or new TV - in order to receive what we currently have.

If life were fair, the Government would forego the TV licence for that year to allow people to pay for the equipment related to their decision.

It's not the governments fault that we are being forced to change. You can thank the EU for that.

Dony

What sort of aeriel will be needed to pick up digital terrestial?

Ronan|Raven

Your existing aerial should be fine if you are getting good tv3/tg4 reception.

Liam Byrne

Dony wrote: »

What sort of aeriel will be needed to pick up digital terrestial?

Any newish UHF aerial should work.

If it's an older one, you might need a new one.

I was picking up interference from the DTT tests last year - very annoying.

mjsmyth

If you already use an aerial (outside or in the attic) to pick up the 4 channels, then you should not need to change...

Some places can pick the signal up using a set of rabbits ears.

LordSutch

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

Your existing aerial should be fine if you are getting good tv3/tg4 reception.

Indeed, but the aerial is the easy part, its the additional box that's the big pain.

The Cush

Minstrel27 wrote: »

It's not the governments fault that we are being forced to change. You can thank the EU for that.

Not correct, broadcasting worldwide is going digital and has been since the mid '90s - you can't blame the EU for that. Remember Sky went digital almost 12 years ago.

@ Camelot, as this is a terrestrial related question you should have posted as a new thread over in the terrestrial forum.

LordSutch

The Cush wrote: »

@ Camelot, as this is a terrestrial related question you should have posted as a new thread over in the terrestrial forum.

I think this topic relates to both Satellite & Terrestrial ?

Many thanks.

Ozzie

Best advice and spread the word; if anyone is buying a new TV, make sure its "Irish Digital TV Ready". Alot of TVs being sold are not!

high heels

Dident the USA have a voucher for people who couldent afford the new box? Maybe we will do the same here?

Has any other EU country done the same?

muffler

high heels wrote: »

Dident the USA have a voucher for people who couldent afford the new box? Maybe we will do the same here?

Indeed

Sam Russell

If you can receive TG4 teletext, you will almost certainly be able to receive DTT with the existing aerial. Currently 85 % of the population are covered by the test transmissions. 60% of homes should be able to receive DTT on 'rabbit ears'. It is no big deal, the STB is not particularly expensive, and all new TVs should (but aren't) equipped with MPEG4 tuners.

Minstrel27

The Cush wrote: »

you can't blame the EU for that.

I can blame the EU for their 2012 deadline.

zagmund

Minstrel27 wrote: »

I can blame the EU for their 2012 deadline.

Yeah, but the deadline was announced a long time ago. The Irish government/relevant bodies failed to get it into gear on the information front, possibly expecting some sort of exemption or something. On the technical front (as mentioned above) it's all working, they have just failed spectacularly to inform d'people.

I expect that the analog switch off will be pushed out to the very, very last minute available.

z

snaps

Minstrel27 wrote: »

I can blame the EU for their 2012 deadline.

The 2012 deadline was set many years ago possibly as early as 2004. I think Ireland have had plenty of time to launch a DTT service. Ireland is only 1 of 3 countrys in europe that doesnt have a DTT service running.

But knowing Ireland, they'll get an extension from europe so that analouge can stay running for another few years.

Personally,I think that the Irish 4 channels should have been broadcast in Mpeg 2 (So that most newish tv's can receive them) and then if a pay DTT broadcaster launches a service then launch that in mpeg 4.

I mean 4 channels (Well 5 with rte news) doesnt take up much bandwith on a multiplex in MPEG 2. And at the moment thats the only 5 channels on a DTT possible service at launch? Im sure that all hardware installed at transmitters is backwards compatible with MPEG 2, so i cant see the problem.

The word "FREEVIEW" in this country is confussing everyone. Nearly everone i speak to about FTA satellite calls that FREEVIEW as well!!!! The problem is that we have relied on UK TV broadcasts to much and we have all picked up the UK brand names and relate digital to those UK brandnames.

Digital TV/Pay TV is a shambles in this country. We are using a UK company to offer us overpriced Pay tv via satellite and there is basically no competition (Apart from cable in citys) to give Mr murdoch a run for his money!

Freesat is a breath of fresh air and so has the DTT trial/test. Luckily i have hardware that can receive the DTT tests, otherwise i would not be watching Irish tv as i have poor analouge and i'd never pay a UK company 20€ a month to watch the 4 Irish national channels!

Rant over!

The Cush

Camelot wrote: »

I think this topic relates to both Satellite & Terrestrial ?

Many thanks.

Your question relates to terrestrial analogue switchoff unless of course you decide to opt for the Irish channels via a Sky Digital subscription.

high heels wrote: »

Dident the USA have a voucher for people who couldent afford the new box? Maybe we will do the same here?

Has any other EU country done the same?

The US TV Converter Box Coupon Program.

The UK has The Switchover Help Scheme.

There is a provision for an assistance scheme in the current Broadcasting Act

PART 8 Digital Broadcasting and Analogue Switch-Off

139. Analogue switchoff.

(9) The Minister, for the purpose of ensuring a smooth and
efficient interchange between the provision of analogue and digital
television services in the context of analogue switch-off, shall have
the power by himself or herself, or in conjunction with any other
person, to—

(a) promote cooperation and coordination between broadcasters,
multiplex contractors and other interested parties
in relation to analogue switch-off,
(b) commission research on matters relating to analogue
switch-off,
(c) promote public awareness and the dissemination of
coordinated information to the public in relation to analogue
switch-off, and
(d) operate, manage or sponsor, whether in whole or in part,
measures aimed at alleviating the effects of analogue
switch-off on classes of communities or persons
adversely affected.

Minstrel27 wrote: »

I can blame the EU for their 2012 deadline.

The 1st Jan 2012 date is not a deadline, it is an EU recommended analogue switch date decided on back in mid 2005, some countries will not meet this date including Ireland. The ITU has set 17 Jun 2015 as the date after which countries will no longer be required to protect the analogue services of neighbouring countries against interference and be able to freely use frequencies assigned for digital services. This date is generally viewed as an internationally mandated analogue switch-off date, at least along national borders.

Deadline for turning off analogue TV may stretch to 2015
by Laura Noonan - Friday March 07 2008

THE 2012 deadline for switching off analogue TV is "not written in stone" and may be extended as far as 2015, the chief executive of the Broadcasting Commission of Ireland (BCI) revealed yesterday.

The comments came as the BCI unveiled details of the licensing process for Digital Terrestrial Television (DTT), which will ultimately replace traditional analogue TV.

The BCI has previously cited 2012 as the absolute cut-off point for DTT, but yesterday chief executive Michael O'Keeffe stuck a distinctly softer tone.

"It's not written in stone," he said. "It was the target date."

He added that the actual switch-off date was likely to be "between 2012 and 2015".

(http://www.independent.ie/business/m...5-1308874.html)

_Kaiser_

Must check, but I bought two Samsung LCDs in the last 2 years that have some sort of native digital support.. what am I looking for exactly?

Oh and I'm in the Cavan area.. should I get them without a big massive aerial on the roof?

slegs

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Must check, but I bought two Samsung LCDs in the last 2 years that have some sort of native digital support.. what am I looking for exactly?

Oh and I'm in the Cavan area.. should I get them without a big massive aerial on the roof?

Cairn Hill in Longford is broadcasting at a fairly powerful level so you may pick up with rabbits ears plugged into the antenna in port. If your TV has an MPEG4 DVB-T tuner you will find 5 TV channels and 4 radio channels on a scan and you will be able to view.

If your TV has an MPEG2 DVB-T tuner it may still find the channels but you will only get sound and no picture from the TV channels.

Tony

Minstrel27 wrote: »

It's not the governments fault that we are being forced to change. You can thank the EU for that.

Thats simply not true our Government decided it was in the country's interest to go digital. Frequency spectrum is valuable commodity, the freed up spectrum will be sold to commercial users.

I agree with Cush this should be in the terrestrial forum it has nothing to do with satellite which is already digital.

sesswhat

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Must check, but I bought two Samsung LCDs in the last 2 years that have some sort of native digital support.. what am I looking for exactly?

Oh and I'm in the Cavan area.. should I get them without a big massive aerial on the roof?

Even if you don't have mpeg4 for the Irish digital channels, it might be worth trying for UK digital (Freeview) from Brougher Mountain northeast of Enniskillen.

The Cush

Suggest that mods move this to terrestrial and merge with duplicate post by OP in this thread http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=64179823#post64179823.

RKQ

high heels wrote: »

Has any other EU country done the same?

Yes, the UK.
(Of course their Channels can be picked up on Sat / Freeview. We'd have to be different!:) RTE couldn't use the existing Sat dishes in Ireland) Maybe its the modern day Tech equivalent of RTE on VHF & UK on UHF?

Sam Russell

zagmund wrote: »

I expect that the analog switch off will be pushed out to the very, very last minute available.

z

There is no real benefit in extending the ASO, analogue equipment is more expensive to operate and service. It requires more power - the Mux carries all the channels (up to 8 channels) on one band, while analogue requires 4. Therefore 4 times the power required. Also, why run two systems in parallel. If changeover is going to happen, why not do it all at once. (Well, at least within a year.) RTE will save money in distribution/transmission when it is up and running, so they have no interest in delaying its start.

We can deal with the problems, it is not rocket science. The most common case would require a STB to be plugged into the TV and the aerial routed throght the box. The boxes could be subsidised, but they are relatively cheap - as a guide about £20 for the UK ones. (I know they are MPEG2, but costs would be the same by the time they would be required, and if the switchover was a short term thing, the volumes would be there to bring down the price.

It is a small issue, it only affects 25% of the homes in the state according to the statistics quoted in other threads. If it succeeds in attracting people away from NTL and $ky, then it might matter more.

Ronan|Raven

To people terrified of how much a suitable receiver will cost, start putting 20 cents a day in a tin and I'm sure ye will be fine by the time it rolls around.

The Cush

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

To people terrified of how much a suitable receiver will cost, start putting 20 cents a day in a tin and I'm sure ye will be fine by the time it rolls around.

What may terrify people more is the number of receivers they may require to upgrade existing tvs and vcrs in the household.

Minstrel27

The Cush wrote: »

What may terrify people more is the number of receivers they may require to upgrade existing tvs and vcrs in the household.

Now is the time to educate people about PVR's etc. but as of yet I am hearing nothing.

LordSutch

The Cush wrote: »

What may terrify people more is the number of receivers they may require to upgrade existing tvs and vcrs in the household.

My point exactly.

Mike 1972

Camelot wrote: »

Another box plugged into another socket, with yet another set of cables > Its going to be so bloody complicated ....... :mad:

Not to mention another remote.

The real fun starts when you want to record something or when you find you dont have enough SCART sockets

zagmund

Sam Russell wrote: »

There is no real benefit in extending the ASO, analogue equipment is more expensive to operate and service. It requires more power - the Mux carries all the channels (up to 8 channels) on one band, while analogue requires 4. Therefore 4 times the power required. Also, why run two systems in parallel. If changeover is going to happen, why not do it all at once. (Well, at least within a year.) RTE will save money in distribution/transmission when it is up and running, so they have no interest in delaying its start.

We can deal with the problems, it is not rocket science. The most common case would require a STB to be plugged into the TV and the aerial routed throght the box. The boxes could be subsidised, but they are relatively cheap - as a guide about £20 for the UK ones. (I know they are MPEG2, but costs would be the same by the time they would be required, and if the switchover was a short term thing, the volumes would be there to bring down the price.

It is a small issue, it only affects 25% of the homes in the state according to the statistics quoted in other threads. If it succeeds in attracting people away from NTL and $ky, then it might matter more.

I know we can deal with it and it's not rocket science. The point is that it hasn't been rocket science for a long time at thist stage but still it hasn't been launched correctly. What I'm getting at is that knowing how Ireland works the Minister will eventually announce the final cut-over date (like he did 2 years ago, only that kind of went away in a puff of smoke) and everyone will cheer. Then nothing will happen. Then the good folk of some marginal FF constituency will find out they will have to buy a new receiver if analog gets switched off, they will complain to their TDs, their TDs will complain to whoever is running the country at that stage, he or she will complain to the Minister, the Minister will talk to his people, they will talk to RTENL and others and ask "how can we avoid the situation where the good people of <wherever> have to shell out ?", the boffins will say "simple, just don't switch off the analog tranmitters" and the next thing you know the analog transmitters will be broadcasting away off into the future. Meantime digital will also be launched and everyone will be happy except those who thought digital should have been launched years ago.

z

zagmund

Sam Russell wrote: »

There is no real benefit in extending the ASO, analogue equipment is more expensive to operate and service.

So are 100 year old water mains, but that hasn't stopped us keeping them in operation.

z

ForeverYoung90

zagmund wrote: »

So are 100 year old water mains, but that hasn't stopped us keeping them in operation.

z

+1

noodler

zagmund wrote: »

So are 100 year old water mains, but that hasn't stopped us keeping them in operation.

z

Two wrongs...?

Sam Russell

My 70 year old water main was replaced last year by a blue plastic pipe inside the old one. Now when they turn it off at night as they do, I can understand why they changed it. Before, with the old pipe, when we had supply cut off, we got brown sludge for hours, now it is always clean. But not always there.

What that has to do with ASO i do not understand. We have a DTT system up and running, just waiting for the green ribbon to be cut by Minister Ryan. When that ribbon is cut, and we are off into the digital green yonder, how long do we need to be wasting power pumping out analogue? Most people will go out and get their STB the day after the ASO anyway, so why wait very long?

zagmund

noodler wrote: »

Two wrongs...?

Guys, I'm not saying it's right or that I want it. I think we should have gone digital long ago.

All I'm saying is that when it comes down to it and pressure is brought to bear on certain parties we are likely to end up with analog & digital running in tandem for a lot longer than we're supposed to. Also, that the so called cut-over is more likely to be a gentle seperation as they think of reasons not to switch off the analog transmitters. Don't forget the DTT trial/test/pick your own word has been de-facto in production for the last year - that's a year of analog power we could have saved.

z

Sam Russell

zagmund wrote: »

Guys, I'm not saying it's right or that I want it. I think we should have gone digital long ago.

. Also, that the so called cut-over is more likely to be a gentle seperation as they think of reasons not to switch off the analog transmitters.
z

The analogue transmitters are at end of life, they may decide to switch themselves off!

Tony

I'm still wondering what any of this has to do with satellite?

Liam Byrne

The Cush wrote: »

What may terrify people more is the number of receivers they may require to upgrade existing tvs and vcrs in the household.

This is indeed the issue; 4 or 5 TVs in a household (maybe 2 main ones and 2 or 3 portables) - will each one require a decoder box ?

What are people going to do with wall-mounted TVs, where there's nowhere to put the box ? Or no additional socket ?

And does each box require its own feed direct from the aerial ?

What happens if you're using a FreeSat or ex-Sky box distributed around the house - can you relay the DTT through that aerial ?

The bottom line is that all of the above makes it seem worthwhile to keep paying Sky, and I was on the verge of dumping that due to the amount of rubbish channels, the pain of accessing "Other Channels", and the ridiculous amount of repeats - it's OK as a free setup where you might find something worthwhile, but paying for it is sickening.

But if you're gonna be paying €200 to re-distribute to each TV, that'd be 5 years of subscriptions to Sky without the hassle of crazy connection setups, cables and distributors, etc.

The Cush

Liam Byrne wrote: »

This is indeed the issue; 4 or 5 TVs in a household (maybe 2 main ones and 2 or 3 portables) - will each one require a decoder box ?

What are people going to do with wall-mounted TVs, where there's nowhere to put the box ? Or no additional socket ?

And does each box require its own feed direct from the aerial ?

What happens if you're using a FreeSat or ex-Sky box distributed around the house - can you relay the DTT through that aerial ?

The bottom line is that all of the above makes it seem worthwhile to keep paying Sky, and I was on the verge of dumping that due to the amount of rubbish channels, the pain of accessing "Other Channels", and the ridiculous amount of repeats - it's OK as a free setup where you might find something worthwhile, but paying for it is sickening.

But if you're gonna be paying €200 to re-distribute to each TV, that'd be 5 years of subscriptions to Sky without the hassle of crazy connection setups, cables and distributors, etc.

Each analogue only and MPEG-2 TV will require a seperate MPEG-4 receiver, also each vcr and analogue PVR/DVD recorder will require an MPEG-4 receiver although an MPEG-4 DTT twin-tuner PVR (with the capability to watch one channel / record one channel, record two channel) would remove the requirement for two standalone receivers and replace the analogue vcr/pvr/dvd recorder. A PVR similar to the freeview Humax 9300T.

Each digital receiver requires an aerial feed just as today each analogue tv/vcr etc. requires an aerial feed, the aerial or co-ax cable doesn't distinguish between an analogue or digital signal. You just loop the aerial through the digital receiver as you would with a vcr/dvd recorder/sky box.

There will be nothing complicated about adding a digital receiver to your current TV if its already fed from a tv aerial. Why do you think it will cost €200 per tv point?, if the aerial feed is already there all you will require is a digital receiver. In the UK at the moment the cheapest basic freeview DTT receivers are retailing between £10 and £20. A new aerial and cabling installation may set you back a few quid and there will be the potential for the rip-off installs.

As TVs are replaced for whatever reason the requirement for an additional receiver will disappear, in any case analogue tv will be around for at least 3 more years.

I haven't been a Sky subscriber for many years but €200 for 5 years of Sky seems a bit low.

jaggiebunnet

ynotdu wrote: »

Hi.ya Tony given your usually sensible posting and discounts to boardsies i am surprised You backed up The cush's moderating as he is not a mod.

It still has nothing to do with satellite.

The Cush

ynotdu wrote: »

Hi.ya Tony given your usually sensible posting and discounts to boardsies i am surprised You backed up The cush's moderating as he is not a mod.

If I was moderating I would have moved this long ago, this thread has nothing to do with satellite - its about terrestrial analogue switchoff - just common sence.

Tony

Why are you surprised, this topic has nothing to do with satellite. Cush was simply pointing that out. Dont see what the boards discount and sensible posting has to do with this.

ynotdu wrote: »

Hi.ya Tony given your usually sensible posting and discounts to boardsies i am surprised You backed up The cush's moderating as he is not a mod.

My Aunt in the UK got a grant to go digital so when its Irelands time i am fairly sure at least OAP.s will get the same.

I sincerely doubt our switchover will go ahead in 2012 anyway.

muffler

I reported this thread and it appears that the mods have either not been active or have decided that its OK. Either way its still in the wrong forum as far as Im concerned but its not my call though.

Tony

You win the T shirt for the the contradiction of the day.:)

ynotdu wrote: »

dont go off-topic!;)

Wizard007

Lads it doesn't really matter. Anywhere people can see this information and get a clearer view of what's going to happen can not be bad as it is causing alot of confusion ( the change over, not the thread ).

It might even be no harm if a thread like this was stickied at the top of all the cable and digital tv forums. All you guys know and understand what's going on but most Joe Soaps don't have a clue about what the change over involves, so the more info posted across these forums the better I think.

Just my 2.5 cent worth

Tony

ynotdu wrote: »

hope i get more than a 10% discount if i buy from You as a reward?:)

I'd prefer if you did not buy to be honest.

Tony

Wizard007 wrote: »

Lads it doesn't really matter.

I must disagree, if it did not matter then only one forum would be needed for the whole of Boards.ie