Looking for a TV Tuner for my laptop, completely new to all this

Digitalism

hello, im new to all this so thought id create my own thread as I need help on this. Basically I want to watch TV from a coaxial connection probably on my dell 1737 laptop running win7 pro. Im not sure on the differences on USB and PCMI, im not sure if I have a PCMI slot even, I think i do though, it just has the dell media controller in it at the moment.

Like does having a tv tuner on your laptop make it basically like a tv on your dekstop of windows? Like is it the same as a tv, like being able to switch channels, tv text etc. Will i get RTE TG4 TV3 or even BBC?

I have a coaxial connection in my room here im pretty sure, so can I use that and connect a coaxial cable into like a USB dongle tuner and watch tv that way? Will the picture be just like it is with a tv using the same cable connected to same coaxial slot here?

So ive been looking on ebay and seeing things like this for cheap:

http://cgi.ebay.com/PCMCIA-TV-Tuner-Video-Capture-Card-Cardbus-Laptop-T-16_W0QQitemZ260538378268QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3ca94c281c

http://cgi.ebay.com/USB-Digital-DVB-T-HDTV-TV-Tuner-Recorder-Receiver-PC_W0QQitemZ260469247849QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3ca52d4f69

etc.

Are these good and will they work fine for what im after?

Any help or guides or whatever welcome, im new to all this. cheers

The Dell 1737 has an ExpressCard slot, it's the slot on the bottom left hand side. It won't take a PCMCIA card.

Mad_Mike

Try this one here
http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=349755
Its working a treat for me

Digitalism

Thats a nice price also! Does that allow you connect a coaxial connection like into the back of a tv?
Does it work with windows 7 do you know? Also does it come with sofftware and does it allow you record tv?
Is it working good at getting RTE etc.?

snaps

seems to have all the specs, mpeg 4 etc.

homer911

Mad_Mike wrote: »

Try this one here
http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=349755
Its working a treat for me

I use this myself - Be aware that this model is a digital-only tuner - you wont pick up analogue signals with it. It will pick up the Irish DTT engineering tests (subject to available signal) and should also pick up the UK Freeview signal in border areas. It has a co-ax socket on it together with a mini aerial which is more than adequate for DTT. You would also pick up digital radio.

Software is provided for viewing and its pretty much plug-and-play. You just have to run a scan to tune in the stations. It has a single tuner, so you can record the programme you are watching and schedule recordings. You can also pause/record live TV. The software picks up the full EPG and the scheduler works with this. If you have a PS3, you can save your recordings to a data stick and watch them on your main TV through it.

The MHEG-5 Support means you can pick up the new digital teletext service so you can watch your programme in a window while reading the teletext.

The tuner also works with Windows Media Centre - oh, and I'm running Windows 7
(I've also plugged it into my laptop running XP and installed the software and it works fine on it too)

Digitalism

homer911 wrote: »

I use this myself - Be aware that this model is a digital-only tuner - you wont pick up analogue signals with it. It will pick up the Irish DTT engineering tests (subject to available signal) and should also pick up the UK Freeview signal in border areas. It has a co-ax socket on it together with a mini aerial which is more than adequate for DTT. You would also pick up digital radio.

Software is provided for viewing and its pretty much plug-and-play. You just have to run a scan to tune in the stations. It has a single tuner, so you can record the programme you are watching and schedule recordings. You can also pause/record live TV. The software picks up the full EPG and the scheduler works with this. If you have a PS3, you can save your recordings to a data stick and watch them on your main TV through it.

The MHEG-5 Support means you can pick up the new digital teletext service so you can watch your programme in a window while reading the teletext.

The tuner also works with Windows Media Centre - oh, and I'm running Windows 7
(I've also plugged it into my laptop running XP and installed the software and it works fine on it too)

So to be sure ive got this right, I cant like plug in a rabbit ears through the coaxial connection on this stick? Like that wont work?
Ill be using this mainly in louth but also some places south of Ireland, but I see it says MHEG-5 Support (U.K only). is that still the case?
Can you take a picture for me of the coaxial socket on the usb stick please as I just want to check something. Also, could you take a like screen shot of this running like RTE on windows 7 media centre or something so I can see the quality and whatnot, please!

M5

This works for me

http://cgi.ebay.ie/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270500755838

homer911

Digitalism wrote: »

So to be sure ive got this right, I cant like plug in a rabbit ears through the coaxial connection on this stick? Like that wont work?
Ill be using this mainly in louth but also some places south of Ireland, but I see it says MHEG-5 Support (U.K only). is that still the case?
Can you take a picture for me of the coaxial socket on the usb stick please as I just want to check something. Also, could you take a like screen shot of this running like RTE on windows 7 media centre or something so I can see the quality and whatnot, please!

Will see what I can do this evening - could you pm me your email address in case I cant work out how to upload them?

Mad_Mike

Digitalism wrote: »

So to be sure ive got this right, I cant like plug in a rabbit ears through the coaxial connection on this stick? Like that wont work?
Ill be using this mainly in louth but also some places south of Ireland, but I see it says MHEG-5 Support (U.K only). is that still the case?
Can you take a picture for me of the coaxial socket on the usb stick please as I just want to check something. Also, could you take a like screen shot of this running like RTE on windows 7 media centre or something so I can see the quality and whatnot, please!

Rabbit ears will work fine
There is an adapter included to regular co-ax size
See the pics I took for you here
http://img37.imageshack.us/slideshow/webplayer.php?id=aver3.jpg


<EDIT>Added screen cap</EDIT>

homer911

homer911 wrote: »

Will see what I can do this evening - could you pm me your email address in case I cant work out how to upload them?

Sent images via email...

Digitalism

Thanks for the info guys, looking like ill get this one. PC world had a hauppage for €60 but I think thats expensive for it. One last question, the guy in PC world was saying RTE will be going digital in 2012, will this still work then? Like can this tuner do analog and digital?

sesswhat

As said earlier, it can only do digital.

Digitalism

Ah right ok, do you think I will be able to pick up the freeview channels on that supplied avermedia ariel in Dundalk? Has anyone from there tried it here?

Also how long do komplett generally take to deliver items?

homer911

Digitalism wrote: »

Ah right ok, do you think I will be able to pick up the freeview channels on that supplied avermedia ariel in Dundalk? Has anyone from there tried it here?

Also how long do komplett generally take to deliver items?

Sorry, cant help you on these questions :mad:

Mad_Mike

Digitalism wrote: »

Ah right ok, do you think I will be able to pick up the freeview channels on that supplied avermedia ariel in Dundalk? Has anyone from there tried it here?

Also how long do komplett generally take to deliver items?

I assume you mean the Irish freeview channels?

Komplett take a few days if collecting at the pickup point. More or less the same for deliveries. See here

homer911

Mad_Mike wrote: »

I assume you mean the Irish freeview channels?

No, he means UK Freeview as he is close to the border - there is no such things as Irish Freeview. The Irish DTT system is now known as Saorview

Digitalism

Mad_Mike wrote: »

I assume you mean the Irish freeview channels?

Komplett take a few days if collecting at the pickup point. More or less the same for deliveries. See here

Well Irish free view as I will be south near kilkenny somedays and in Louth others. So Irish freeview also with UK as hopefully I could pick them up as im near the border.

Do those tvs with freeview in them work the same as these usb sticks? Like they have an antenna? As Im thinking of maybe getting a tv on the cheap for about €200 with freeview in it.

danjo-xx

Digitalism wrote: »

Well Irish free view as I will be south near kilkenny somedays and in Louth others. So Irish freeview also with UK as hopefully I could pick them up as im near the border.

Do those tvs with freeview in them work the same as these usb sticks? Like they have an antenna? As Im thinking of maybe getting a tv on the cheap for about €200 with freeview in it.

TV's with Freeview will not be able to receive irish DTT as they do not have an MPEG4 decoder.

If you want UK Freeview and Irish DTT you need a tv or set top box or stick etc that is both MPEG4 + MPEG2 compliant.

mjsmyth

If the stick supports Mpeg4, it will support Mpeg2.

It also mentions it in the spec...

HDTV (MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 & MPEG-2) ready

danjo-xx

mjsmyth wrote: »

If the stick supports Mpeg4, it will support Mpeg2.

It also mentions it in the spec...

Good point I forgot that one.


Just wondering is DVB-T2 (which I think is High Definition) backward compliant with DVB-T

The Cush

danjo-xx wrote: »

TV's with Freeview will not be able to receive irish DTT as they do not have an MPEG4 decoder.

If you want UK Freeview and Irish DTT you need a tv or set top box or stick etc that is both MPEG4 + MPEG2 compliant.

Some freeview compatible tv's are also MPEG-4. You will have to check the specification. Alternatively look out for the French MPEG-4 HD logo TNT HD or Norway's MPEG-4 DTT service logo - RiksTV on a sticker attached to the TV.

My almost 2 year old freeview compatible Sony V4500 is MPEG-4.

mjsmyth

danjo-xx wrote: »

Just wondering is DVB-T2 (which I think is High Definition) backward compliant with DVB-T

I presume that DVB-T2 is backward compatible with DVB-T as the UK are not changing all multiplexes to DVB-T2 yet, only the PSB one. The reason for moving to DVB-T2 is so that they can get HD on to Freeview. The switch means that the exisiting bandwidth can be better used.

By the way, DVB-T2 does not mean HD. HD could be broadcast over DVB-T (and is in France) using Mpeg4. I believe that it could also be broadcasted over DVB-T using Mpeg2 also, but the bandwidth required would be huge.

The Cush

mjsmyth wrote: »

By the way, DVB-T2 does not mean HD. HD could be broadcast over DVB-T (and is in France) using Mpeg4. I believe that it could also be broadcasted over DVB-T using Mpeg2 also, but the bandwidth required would be huge.

As is the case in Australia HD is DVB-T/MPEG-2 (7 MHz channel bandwidth)

Off-topic I know, but for reference, I have a short clip from Euro1080 when they were broadcasting on Astra 1 using MPEG-2. The video bitrate of that particular clip was 16.1 megabits.

danjo-xx

mjsmyth wrote: »

I presume that DVB-T2 is backward compatible with DVB-T as the UK are not changing all multiplexes to DVB-T2 yet, only the PSB one. The reason for moving to DVB-T2 is so that they can get HD on to Freeview. The switch means that the exisiting bandwidth can be better used.

By the way, DVB-T2 does not mean HD. HD could be broadcast over DVB-T (and is in France) using Mpeg4. I believe that it could also be broadcasted over DVB-T using Mpeg2 also, but the bandwidth required would be huge.

OMG just when I thought I was getting a handle on things it gets even more confusing. Thanks for the clarification though:)

Sam Russell

Karsini wrote: »

Off-topic I know, but for reference, I have a short clip from Euro1080 ..........

Did they even have TVs back then? It was only just after the battle of Clontarf!

homer911

Just to close this off, I'm posting the screenshots from Avermedia A815 software, a photo of the dongle and a screenshot from WMC on W7

homer911

And a couple of the EPG and scheduler....

Digitalism

Alright so I got a Sony Bravia 23" KDL 23B4050 today in currys forr €195, its got a freeview diggital built in, and im using it currently. It picks up a few radio statiosn perfectly and RTE 1 and 2, TV3 and TG4.
I can hear the sound of those stations perfectly but theres no picture for any of them. It says on the screen "No Video".
Also the guide works fine also, everything fine but no video.

Anyone know whats wrong?

slegs

Digitalism wrote: »

Alright so I got a Sony Bravia 23" KDL 23B4050 today in currys forr €195, its got a freeview diggital built in, and im using it currently. It picks up a few radio statiosn perfectly and RTE 1 and 2, TV3 and TG4.
I can hear the sound of those stations perfectly but theres no picture for any of them. It says on the screen "No Video".
Also the guide works fine also, everything fine but no video.

Anyone know whats wrong?

Freeview is a UK standard which is MPEG2 and is not compatible with Irish DTT (or Saorview as it will be called) which is MPEG4. Your TV is MPEG2 only.

Digitalism

Ah right, so all those tvs with "Freeview" written on them wont work with irish DTT more than likely is it? I think nearly every tv had that on it. Will we have to wait a while forr TVs to be compatabile with irish DTT or is there some now?
I always thought Freeview was the name of the digital tv like.
Youd think they would have made the codec the same as the UK being so close together....

EDIT: Will like analog still be around when digital kicks in fully or will this tv be redundant in that sense? Or is there anything I can do about that? I might return it, or are tvs with MPEG 4 codec expensive?

mjsmyth

Digitalism wrote: »

I always thought Freeview was the name of the digital tv like.
Youd think they would have made the codec the same as the UK being so close together....

The UK system is many years old. Mpeg4 is favoured throughout Europe, so there is no shortage of Mpeg4 compatible TV's, it is just shops knowingly selling incompatible equipment. Some, like Tesco, put up signs saying Freeview does not work in Ireland, others don't bother.

Many Mpeg4 compatible TV's have a TNT HD logo displayed.



As it happens, the UK is switching to DVB-T2 which will decode Mpeg4.

Digitalism

Will like analog still be around when digital kicks in fully or will this tv be redundant in that sense? Or is there anything I can do about that? I might return it, or is there a need to really, as I bought the tv mainly for gaming and bit of watching tv.
Is there anywhere where you can see what channels will be on the irish DTT?

Digitalism

Digitalism wrote: »

Will like analog still be around when digital kicks in fully or will this tv be redundant in that sense? Or is there anything I can do about that? I might return it, or is there a need to really, as I bought the tv mainly for gaming and bit of watching tv.
Is there anywhere where you can see what channels will be on the irish DTT?

Analogue will switch off around 2015 or so, the government claim 2012 but I seriously doubt it. The TV won't be redundant as such, you'll just need a set-top box.

Digitalism

How much do those set top boxes cost about? Also anywehre I can see the list of channels on irish DTT or is that announced yet?

Ill bring the tv back tomorrow then, ill tell them its of no use to me, even the guy helping me said it will work when ireland goes digital, obviously hasnt a clue. They better take it back and give me a refund. Would this problem come under a fault with the tv, as the guy never told me it wont work with irish DTT.

The only affordable one right now is the Sagem Picnic box but there's also combo boxes (satellite and terrestrial) available. Once the Irish DTT service officially launches there will be more available.

mjsmyth

There is no set list of channels yet for DTT.

The TV channels currently available free are:

RTE1
RTE2
TV3
TG4
RTE News Now

There are also 4 radio channels available. In the future, there may be extra free channels, and there may be a Pay TV option also.

If you have a PS3 in the house, you can connect the Sony PlayTV adapter to it, run the software upgrade and use it to view and record the current channels on DTT.

mj

Digitalism

No i dont have a ps3 here. Thanks for that info on TNT HD logo, thats helped alot now looking to see if a tv does irish DTT.
Ill bring the tv back tomorrow to currys tomorrow, ill tell them its of no use to me, even the guy helping me never said it wont work with irish DTT when he was explaining it to me, obviously hasnt a clue.
They better take it back and give me a refund. Would this problem come under a fault with the tv, as the guy never told me it wont work with irish DTT or anyone know what currys are like with returns?
Also how much abouts are those set top boxes that pick up MPEG4? About €30 maybe or what? Can I use that on my sony but still use the Digital function of the sony like, if you get what I mean, that the picture will just be added where as now it says "No picture available". Or will it be like Sky kind of thing where you have to go to like AV1 to use it?

Digitalism

Alright I went todday to currys and they said theyd give a refund within 7 days, but I havnt brought it back as im thinking whether to keep it or not as I think it was a good price. The only other one there I probably could afford is the LG M227WDP for €250 but im not sure if that does analog, they seem to be pushing that as a PC monitor, reason being I get stations like ITV and BBC over analog here.

Is there anything I could buy to hook up to the sony bravia to make the digital MPEG4? Like a over the air ariel or connector or something?

Also how much abouts are those set top boxes that pick up MPEG4? About €30 maybe or what? Can I use that on my sony but still use the Digital function of the sony like, if you get what I mean, that the picture will just be added where as now it says "No picture available". Or will it be like Sky kind of thing where you have to go to like AV1 to use it?

Digitalism

If it makes any difference I just noticed the sony bravia has a PC card slot, at least thats what it says on the Dummy card slot. Will I be able to make it MPEG4 compatabile to watch Irish DTT by buying some sort of card? If so any links to where I can buy them and the prices? Im not sure on the specs of these slots, id say youd need to google them. Any help welcome thanks!

EDIT: The manual says it is a "CAM" Card slot, but online for example this site, http://www.sony.co.uk/product/t15-b-series/kdl-23b4050/tab/technicalspecs
says it has a PCMCIA Card Slot. Not sure which it is, or if there both the same.

homer911

Digitalism wrote: »

If it makes any difference I just noticed the sony bravia has a PC card slot, at least thats what it says on the Dummy card slot. Will I be able to make it MPEG4 compatabile to watch Irish DTT by buying some sort of card? If so any links to where I can buy them and the prices? Im not sure on the specs of these slots, id say youd need to google them. Any help welcome thanks!

EDIT: The manual says it is a "CAM" Card slot, but online for example this site, http://www.sony.co.uk/product/t15-b-series/kdl-23b4050/tab/technicalspecs
says it has a PCMCIA Card Slot. Not sure which it is, or if there both the same.

you should check this sticky
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055384875&page=9

I use the Viaccess NP4 card in my Sony - around €50

Digitalism

How much abouts are those set top boxes, and is the quality goodwith thos NP4 cards? Like just as good if the tv was mpeg4 compatabile from the start.

jammygit

Digitalism wrote: »

How much abouts are those set top boxes, and is the quality goodwith thos NP4 cards? Like just as good if the tv was mpeg4 compatabile from the start.

In my experience the NP4 card does not offer the same quality as a 'native' MPEG-4 set. If you want to stick with the Sony check out low cost STB solutions on this thread:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055471880

homer911

jammygit wrote: »

In my experience the NP4 card does not offer the same quality as a 'native' MPEG-4 set. If you want to stick with the Sony check out low cost STB solutions on this thread:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055471880

I agree, but it does have the advantage of providing native support within the TV, as opposed to using some AV input with another remote control

ednwireland

homer911 wrote: »

Just to close this off, I'm posting the screenshots from Avermedia A815 software, a photo of the dongle and a screenshot from WMC on W7

i have the same dongle downloaded the latest avermedia software and only getting sound no picture, what am i missing ?

watty

An MPEG4 Codec!

jammygit wrote: »

In my experience the NP4 card does not offer the same quality as a 'native' MPEG-4 set.

The Neotion cards ARE poorer than native MPEG4 and worse, they can't do HD. In Months RTE will be moving to HD only transmissions. Initially part time, but no SD simulcast. You need HD minimum.

A Setbox will downsample HD to SCART for a Non-HD TV. The NP4 can't do HD at all. Not even downsampled.

homer911

watty wrote: »

An MPEG4 Codec!
The NP4 can't do HD at all. Not even downsampled.

That's confirmed - I can't pick up the HD Test Transmission from RTE with this. Fortunately I also have a (now defunct) LG LF700 TV which does Freesat, FTA and DTT (including the HD and digital Teletext)

watty

I've been saying since before anyone here bought one. I had Neotion Pocket Duo for "official tests" (Nothing to do with Irish DTT) and while is would transcode MPEG4 SD (standard definition) to MPEG2 in a CI slot, the quality was poorer, compatibility was poorer and Neotion themselves told me it could never do HD.

The version I tested also had ethernet on the card. But could only playback on most setboxes and TVs if you could actually tune a live signal. There is no solution to that because the card is pretending to be a CAM and replacing the Live Transmission stream either with MPEG4 transcoded to MPEG2 or MPEG2 playback. Obviously acting as a CAM as well is trivial.