Stop looking for Mr Right

Gyalist

From yesterday's Observer:

Women looking for a Mr Right should give up after 30 and settle for a Mr *Second Best or a Mr Right Now.

Lori Gottlieb, author of Marry Him: The Case for Settling for Mr Good Enough, which is published in the UK next week, believes women who refuse to commit unless they find a man with whom they feel a deep, romantic love are consigning themselves to a lonely future.

"The theme of holding out for true love (whatever that is – look at the divorce rate) permeates our collective mentality," writes Gottlieb, a 40-year-old single mother who now admits she wishes she had "settled" for any of the "perfectly acceptable but uninspiring" men she rejected during her search for the perfect man.

"My dream, like that of my mother and her mother, was to fall in love, get married and live happily ever after. Of course, women are loth to admit it in this day and age, but ask any soul-baring 40-year-old single heterosexual woman what she most longs for in life, and she probably won't tell you it's a better career or a smaller waistline or a bigger apartment. Most likely, she'll say that what she really wants is a husband (and, by extension, a child)," she writes.

Link to article

watna

She just sounds like a bitter old woman, tbh.

I think people need to be realistic but thinking of your OH as someone you have "settled for" sounds like a horrible way to live.

Dudess

I'm incapable - in every possible way - of striking up a relationship with someone I'm not that into. That woman really should stop speaking for all women.

anucksunamun

Speaking from personal experience here, after being with mr second best, and making the most of it... and now being with my soul mate.. I can say even if one had to wait all their life and only got ONE DAY with their true love it would absolutely be worth it!

I honestly dont believe everyone gets to be this happy, I honestly dont think many people actually ever meet the one person who knows, loves and understands them absolutely.. and A LOT of people give up, and settle for whoever.. And I actually think thats heartbreaking..

I know its hard to believe from what Ive said, but a few years ago I was the most cynical person, uninterested in what I actually referred to as 'stupid gushy in love bit**es' but there is such a thing as beautiful and pure love, and its divine and its worth waiting for and working for, I don't think anyone should 'settle'

Chad ghostal

watna wrote: »

someone you have "settled for" sounds like a horrible way to live.

+1

She complains about the divorce rate then tells people to settle for what they have in front of them .. the only people who should consign themselves to a lonely future are the people that have stopped looking.

Gyalist

I've just found the article in The Atlantic which led to the book:

About six months after my son was born, he and I were sitting on a blanket at the park with a close friend and her daughter. It was a sunny summer weekend, and other parents and their kids picnicked nearby—mothers munching berries and lounging on the grass, fathers tossing balls with their giddy toddlers. My friend and I, who, in fits of self-empowerment, had conceived our babies with donor sperm because we hadn’t met Mr. Right yet, surveyed the idyllic scene.

“Ah, this is the dream,” I said, and we nodded in silence for a minute, then burst out laughing. In some ways, I meant it: we’d both dreamed of motherhood, and here we were, picnicking in the park with our children. But it was also decidedly not the dream. The dream, like that of our mothers and their mothers from time immemorial, was to fall in love, get married, and live happily ever after. Of course, we’d be loath to admit it in this day and age, but ask any soul-baring 40-year-old single heterosexual woman what she most longs for in life, and she probably won’t tell you it’s a better career or a smaller waistline or a bigger apartment. Most likely, she’ll say that what she really wants is a husband (and, by extension, a child).

The rest is here: Link to article

Crumble Froo

i don't know where to start on that article.

i think i just have to say that i disagree with almost every thing said, from the first sentence, to the last... including the 'fellow author' who reckons that

"The fact is women generally lose in the exchange of vows."

gyah.

what bull.

seanybiker

Tis right. No use looking for Mr right girls. im taking already. Sorry

minidazzler

To be fair, with 6.7 billion people in the world, there must be at least a few dozen perfect people for each person!

Some people find their perfect match (or one of them) when they are young in their very own hometowns. What are the odds of that like, that they only have one true love, and they happen to live 5 miles down the road?

So, Mr. Right is not one person for everyone, no matter what people who are hopelessly in love tell you. We all have the capacity to be in love with more than one person.

So, I say, never give up the search for that perfect person!

princess-lala

Meh...shes a bitter woman!

I for one wont be settling for Mr. Good Enough, its the best for lala or nothing at all

Why settle for second best?? I want my soul mate and nobody else......



*runs along to find him:)*

metrovelvet

Dreaming is a dangerous activity.

Carsinian Thau

metrovelvet wrote: »

Dreaming is a dangerous activity.

True. But it's preferable to just giving up. It's always better to have hope.

metrovelvet

Carsinian Thau wrote: »

True. But it's preferable to just giving up. It's always better to have hope.

What I mean is people should stop with the box ticking and stop expecting happiness to last forever.

Boston

Question, what makes women think they deserve mr right?

I've only come across this "Mr right" attitude a handful of times. Inevitable "Mr right" is merely a pseudonym for "Mr better then me". The women in question are looking for a man who they feel measures up in all the critical areas better then they themselves. This tends to result in a rather egocentric approach to relationship where people inevitably are never good enough, because "Mr right/better then me" can't be "Mr right if he settles for me". It's just another form of moronic game playing, and people who play them won't ever find love.

Note* I notice how shes equates Mr right with love, when in reality the searching for Mr right has nothing to do with love and instead is all about the right look, the right job, the right education, the right background, the right mannerisms, the right political views, the right religious views, the family, the right social class, the right car, the right tracker mortgage, ect ect.

Dudess wrote: »

I'm incapable - in every possible way - of striking up a relationship with someone I'm not that into. That woman really should stop speaking for all women.

So out bitter-sweet love affair will never know fruition? *Sobs and Eats entire tub of Ben and Jerry's*

Wibbs

Have to agree with Boston on that one. I've known some women very much like that. They've been ticking off the boxes on their social standing list. Get "right" guy, get engaged, get "right" house, get married, have baby. All fine, but this particular type is very self centred about the whole process. The guy(and often the kids) are cardboard cutouts and accessories to their lives. They're not that common to that extreme luckily.

Theres a male equivalent too. Right job, right car, trophy wife etc

metrovelvet

Wibbs wrote: »

Have to agree with Boston on that one. I've known some women very much like that. They've been ticking off the boxes on their social standing list. Get "right" guy, get engaged, get "right" house, get married, have baby. All fine, but this particular type is very self centred about the whole process. The guy(and often the kids) are cardboard cutouts and accessories to their lives. They're not that common to that extreme luckily.

Theres a male equivalent too. Right job, right car, trophy wife etc

That's been the bourgeois paradigm for ages now. I would get bored with that very very quickly. I am lucky to have known only only one woman with that in mind and I just find it so strange.

Novella

Stop looking for anyone fullstop, imo.

So many women have an imaginary checklist of what Mister Perfect is gonna be like. Tall, blue eyes, with a degree in Architecture / Law / Medicine, lives in Dalkey, likes alternative music and art, takes five holidays a year.

This is not looking for Mister Right. Dr Dalkey is not someone you are gonna fall for head over heels because he treats you right, he's not your soulmate, you're in love with an idea, fixated and the person who ticks the most boxes, he puts a 5K ring on your finger and you make children to send to private schools and you're not doing it for you, you're doing it because you think it's "perfect".

I'd say there are soooo many people out their parts of couples because their other half fulfilled some (or all) or these makey up-y rules. Maybe they are in love or maybe they just never stepped outside of their comfort zone to really fall in love. Afterall isn't love accepting someone no matter what, even if they have a degree in Anthropology and that's not on the list!

I read a quote somewhere once, "I love you not because of who you are, but because of who I am when I'm with you". Sure, nice thought but to me it just says, "You make the kind of person I always wanted to be, so thanks". It makes love all about you.

I never wanna be in love where I feel like I'm fulfilling some kind of fantasy I dreamed up when I was playing with my Barbies. I don't wanna fall in love just because the boxes are ticked. I hope when I fall in love, it is the complete last thing I could ever have expected. I hope it is absolutely nothing like what I think it'll be like!

I wish there were no check lists and ideals. I wish we could all walk around with an open mind, not knowing that the Tesco delivery man who is about to call to your house with your shopping is going to fall in love with you because you answer the door still wrapped up in the warmth of sleep.

I could go on but I'm making a huge mess of this post, still half asleep :pac:

metrovelvet

That was hilarious Novella. Ive decided I dont like being in love. Its bad for me. My seratonin levels drop. Old insecurities come back. Not a good scene.

jellie

watna wrote: »

I think people need to be realistic but thinking of your OH as someone you have "settled for" sounds like a horrible way to live.

& it would be horrible to think that your OH had "settled for" you. id rather be single & lonely than be someones second best.

Novella wrote: »

Stop looking for anyone fullstop, imo.

This I agree with. quite often people come into your lives when youre just living your life and having fun and being yourself and just not caring

Novella wrote: »

I read a quote somewhere once, "I love you not because of who you are, but because of who I am when I'm with you". Sure, nice thought but to me it just says, "You make the kind of person I always wanted to be, so thanks". It makes love all about you.

Either youre taking the quote the wrong way or I am.
I read it as more along the lines of "i can be myself when im with you, you bring out a side of me i wasnt aware of, im a happier person with you, etc" rather than "being with you makes me makes me a doctors wife, yay i always wanted to be" - maybe thats not what you mean?

Novella wrote: »

I wish there were no check lists and ideals. I wish we could all walk around with an open mind, not knowing that the Tesco delivery man who is about to call to your house with your shopping is going to fall in love with you because you answer the door still wrapped up in the warmth of sleep.

I think people with check lists are just fooling themselves. You cant fall in love with a check list - maybe you can love the idea of the person or even convince yourself you love them, but if its all about being the perfect man/woman then thats a load of crap cause theres no such thing.

im not sure im making sense, its still early for me.. zzz..

Novella

jellie wrote: »

Either youre taking the quote the wrong way or I am.
I read it as more along the lines of "i can be myself when im with you, you bring out a side of me i wasnt aware of, im a happier person with you, etc" rather than "being with you makes me makes me a doctors wife, yay i always wanted to be" - maybe thats not what you mean?

Oh, no. I understand the quote, I get it. I just don't like it. I don't wanna be a happier person because of someone else. I don't want my happiness to depend on another person. I know you can take the quote as, "Woohoo, I can tell you all my secrets" but to me, that isn't the big, once in a lifetime type love. I love my friends because I can tell them anything.
When I fall in love with someone, I hope it's never for selfish reasons like they make me happier or I can be myself. I want it to be a mutual thing. I want to love someone... just because I had never had a choice not to.

rainbowtrout

Dudess wrote: »

I'm incapable - in every possible way - of striking up a relationship with someone I'm not that into. That woman really should stop speaking for all women.

I couldn't do it either. I've met some perfectly nice guys who were interested in me but I wasn't into them. I could have gone out with them for the sake of being in a relationship. But I know I would end up resenting spending time with someone I didn't really want to be with and I'd end up being mean to them as a result. I don't want to be like that and they didn't deserve to be treated like that so I don't get involved. I have a number of friends who are in relationships where a large part of it is spent arguing and are of the mentality 'I don't know how you can stay single rainbowtrout, I don't know what I'd do without my man'...

witchgirl26

I really don't agree with the settling for second best theory whether you're male or female.

I am waiting for Mr. Right....not Mr. Perfect. In fact the idea of dating someone who ticks all the pre-conceived boxes that so may have really kinda scares me. I'm not perfect so why should I expect my partner to be?! Also it would make me feel totally inadequate & self doubting to be with someone so perfect. I like people to have flaws - makes them human.

The Corinthian

witchgirl26 wrote: »

I really don't agree with the settling for second best theory whether you're male or female.

I don't know if settling is really a fair description. I think the issue is not so much one of "settling for second best" as being unrealistic in one's expectations of 'best'. After all, no matter how much someone is right for you, there will always be a flaw. It may be something trivial, like they chew with their mouth open, or something more substantial, but ultimately a 'soul mate' is someone who's positives so outweigh the negatives as to make them almost irrelevant. Perfection is something that only exists in fairy tales and mathematics.

Instead both men and, especially, women have been sold an abstract standard for a soul mate that is frankly unrealistic, if not impossible. As a result, Mr (or Miss) Right don't actually exist as advertised and anyone else would, by definition, be 'settling'. So both genders end up ticking the boxes in our twenties, striking off anyone who fails to get a perfect 100% until, in our thirties, many end up panicking and settling for any mammal with the right sexual bits.

So I would not conclude that people should stop 'looking' for Mr/Miss Right (although whether one should 'look' is another debate), only that they should stop 'looking' for Mr/Miss Perfect, who only exists in romcoms.

Silverfish

I can safely say I found my Mr Right ....too bad his first name is 'Always'.

Malari

The Corinthian wrote: »

I don't know if settling is really a fair description. I think the issue is not so much one of "settling for second best" as being unrealistic in one's expectations of 'best'. After all, no matter how much someone is right for you, there will always be a flaw. It may be something trivial, like they chew with their mouth open, or something more substantial, but ultimately a 'soul mate' is someone who's positives so outweigh the negatives as to make them almost irrelevant. Perfection is something that only exists in fairy tales and mathematics.

Instead both men and, especially, women have been sold an abstract standard for a soul mate that is frankly unrealistic, if not impossible. As a result, Mr (or Miss) Right don't actually exist as advertised and anyone else would, by definition, be 'settling'. So both genders end up ticking the boxes in our twenties, striking off anyone who fails to get a perfect 100% until, in our thirties, many end up panicking and settling for any mammal with the right sexual bits.

So I would not conclude that people should stop 'looking' for Mr/Miss Right (although whether one should 'look' is another debate), only that they should stop 'looking' for Mr/Miss Perfect, who only exists in romcoms.

I was going to post something exactly like this! As long as potential partners are ruled out on the basis of minor irritations or any differences in attitude, the persuit of perfection is pointless and always going to result in "settling".

iguana

From the insight into her personality that the article in Atlantic Wire gives me, I suspect this woman would be 'settling' for any man she is ever with as her expectations are ridiculous. The way she describes some of her acquaintances partners, the contempt she has for someone who is balding, shy, a recovering alcoholic or hasn't gone to college. Or the way she automatically assumes that anyone who isn't 100% happy 100% of the time in their marriage must have settled.:rolleyes:

Her Mr Right doesn't exist, he is nothing more than an impossible fantasy. She's been holding out for a perfectly educated man, with a great career but reasonable hours. Handsome, kind, funny and a full head of hair, who never argues with her, never pisses her off, is always madly passionate for her but never wants sex when she doesn't and gives great massages. So obviously if she plans on sharing the rest of her life with someone she will have to settle, or wait for lifelike android-husbands to be widely available.

Futurecrook

My dream, like that of my mother and her mother, was to fall in love, get married and live happily ever after.

I've never been more appreciative of growing up with a mother whose dream, for both herself and her children, is to be be healthy and happy.

I find the whole idea laughable really. She seems to look on a partner as some sort of investment.

What makes for a good marriage isn't necessarily what makes for a good romantic relationship. Marriage isn't a passion-fest; it's a partnership formed to run a very small, mundane and often boring non-profit business.

Is someone who thinks like this even capable of romantic love? As another poster said, she will always be settling. If you decide to spend the rest of your life with someone it should be because they make you happy, they make you laugh, because feeling their arms wrapped around you can all the bad things in life disappear for just a while, not because he is a doctor who also happens to have a degree in law, who drives a nice car and plays golf on Sundays or whatever strange ideal this women has imagined.

A man shouldn't have to tick any boxes other than treating you right, being a decent human being and making you happy. Also, any woman who holds a man up to these ridiculous expectations should expect to have the exact same happen to her.

Gyalist

We have to remember that the author is American and they tend to have a different approach on these matters. I once dated one who told me on the first date that she was an intellectual. I just managed to stifle my laughter! Things like college degrees, income, etc, are discussed openly on the first date and i guess that the author feels that she is "settling" if the person doesn't meet all the requirements on her check list. Or maybe it's a more honest approach.

Futurecrook

Gyalist wrote: »

Or maybe it's a more honest approach.

Really? But using that approach you don't give anyone a chance who doesn't tick all your predetermined boxes. It doesn't guarantee happiness.

DeVore

"The things you own end up owning you".


Its true about "partners" too.

DeV.

Malari

Futurecrook wrote: »

Really? But using that approach you don't give anyone a chance who doesn't tick all your predetermined boxes. It doesn't guarantee happiness.

Which is why I think some dating websites have the wrong approach by trying to "match" people based on criteria that are incidental in a lot of people's relationships.

I don't think I would be even in the same sphere as my boyfriend if you tried to match us using that technique. You can't find happiness with a checklist unless you have a million questions on it and are unwilling to compromise!

minidazzler

Why does everyone here seem pessimistic enough to assume that Mr. Right is an idea, or a figment of your imagination you think you would love. What's worse is people seem to assume that OTHER people are doing this but that they themselves wouldn't because they are clued in right.

I always thought this Mr. Right person, meant Mr. Right for you?

iguana

minidazzler wrote: »

Why does everyone here seem pessimistic enough to assume that Mr. Right is an idea, or a figment of your imagination you think you would love. What's worse is people seem to assume that OTHER people are doing this but that they themselves wouldn't because they are clued in right.

I always thought this Mr. Right person, meant Mr. Right for you?

Have you read the long article? This woman has written off many men based on tiny flaws. She has clearly got a very exacting criteria and sees anyone outside this criteria as someone she would have to settle for. However her criteria are, quite frankly, absurd, she wants a man who can never, ever exist.

metrovelvet

I have a friend who wrote off a guy because his pants weren't hemmed correctly.

jenga-jen

Surely if you've 'settled' with someone, and I'm presuming that as a result it isn't a 'head over heels in love' scenario as a result, then the inevitable trials and tribulations of a marriage will be met with, at best, half-arsed enthusiasm to solve/overcome them!?

Let's see how the divorce stats go then...

Silly woman!

metrovelvet

jenga-jen wrote: »

Surely if you've 'settled' with someone, and I'm presuming that as a result it isn't a 'head over heels in love' scenario as a result, then the inevitable trials and tribulations of a marriage will be met with, at best, half-arsed enthusiasm to solve/overcome them!?

Let's see how the divorce stats go then...

Silly woman!

That, or youd end up cheating.

Wibbs

metrovelvet wrote: »

I have a friend who wrote off a guy because his pants weren't hemmed correctly.

Well in fairness.....

Snowie

metrovelvet wrote: »

I have a friend who wrote off a guy because his pants weren't hemmed correctly.

Ok is her second anme hiesent boookayyyyyyyyyyy ? :eek:

thats crazyer then a cocanut

PK2008

The phrase 'soul mate' makes me want to kick balls and punch tits!!!

As my auld one used to say; "You'll eat whats on your plate and be glad"

metrovelvet

Wibbs wrote: »

Well in fairness.....

I know... me and my low standards. Its a long and noble tradition.

anucksunamun

PK2008 wrote: »

The phrase 'soul mate' makes me want to kick balls and punch tits!!!

As my auld one used to say; "You'll eat whats on your plate and be glad"

what has any of this actually got to do with the thread here?

I realise from my previous post people may have assumed I am in the first flush of 'omg he's so perfect' love, but we have been together 6 years now, he's far from perfect, and so am I.. but he makes me laugh till I cry and sometimes cry till all I can do is laugh... I dont believe we only have one person out there, nor should we expect anyone to jump through hoops to prove their love, BUT I do believe in waiting for true love, true happiness, even when you havent a pot to pee in, you can still have someone who cares about everything you think, do or say.. not someone who thought you were hot a few years ago and hopes you'll shut up in time for top gear!

metrovelvet wrote: »

I have a friend who wrote off a guy because his pants weren't hemmed correctly.

I have one who didn't like the way he sneezed, and said she couldn't live like that!
another time she thought some guys shoes were not shined enough, so he didn't care about their date...
and her most recent one was, and I know this sounds like it something out of a movie, but that he smelled like orange juice, apparently all the time..

Ashlinggnilsia

In my opinion i just think women should be realistic, there is no perfect man. Nobody is perfect, you will fight, you will laugh, you will cry but its all part of it, their is no prince charming, I think if you think there is you will be disappointed and I think the sooner your realise that the better, I don't feel like im settling because I'm not dumping my boyfriend and going looking for mr. perfect because he doesn't exist. My boyfriend makes me laugh, cry, and wrecks my head but i am not settling by any stretch, I don't think i could find anyone that i feel more comfortable around and feel like i can be myself, there might be someone more romantic, but they wouldn't be him. Nothing will be 100% perfect 100% of the time maybe aside from the first year of a relationship but i think sometimes girls jump ship too soon and think god we are fighting a fair bit, this isn't right, i think it is, if you don't get angry with them from time to time you wouldn't care. I also think the reason they upset us is because for the first year or so we do think they are mr.perfect and can do no wrong and so we build high expectations from them and expect them to be sweet as pie 24/7 but I am not like that so how can I expect him to be.

I think if you are happy with someone be with them if you are not don't. And do not settle at any age whether your 20, 30, 40 or even 90. I would hate to be second best to someone else so why would you do that to them. If it ain't broke don't fix it!

Novella

Ashlinggnilsia wrote: »

In my opinion i just think women should be realistic, there is no perfect man.

This made me roll around laughing!

Fago!

Novella wrote: »

This made me roll around laughing!

The truth is funny huh.

Raekwon

I read that article and pictured some sad old bint who sits around watching reruns of Sex and the City dreaming what her life really could be like if she found this God like being that she craves so much. She needs a great big fat reality check.......hopefully she finds her 'dream man' and he turns out to be a narcissistic, serial cheating alcoholic

Like another poster said women are more guilty of this sort of nonsense then men. IMO men in general are more realistic then women when it comes to picking potential partners. Men tend to go for personality more then looks IMHO, okay some guys in their teens or early twenties will go for girls that look like human Barbie dolls (& in their head that alone ticks all of their boxes) but that novelty wears off very quickly and personality becomes a more admirable feature.

Women on the other hand tend to go for the total package and in alot of cases stubbornly stick to that. To give a quick example, a female work colleague of mine was seeing a guy for a few months but ended it because the guys big ears were getting on her nerves and in her words "spoiled the rest of his more endearing features" :rolleyes: I actually met that guy on a night out & his ears weren't that big at all so to me this reflected badly on her and tainted her as shallow in my view. But then again, I have never met a woman who was wrong

Wibbs

I dunno about men not doing that. Men can be just as superficial or not as women.

IMHO there's a slightly different language and approach thing going on that has broad diffs between the genders. So in that example of the big eared guy. It's not his ears, they're just her trigger and explanation for the simple fact that for all sorts of reasons he just doesnt do it for her long term.

Ditto when a woman may be with a guy for a few years and one day notices something that just switches her off him completely. It may be something completely daft sounding even for her. Again its feck all to do with the particular something, but all to do with the overall package or background issues that build up to a point where a switch is thrown. You tend to see that trajectory less with men IME. They go off the boil in slightly different ways but it amounts to the exact same thing in both genders

iguana

It's a theme; http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1246008/Waiting-perfect-man-Mr-Second-Best-better-Mr-Nobody--I-know.html