Eviction - how long will this take?

linola_c

Ok so i will try to keep this as brief as i can.

During November, one night there was about 5 people in our flat around 2.30am. We were not under any circumstances having a 'party' but we would have been watching tv and people were probably laughing and talking and the likes. We received a phone call the next day from the office our landlords (the lady in the office) who said that we had breached our lease as there had been noise etc and that we could expect a phone call from our landlord which we never did receive.

Last night, there ended up being a party here - around 20 people i would say - music would have been played and yes we put our hands up there was definitely a party and it wasn't fair to our neighbours. We arrived back to the flat around 3am and the noise would have occured between 3.30 and 4. At 4, two security men let themselves into our apartment and removed everyone, acting extremely threatening in their manner. They entered the apartment once again after this to ensure everyone had left.

Everyone did leave at this stage and we all went off to bed. Today we have received a notice of termination. The actual eviction notice is invalid and we are aware of this.

Basically, we are 3 students and our lease is up at the end of may. We have been advised that the length of time a case takes at the PRTB can run into a number a months between obtaining a hearing date, the hearing and the decision and this will more than likely buy us enough time until our lease actually does end.

We have applied to the PRTB on the basis of an invalid lease and reasons for it also being invalid due to provisions of our actual lease.

Does anyone have any experience in the length of time it will take us with the PRTB?

Thank you!

Coriolanus

Just a quick query, is it definitely a lease, and not a license to reside? Ie: is it on-site college accomodation or off-site? The comments about security letting themselves in reminded me of UCD, that's all.

linola_c

No it is definitely a lease. It is not student accom!

Mediocrity

linola_c wrote: »

No it is definitely a lease. It is not student accom!

What kind of a kip are you living in that allows jack-boots in luminous jackets to barge into your place of residence?

Why do you put up with that? Solicitors letter to the security company all the way.

linola_c

I know, we are extremely enraged by that. Our lease has a provision in it, that the landlord may enter the premises in emergency only.

Surely, they are unable to do this legally. Our flat is on three floors with one bedroom on the top floor. One of the security guards then proceeded to order my flat mate to go up to the room and ensure no one else was up there - threatening to go up himself if she did not comply.

We firmly understand that our behaviour breached our lease. This incident is a one off and we have never had security here before.

Could we rely in anyway on them entering our flat also?

Mediocrity

linola_c wrote: »

I know, we are extremely enraged by that. Our lease has a provision in it, that the landlord may enter the premises in emergency only.

Surely, they are unable to do this legally. Our flat is on three floors with one bedroom on the top floor. One of the security guards then proceeded to order my flat mate to go up to the room and ensure no one else was up there - threatening to go up himself if she did not comply.

We firmly understand that our behaviour breached our lease. This incident is a one off and we have never had security here before.

Could we rely in anyway on them entering our flat also?

Ring your solicitor in the morning and make an appointment. You'll definitely get a payout for that kind of harrassment. Did you call the Gardai on the night?

linola_c

Ok right yes but we have been just served with a notice of eviction - we would be content with it over throwing their right to do that.

stepbar

Very few places have security onsite... I'm guessing that it's a type of student acc... NCI by any chance?

linola_c

No this is definitely not student accomodation. We live in the city centre and security are available.


We are three post graduate students and this was the man reason for us obtaining the lease. Although, other students are also living in the complex.

stepbar

The only other place i know of then is foley st run by ely properties. Can you clarify what apt complex it is?

Victor

Bring your lease to you solicitor. If you can't afford your own solicitor, your students union or FLAC may be of assistance. You could also try Threshold.

www.flac.ie
www.threshold.ie

"Emergency" in a lease usually means burst pipe or similar, where not dealing with it immediately will have disproportionate implications.

We have no idea how long it will take.

linola_c

We contacted Threshold and they have told us to further our claim on the basis that it is invalid to the the PRTB.

We are just concerned that the process might run until May in which case it will no longer be an issue for us.

Mediocrity

Victor wrote: »

Bring your lease to you solicitor. If you can't afford your own solicitor, your students union or FLAC may be of assistance. You could also try Threshold.

www.flac.ie
www.threshold.ie

"Emergency" in a lease usually means burst pipe or similar, where not dealing with it immediately will have disproportionate implications.

We have no idea how long it will take.

I'd go straight to your solicitor and tell them to write a letter. Will cost you about €250. Threateninig jack boots inside your own home is totally unacceptable. If a stranger tried to set foot in my door I'd make it known that they do so at their own peril and promptly reach for my baseball bat.

grizzly

Mediocrity wrote: »

If a stranger tried to set foot in my door I'd make it known that they do so at their own peril and promptly reach for my baseball bat.

Taking that to it's conclusion; the Garda would turn up, side with the security guys and lock you up (especially if there were drunk students everywhere).

Mediocrity

grizzly wrote: »

Taking that to it's conclusion; the Garda would turn up, side with the security guys and lock you up (especially if there were drunk students everywhere).

The trick is to make sure you leave the culprit outside your property's boundary when you're finished with him.

Coriolanus

Just call the guards, saying there are intruders in your apartment and that they seem to be looking for something.
Works even better if your a girl I guess.

the_syco

linola_c wrote: »

I know, we are extremely enraged by that. Our lease has a provision in it, that the landlord may enter the premises in emergency only.

Are the jack-boots your landlords?

linola_c

I would not have thought so.

Does anyone know if a landlord is obliged to notify you if another apartment have made a complaint towards us?

Our fear now is that the landlord will come forward with a set of complaints we have never heard of.

tonyfillony

isnt their 3 stages to an eviction , verbal , written and then final written warning?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

stepbar wrote: »

The only other place i know of then is foley st run by ely properties. Can you clarify what apt complex it is?

stepbar wrote: »

Very few places have security onsite... I'm guessing that it's a type of student acc... NCI by any chance?

I don't know why you find it so difficult to comprehend, but colleges are not the only place with security... :rolleyes:

mink_man

2 weeks max

Rulmeq

Anti-social behaviour 7 days notice

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/if-your-landlord-wants-you-to-leave

Under the notice period table.
"Landlords can give less notice if the tenants are not keeping their obligations (28 days) or if there is serious anti-social behaviour (7 days). Anti-social behaviour includes violence, threats or intimidation as well as any persistent behaviour that interferes with neighbours."

Rulmeq

grizzly wrote: »

Taking that to it's conclusion; the Garda would turn up, side with the security guys and lock you up (especially if there were drunk students everywhere).

Unless it was the landlord or his agent (with his/her permission) which would turn it into a civil matter, which means the Gardaí would tell you there is nothing they can do, and to get on with your life.

happymondays

Rulmeq wrote: »

Anti-social behaviour 7 days notice

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/if-your-landlord-wants-you-to-leave

Under the notice period table.
"Landlords can give less notice if the tenants are not keeping their obligations (28 days) or if there is serious anti-social behaviour (7 days). Anti-social behaviour includes violence, threats or intimidation as well as any persistent behaviour that interferes with neighbours."

none of the above apply to the OP, the only one might be "any persistent behaviour that interferes with neighbours" but having 2 parties in 3 months is hardly persistent behaviour.
i think the 7 days is for extreme cases, i.e. drug dealing, vandelisim etc..

i too am interested in how some security people can just let themseleves into someones apt and start issueing demands. Never seen or heard of that before.

Cookie_Monster

happymondays wrote: »

none of the above apply to the OP, the only one might be "any persistent behaviour that interferes with neighbours" but having 2 parties in 3 months is hardly persistent behaviour.
i think the 7 days is for extreme cases, i.e. drug dealing, vandelisim etc..

+1 on that, there is no cause for eviction IMO, everyone has a party like that every now and then. Hardly a reason for anything other than a word saying to keep noise down in future

happymondays wrote: »

i too am interested in how some security people can just let themselves into someone's apt and start issuing demands. Never seen or heard of that before.

Nor have I, sounds pretty dodgy. I would be contact a solicitor about it and would consider it harassment or threatening behaviour. Its way out of line, also knowing that a security firm that acts like that can access the apt anytime they want is worrying, they clearly have no morals and I would be wary as to stuff going missing and so forth.

linola_c

They have indeed given us the 28 days notice. The case is now with the PRTB and we as such, have immunity against eviction whilst it is with them.

In relation to the security guards entering the premises - we will be using this at our PRTB hearing. We are students and we do not want to run into legal fees etc.

A landlord can evict you without a reason in the first 6 months - is this right?
We have only been here since september.

We were very shocked when we received the notice of termination. We put our hands up to the party last tuesday, the neighbours had every right to complain but this is certainly not 'persistent'.

Is the landlord obliged to notify us if they receive a complaint about us? We are concerned now that when we go to the hearing...they will start saying they had been receiving loads of complaints which we have no notice of!

Rulmeq

linola_c wrote: »

They have indeed given us the 28 days notice. The case is now with the PRTB and we as such, have immunity against eviction whilst it is with them.

In relation to the security guards entering the premises - we will be using this at our PRTB hearing. We are students and we do not want to run into legal fees etc.

A landlord can evict you without a reason in the first 6 months - is this right?
We have only been here since september.

We were very shocked when we received the notice of termination. We put our hands up to the party last tuesday, the neighbours had every right to complain but this is certainly not 'persistent'.

Is the landlord obliged to notify us if they receive a complaint about us? We are concerned now that when we go to the hearing...they will start saying they had been receiving loads of complaints which we have no notice of!

Yes to the 6 months clause
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/if-your-landlord-wants-you-to-leave

Under the heading Terminating a Tenancy
"Landlords can ask tenants to leave without giving a reason during the first six months of a tenancy"

also under the heading Notice of Termination
"state the reason for termination (if a tenancy has lasted more than six months)"

But essentially it doesn't matter, because of the sloth of the PRTB you guys are essentially in situ until the end of your exams. Perhaps a tiny bit of consideration for your neighbours wouldn't go astray.

Ste.phen

Rulmeq wrote: »

Yes to the 6 months clause
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/housing/renting-a-home/if-your-landlord-wants-you-to-leave

Under the heading Terminating a Tenancy
"Landlords can ask tenants to leave without giving a reason during the first six months of a tenancy"

also under the heading Notice of Termination
"state the reason for termination (if a tenancy has lasted more than six months)"

But essentially it doesn't matter, because of the sloth of the PRTB you guys are essentially in situ until the end of your exams. Perhaps a tiny bit of consideration for your neighbours wouldn't go astray.

Doesn't that only apply in the case where there's no formal lease signed? (With the terms set out in the lease applying if they're more beneficial)

Rulmeq

Ste.phen wrote: »

Doesn't that only apply in the case where there's no formal lease signed? (With the terms set out in the lease applying if they're more beneficial)

I doubt any landlord would be willing to give up on that right, but yes you can gain additional rights from a lease.

positron

Am I alone in feeling pity for the landlord? If OP is willing to have a party in the house even if he/she had signed up to a contract saying it's not to allowed, looking at it from the landlord's point of view, w the landlord has all reasons to worry what else OP would get up to next.. ?

Apologies if this is not contributing to the topic - just thinking out loud! If I were OP, I would speak to the landlord and apologies and make it clear that you don't intend to have any more parties. After all which landlord wants to lose tenants in this market?

linola_c

I agree with you positron in relation to the market. However, this incident is the first and will very well be the last of its kind. It is extremely harsh for us to be evicted after this?

Our behaviour has not been persistent and there is no damage whatsoever to the dwelling.

The case is now with the PRTB so regardless, we cannot be asked to leave the dwelling whilst the dispute is ongoing.

stepbar

Megan Ripe Kilt wrote: »

I don't know why you find it so difficult to comprehend, but colleges are not the only place with security... :rolleyes:

I'm glad my comment struck such a chord that you felt the need to respond to it. Well done you :rolleyes:

Go on buddy, name an apt complex with onsite security and I'll name 10 that don't (and BTW concierge services are a different kettle of fish, so they don't count as far as I'm concerned)

The_Conductor

Calm down guys.

OP- if the landlord starts eviction proceedings within the first 6 month period- he/she does not have to specify any particular reason. If you delibertly contest the process- and the PRTB find against you- they can issue a legally binding judgement against you.

I'd love to know what the story is with a private security company- I've yet to see one elsewhere. It may very well be the case that they are in fact employed by the Management Company- and there may be provisions for them in the long term leases for the units- in which case, they would not be considered as an agent of the landlord- rather an agent of the management company- and there can be a whole different set of rules governing their behaviour. Thread carefully on this- its not as clearcut as you appear to be imagining.

Most apartment complexes have set noise rules- mine for example specify no playing music or loud noise after 10PM at night. You can still watch TV by all means- but sound carries incredibly in modern builds- and you would be expected to show due consideration for your neighbours- but also those who live above or below you. My lease goes as far as stating that I am legally obliged to have rugs on the floor (to muffle footsteps) and strictly prohibited from having a tiled floor in any areas of the apartment (bathrooms included).

You can drag this out via the PRTB- which could take a few months- but you're just as likely to end up with a judgement against you, regardless of whether you have the means to satisfy the judgement or not. All it takes is a little paper work to have this over your head for the next 12 years........

Be careful- get good advice- and seriously- regardless of how indignant you are about how you have been treated- ignore the internet- you need to get professional help on this.

S.

linola_c

Very concerned over last post. Could anyone elaborate on this?

astrofool

It seems fairly comprehensive to me?

Fact is, no one here can tell you the rules on your apartment, or the conditions of the lease, or what the PRTB will do. If you are going to go the legal route, you have to get professional legal help.

me_right_one

Get over it FFS. You pissed off the neighbours, landlord, and the security people. You were lucky you werent arrested. Move out, rent elsewhere, and sh1t in the beds on your last day!

hobochris

me_right_one wrote: »

Get over it FFS. You pissed off the neighbours, landlord, and the security people. You were lucky you werent arrested.

under what section of the criminal justice act would that arrest be made under?
:rolleyes:

lion_bar

linola_c wrote: »

Ok so i will try to keep this as brief as i can.

During November, one night there was about 5 people in our flat around 2.30am. We were not under any circumstances having a 'party' but we would have been watching tv and people were probably laughing and talking and the likes. We received a phone call the next day from the office our landlords (the lady in the office) who said that we had breached our lease as there had been noise etc and that we could expect a phone call from our landlord which we never did receive.

Last night, there ended up being a party here - around 20 people i would say - music would have been played and yes we put our hands up there was definitely a party and it wasn't fair to our neighbours. We arrived back to the flat around 3am and the noise would have occured between 3.30 and 4. At 4, two security men let themselves into our apartment and removed everyone, acting extremely threatening in their manner. They entered the apartment once again after this to ensure everyone had left.

Everyone did leave at this stage and we all went off to bed. Today we have received a notice of termination. The actual eviction notice is invalid and we are aware of this.

Basically, we are 3 students and our lease is up at the end of may. We have been advised that the length of time a case takes at the PRTB can run into a number a months between obtaining a hearing date, the hearing and the decision and this will more than likely buy us enough time until our lease actually does end.

We have applied to the PRTB on the basis of an invalid lease and reasons for it also being invalid due to provisions of our actual lease.

Does anyone have any experience in the length of time it will take us with the PRTB?

Thank you!

Did the security men take the comma key from your keyboard?

me_right_one

hobochris wrote: »

under what section of the criminal justice act would that arrest be made under?
:rolleyes:

Public disorder

That Dave Fella

I think it's pretty standard fare to have it written into a lease that there's to be no loud noise after 10/11pm and that if you do this the landlord can have you evicted. It's in my lease anyway.

Victor

me_right_one wrote: »

Public disorder

In a private residence?