Maps with latest roads (incl. new OSI Road Atlas)

Villain

Hi all can anyone tell me where to find a map of Ireland that includes are the recently opened new roads like the carlow kilcullen bypass etc?

Stark

www.openstreetmap.org is the only resource I know of. Will be a while before the paper maps catch up I reckon.

Amtmann

This. It'll be released 4 February.

mackerski

Furet wrote: »

This. It'll be released 4 February.

I'd be surprised if it had the very latest state of the new road schemes. I'll be particularly interested in the M1/M50 junction, the Cloghoge junction on the A1 and the Sheep Hill junction, also A1. All of these are present on OpenStreetMap (granted, many smaller roads are still missing, but we're getting there).

All that said, fair play to Collins for seeming to care about up-to-date maps. Michelin used to be good at that, but not any more.

Amtmann

I know for a fact that the Collins editors get a lot of their information from this particular board. Open Street Map is very good, but it's not glossy and printed like a traditional map... and I love my traditional maps.

L1011

I'm a loyal OSI boy, which is causing problems based on the advancing age of the current OSI country-wide road atlas.

They've spent far too much time producing their Taxi Regulator-logo'd town plans and have completely ignored the idea of replacing the country-wide map. That its listed under "tourist and leisure" when it *should* be the main map any business road used relies on speaks volumes. Navteq's dodgy mapping has replaced it in that field, I suspect.

CelticTiger*

Someone please tell google maps to update our motorways!

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=&vps=1&jsv=178b&sll=53.501117,-6.108398&sspn=7.230255,16.940918&ie=UTF8&geocode=FWHRLAMdLFWg_w&split=0

L1011

Google Maps use Tele-Atlas for Ireland , its them you need to shout at.

xtradel

Another crowd who need a serious update is the AA. The route planner still does not include the M6 from Athlone to Galway!

MJohnston

The state of the GPS maps for this country seems to be pretty poor too. I have a couple of iPhone GPS apps and they still don't show the Mitchelstown bypass

Chris_533976

Openstreetmap + Garmin unit + routable maps = great

mackerski

MJohnston wrote: »

The state of the GPS maps for this country seems to be pretty poor too. I have a couple of iPhone GPS apps and they still don't show the Mitchelstown bypass

I'm surprised at that - a lot of iphone map applications use OpenStreetMap and the Mitchelstown Bypass has been on OSM since a week or so after it opened. I recommend Offmaps (cheap) and RouteBuddy Atlas (free, edit: and also with offline support).

mackerski

Furet wrote: »

I know for a fact that the Collins editors get a lot of their information from this particular board. Open Street Map is very good, but it's not glossy and printed like a traditional map... and I love my traditional maps.

I love the traditional maps too - I grew up with them and they created my passion for mapping. But remember that OSM is just a map database - one can, and people do, create printed maps from that database. The output can be as shiny as we choose

MJohnston

mackerski wrote: »

I'm surprised at that - a lot of iphone map applications use OpenStreetMap and the Mitchelstown Bypass has been on OSM since a week or so after it opened. I recommend Offmaps (cheap) and RouteBuddy Atlas (free, but no offline support).

Cool, do you know of any that provide supply turn by turn GPS though? I have TomTom and Navigon and they're both fairly rubbish for updating.

mackerski

MJohnston wrote: »

Cool, do you know of any that provide supply turn by turn GPS though? I have TomTom and Navigon and they're both fairly rubbish for updating.

Ah - well the generic advice for any navigation in Ireland, iphone or not, is "don't buy Tom Tom". The Teleatlas data that Tom Tom uses (in fact, they own Teleatlas) is utterly useless for Ireland. That it is offered for sale is simply astonishing. Navigon, as far as I know, uses Navteq data, which are far superior, but still updated fairly infrequently. Both Navigon and TomTom have decent enough software for navigation, so if you don't like either, then it's likely that your annoyance is with the map data.

OpenStreetMap data offers, in theory, a solution, in that it tends to be very up-to-date in prominent locations where other maps are not. The flip side, though, is that the Irish OSM data set is not yet as mature as in, say, UK or Germany, so there are many gaps on back roads or in certain urban areas. There are also mistakes yet to be located - community mapping suffers both from newbie breakage and from simple errors. The main reason commercial map providers take so long to update their maps is because of the QA measures they employ to avoid these errors (pity it doesn't seem to help Teleatlas...).

Although there is at least one iphone app doing turn-by-turn navigation using OSM (Roadee), it's a little raw and you'll likely find it quite frustrating. I fully expect to see a lot of progress in this space, though, so keep looking.

BTW, I gave bad information in my last post - RouteBuddy Atlas does support offline cacheing of map tiles.

MJohnston

I didn't quite pay for either of the GPS apps, as I know my way about fairly well, I just wanted to see how the phone would do with it. Seems to me that Navigon has the superior software, but TomTom have better address/POI locating. Wouldn't really recommend either for purchasing though, I'm hoping this Google navigation system ends up on iPhone soon.

mackerski

MJohnston wrote: »

I didn't quite pay for either of the GPS apps, as I know my way about fairly well, I just wanted to see how the phone would do with it. Seems to me that Navigon has the superior software, but TomTom have better address/POI locating. Wouldn't really recommend either for purchasing though, I'm hoping this Google navigation system ends up on iPhone soon.

Until Google discards Teleatlas data (as they did in the US) their navigation here will be just as poor as TomTom (albeit probably with some nice real-time info)

-Corkie-

I am using nokia ovi maps through my phone and it updates itself. Most of the new roads are there except m6 athlone to galway and m8 fermoy to mitchelstown. its a good system and you dont need a seperate nav system

wellbutty

CelticTiger* wrote: »

Someone please tell google maps to update our motorways!

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&q=&vps=1&jsv=178b&sll=53.501117,-6.108398&sspn=7.230255,16.940918&ie=UTF8&geocode=FWHRLAMdLFWg_w&split=0

I've contacted TeleAtlas and Navteq numerous times in the past, no answers and no changes

-Corkie-

I see that they have a bit of the m8 around johnstown or somewhere like that maybe they ran out of blue ink.......

Stark

They seem to go on the original NRA published plans. Like the section of the M8 marked in blue is the part that was originally designated motorway as it was going to lead inescapably to the M8 Portlaoise-Cullahill scheme. They didn't take into account the remaining motorway redesignations that happened afterwards. They also seem to put in new roads according to the original estimated completion dates. Note that delayed roads like the N7 (now M7) Nenagh-Limerick section or the N9 (now M9) Waterford - Knocktopher schemes are mapped on Google Maps, whereas roads that finished early like M6 Ballinastoe - Galway and M8 Mitchelstown - Fermoy schemes have yet to be mapped.

spacetweek

wellbutty wrote: »

I've contacted TeleAtlas and Navteq numerous times in the past, no answers and no changes

Yeop, same here, submitted loads of change requests with no response and no action taken. Fail.

Stark wrote: »

They seem to go on the original NRA published plans. Like the section of the M8 marked in blue is the part that was originally designated motorway as it was going to lead inescapably to the M8 Portlaoise-Cullahill scheme. They didn't take into account the remaining motorway redesignations that happened afterwards. They also seem to put in new roads according to the original estimated completion dates. Note that delayed roads like the N7 (now M7) Nenagh-Limerick section or the N9 (now M9) Waterford - Knocktopher schemes are mapped on Google Maps, whereas roads that finished early like M6 Ballinastoe - Galway and M8 Mitchelstown - Fermoy schemes have yet to be mapped.

So that's it! Was really confuddled by this.

Alun

spacetweek wrote: »

Yeop, same here, submitted loads of change requests with no response and no action taken. Fail.

On the other hand, I've submitted a number of faults both local to me and abroad to Navteq via their MapReporter site, all acknowledged, and all fixed eventually, albeit rather slowly. You don't get any intermediate updates on the progress of your submission from them and have to check up manually on the website, but you do get an email when it's finally resolve, at least I did.

wellbutty

Just installed the new Garmin maps (Europe NT 2010.30), here's the Irish summary:

M4/M6 Dublin to Athlone is on it
Gorey and Carlow bypasses still not motorways
Waterford Bypass is missing
Too soon for M9 Kilcullen to Carlow
M8 Culahill to Watergrasshill is on it
None of the M7/M20 near Limerick is on it
M18 north of Shannon and M11 at Rathnew re-designations not there

I think we should all bombard Navteq and other map providers and get our country even more up to date

csd

wellbutty wrote: »

Just installed the new Garmin maps (Europe NT 2010.30), here's the Irish summary:

M4/M6 Dublin to Athlone is on it
Gorey and Carlow bypasses still not motorways
Waterford Bypass is missing
Too soon for M9 Kilcullen to Carlow
M8 Culahill to Watergrasshill is on it
None of the M7/M20 near Limerick is on it
M18 north of Shannon and M11 at Rathnew re-designations not there

Were all of these not in the 2010.20 update? From a cursory look at the online version of the map, they don't appear to have updated much at all!

/csd

wellbutty

csd wrote: »

Were all of these not in the 2010.20 update? From a cursory look at the online version of the map, they don't appear to have updated much at all!

/csd

They could have been in 2010.20 alright, never checked with as much anticipation as today!

csd

I've found one major scheme that's new to 2010.30: M8 Mitchelstown - Fermoy scheme is in this update and wasn't in the 2010.20 version.

/csd

L1011

Does the M6 speed limit still suddenly drop to 100 west of Kilbeggan in .30? The KTA section is marked as M6 and all in 2010.20, but 100 limit.

Avoiding 15 minutes of "recalculating" on the way to Cork is worth the hassle of getting it alone, mine.

Sponge Bob

Guys.

The Navtech map base was created by given a pack of students a gps and a car and a laptop back in 2005/2006. It is by far the best map of Ireland but is hopelessly out of date when it comes to Motorways. They could bring it up to date by hiring 1 student for 1 week , but won't. Not forgetting the missing Barna Bypass about here and the western bypass of Athenry either lads if ye do get the finger out

yahoo maps ( http://maps.yahoo.com/ ) use this map.

Teleatlas is simply cack, it was done by tracing low res satellite pics or something low tech like that ...by cheap labour in India..although City maps are Ok for some reason

Google have driven every road in Ireland in the past year as well as street viewed them. I would be very pleased to see that map as soon as

irishdub14

wellbutty wrote: »

I've contacted TeleAtlas and Navteq numerous times in the past, no answers and no changes

I was on Google Earth today and noticed they've extended the M9, the M6 and most of the M8 is now showing ... but the updates are still not up to date and are not showing on google maps...??!

They're unbelievably slow at updating! Given the fact there European HQ is in Dublin!! Rediculous!

L1011

Google use Tele Atlas for Ireland, not themselves (yet).

Navteq appear to get ideas for their Irish updates by people using Map Reporter on their website. I've sent in a load of stuff and only ever got one confirmation off them ('new' roundabout in Ferns thats been there as long as I can remember). They clearly have someone still driving roads here, there may be delays in getting stuff uploaded to the main map and then Garmin themselves have delays between the day the map data is dumped from Navteq to when it hits consumer units.

csd

MYOB wrote: »

Does the M6 speed limit still suddenly drop to 100 west of Kilbeggan in .30? The KTA section is marked as M6 and all in 2010.20, but 100 limit.

Avoiding 15 minutes of "recalculating" on the way to Cork is worth the hassle of getting it alone, mine.

Yup, still 100 km/h. Noticed that on my way back from Galway last night.

The Garmin units always seem a bit optimistic in calculating ETAs anyway, so having this few km at a lower speed limit helps with a more realistic time!

/csd

cc

irishdub14 wrote: »

I was on Google Earth today and noticed they've extended the M9, the M6 and most of the M8 is now showing ... but the updates are still not up to date and are showing on google maps...??!

They're unbelievably slow at updating! Given the fact there European HQ is in Dublin!! Rediculous!

Just noticed this myself. Hopefully there won't be too much of a delay untill they update their google map servers. This is really important IMO, for too long the route planner function has being using out of date info. Journey ETA's and directions might be a bit more realistic now

mackerski

cc wrote: »

Just noticed this myself. Hopefully there won't be too much of a delay untill they update their google map servers. This is really important IMO, for too long the route planner function has being using out of date info. Journey ETA's and directions might be a bit more realistic now

If you want to see how out of date Google's routing is, you need look no further than this route.

This route has been impossible by car since the mid-1970's - the aerial photography will show you why if you don't know the area. In fact, the northern end of the route was probably never possible.

This is how poor Teleatlas data for Ireland can be, even in an urban area.

cc

yea its pretty dreadful alright, I think a lot of the problem also stems from the Ordnance Survey's reluctance to do a deal and licence their maps with the likes of Teleatlas and Navteq, who have gone out and mapped Ireland themselves. It seems Teleatlas are a bit more sloppy!

Alun

cc wrote: »

yea its pretty dreadful alright, I think a lot of the problem also stems from the Ordnance Survey's reluctance to do a deal and licence their maps with the likes of Teleatlas and Navteq, who have gone out and mapped Ireland themselves.

Perhaps all is not lost though ...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/motors/2009/1007/1224256090883.html

cc

I'm glad i have a Garmin now

Chris_5339762

I have my Garmin with an old version of City Navigator (M4/M6 scheme is the most recent thing on it). Thats supplemented with Openstreetmap routable which is updated about 15 minutes after a road opens

mackerski

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

Thats supplemented with Openstreetmap routable which is updated about 15 minutes after a road opens

Yeah.

Sponge Bob

Open streetmap is the only one with the completed section of the Barna Bypass but it is otherwise cack west of Galway

Chris_5339762

That is true but whenever I go a-geocaching west of Galway I add any roads I happen to potter down.

EVERYONE POST GPS TRACKS

mackerski

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Open streetmap is the only one with the completed section of the Barna Bypass but it is otherwise cack west of Galway

What Chris said - contribute. Crowds are good at finishing tasks like this. Let's have one apply itself to the empty bits.

Sponge Bob

mackerski wrote: »

What Chris said - contribute. Crowds are good at finishing tasks like this. Let's have one apply itself to the empty bits.

I never bothered with a GPS because the maps are such crap, my trusty 1999 atlas of Ireland suffices

mackerski

Sponge Bob wrote: »

I never bothered with a GPS because the maps are such crap, my trusty 1999 atlas of Ireland suffices

Fine so - we'll let you know when we've fixed the maps for you

L1011

Garmin's City Navigator 2010.30 is too big to fit the entirity of Europe on to my about one year old unit, requiring ANOTHER 20 quid for an microSDHC card.

However, it'll be worth not having it scream "RECALCULATING!" at me for the entire distance around Mitchelstown tomorrow.

geo15

http://www.nra.ie/JunctionLayoutsProjectVideos/

murpho999

On this OSM , I cannot view any maps from anywhere! Is there a plug-in or something I need to download. Can't find anything on their site. All maps just show a magnifying glass with 'More OSM Coming Soon'.

Thanks

Stark

No plugin needed to view it. You must have visited when they were having server issues or something.

mackerski

geo15 wrote: »

http://www.nra.ie/JunctionLayoutsProjectVideos/

Their representation of M9 J8 is worrying - they have the N10 spur shown in green, suddenly becoming motorway inescapably as it hits the trumpet. I _really_ hope that's not how it'll be signed on the ground.

deiseman21

a simple round-a-bout would solve that

mackerski

deiseman21 wrote: »

a simple round-a-bout would solve that

Well, it doesn't actually need solving - there are only two routes you'd want to reach using that spur, both of them freeflow with the standard trumpet that they are apparently building and both of them lead inescapably to a motorway. So you put motorway restrictions on the spur and all is well.